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Reply | In the midst of tragedy
at 21:18 5 Oct 2021
“ The sexual misconduct allegations include accusations of sexual harassment, sexual assault, rape and using a position of power for sexual gain.”
From the FOI response that led to these %s being widely quoted.
Quite a lot more than ‘whistling at a colleague’. And, as can be seen, touching is certainly not the gravest offence.
I’m sure that some of the allegations and indeed convictions were more minor, and I would hope that it is those cases where officers have retained their jobs, but it’s not great is it, however minor, as it is symptomatic of type culture issue which was my point.
I see that the Home Secretary has today announced a formal inquiry so we will have to wait to see what comes of that. |
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Reply | In the midst of tragedy
at 17:12 5 Oct 2021
On the wider point. Surely the issue is not that the Met didn’t fully investigate when the extent of the crime was known, but rather why they didn’t investigate sooner when the sexual offences had come to light but rather had kept him in post?
It’s obvious that they have not been treating sexual crimes seriously in many cases. More than half of all Met police officers found guilty of sexual misconduct over a four-year period to 2020 remained in their jobs.
That’s simply unacceptable. |
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Reply | In the midst of tragedy
at 17:07 5 Oct 2021
I’d have agreed with you for most of my life about providing details without a second thought.
I’m not so sure I’d give details now without an explanation of why exactly they were needed and why I’d been stopped in the first place. Sad though that is. |
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Reply | Shooting migrants boats
at 17:04 5 Oct 2021
Do you ever wonder why you agree with the most right wing Home Secretary imaginable on so many things and yet claim to be on the left side of the Labour Party? |
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Reply | Shooting migrants boats
at 17:01 5 Oct 2021
How?
Reading the replies on here is sad. It really is.
Partly people’s attitude to asylum seekers and partly people’s absolute ignorance of the law. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 19:18 2 Oct 2021
Yes, I’m sure we do, which is why I was surprised at you believing I had an agenda.
Anyway. That’s not the important bit. The important bit is trying to deal with this issue. In society. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 19:15 2 Oct 2021
Rape statistics are c. 90% female to 10% male in the US.
Here (a England and Wales) it’s just over 7 times more likely to be a woman rather than a man that’s a victim of rape, attempted rape and sexual assault where there is penetration by an object.
Most rapes here of course are unreported. It’s likely that many men don’t report rape due to embarrassment, but equally many women don’t due to fear of having their private lives dragged through the mud. |
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Reply | Derby County v Swansea City : Matchday Thread 2021/22 TEAMS
at 18:54 2 Oct 2021
Some of our play is quite reminiscent of that period actually. I’d say even more when we were championship.
But we had Sinclair, who could create the odd goal needed to win the game on his own. We don’t have that equivalent.
We went through a phase of possession for possession’s sake several times under Brendan.
He changed system though the year we went up if you recall. Dobbie was pushed to 10 which made a massive difference and Borini made a difference as well. Plus we’d grabbed enough wins due to Sinclair.
I found Piroe disappointing today. Didn’t control the ball on a couple of occasions in the box. The continued choice of Cullen mystifies me and the creative spark just isn’t there. It’s all very pretty, but that’s about it. If we don’t have truly creative players, we have to have pace. And if we don’t have fast players to give that pace, we need to generate that instead by how quickly we move the ball. Standing on it and playing triangles without purpose isn’t owning anyone up. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 18:42 2 Oct 2021
That’s an indirect effect rather than direct. (An indirect effect that also affects women in the same way, of course).
A bit like saying suicide amongst men, which is far worse than it is amongst women, has an indirect effect on women as they will be family members, friends and loved ones.
That’s not denigrating it even slightly by the way, it’s just different.
Women face a threat of sexual violence that is far, far less frequent for men. It does happen, but it’s a crime that is exceptionally lop sided.
I’ve said before that I do not know a single woman who hasn’t been subject to this sort of stuff. And actually from quite a young age in many cases. Some of it, most of it, is what could be termed lower level, but it still has a huge impact on life. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 17:03 2 Oct 2021
Sexual violence against women doesn’t affect men. It is a different type of crime.
That’s why I didn’t mention it.
I was not attempting to list everything possible that could be done to improve the police. That was obvious.
We are not talking about violence from the police. We are talking about sexual violence, and other sexual crimes. You seem unable to countenance a discussion which doesn’t put men front and centre. When talking sexual violence and sexual harassment and a culture of that being acceptable within the police, men are not the victims which is why I didn’t mention it.
Now we are going round in circles and adding nothing. So you can now say it’s wrong again as no one cares about men and we can stop. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 16:00 2 Oct 2021
I am taking about immediate changes to the police that would make women feel safer with them.
It doesn’t instantly need to also cover issues regarding men as well.
Yes, domestic violence is underreported women against men, you are right. Different issue though.
We are talking about sexual violence and the wider culture of harassment, sexualisation, sexual threats etc. Which all are, in the vast, vast majority of cases, men against women. The fact there are different crimes affecting different groups of people doesn’t alter that, nor do they all need to be discussed at once. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 15:15 2 Oct 2021
No. Because we are talking about sexual violence and the inability for women to feel safe as that’s what this case is about.
And although this case is a rarity, it has shone a light on the toxicity of the UK’s largest police force. A toxicity that those of us living in London have complained about for years and years.
I agree in the last paragraph. The issue we have is that the necessary culture change will take a long time, years even, and in the meantime women in London do not feel they can trust the police so procedural change will have to be made even if only as a temporary fix until the issue is sorted out properly. This is just the final straw for many people who have witnessed the behaviour of the Met at first hand for years. Whether it is harassment of women, gay people, black people, refusing to take people seriously when it comes to the reporting of certain crimes, whether it’s the horrific disregard or lack of respect for victims, sharing of inappropriate material, taking selfies over dead bodies, sharing memes about how to kidnap, rape and murder a woman, etc etc etc.
Unfortunately it appears that anyone whether in politics, media or wider society, who has had enough of this sort of stuff tries to call it out, they are met with the type of ‘bet you’d call them if anything happened to you’ type comment we frequently see on this board, or accusations of people being ‘anti police’ or some sort of commie. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 15:01 2 Oct 2021
It’s bloody stupid advice in this case as an outcome of this case.
If a call had been made to confirm that this police officer was a serving officer with a valid warrant card the answer would have been yes he is. It’s completely missing the point of what actually happened. It’s changing the narrative to suggest that he was impersonating a police officer. It’s the same as they keep referring to him as an ex police officer. He wasn’t an ex officer. He was a serving officer. He was only sacked when he pleaded guilty. And even then, having actually pleaded guilty to kidnap, rape, murder and disposing of the poor woman’s body by burning it, other police officers provided character references for him.
Decent police officers of which there are many, must be sickened by the absolute horror they see around them. The issue is that they must know that this culture exists, and yet have not done anything about it. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 14:54 2 Oct 2021
I’ve absolutely no idea what agenda I’m supposed to have.
You referring to it or making comments about you being able to ‘guess’ what it is doesn’t mean it exists anywhere other than in your opinion.
I didn’t misinterpret what you posted. Your post was not appropriate in my view. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 14:49 2 Oct 2021
We are talking about different things.
There is a specific problem with sexual violence against women.
The fact that there is also a problem with violence against men is not being ignored by focusing on this particular issue in this discussion.
Yes, I am saying that no woman should be arrested by a lone police officer (male - women police officers are never alone in the first place, at least not in London which is where I am referring to in this discussion).
The Met in fact have now said that a woman can’t be arrested by a lone plain clothes police officer. But the issue is that this case highlights that a woman cannot feel safe even in the presence of the police, until such time as the toxic culture within the Met is addressed. For advice to be given saying ‘flag down a bus’ is so ridiculous as to be almost incredible.
For this police officer to have been able to continue in his role is shameful given his past and his reputation. It is obvious that, although an extreme example of the toxicity I’m referring to, it is not as isolated as some are attempting to portray. It may be an extreme, but it is an extreme of a continuum of behaviour that is accepted and, in some instances, encouraged.
It had to start at the top with the removal of the current head of the Met. London will effectively become impossible to police as a result of all this, as women are simply going to refuse arrest now until a female officer attends. Transparently those that are completely deserving of arrest will use that to their own ends. You can’t have a situation like this exist for long.
I wouldn’t allow anyone to be a police offer if they have a history of violence against anyone, male or female. I was simply addressing one particular issue that will go some way to establishing some sort of trust again amongst women. Because at the moment, that has evaporated completely. We do need to protect everyone, but there is an immediate need to sort out this culture issue. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 12:58 1 Oct 2021
Perhaps today of all days isn’t the time to play the ‘poor police’ card?
Perhaps today is a better day to reflect on the culture that allows a man nicknamed ‘the rapist’ with three allegations of indecent exposure to continue as a serving police officer?
‘Another stick’? Wow. Sickening. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 12:49 1 Oct 2021
I’ve no idea whether you don’t actually know what happened in this case or whether you’re just attempting to draw inappropriate parallels.
She didn’t die in police custody. She was kidnapped, raped, murdered, burned by a serving police officer who used his warrant card to pretend to arrest her. That police officer had a history of sexual misconduct, had three (that we know about) reports of indecent exposure including one from a few weeks earlier to the murder, was nicknamed ‘the rapist’, shared what papers are describing as ‘deeply offensive’ misogynistic, racist and homophobic messages with other serving police officers, (a total of 16 officers are now being investigated, and three officers are actually now subject to criminal investigation ) and he was still allowed to remain in position, as an armed police officer as well.
Deaths in police custody are abhorrent but irrelevant here.
There is a culture of misogyny in the Met police that is now culminating in women being told to refuse arrest by a male police officer (told by the Met Police that is).
Random unprovoked violence against men is, again, irrelevant to the matter being discussed.
No one is demonising a whole sex, but it is certainly not a ‘him’ problem. It’s far more endemic than that. In the last decade, 771 accusations have been made against the Met Police of sexual misconduct. Accusations were anything from sexual harassment, sexual assault and rape. Many instances of using police powers to stalk, intimidate and harass women. Women police officers are today stating they are afraid to report male colleagues for fear of physical retribution and, even worse, their male colleagues refusing to attend when they call for help.
It’s come to something when we have London’s police force using instructions to women telling them to flag down a bus if they’re scared of a police officer. The day they say the same to men your post may be relevant. Men are certainly not the demographic that make up most of the victims of sexual violence. They are just almost always the perpetrators. |
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Reply | Sarah Everad
at 18:07 30 Sep 2021
Easy way out for him. |
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Reply | Top Half...Top 6
at 18:06 30 Sep 2021
‘ Don't you realise that West Brom and Fulham are head and shoulders above the rest in this division. ’
Isn’t that a but inconsistent with the claims about going toe to toe with them?
I agree they are a great team at this level.
I’m sure they’ll go up.
Our season won’t depend on last nights result. More concerning are the comments from RM that we matched them as I really don’t think we did anything of the sort.
Hopefully we can get some sort of sequence of results together soon.
I’ve spent almost as long as you btw supporting us, and I’ve been many seasons where I’ve thought we are about to kick on and yet we haven’t done so and have been in trouble. I worry that Martin is too stubborn to do what is necessary. |
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