| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:38 - Nov 2 with 772 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:29 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
Nothing to do with being “obsessed” with it. It’s about being accurate, and the comments people are highlighting now, we’re with regards to that early style. Not this one. It’s a very sly way to try and marry the two together.
This is a simplified version of what this whole thing is about. It’s like a manager putting Piroe in defence and people saying “Piroe will never score regularly when played in defence and needs to be up front”…. We are told “stick with it, he’ll get better, just needs time”.
Weeks of it being awful continue before the manager puts him up front and starts scoring. Instead of admitting those people were right, the narrative becomes “See, told you patience was all that was needed. Look at him scoring now, this was part of the plan all along obviously”.
It’s mind numbingly stupid.
The style he first brought did not work, we have been through this countless times. It was highlighted why it didn’t work and what needed to change. That change was brought in…. And it now starts to work.
It really isn’t rocket science. |
Person1: "Lets give Martin time to adapt"
Person2: "These games are terrible to watch, Martin must adapt!"
P1: "Yes he does, so give him time and patience and he will"
martin adapts with time
P2: Aha, I told you so!
Can you see how the second person here can appear unreasonable? |  | |  |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:43 - Nov 2 with 769 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:36 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
Each season has its challenges, for various different reasons. But people have to decide why the style of play was so bad when we started out this season.
Was the virus giving us instructions to not go direct at any costs, or was that an instruction from the manager? Assuming it wasn’t the first option, it’s hard to blame Covid for a style of play.
And I most certainly won’t be. |
The virus' interference with our system meant our players were clearly unfit and therefore unable to play to the standards required by Martin's system. Martins lateness meant that he had much less time to put his stamp on the team.
Brushing this off as 'each season has its challenges' is like me holding a marathon between two people. I give one coke instead of water before the run, and the other I bash over the head with a hammer.
Both had challenges though, all sounds like excuses to me! | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:48 - Nov 2 with 758 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:38 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
Person1: "Lets give Martin time to adapt"
Person2: "These games are terrible to watch, Martin must adapt!"
P1: "Yes he does, so give him time and patience and he will"
martin adapts with time
P2: Aha, I told you so!
Can you see how the second person here can appear unreasonable? |
That’s made up though, the comments were not anything to do with Martin adapting, in fact the “Aha” people specifically stated he couldn’t and he wouldn’t compromise on it.
What was said was that we must stick with THE STYLE that we were criticising. Many of us were saying we like Martin, don’t want him sacked and believe he can change it…. But he needs to because it isn’t working.
We were told we were wrong.
We were absolutely right. |  |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:52 - Nov 2 with 751 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:43 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
The virus' interference with our system meant our players were clearly unfit and therefore unable to play to the standards required by Martin's system. Martins lateness meant that he had much less time to put his stamp on the team.
Brushing this off as 'each season has its challenges' is like me holding a marathon between two people. I give one coke instead of water before the run, and the other I bash over the head with a hammer.
Both had challenges though, all sounds like excuses to me! |
Again not something I am accepting.
First I don’t agree that it takes more fitness to play a mixed and direct style than a short at all costs game. Secondly, if that was true then we should never be playing a style of play we weren’t fit enough to play, the managers job there is to adapt and change things to counter that.
The fitness thing is a fallacy. Fitness is one thing the players are able to work on regardless of covid closures. During various lockdowns I became the fittest Ive been for years and I’m pretty fit anyway. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 0:54]
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:54 - Nov 2 with 752 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:48 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
That’s made up though, the comments were not anything to do with Martin adapting, in fact the “Aha” people specifically stated he couldn’t and he wouldn’t compromise on it.
What was said was that we must stick with THE STYLE that we were criticising. Many of us were saying we like Martin, don’t want him sacked and believe he can change it…. But he needs to because it isn’t working.
We were told we were wrong.
We were absolutely right. |
Re-read the quote again. The second person is trying to brag to people about Martin adapting when the other people said he would all along.
Do you have a single quote from anyone insisting Martin would never adapt to adopt his MK Dons attacking approach given time and a chance to get it across to the players? Genuinely curious. Haven't been reading the site for that long before making this account. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:59 - Nov 2 with 740 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:54 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
Re-read the quote again. The second person is trying to brag to people about Martin adapting when the other people said he would all along.
Do you have a single quote from anyone insisting Martin would never adapt to adopt his MK Dons attacking approach given time and a chance to get it across to the players? Genuinely curious. Haven't been reading the site for that long before making this account. |
Doesn’t matter how many times I read it, it still won’t be right.
Absolutely nobody said he would add a direct and mixed game, nobody. We were told he wouldn’t compromise and can’t adapt.
We were the ones who said we see no reason why he can’t adapt, we were told we were wrong.
I’m not trawling back thousands of pages. But you are welcome to find the posts telling us Martin will adapt, I assure you that wasn’t what was being said though, may save you time.
As for you not posting here for long… I somehow have my doubt there.
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:01 - Nov 2 with 741 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:52 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
Again not something I am accepting.
First I don’t agree that it takes more fitness to play a mixed and direct style than a short at all costs game. Secondly, if that was true then we should never be playing a style of play we weren’t fit enough to play, the managers job there is to adapt and change things to counter that.
The fitness thing is a fallacy. Fitness is one thing the players are able to work on regardless of covid closures. During various lockdowns I became the fittest Ive been for years and I’m pretty fit anyway. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 0:54]
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What sense would it make to play Brexit football rather than give players some much needed gametime to experience a more possession-based style (which has clearly worked as an approach as most of the players have adapted by now, other than Whittaker and Fulton)? We didn't bring in Martin to do that.
A high level of fitness is needed in every system. Players don't just sit on the ball to make a possession style work, they have to do quick short sprints constantly throughout the game to regain possession (as was noted by Laird in the earlier press conference).
Fitness is absolutely not something players can work on regardless of COVID closures. I'm happy for your fitness journey, but Ntcham is a prime example of a player not being fit despite working all summer. He's still not trusted by Martin to do a full 90 because of his lack of training with a team during pre-season. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:06 - Nov 2 with 735 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:59 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
Doesn’t matter how many times I read it, it still won’t be right.
Absolutely nobody said he would add a direct and mixed game, nobody. We were told he wouldn’t compromise and can’t adapt.
We were the ones who said we see no reason why he can’t adapt, we were told we were wrong.
I’m not trawling back thousands of pages. But you are welcome to find the posts telling us Martin will adapt, I assure you that wasn’t what was being said though, may save you time.
As for you not posting here for long… I somehow have my doubt there.
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'I'm not trawling back thousands of pages' because you can confidently make up statements by unnamed random people to suit whatever it is you are saying. I remember someone saying in the summer we need to reappoint Bob Bradley! I also remember me telling everyone back in 2015 we need to start Jamie Paterson, Joel Piroe and Jake Bidwell in the south wales derby in 2021. I'm not going back to look for this, though. I simply insist.
I've been browsing this forum since the Cardiff game and was shocked at the level of negativity here. Decided to set an account up here instead of PlanetSwans so I could get more varied responses to my points, as they pretty much agree over there on how swell a job Martin is really doing. Dunno if you're insinuating my writing style is similar to someone you recognize from previous experience or what? | | | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:10 - Nov 2 with 728 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:06 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
'I'm not trawling back thousands of pages' because you can confidently make up statements by unnamed random people to suit whatever it is you are saying. I remember someone saying in the summer we need to reappoint Bob Bradley! I also remember me telling everyone back in 2015 we need to start Jamie Paterson, Joel Piroe and Jake Bidwell in the south wales derby in 2021. I'm not going back to look for this, though. I simply insist.
I've been browsing this forum since the Cardiff game and was shocked at the level of negativity here. Decided to set an account up here instead of PlanetSwans so I could get more varied responses to my points, as they pretty much agree over there on how swell a job Martin is really doing. Dunno if you're insinuating my writing style is similar to someone you recognize from previous experience or what? |
So I have to do all the work, for you to see things you want?
Don’t work like that squire.
However here is a freebie. This was me in August discussing the style with someone telling me he wouldn’t adapt.
I am here clearly saying I like him, I back him to adapt - my issue is the style.
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:10 - Nov 2 with 731 views | Evs |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 00:54 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
Re-read the quote again. The second person is trying to brag to people about Martin adapting when the other people said he would all along.
Do you have a single quote from anyone insisting Martin would never adapt to adopt his MK Dons attacking approach given time and a chance to get it across to the players? Genuinely curious. Haven't been reading the site for that long before making this account. |
This is the myth about Plan A that's permeated through this forum, time and time again. It's very tiresome.
RM clearly stated in that interview in March 2021 that he would stick to Plan A.
He then clarified what he meant by this - and I'll have to paraphrase it - he wouldn't adopt a Plan B of lumping a long ball to a tall striker.
He added that it's a myth that Plan A's the problem. He stated that they need to get better at what they do (Plan A) and solve more problems being us with the identity we want to have at this football club.
But don't take my word for this. Here's the clip. It takes just 2 minutes of anyone's time. It helps.
link:
http://www.facebook.com/MKDonsOfficial/videos/russell-martin-speaking-in-todays- [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:11]
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:13 - Nov 2 with 724 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:10 - Nov 2 by Evs |
This is the myth about Plan A that's permeated through this forum, time and time again. It's very tiresome.
RM clearly stated in that interview in March 2021 that he would stick to Plan A.
He then clarified what he meant by this - and I'll have to paraphrase it - he wouldn't adopt a Plan B of lumping a long ball to a tall striker.
He added that it's a myth that Plan A's the problem. He stated that they need to get better at what they do (Plan A) and solve more problems being us with the identity we want to have at this football club.
But don't take my word for this. Here's the clip. It takes just 2 minutes of anyone's time. It helps.
link:
http://www.facebook.com/MKDonsOfficial/videos/russell-martin-speaking-in-todays- [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:11]
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That’s from his time at MK Dons.
He was receiving criticism for refusing to go long when it was clearly needed within a game. A lot of MK Dons fans said that when they come up against a team that knows how to play against a short passing possession game then it’s over after a few mins, because they would not adapt.
With us he also came with a reluctance to go long or direct. He has clearly compromised on that early desire, that early system is one the fans refer to as “Plan A”.
Whether Martin publicly recognises it as Plan A, isn’t really relevant. | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:16 - Nov 2 with 724 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:10 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
So I have to do all the work, for you to see things you want?
Don’t work like that squire.
However here is a freebie. This was me in August discussing the style with someone telling me he wouldn’t adapt.
I am here clearly saying I like him, I back him to adapt - my issue is the style.
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I asked you
"Do you have a single quote from anyone insisting Martin would never adapt to adopt his MK Dons attacking approach given time and a chance to get it across to the players?"
You've just posted a quote from yourself. In your post above the quote you said you were 'discussing the style with someone telling me he wouldn’t adapt.' without a single quote from him saying this. Poor attempt at changing people's words. Again. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:19 - Nov 2 with 721 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:13 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
That’s from his time at MK Dons.
He was receiving criticism for refusing to go long when it was clearly needed within a game. A lot of MK Dons fans said that when they come up against a team that knows how to play against a short passing possession game then it’s over after a few mins, because they would not adapt.
With us he also came with a reluctance to go long or direct. He has clearly compromised on that early desire, that early system is one the fans refer to as “Plan A”.
Whether Martin publicly recognises it as Plan A, isn’t really relevant. |
You're totally correct. He really compromised on his vision when he.. implemented his vision.
Nonsense. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:19 - Nov 2 with 717 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:01 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
What sense would it make to play Brexit football rather than give players some much needed gametime to experience a more possession-based style (which has clearly worked as an approach as most of the players have adapted by now, other than Whittaker and Fulton)? We didn't bring in Martin to do that.
A high level of fitness is needed in every system. Players don't just sit on the ball to make a possession style work, they have to do quick short sprints constantly throughout the game to regain possession (as was noted by Laird in the earlier press conference).
Fitness is absolutely not something players can work on regardless of COVID closures. I'm happy for your fitness journey, but Ntcham is a prime example of a player not being fit despite working all summer. He's still not trusted by Martin to do a full 90 because of his lack of training with a team during pre-season. |
I don’t know what Brexit football means.
As I said fitness is not an excuse to refuse a mixed style of play. You don’t have to sacrifice a possession based game to add a direct and mixed passing style. We did it under Brendan and Martinez and all other passing and possession styles.
The fitness thing really doesn’t stack up and I’m not entertaining it. It’s brainless.
If Martin doesn’t think Ntcham is fit then he needs to get him up to speed before allowing him to ruin the good work we are trying to achieve on the pitch. This isn’t a computer game with locked players, he’s the manager and it’s his choice to select players and a style.
To select a style he knew wouldn’t work because players weren’t fit enough to play it is ludicrous. But again, I’m not buying the fitness thing for a second, just like I didn’t last year.
And no I’m not going to find my comments from last season to satisfy your curiosity before you ask. | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:22 - Nov 2 with 717 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:19 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
I don’t know what Brexit football means.
As I said fitness is not an excuse to refuse a mixed style of play. You don’t have to sacrifice a possession based game to add a direct and mixed passing style. We did it under Brendan and Martinez and all other passing and possession styles.
The fitness thing really doesn’t stack up and I’m not entertaining it. It’s brainless.
If Martin doesn’t think Ntcham is fit then he needs to get him up to speed before allowing him to ruin the good work we are trying to achieve on the pitch. This isn’t a computer game with locked players, he’s the manager and it’s his choice to select players and a style.
To select a style he knew wouldn’t work because players weren’t fit enough to play it is ludicrous. But again, I’m not buying the fitness thing for a second, just like I didn’t last year.
And no I’m not going to find my comments from last season to satisfy your curiosity before you ask. |
If you want to know what Brexit football is, turn on the Cardiff 3 - 0 Swansea full match. You'll see plenty of it, from one end.
I don't really care if you don't believe in player fitness and conditioning being vital. It is. Pointless discussion if we can't agree on something as basic and fundamental as that. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:23 - Nov 2 with 712 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:19 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
You're totally correct. He really compromised on his vision when he.. implemented his vision.
Nonsense. |
I don’t understand your point.
These notions of “his vision” is just romanticised drivel, get a grip. He came here wanting to play a short passing game with a reluctance to mix the passing style, felt like more of a statement than an effective method. Again something MK Dons fans accused him of.
I backed him to see sense and change that. I was told he wouldn’t and we must stick with that style. We changed it, it appears to be better.
That’s the story. What people have moulded that into now is pretty amusing…. But not entirely unexpected.
Now you show me comments from back then telling us that if we are patient he will change the style and add the elements we were complaining were missing. As that seems to be the latest made up narrative that apparently we were told.
Before you start your journey on that quest, let me warn you that it doesn’t exist. | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:26 - Nov 2 with 710 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:22 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
If you want to know what Brexit football is, turn on the Cardiff 3 - 0 Swansea full match. You'll see plenty of it, from one end.
I don't really care if you don't believe in player fitness and conditioning being vital. It is. Pointless discussion if we can't agree on something as basic and fundamental as that. |
I watched it, still don’t know what it means. Sounds a ridiculous and meaningless phrase.
Are you saying that those that criticised the early style wanted to play like Cardiff?
Who said player fitness isn’t vital? What you were told is that player fitness is something that should not have been affected by any closures. If we were deemed not quite fit enough to play a certain way, then we should adapt it or play players that are. What you are claiming we adapted to, does nothing to conserve fitness. The argument makes no logical sense.
I agree, we don’t appear like we will agree on much. You are coming from a place where you think you can change what was said to represent something convenient for your argument.
I’m coming from a place from what was actually said.
Those two will never marry up. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:41]
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:38 - Nov 2 with 705 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:23 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
I don’t understand your point.
These notions of “his vision” is just romanticised drivel, get a grip. He came here wanting to play a short passing game with a reluctance to mix the passing style, felt like more of a statement than an effective method. Again something MK Dons fans accused him of.
I backed him to see sense and change that. I was told he wouldn’t and we must stick with that style. We changed it, it appears to be better.
That’s the story. What people have moulded that into now is pretty amusing…. But not entirely unexpected.
Now you show me comments from back then telling us that if we are patient he will change the style and add the elements we were complaining were missing. As that seems to be the latest made up narrative that apparently we were told.
Before you start your journey on that quest, let me warn you that it doesn’t exist. |
The notions of vision come from him dragging the Dons to playoff form out of a relegation battle. He obviously came here to implement our currently WINNING style. Saying otherwise, accusing him of arriving with the intention of 'ego-stroking football' is what should be considered drivel totally not based in facts.
This thing about 'narrative' you have is hilarious to me. Do you think everyone that is currently backing Martin and has done so is in some sort of cult that thinks he can do and has done no wrong, and that everyone in it has the exact same opinion? But Cooper doesn't have the backing of this cult because.. hidden agendas or narratives or some other spiel. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:41 - Nov 2 with 704 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:26 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
I watched it, still don’t know what it means. Sounds a ridiculous and meaningless phrase.
Are you saying that those that criticised the early style wanted to play like Cardiff?
Who said player fitness isn’t vital? What you were told is that player fitness is something that should not have been affected by any closures. If we were deemed not quite fit enough to play a certain way, then we should adapt it or play players that are. What you are claiming we adapted to, does nothing to conserve fitness. The argument makes no logical sense.
I agree, we don’t appear like we will agree on much. You are coming from a place where you think you can change what was said to represent something convenient for your argument.
I’m coming from a place from what was actually said.
Those two will never marry up. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:41]
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It's just another phrase for hoofball. Not sure why you're hung up on it.
The complete lack of any self awareness you have is incredible. Genuinely awe inspiring. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:45 - Nov 2 with 699 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:41 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
It's just another phrase for hoofball. Not sure why you're hung up on it.
The complete lack of any self awareness you have is incredible. Genuinely awe inspiring. |
I’m not hung up on it, I explained that I had no idea what it was.
You have now explained it was hoofball, which renders your initial point useless and I was correct to question it.
Nobody has advocated to play hoofball. Do you have any quotes you can show?
I wouldn’t want you to have the lack of self awareness to demand proof of comments, which I duly oblige while refusing to yourself.
Stick to what was said, stop making stuff up and we will get along just fine. | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:53 - Nov 2 with 697 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:38 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
The notions of vision come from him dragging the Dons to playoff form out of a relegation battle. He obviously came here to implement our currently WINNING style. Saying otherwise, accusing him of arriving with the intention of 'ego-stroking football' is what should be considered drivel totally not based in facts.
This thing about 'narrative' you have is hilarious to me. Do you think everyone that is currently backing Martin and has done so is in some sort of cult that thinks he can do and has done no wrong, and that everyone in it has the exact same opinion? But Cooper doesn't have the backing of this cult because.. hidden agendas or narratives or some other spiel. |
That’s form, not vision. 18 months of disappointing finishes, ask them.
MK Dons accused him of ego stroking tactics, they said that often it appeared that getting people talking about the style and getting his name out there was more important than the team winning. It’s something hard to disagree with if the opening games we saw were also similar to the Mk Dons performances, which nothing has shown to not be the case.
Winning, is not a style. That’s playground chatter based on a very simple understanding of football. A roll of the eyes comment rather than anything we can explore.
As for your last paragraph, it is quite “cult like” now you mention it. Nothing can be questioned, mistakes and errors passed off as part of the great plan and reality changed to suit, anyone who speaks that reality get told they are wrong - when they factually aren’t. It’s quite an odd one.
As for Cooper, I would say it stemmed from their comments toward him last year and their attacks on the management team despite our continued and consistent successes. We could have appointed Bradley again and people would be falling over themselves to state how great it was, anything else would have to be a nod to the previous management in acknowledgement for the achievements they criticised. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:54]
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:04 - Nov 2 with 695 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 01:53 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
That’s form, not vision. 18 months of disappointing finishes, ask them.
MK Dons accused him of ego stroking tactics, they said that often it appeared that getting people talking about the style and getting his name out there was more important than the team winning. It’s something hard to disagree with if the opening games we saw were also similar to the Mk Dons performances, which nothing has shown to not be the case.
Winning, is not a style. That’s playground chatter based on a very simple understanding of football. A roll of the eyes comment rather than anything we can explore.
As for your last paragraph, it is quite “cult like” now you mention it. Nothing can be questioned, mistakes and errors passed off as part of the great plan and reality changed to suit, anyone who speaks that reality get told they are wrong - when they factually aren’t. It’s quite an odd one.
As for Cooper, I would say it stemmed from their comments toward him last year and their attacks on the management team despite our continued and consistent successes. We could have appointed Bradley again and people would be falling over themselves to state how great it was, anything else would have to be a nod to the previous management in acknowledgement for the achievements they criticised. [Post edited 2 Nov 2021 1:54]
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Eighteen months of disappointing finishes after he took over when they were considered relegation fodder is a laughably absurd take. There are plenty of Dons fans who praised him, just as there are many who lambast him after his exit. Many of these would have been singing his praises days before he left.
Can you tell me what part of the football you've seen recently gives you the impression that it is ego-stroking and not a winning formula? It would make sense if MK were on a downward trend during his employment. They absolutely weren't. He raised the bar, the expectations of the club. Set up his successor for success (who is seventh in the league, worse than the form Martin had in his last games, despite playing 'non ego-stroking winning football' with a much better team than Martin had, which is interesting)
If Martin served up dreadful football after time and patience was given I will freely criticize him, as many would. He has in fact served brilliant football that makes me more than happy to get up on a Saturday afternoon and look forward to a great game ahead. Your problem is your demand for constant criticism when there is really not much to complain about, at all.
Did you miss when John Terry was strongly linked and had betting suspended on him being appointed? I remember. No one around me was happy. No one was falling over themselves. Everyone I spoke to has been positive about Martin because he was a fantastic signing that indicated strong ambition for our football club. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:17 - Nov 2 with 687 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:04 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
Eighteen months of disappointing finishes after he took over when they were considered relegation fodder is a laughably absurd take. There are plenty of Dons fans who praised him, just as there are many who lambast him after his exit. Many of these would have been singing his praises days before he left.
Can you tell me what part of the football you've seen recently gives you the impression that it is ego-stroking and not a winning formula? It would make sense if MK were on a downward trend during his employment. They absolutely weren't. He raised the bar, the expectations of the club. Set up his successor for success (who is seventh in the league, worse than the form Martin had in his last games, despite playing 'non ego-stroking winning football' with a much better team than Martin had, which is interesting)
If Martin served up dreadful football after time and patience was given I will freely criticize him, as many would. He has in fact served brilliant football that makes me more than happy to get up on a Saturday afternoon and look forward to a great game ahead. Your problem is your demand for constant criticism when there is really not much to complain about, at all.
Did you miss when John Terry was strongly linked and had betting suspended on him being appointed? I remember. No one around me was happy. No one was falling over themselves. Everyone I spoke to has been positive about Martin because he was a fantastic signing that indicated strong ambition for our football club. |
It’s reality, 19th and 13th…. they are now 7th after throwing out Martin’s style and adopting a more attacking and direct style. It’s not remotely similar.
Their last game they won 4-1 away to Crewe with 44% possession. Their win before that was 2-1 away to Wigan where they had 42% of possession.
To attribute that to Martin is hilarious.
Indeed many people enjoyed the football, but also many didn’t. It was not just “after his exit”, hence why Martin said after the loss to Accrington “I know I’ll get criticised….”.
Sure, I think a refusal to play long when it was clearly on and instead choose to play short into non dangerous areas knowing that you are sacrificing an attacking threat for us in favour of a defensive threat, can certainly be seen as someone wanting to get passes and possession stats up as opposed to being effective. Style over substance is the term, that’s never a winning formula - hence we were destroyed.
I don’t understand this notion of “time and patience”, we are football supporters, not the board. We don’t have the power to give either. What we can do is note the weaknesses and back him to change it… which we did of course.
Turning a blind eye to those weaknesses and accusing those correctly noting the shortcomings needed to be changed of being “negative”, is not what I would call “patience”. I’d say it’s ignorance.
No idea what you are talking about regarding John Terry. What on earth has he got to do with anything? 
You are again assuming that people were slating Martin as opposed to the style. Again, what was said that we like Martin and back him to make the changes that are clearly needed from a system that isn’t working.
OHL may have said some things about Martin but to pretend others were is just false and dishonest. | |
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| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:55 - Nov 2 with 675 views | YouBackJastard |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:17 - Nov 2 by Dr_Parnassus |
It’s reality, 19th and 13th…. they are now 7th after throwing out Martin’s style and adopting a more attacking and direct style. It’s not remotely similar.
Their last game they won 4-1 away to Crewe with 44% possession. Their win before that was 2-1 away to Wigan where they had 42% of possession.
To attribute that to Martin is hilarious.
Indeed many people enjoyed the football, but also many didn’t. It was not just “after his exit”, hence why Martin said after the loss to Accrington “I know I’ll get criticised….”.
Sure, I think a refusal to play long when it was clearly on and instead choose to play short into non dangerous areas knowing that you are sacrificing an attacking threat for us in favour of a defensive threat, can certainly be seen as someone wanting to get passes and possession stats up as opposed to being effective. Style over substance is the term, that’s never a winning formula - hence we were destroyed.
I don’t understand this notion of “time and patience”, we are football supporters, not the board. We don’t have the power to give either. What we can do is note the weaknesses and back him to change it… which we did of course.
Turning a blind eye to those weaknesses and accusing those correctly noting the shortcomings needed to be changed of being “negative”, is not what I would call “patience”. I’d say it’s ignorance.
No idea what you are talking about regarding John Terry. What on earth has he got to do with anything?
You are again assuming that people were slating Martin as opposed to the style. Again, what was said that we like Martin and back him to make the changes that are clearly needed from a system that isn’t working.
OHL may have said some things about Martin but to pretend others were is just false and dishonest. |
MK were sixth in the form table throughout the entire latter part of the season on a much smaller budget. Accept that fact. They've adopted a new style that may have set the world on fire to start with but has now resulted with them being THIRTEENTH in the league table on form from their past six games. A position that you often beat Martin with a stick with. They are now statistically worse off after a fantastic transfer window and a club on an upward trend, but nevermind that logic based on valid reasoning. Whatever suits your agenda.
You said (to paraphrase) anyone who wasn't Cooper would've been heralded by this delusional fanbase who hated on a fantastically successful manager for zero reason whatsoever. I pointed out how this is wrong, as when a manager like Terry was linked, no one was positive about the appointment. So why you honestly believe some people would see reappointing a manager of Bradley's caliber would've been seen as a great move, I have no idea.
It made no sense to criticize him then when he wasn't given time. To look back and pat yourself on the back for your efforts is foolish. | | | |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 03:01 - Nov 2 with 669 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin ‘ I told you we would get better’ We told you too ! on 02:55 - Nov 2 by YouBackJastard |
MK were sixth in the form table throughout the entire latter part of the season on a much smaller budget. Accept that fact. They've adopted a new style that may have set the world on fire to start with but has now resulted with them being THIRTEENTH in the league table on form from their past six games. A position that you often beat Martin with a stick with. They are now statistically worse off after a fantastic transfer window and a club on an upward trend, but nevermind that logic based on valid reasoning. Whatever suits your agenda.
You said (to paraphrase) anyone who wasn't Cooper would've been heralded by this delusional fanbase who hated on a fantastically successful manager for zero reason whatsoever. I pointed out how this is wrong, as when a manager like Terry was linked, no one was positive about the appointment. So why you honestly believe some people would see reappointing a manager of Bradley's caliber would've been seen as a great move, I have no idea.
It made no sense to criticize him then when he wasn't given time. To look back and pat yourself on the back for your efforts is foolish. |
What has the last 6 games of the season got to do with anything? Form will be a mix of ups and downs, its where it averages that is important, not what it is like over a 6 game period. It averaged 13th.
What do you mean they are statistically worse off? They are 7th, such a position they were never in under RM. I appreciate the creativity of your delusional point, but in terms of an actual point - it has very little substance.
Terry was not appointed, that is a moot point. If he did come in I am sure the narrative would have been how great everything is. We will never know as he was never appointed.
It made perfect sense to criticise a style that was not working. Even more so when t's proven that those comments were absolutely correct.
There would need no need for back patting if there wasn't a dishonest push to do the opposite.
You won't be getting anywhere with this one I'm afraid. | |
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