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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 11:28 - Nov 8 by Shonky
The link made no difference. Any physicist worth his salt knows the Second Law of Thermodynamics.
Again I refer you to your phrase "less useful". Entropy is a fact of our universe and therefore the "usefulness" of the energy is redundant. Also, you told me I should look at the link and now it makes no difference. Lastly, neither you or I are physicists so no salt needed. Laters Sham.
It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 12:12 - Nov 8 with 1129 views
"News just in - Perchie's dad has just blown Catholic belief out of the water. The Pope and Patriarchs of the 5 Orthodox Jurisdictions have resigned. It is believed that the Patriarch of Alexandria has commissioned himself a barrow on Port Said dockside selling Fezes and saying "just like that" to attract customers".
The reason for Atheism and it's stranglehold on our society is the Protestant mania with science - that's why so many chapels are now no longer. You need more than just fire, brimstone and the threat of hell fire and damnation to attract people to the Christian faith . Science is no comforter of the human being on his/her deathbed. I expect quite a few atheists will have a change of mind when that time comes. Consider their choice - nothing? Or everything?
Incoming!!!!!!
(no disrespect meant to Mr PRJ senior but what his son just said is an unbelievable statement in the context of 2,000 years of Christianity)
Each time I go to Bedd - au........................
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 12:14 - Nov 8 with 1128 views
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 09:37 - Nov 7 by Parlay
It means that energy is the only thing living things have in common, without energy you wouldn't exist. Its called energy transference and ones energy lives on long after death and can also give birth to more life - born from you.
Cant explain it any better im afraid, although in fairness i wouldn't have thought it needs to be.
Are you saying that we have energy that is specific to us and remains as our energy even when it is transferred as heat, for instance?
If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys?
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 13:51 - Nov 8 with 1101 views
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 00:02 - Nov 8 by DJack
Stella drives me to stupidity, but here goes.
Your golf ball analogy is flawed as, with this scenario, we have no other information. As to existence in this plane of "reality" we have the, not quite complete, "laws of nature", "Conservation of energy" and all that stuff to give indication to probability. Probability is a mainstay of quantum physics which is proving to be VERY effective at predicting outcomes from what we "know" to be "true".
Using the words "Bollox" and "guff" is NOT tantamount to putting ones fingers in ones ears and stamping ones feet when faced with assertions totally devoid of any evidence or "hard" science to back it up. It is just an inane reaction to an inane assertion.
Back to the debate, which incidentally was not "what can live without energy" and avoiding your get-out clause "we must both have the same understanding of the word "life"...
For there to be life after death it must be a process either driven by "life" or by the overarching" Laws of nature" but the elephant in the room is entropy and the eventual dissolution of everything to the photonic level (and maybe beyond). Get beyond that and then maybe we have a discussion otherwise it's guff and bollucks.
Well, you have upped the ante. From defending the intellectual, philosophical, and rhetorical gems "bollox" and "guff," you take the leap to "insane."
Hardly advances the discussion to do that.
Your understanding of "entropy" is seriously flawed. It has to do with the different ways energy can be arranged, and by extension the possibility that energy is rearranging itself into pure randomness. It does not mean the eventual dissolution of everything, to any level.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 00:10 - Nov 8 by perchrockjack
It all boils down to the simple fact none of us know and we have all wasting our time on earth posting drivel on a subject that cannot be determined..
For unknown thousands of years, Mankind has been thinking about and discussing subjects that at the time could not be determined, and with considerable success.
Look around you and you should see some of the results of that search. Look as far as the edge of our solar system, and beyond it, for example. Stare intently at your computer. Remember your last flight to your holiday in Antigua.
One of Mankind's greatest gifts is the ability to see and contemplate the abstract, then explain it.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 09:18 - Nov 8 by shingle
And you are thinking way to deep and writing way to long posts trying to find way`s of there maybe something after death all speculation of course, but if it helps you to get over your fears of reality then good for you, personally i`ll stick with what i see and only believe something when it`s proven to me.
Curious. I have to wonder whether he's "thinking way too deeply" or you're in over your head?
You have every right to "believe something when it's proven to you," but please remember that it will be proven to you by someone or someones who have thought long and deeply about the subject; and then remember to thank him/her/them.
You have brought "fear" into the discussion. Marcus Aurelius Antoninus, I believe it was, said [I'm paraphrasing from memory now] that upon your death you will either move to another form of being, or to nothingness. You have nothing to fear in either case.
Is fear, then, the only reason for thinking about matters of life and death? The main one? Neither?
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 09:46 - Nov 8 by perchrockjack
Shingle makes a good point; maybe we should be concerned as to what we see, do, hear and live on earth rather than worry too much about the "possible" after life
That's a choice for each of us to make freely. Neither option is wrong. I refrain from characterizing either further.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 10:58 - Nov 8 by Shonky
Errr. Try reading the link.
The second law may seem a little less happy to some. It describes the aftermath of every energy change that makes something happen. The second law says that each time energy gets transferred or transformed, some of it, and eventually all of it, gets less useful. That's the truth. It gets less useful, until finally, it becomes mostly useless (at least as far as its ability to make things happen is concerned).
So it seems I do know better , than you anyway.
[Post edited 8 Nov 2014 11:01]
Odd that you used a comic book, or "thermodynamics for dummies," site.
Now you might find a comic book explanation of thermonuclear energy, where the energy contained in a single atom -- not enough to blow the snot out of a mite's nose -- is converted into energy that must be measured in megatons, an almost inconceivable standard of measure.
When energy is used under natural circumstances, it either creates more energy directly, or helps to create something that itself creates more energy. And if I understand this correctly, the amount used and the amount created will be equal.
And, in my opinion, all of this has nothing, or virtually nothing, to do with life and death because energy is not life. The exact relationship is probably more complex than we even suspect, but as electrical wires are not energy but carry it, and as electricity is not energy but a vessel for energy, and an electric motor is not energy, but uses it, so too is life not energy but uses it.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 14:10 - Nov 8 by Davillin
Curious. I have to wonder whether he's "thinking way too deeply" or you're in over your head?
You have every right to "believe something when it's proven to you," but please remember that it will be proven to you by someone or someones who have thought long and deeply about the subject; and then remember to thank him/her/them.
You have brought "fear" into the discussion. Marcus Aurelius Antoninus, I believe it was, said [I'm paraphrasing from memory now] that upon your death you will either move to another form of being, or to nothingness. You have nothing to fear in either case.
Is fear, then, the only reason for thinking about matters of life and death? The main one? Neither?
Well you seem to think long and deeply, and you have proved fcuk all to anyone, as for the Marcus Aurelius Antoninus saying you have nothing to fear well if there is a creator aka God waiting for us when we die we may very well have plenty to fear because this creator seems like a right evil sod to me.
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 19:51 - Nov 8 with 949 views
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 18:31 - Nov 8 by shingle
Well you seem to think long and deeply, and you have proved fcuk all to anyone, as for the Marcus Aurelius Antoninus saying you have nothing to fear well if there is a creator aka God waiting for us when we die we may very well have plenty to fear because this creator seems like a right evil sod to me.
How so?
Each time I go to Bedd - au........................
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 20:20 - Nov 8 with 933 views
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 16:45 - Nov 7 by londonlisa2001
I state up front in this that I have no particular leaning towards religion, and no idea whether or not there is such a thing as life after death in whatever form that takes. My 'reason' if you like says that it is more likely than not that we don't exist in any understandable way after death, although I believe it wouldn't be rational to have some faint hope that this may be wrong !!
Anyway, that aside, my meagre knowledge on all of this understands that the amount of energy that exists in the universe is both fixed and unchanging, and therefore it converts from one form to another form (and again, my understanding Dav to the question what were the dying stars before, well they were something else, because all the energy that exists now has always existed as i understand it). But that is the scientific stuff and I think your point here is very interesting.
It is not entirely different to the point I once heard framed which said that our bodies do not have souls to help us feel and be aware, it is more accurate to say that our souls have bodies to help us experience and interact.
The question that I do find interesting is the one of self awareness. There is definitely something in us (which doesn't seem to be present in other living things, at least not to the same extent) which is 'aware' of ourselves and our existence. That is bizarre from a scientific perspective. And not only do we appear to be aware, but we are aware of ourselves in a quite specific way, that transcends what we look like and the external stuff. (I've often wondered about this with transgender people for example - they have an awareness which doesn't even correlate to their gender - such that they say they are 'shocked' when they see themselves). It's similar to when we dream and 'know' that someone is in the dream, even though it doesn't look like them, we know it's them.
Now I don't know whether this 'self' is a mix of the brain with hormones etc. but as I say, it does seem both powerful and odd scientifically. And I guess that when we talk about 'life after death' what we are really talking about is whether this sense of self lives on in a different form.
I think animals do have self awareness, I have heard about dolphins and elephants, I am aware of a story involving horses.
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 17:32 - Nov 7 by londonlisa2001
re no. 4 first (as it may be easier) I heard recently (and I can't for the life of me remember where) that we are the only animal born with a knowledge of our own certain death. I don't know whether this is remotely trues, but it seems quite an important part to me of self awareness. That is different btw to the 'self preservation' instinct that all animals have.
re point 2. I think the whole point (as I understand it anyway) is that there isn't a beginning. The energy has always existed - a concept that we can't understand because we have no capacity to understand infinity.
My understanding (and this may be complete rubbish by the way) is that the Big Bang explains the start of what is now the universe, not the start of everything, and that the energy contained within the whatever it was before big bang was the same as the sum of the energy in the universe today. Equally, I thought that when the universe stops expanding and starts contracting again (which I believe it is supposed to do), then after an insanely long period of time it will be back to a pinprick (yes, I know - miles smaller than that, but using it for simplicity) and the energy will still remain the same. Then it repeats, maybe not exactly, but in some way. For ever. In the same way as this is a repetition. The 'before' bit doesn't actually exist I don't think, because time is, in itself, part of that same energy that has no start and no end and doesn't disappear, just change. This is so far beyond my ability to comprehend though that as I say, it may not be what the theory actually is but I believe it to be pretty close.
I think some animals have a sense of when they are going to die, dogs and cats might be an example, especially cats they often find somewhere out of the way like under a bush to go and die.
[Post edited 8 Nov 2014 20:39]
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 20:37 - Nov 8 by trampie
I think some animals have a sense of when they are going to die, dogs and cats might be an example, especially cats they often find somewhere out of the way like under a bush to go and die.
[Post edited 8 Nov 2014 20:39]
This is hard to write.
I have seen that with some of my own animals.
For example, Lady, a lovely and sweet-tempered Whippet, used to nip the tip of my nose to show affection. When it was time for her to go, she reached up, nipped my nose, lay her head down, closed her eyes, and was gone.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 18:31 - Nov 8 by shingle
Well you seem to think long and deeply, and you have proved fcuk all to anyone, as for the Marcus Aurelius Antoninus saying you have nothing to fear well if there is a creator aka God waiting for us when we die we may very well have plenty to fear because this creator seems like a right evil sod to me.
Marcus Aurelius was not encumbered by being a Christian.
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 21:54 - Nov 8 by Davillin
This is hard to write.
I have seen that with some of my own animals.
For example, Lady, a lovely and sweet-tempered Whippet, used to nip the tip of my nose to show affection. When it was time for her to go, she reached up, nipped my nose, lay her head down, closed her eyes, and was gone.
[Post edited 8 Nov 2014 23:02]
Wow that's a touching story tony.
Animals have an inane ability to predict death and even diseases in humans. This article from the Bbc tells of a cat in a nursing home that could tell when patients were about to die and dogs that could smell various cancers well in advance in humans.
"Dogs are very good at picking up on emotional changes and when people are depressed and inactive they are very good at comforting people in these circumstances. Elephants show the same altruistic tendencies, but not cats, they are very much more selfish, solitary creatures."
One theory about how dogs have evolved this capacity is that their wolf ancestors developed an ability to tell when one of the pack was sick.
But it is not just in health that the heightened senses of animals have proved to be more advanced than humans'.
"Scientists remarked at how few wild animals died in the Asian tsunami in 2004, because they were able to sense the disaster and move to higher ground."
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 22:05 - Nov 8 by Lord_Bony
Wow that's a touching story tony.
Animals have an inane ability to predict death and even diseases in humans. This article from the Bbc tells of a cat in a nursing home that could tell when patients were about to die and dogs that could smell various cancers well in advance in humans.
"Dogs are very good at picking up on emotional changes and when people are depressed and inactive they are very good at comforting people in these circumstances. Elephants show the same altruistic tendencies, but not cats, they are very much more selfish, solitary creatures."
One theory about how dogs have evolved this capacity is that their wolf ancestors developed an ability to tell when one of the pack was sick.
But it is not just in health that the heightened senses of animals have proved to be more advanced than humans'.
"Scientists remarked at how few wild animals died in the Asian tsunami in 2004, because they were able to sense the disaster and move to higher ground."
Not all cats. I have 2 cats. 3 years ago, one of them was run over but survived (glancing blow) no broken bones but was in a lot of pain. After bringing him back home from the vets, the next day I couldn't find him in the house anywhere. After 48 hours i heard a noise and he'd somehow got underneath the bathroom cabinet. I had to take the plinth off to find him. I read up on it and the popular view is that he'd gone there to die. I picked him up and kept him next to me but he wouldn't eat or drink. After another 3 days I lay next to him on the floor and picked up a morsel of cat food and held it to him. He finally ate that food. It was a special moment. He perked up from then on and he just changed. The 4 years since have just seen him totally devoted to me. He sits next to me every night. If I'm ill he seems to know and snuggles up closer. He's 9 now and I'm sure if he was strong enough he'd get my slippers for me, lol.
It's just the internet, init.
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iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 23:03 - Nov 8 with 873 views
I would love to have a cat but alas I have a bad reaction to them... The last pets I had were a pair of guinea pics for my son...they were lovely and eventually used to roam around the house freely...
Until one day to my horror I discovered the little bastards had chewed up all the new carpeting behind the furniture and gnawed through electiral sheathing on wires everywhere...the damage ran into hundreds... I'm sure they could sense death imminently approaching as they went all quiet and well behaved for a while after that until we got rid of them to some poor unsuspecting soul..
PROUD RECIPIENT OF THE THIRD PLANET SWANS LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD.
"Per ardua ad astra"
iS tHERE lIFE aFTER dEATH on 21:54 - Nov 8 by Davillin
This is hard to write.
I have seen that with some of my own animals.
For example, Lady, a lovely and sweet-tempered Whippet, used to nip the tip of my nose to show affection. When it was time for her to go, she reached up, nipped my nose, lay her head down, closed her eyes, and was gone.
[Post edited 8 Nov 2014 23:02]
Sorry to hear about you losing Lady Dav.
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
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