| The 20MPH punishments 08:34 - Aug 3 with 140659 views | SullutaCreturned |
Well the punishment for breaking the limit,
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/police-confirm-how-punish-drivers-
Given how many idiots are on the roads, the delivery drivers under pressure and the actual difficutly in staying below 20 (it is difficult, I do it every week when I go to Cardiff and it's harder than you'd think, specially going downhill) there will be a lot of speeding going on.
The Senedd expect the fire brigade to become a road safety unit, how stupid is that? The fire brigade have their job and it's hard enough for them to do that the way the Senedd behaves.
Then there's the pollution problem, all those cars tootling around in second gear will fill the streets with pollution, it'll rise and rise and the few accidents stopped by this madness will be replaced tenfold and more in the years to come by serious health issues, those with asthma can look out, better buy your respirators now.
I wonder if cancers will also increase?
By the time we have all gone electric, assuming we all do, thousands of lives will be blighted by illness. |  | | |  |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:24 - Jan 7 with 1489 views | onehunglow |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:06 - Jan 7 by lifelong |
Blanket means ‘total and complete’ which means it can’t be changed, surprised that you can’t see the point.
Let’s face it Felix, I agree with the new restrictions, you don’t. I want to see serious accidents reduced on our 30 mph roads and you appear to want things to remain the same. |
What appears to one is subjective | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 10:35 - Jan 7 with 1477 views | SullutaCreturned |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:06 - Jan 7 by lifelong |
Blanket means ‘total and complete’ which means it can’t be changed, surprised that you can’t see the point.
Let’s face it Felix, I agree with the new restrictions, you don’t. I want to see serious accidents reduced on our 30 mph roads and you appear to want things to remain the same. |
Blabket doesn't mean something can't be changed. In this case it was a blanket rule unless or until an exemption was applied for.
I don't disagree with the 20 in the right places, what I do disagree with is the implementation which was completely shoddy and inefficient.
As I will keep saying, it was never the 30 limit that caused problems it was the bad and dangerous drivers and they are still out there. We have had several deaths on our roads in the last few months and a 20mph limit didn't stop them because when people don't obey limits, it doesn't matter what the limit is. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:39 - Jan 7 with 1468 views | onehunglow |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:35 - Jan 7 by SullutaCreturned |
Blabket doesn't mean something can't be changed. In this case it was a blanket rule unless or until an exemption was applied for.
I don't disagree with the 20 in the right places, what I do disagree with is the implementation which was completely shoddy and inefficient.
As I will keep saying, it was never the 30 limit that caused problems it was the bad and dangerous drivers and they are still out there. We have had several deaths on our roads in the last few months and a 20mph limit didn't stop them because when people don't obey limits, it doesn't matter what the limit is. |
Absolutely.
Many drivers today simply lack basic concentration and appreciation of hazards .
They are dangerous at 10 mph . | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 10:53 - Jan 7 with 1456 views | felixstowe_jack |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:06 - Jan 7 by lifelong |
Blanket means ‘total and complete’ which means it can’t be changed, surprised that you can’t see the point.
Let’s face it Felix, I agree with the new restrictions, you don’t. I want to see serious accidents reduced on our 30 mph roads and you appear to want things to remain the same. |
I want to see accidents reduced that means concentrating on the most dangerous roads which are single carriageway A and B roads which are deadly. The Welsh government have stopped all investment in these accident black spots.
As all data has shown, which the Welsh Government and its supporters have ignored, shows the major causes of accidents even in 30mph area are.
Dangerous driving, careless driving. Drink and drink driving and speeding, unlicensed drivers. Death and accidents among the under 21s age groups are upto 8 times higher than average
Another area the Welsh government could invest money to save lives with compulsory speed and safety course once young drivers have passed their tests.
Very few are caused by motorist driving safely under the 30 mph limit.
The Welsh government could have saved far more deaths and accidents using the wasted money to enforce current road laws.
The Welsh government will start enforcing the new 20 mph zones from Monday with extra speed camera and enforcement vans. | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 12:04 - Jan 7 with 1421 views | lifelong |
| The 20MPH punishments on 10:35 - Jan 7 by SullutaCreturned |
Blabket doesn't mean something can't be changed. In this case it was a blanket rule unless or until an exemption was applied for.
I don't disagree with the 20 in the right places, what I do disagree with is the implementation which was completely shoddy and inefficient.
As I will keep saying, it was never the 30 limit that caused problems it was the bad and dangerous drivers and they are still out there. We have had several deaths on our roads in the last few months and a 20mph limit didn't stop them because when people don't obey limits, it doesn't matter what the limit is. |
Read this report on a survey carried out on the 20mph limit implemented in Edinburgh, scroll down to the results of the survey carried out before the 20 mph and then sometime after it was implemented.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&c |  | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:12 - Jan 7 with 1367 views | SullutaCreturned |
I pulled this of that report,
The speed and volume data used in the analysis covered sixty-six 20mph streets. These streets were 30mph
before the speed limit implementation and changed to 20mph afterwards.
• There has been a statistically significant reduction in average vehicle speed of -1.34mph for all 66 streets
combined.
• The largest reduction in average vehicle speed was -2.41mph and was observed in zone 1b, Rural West
Edinburgh.
• A comparatively higher reduction in average speed, -2.03mph, was observed in streets where the average
speed before the speed limits was greater than or equal to 24mph.
• The frequency of average speed observations which were less than or equal to 20mph was greater after
the speed limit implementation.
• There was a reduction post speed limit introduction in the number of drivers exceeding 20mph at
speeds over 20mph (10%), 24mph (25%) and 30mph (41%).
So 41% of drivers still did more than 30 and 76% did speeds over 20. There is a lot of room for improvement in that report too, up to date specific figurs ragarding types and numbers of accident. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:29 - Jan 7 with 1362 views | controversial_jack |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:12 - Jan 7 by SullutaCreturned |
I pulled this of that report,
The speed and volume data used in the analysis covered sixty-six 20mph streets. These streets were 30mph
before the speed limit implementation and changed to 20mph afterwards.
• There has been a statistically significant reduction in average vehicle speed of -1.34mph for all 66 streets
combined.
• The largest reduction in average vehicle speed was -2.41mph and was observed in zone 1b, Rural West
Edinburgh.
• A comparatively higher reduction in average speed, -2.03mph, was observed in streets where the average
speed before the speed limits was greater than or equal to 24mph.
• The frequency of average speed observations which were less than or equal to 20mph was greater after
the speed limit implementation.
• There was a reduction post speed limit introduction in the number of drivers exceeding 20mph at
speeds over 20mph (10%), 24mph (25%) and 30mph (41%).
So 41% of drivers still did more than 30 and 76% did speeds over 20. There is a lot of room for improvement in that report too, up to date specific figurs ragarding types and numbers of accident. |
There's a need for enforcement. vast majority of drivers seem to make no effort to follow any limits whatsoever | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:35 - Jan 7 with 1349 views | Whiterockin |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:29 - Jan 7 by controversial_jack |
There's a need for enforcement. vast majority of drivers seem to make no effort to follow any limits whatsoever |
There is an argument that if the 30 mph was enforced there would be no need for a reduction to 20 mph. |  | | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 17:46 - Jan 7 with 1315 views | lifelong |
| The 20MPH punishments on 16:12 - Jan 7 by SullutaCreturned |
I pulled this of that report,
The speed and volume data used in the analysis covered sixty-six 20mph streets. These streets were 30mph
before the speed limit implementation and changed to 20mph afterwards.
• There has been a statistically significant reduction in average vehicle speed of -1.34mph for all 66 streets
combined.
• The largest reduction in average vehicle speed was -2.41mph and was observed in zone 1b, Rural West
Edinburgh.
• A comparatively higher reduction in average speed, -2.03mph, was observed in streets where the average
speed before the speed limits was greater than or equal to 24mph.
• The frequency of average speed observations which were less than or equal to 20mph was greater after
the speed limit implementation.
• There was a reduction post speed limit introduction in the number of drivers exceeding 20mph at
speeds over 20mph (10%), 24mph (25%) and 30mph (41%).
So 41% of drivers still did more than 30 and 76% did speeds over 20. There is a lot of room for improvement in that report too, up to date specific figurs ragarding types and numbers of accident. |
The 66 streets relate to the speed of vehicles.
The collision table figures relate to the city wide survey, have you read the figures? | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 19:33 - Jan 7 with 1279 views | AnotherJohn |
I've just driven from Swansea to Porthmadog for a short break - my first south-north trip for couple of years. There are a lot of 20mph zones along the route (via Lampeter and Aberystwyth), and together with the many 30, 40, and 50 mph zones (plus the state of the roads) this is a longer drive than I was expecting. It isn't easy to keep to 20mph on steep uphill or downhill gradients. I would imagine it only takes a momentary lapse in concentration to get a ticket, and any pleasure from driving has greatly diminished. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 08:44 - Jan 8 with 1206 views | SullutaCreturned |
| The 20MPH punishments on 17:46 - Jan 7 by lifelong |
The 66 streets relate to the speed of vehicles.
The collision table figures relate to the city wide survey, have you read the figures? |
Whatever the figures say, the problem remains the same, it will be speeding and bad/dangerous driving that causes acidents and kills people.
Until people obey speed liimits and drive responsibly accidents will continue to happen and I see absolutely stupid, dangerous driving every day, several times a day.
That is something you never seem to understand or want to acknowledge. We could set the speed limits anywhere and some people will always eceed them, some people will always drive like a-holes and until they are clamped down on people will continue to die. More lives could be saved through proper enforcement than by reducing a speed limit, people ifnored the 30 and they will ignore the 20 too. This may save a few lives but it will raise much more money in fines as people drift over the limit. For most of us whohave been driving a long time, we are so used to driving at 30 it is very easy to drift over the 20 limit. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 09:40 - Jan 8 with 1195 views | lifelong |
| The 20MPH punishments on 08:44 - Jan 8 by SullutaCreturned |
Whatever the figures say, the problem remains the same, it will be speeding and bad/dangerous driving that causes acidents and kills people.
Until people obey speed liimits and drive responsibly accidents will continue to happen and I see absolutely stupid, dangerous driving every day, several times a day.
That is something you never seem to understand or want to acknowledge. We could set the speed limits anywhere and some people will always eceed them, some people will always drive like a-holes and until they are clamped down on people will continue to die. More lives could be saved through proper enforcement than by reducing a speed limit, people ifnored the 30 and they will ignore the 20 too. This may save a few lives but it will raise much more money in fines as people drift over the limit. For most of us whohave been driving a long time, we are so used to driving at 30 it is very easy to drift over the 20 limit. |
With all due respect, what is not understood or acknowledged by yourself and others on this thread is that reducing the speed limit in built up locations significantly reduce collisions and serious injuries.
This has been shown in studies over a long period of time in this country and abroad and hopefully it will prove to be the case in Wales. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 11:29 - Jan 8 with 1179 views | onehunglow |
| The 20MPH punishments on 09:40 - Jan 8 by lifelong |
With all due respect, what is not understood or acknowledged by yourself and others on this thread is that reducing the speed limit in built up locations significantly reduce collisions and serious injuries.
This has been shown in studies over a long period of time in this country and abroad and hopefully it will prove to be the case in Wales. |
And also with respect ,the acronym RTA was changed to RTC because “ accidents” are not as people imagine. The cause of collisions is mainly non appreciation of hazards ,non compliance with road conditions and lack of concentration. | |
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| The 20MPH punishments (n/t) on 13:16 - Jan 8 with 1168 views | lifelong |
| The 20MPH punishments on 11:29 - Jan 8 by onehunglow |
And also with respect ,the acronym RTA was changed to RTC because “ accidents” are not as people imagine. The cause of collisions is mainly non appreciation of hazards ,non compliance with road conditions and lack of concentration. |
[Post edited 8 Jan 13:54]
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| The 20MPH punishments on 13:18 - Jan 8 with 1168 views | felixstowe_jack |
| The 20MPH punishments on 09:40 - Jan 8 by lifelong |
With all due respect, what is not understood or acknowledged by yourself and others on this thread is that reducing the speed limit in built up locations significantly reduce collisions and serious injuries.
This has been shown in studies over a long period of time in this country and abroad and hopefully it will prove to be the case in Wales. |
With all due respect what is not appreciated by Drakeford and is his supporters very few Collisions occur at 30mph . Drivers in nearly all cases have time to react, brake and slow down. It is the drivers who are speeding dangerously or are drunk who cause the high speed collisions which all scientific evidence and analysis of accidents proves.
This is the area that needs enforcement not fining motorist who are driving safely.
It is purely a cash raising exercise by the Welsh Government.
The Welsh economy will also be hit when people lose their Licences. | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 13:50 - Jan 8 with 1153 views | SullutaCreturned |
| The 20MPH punishments on 09:40 - Jan 8 by lifelong |
With all due respect, what is not understood or acknowledged by yourself and others on this thread is that reducing the speed limit in built up locations significantly reduce collisions and serious injuries.
This has been shown in studies over a long period of time in this country and abroad and hopefully it will prove to be the case in Wales. |
Yes, reduce it where it needs to be reduced, in areas with high footfall, outside schools and colleges and at accident blackspots and that all makes sense.
What doesn't make sense is changing the speed limits onsome roads but not other roads where the situation seems identical. Take Skewen, come off Birchgrove roundabout into Skewen and it's 40 until the garage where it drops to 20,the road is wide, it has low foot traffic (until past the bridge) and I don't remember any accidents there in the 4 years I have been living here. Then go to Pontardawe and drive out to Coelbren, the speed is still 30 there all the way out yet it has a narrower road, higher foot traffic and schools along the route. Where is the sense?
Then there's the road from Pontardawe back towards cadoxton, in 3 miles the speed limit changes 7 times 40-20-40-30-40-30-20, there are bound to be slip ups.
As I will keep saying, the idea was fine, reduce speed limits where they needed reducing but how the Senedd has gone about this has been absolutely shocking, there was no grand plan, no idea besides do it, get it done and sort the mess out afterwards. it's been an expensive balls up and will cost yet more money to sort out going forward.
It will probably save some lives but again I will say, to save more lives go after the bad drivers, the dangerous drivers and get them off the roads. That will save even more lives. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 14:50 - Jan 8 with 1132 views | onehunglow |
| The 20MPH punishments on 13:50 - Jan 8 by SullutaCreturned |
Yes, reduce it where it needs to be reduced, in areas with high footfall, outside schools and colleges and at accident blackspots and that all makes sense.
What doesn't make sense is changing the speed limits onsome roads but not other roads where the situation seems identical. Take Skewen, come off Birchgrove roundabout into Skewen and it's 40 until the garage where it drops to 20,the road is wide, it has low foot traffic (until past the bridge) and I don't remember any accidents there in the 4 years I have been living here. Then go to Pontardawe and drive out to Coelbren, the speed is still 30 there all the way out yet it has a narrower road, higher foot traffic and schools along the route. Where is the sense?
Then there's the road from Pontardawe back towards cadoxton, in 3 miles the speed limit changes 7 times 40-20-40-30-40-30-20, there are bound to be slip ups.
As I will keep saying, the idea was fine, reduce speed limits where they needed reducing but how the Senedd has gone about this has been absolutely shocking, there was no grand plan, no idea besides do it, get it done and sort the mess out afterwards. it's been an expensive balls up and will cost yet more money to sort out going forward.
It will probably save some lives but again I will say, to save more lives go after the bad drivers, the dangerous drivers and get them off the roads. That will save even more lives. |
Drivers lack of application means they don’t really adjust to varying speed limits.
I’ve followed many doing 40 in a 30 then stay the same in a 60 zone.
It’s not unlike the morons staying in “ middle ) lane of a motorway or the “ fast” lane.
Most car drivers are pretty thoughtless most times | |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 19:18 - Jan 8 with 1095 views | SullutaCreturned |
| The 20MPH punishments on 14:50 - Jan 8 by onehunglow |
Drivers lack of application means they don’t really adjust to varying speed limits.
I’ve followed many doing 40 in a 30 then stay the same in a 60 zone.
It’s not unlike the morons staying in “ middle ) lane of a motorway or the “ fast” lane.
Most car drivers are pretty thoughtless most times |
I see that regualrly, on the stretch of road I mentioned with the 7 changes I have been behind a vehicle doing 30 in the 40 zone and kept on going through the 20 zone, pulling away from me only for me to catch up at the nexy 40 zone.
I see others doing 20 down Pontardae bypass where it's 40 and even got caught behind someone doing 20 on the 60 stretch out towards Ystalyfera.
People are confused and surely that is also dangerous. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 19:23 - Jan 8 with 1092 views | builthjack |
It’s exactly as I thought it would pan out. Very sensible.
As a police officer friend said at the start, if the limit is 30 they will do 35-38.
If they bring it to 20 they will do 24-27.
It’s how it is. |  |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| The 20MPH punishments on 12:58 - Jan 9 with 967 views | SullutaCreturned |
I just red the story. The Senedd doesn't know what's going on. The Fire service doesn't know whats going on and the Police don't know either. It's been a complete mess.
To read that Drakeford says genuine confusion should be enough to get you off a ticket is ridiculous. if this had been planned properly, rolled out properly, if the public had been informed properly then there should be no confusion.
It's just another shiteshow from a group of useless politicians. This country is bogged down by useless politicians, by this country I mean the UK. We have Westminster and the Senedd and both are utterly hopeless. | | | |
| The 20MPH punishments on 17:13 - Jan 10 with 857 views | Flashberryjack |
And still Drakeford and some on here can't/don't want to admit it. |  |
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| The 20MPH punishments on 17:16 - Jan 10 with 855 views | felixstowe_jack |
| The 20MPH punishments on 17:13 - Jan 10 by Flashberryjack |
And still Drakeford and some on here can't/don't want to admit it. |
As a direct result of Drakeford's ill thought out law less frequent and slower bus journeys will mean more cars on the road causing congestion, more pollution and more accidents. | |
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