| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin 22:04 - Apr 5 with 9476 views | 73__73 |
ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘ðŸ‘👠|  |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:16 - Apr 8 with 925 views | 73__73 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 09:21 - Apr 8 by vetchonian |
which is why also Martin hasnt had to "knock" the last two seasons of brainwashing out tof them that so many have spoken of.
I dont believe Grimes and Fulton "wrested control" I believew Martin has told the team to play differently he has had an epiphany ( or some one one has offered some advice maybe) that using the ball rathr than keeping the ball will be better.
the players did "take control" at Bristol City away when we won but Martin made comment on this in his post match presser ...I doubt if any playerwould do so again. |
I haven’t really been reading what you think about Martin, but let me have a guess,
You are one of the detractors who have backed themselves into a corner.
The problem with backing yourself into a corner is you then find you have nowhere to go, when things change.
Russell Martin deserves at least two seasons so he can mould the team the way he wants.
I’m not sure if you know the Piers Plowman poem, it’s where the expression “Patience is a Virtue” comes from. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:18]
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:24 - Apr 8 with 909 views | RichardO |
Martin's team has generally played the same all season but now finally worked out a stable back three in positions where they are defensively comfortable, which three he will ultimately settle on remains to seen re. .Manning or Lati, nice to have viable options.
Still think we will be susceptible to players with pace being given the ball early Cooper countered that by when conceding position dropping deep into the two banks of defenders hence our good goal against record but dropping limits the attacking options hence the low goal for record.
Was the balance right last year with the team we had, don't really care last season is gone.
Having that stability in defence enables the midfield 6 players in all to be more focused on attacking options, unless the opposition puts the press on then the wingbacks drop deep to make 5 in defence 4 in midfield.
Have we got better players now than last season? Think we have more pacey and more skilful players overall?
Better teams and I use that term loosely, try to force mistakes and expose our weaknesses
Still work to be done, it is taking some time and I think we'll have some disappointing result yet this season.
Hopefully more joy than not.
[Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:31]
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:48 - Apr 8 with 890 views | vetchonian |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:16 - Apr 8 by 73__73 |
I haven’t really been reading what you think about Martin, but let me have a guess,
You are one of the detractors who have backed themselves into a corner.
The problem with backing yourself into a corner is you then find you have nowhere to go, when things change.
Russell Martin deserves at least two seasons so he can mould the team the way he wants.
I’m not sure if you know the Piers Plowman poem, it’s where the expression “Patience is a Virtue” comes from. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:18]
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I havnet backed myself into any corner
I bagan criticisng Martin early doors as we were watching boring football with no attack and getting beaten.
I have documented my points on many posts...including data from MKDons and also the posta on their fans forum...Martin seemed obsessed with possesion rather than winning games.
He seems to have tweaked things.
No manager gets two season in football any more and why should he need two seasons?
Potter managed a top ten finish in his frist season, Cooper 6th then 4th place
People seem to have this thought that following Coopers defootballisation of the club we need a revolution...whihc will take Martin two seasons.
I am patient but many others both on here and other forums who have watched us for a long time have all been critical of MArtin's" process"
I havent backed myself into a corner if anytrhing I have been provren right given I was critical of Martins philosophy and style . In the last teo matches we have moved the ball forwards with pace, used long crossfield passes and knocked balls from height into the box for Obafemi to chase. Piroe has put some nice balls into the box from "distance" we werent doing that before.
Its alla bout opinions though and I recgonise that others may disagree.
But no manager gets two season anymore . | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:56 - Apr 8 with 885 views | vetchonian |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:24 - Apr 8 by RichardO |
Martin's team has generally played the same all season but now finally worked out a stable back three in positions where they are defensively comfortable, which three he will ultimately settle on remains to seen re. .Manning or Lati, nice to have viable options.
Still think we will be susceptible to players with pace being given the ball early Cooper countered that by when conceding position dropping deep into the two banks of defenders hence our good goal against record but dropping limits the attacking options hence the low goal for record.
Was the balance right last year with the team we had, don't really care last season is gone.
Having that stability in defence enables the midfield 6 players in all to be more focused on attacking options, unless the opposition puts the press on then the wingbacks drop deep to make 5 in defence 4 in midfield.
Have we got better players now than last season? Think we have more pacey and more skilful players overall?
Better teams and I use that term loosely, try to force mistakes and expose our weaknesses
Still work to be done, it is taking some time and I think we'll have some disappointing result yet this season.
Hopefully more joy than not.
[Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:31]
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we scored 3 goals at Milwwall last season
We havent played the same all season....there were games where wemixed it more going direct by that I mean passing forwars rather than just side to side...reduced the number of backeard and sideways passes going forwards and using long balls.
THe last two games have been a mix of how we have played and in fact used quicker passing and mpre long passes rather than short passing.
Cooper played to his squads strnghts last season and that has gone ....Martinhasnt necessarily played to the strenghts of hos squad this season.....but maybe this is changing.
He seems to have founfd as better defensiveline up I have always wondered why he persisted playing the right footed Cabango on the left....even when he had a left footed player in Rhys Williams who he persisted in playing on the right.....this same player played in the champions and Premier league for Liverpool last season to good review but on the left yet Martin seemd to know better thsan Klopp....noe you see why I was critical.
NCabango Naughton and Lati looked good last two games and Manning can sllip in for Lati.
We need to be looking for a Naughtin replacement either within the acadamy or externally to come in and learn that role . Britton was fundemental to oour play in the last golden years yet we never developed a player to fit the role...we need to do this nowwith Naughts as at best hes one or two season left. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:59 - Apr 8 with 880 views | raynor94 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:48 - Apr 8 by vetchonian |
I havnet backed myself into any corner
I bagan criticisng Martin early doors as we were watching boring football with no attack and getting beaten.
I have documented my points on many posts...including data from MKDons and also the posta on their fans forum...Martin seemed obsessed with possesion rather than winning games.
He seems to have tweaked things.
No manager gets two season in football any more and why should he need two seasons?
Potter managed a top ten finish in his frist season, Cooper 6th then 4th place
People seem to have this thought that following Coopers defootballisation of the club we need a revolution...whihc will take Martin two seasons.
I am patient but many others both on here and other forums who have watched us for a long time have all been critical of MArtin's" process"
I havent backed myself into a corner if anytrhing I have been provren right given I was critical of Martins philosophy and style . In the last teo matches we have moved the ball forwards with pace, used long crossfield passes and knocked balls from height into the box for Obafemi to chase. Piroe has put some nice balls into the box from "distance" we werent doing that before.
Its alla bout opinions though and I recgonise that others may disagree.
But no manager gets two season anymore . |
Martin can achieve a top 10 finish in his first season, 7 games to go.
There's never been many against Martin, you and about 3 others on here.
Rarely would I agree with 73, but he's right here, you have backed yourself into a corner |  |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 11:06 - Apr 8 with 877 views | Whiterockin |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:24 - Apr 8 by RichardO |
Martin's team has generally played the same all season but now finally worked out a stable back three in positions where they are defensively comfortable, which three he will ultimately settle on remains to seen re. .Manning or Lati, nice to have viable options.
Still think we will be susceptible to players with pace being given the ball early Cooper countered that by when conceding position dropping deep into the two banks of defenders hence our good goal against record but dropping limits the attacking options hence the low goal for record.
Was the balance right last year with the team we had, don't really care last season is gone.
Having that stability in defence enables the midfield 6 players in all to be more focused on attacking options, unless the opposition puts the press on then the wingbacks drop deep to make 5 in defence 4 in midfield.
Have we got better players now than last season? Think we have more pacey and more skilful players overall?
Better teams and I use that term loosely, try to force mistakes and expose our weaknesses
Still work to be done, it is taking some time and I think we'll have some disappointing result yet this season.
Hopefully more joy than not.
[Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:31]
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Have we got better players now than last season? Think we have more pacey and more skilful players overall?
IMO if we had Patterson, Piroe and Obafemi instead of Ayew, Lowe and Hourihane last season we would have gone up automatically. |  | | |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 11:22 - Apr 8 with 865 views | vetchonian |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:59 - Apr 8 by raynor94 |
Martin can achieve a top 10 finish in his first season, 7 games to go.
There's never been many against Martin, you and about 3 others on here.
Rarely would I agree with 73, but he's right here, you have backed yourself into a corner |
He can yes but only through a tweak in his style...which many on here are commenting on..
There have been posters on other forums who have discussed the football of Martin and the "enjoyment" of watching us get beaten virtually every week...
The football has changed maybe you need to go back and watch some of the earlier games form this season....and compare them with the last two.
If we continue playing in the manner of the last two games a top ten finish is possible if other results go our way if he reverts to type there is no chance....shame he hadnt tweaked things earlier this season then maybe a top ten placing would hve been reality. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 12:07 - Apr 8 with 833 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:16 - Apr 8 by 73__73 |
I haven’t really been reading what you think about Martin, but let me have a guess,
You are one of the detractors who have backed themselves into a corner.
The problem with backing yourself into a corner is you then find you have nowhere to go, when things change.
Russell Martin deserves at least two seasons so he can mould the team the way he wants.
I’m not sure if you know the Piers Plowman poem, it’s where the expression “Patience is a Virtue” comes from. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:18]
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Patience doesn’t come into it for me.
It’s not like his system is working now due to the value of time. The issues surrounding the system he insisted on playing at the start are still there today, hence why we have evolved into a far more direct team when we play well.
The win at Millwall was typical “Martinball” as it were, the win at Cardiff wasn’t.
500 passes and double figures long ball %, that was the style many wanted him to adopt, hence the complaints. When we were winning comfortably, we knocked it about to frustrate them and make it hard for them - it’s fine in that situation, but that game was a mixed and direct style constantly looking for Obafemi’s pace.
Millwall was the traditional 700 passes, single digit long ball %. It worked against them, but it rarely has this season, it’s still not the right way to play to maximise our strengths.
Patience being rewarded is not an accurate way to describe it. Finally doing what we have been saying he should would be more apt.
How we played against Cardiff is what we could have played like months ago, it’s nice he’s finally started to see what’s been obvious for the last 30 games. I’m hoping it continues, but patience with that style many of us had an issue with is something that was thrown out the window long ago - and rightly so.
I don’t think anyone is against Martin, they are against the style he persisted with for far too long. Which is very difficult to argue against if you ask me.
But we are ending the season strongly as we should have been doing long before now, so better late than never and hope this really is not a false dawn this time. |  |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 12:53 - Apr 8 with 794 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 10:16 - Apr 8 by 73__73 |
I haven’t really been reading what you think about Martin, but let me have a guess,
You are one of the detractors who have backed themselves into a corner.
The problem with backing yourself into a corner is you then find you have nowhere to go, when things change.
Russell Martin deserves at least two seasons so he can mould the team the way he wants.
I’m not sure if you know the Piers Plowman poem, it’s where the expression “Patience is a Virtue” comes from. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 10:18]
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Definetly deserves and will have two seasons if it goes okay.
If it all goes wrong ( and I don't think it will ) then December would be crunch time.
Patience is being rewarded.
16 points from 24 repeated over next season would equate to 92 points.
The future is looking brighter now with Martin |  |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:03 - Apr 8 with 779 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 12:53 - Apr 8 by STID2017 |
Definetly deserves and will have two seasons if it goes okay.
If it all goes wrong ( and I don't think it will ) then December would be crunch time.
Patience is being rewarded.
16 points from 24 repeated over next season would equate to 92 points.
The future is looking brighter now with Martin |
Form of most teams is usually up and down, you can’t really take 8 favourable games and extrapolate them over the next season. Just like if we lose the next 8 it will be silly to say “next season if we continue this then we will finish on zero points”.
We are doing well at the moment, but overall we are underperforming. We are hoping he has finally learned lessons he should have learned 6 months ago. If he has then happy days, if he hasn’t then people will no doubt end up criticising again as that system is terrible.
Nature of the beast.
Patience with the system that didn’t, doesn’t and won’t work is irrelevant. A flawed system is a flawed system. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 13:05]
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:09 - Apr 8 with 777 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:03 - Apr 8 by Dr_Parnassus |
Form of most teams is usually up and down, you can’t really take 8 favourable games and extrapolate them over the next season. Just like if we lose the next 8 it will be silly to say “next season if we continue this then we will finish on zero points”.
We are doing well at the moment, but overall we are underperforming. We are hoping he has finally learned lessons he should have learned 6 months ago. If he has then happy days, if he hasn’t then people will no doubt end up criticising again as that system is terrible.
Nature of the beast.
Patience with the system that didn’t, doesn’t and won’t work is irrelevant. A flawed system is a flawed system. [Post edited 8 Apr 2022 13:05]
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I wouldn't say favourable as included Blackpool Fulham and Brum ?
I think Martin is now on the right track.
Could be something to do with a change of assistant ? | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:09 - Apr 8 with 777 views | vetchonian |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 12:53 - Apr 8 by STID2017 |
Definetly deserves and will have two seasons if it goes okay.
If it all goes wrong ( and I don't think it will ) then December would be crunch time.
Patience is being rewarded.
16 points from 24 repeated over next season would equate to 92 points.
The future is looking brighter now with Martin |
Two wins and suddenly all is well and looking rosy?
I feel the hype of the double has boosted all of us...BUT lets see how it goes from here all seemed good after the home win V Cardiff we beat West Brom next then lost at Brum and then it went a little fuzzy.
Green shoots of chaange and improvement but lets not all run away with things.
What happens if Obafemi or Piroe ( or both) end up being sold in the summer....Downes may not be as great a loss as Fulton demonstrated he can fit in maybe
Then what happens again is we are in another season of transition and more patienced will be asked for | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:17 - Apr 8 with 763 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 13:09 - Apr 8 by vetchonian |
Two wins and suddenly all is well and looking rosy?
I feel the hype of the double has boosted all of us...BUT lets see how it goes from here all seemed good after the home win V Cardiff we beat West Brom next then lost at Brum and then it went a little fuzzy.
Green shoots of chaange and improvement but lets not all run away with things.
What happens if Obafemi or Piroe ( or both) end up being sold in the summer....Downes may not be as great a loss as Fulton demonstrated he can fit in maybe
Then what happens again is we are in another season of transition and more patienced will be asked for |
I agree early days and lots of ifs and ands.
Looking a bit brighter.
Garden not blooming yet but certainly seeing rhe buds coming in sunny Birchgrove  | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 15:01 - Apr 8 with 729 views | 73__73 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 12:07 - Apr 8 by Dr_Parnassus |
Patience doesn’t come into it for me.
It’s not like his system is working now due to the value of time. The issues surrounding the system he insisted on playing at the start are still there today, hence why we have evolved into a far more direct team when we play well.
The win at Millwall was typical “Martinball” as it were, the win at Cardiff wasn’t.
500 passes and double figures long ball %, that was the style many wanted him to adopt, hence the complaints. When we were winning comfortably, we knocked it about to frustrate them and make it hard for them - it’s fine in that situation, but that game was a mixed and direct style constantly looking for Obafemi’s pace.
Millwall was the traditional 700 passes, single digit long ball %. It worked against them, but it rarely has this season, it’s still not the right way to play to maximise our strengths.
Patience being rewarded is not an accurate way to describe it. Finally doing what we have been saying he should would be more apt.
How we played against Cardiff is what we could have played like months ago, it’s nice he’s finally started to see what’s been obvious for the last 30 games. I’m hoping it continues, but patience with that style many of us had an issue with is something that was thrown out the window long ago - and rightly so.
I don’t think anyone is against Martin, they are against the style he persisted with for far too long. Which is very difficult to argue against if you ask me.
But we are ending the season strongly as we should have been doing long before now, so better late than never and hope this really is not a false dawn this time. |
I’m glad you agree with me. Patience is key 👠| |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:07 - Apr 8 with 659 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 15:01 - Apr 8 by 73__73 |
I’m glad you agree with me. Patience is key 👠|
Maybe this is the new, improved Dr P ? | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:08 - Apr 8 with 652 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 15:01 - Apr 8 by 73__73 |
I’m glad you agree with me. Patience is key 👠|
Learning is key and managers have a duty to do it quickly.
Martin has learned incredibly slowly, but he may have finally got it. Time will tell.
Patience shouldn’t have been a requirement though. If it was then why no patience with players that aren’t playing well. Why bring in Piroe when we had Cullen, just be patient with Cullen etc etc etc
Patience only comes an asset if what we are doing is the correct thing. We were not doing the correct thing by playing that awful style and that style is what people were calling for patience over. That patience was not rewarded as the style has largely been scrapped because it doesn’t work, for the reasons many pointed out long ago. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:16 - Apr 8 with 644 views | Fireboy2 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:07 - Apr 8 by STID2017 |
Maybe this is the new, improved Dr P ? |
Looks like his 'holiday' has done him the world of good 🤔 |  | | |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:22 - Apr 8 with 639 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:16 - Apr 8 by Fireboy2 |
Looks like his 'holiday' has done him the world of good 🤔 |
Would seem so ... | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:24 - Apr 8 with 637 views | builthjack |
It was always a longer plan, not just the one season. Those who think he was here to produce promotion in the first year are deluded. There's plenty of them. |  |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:27 - Apr 8 with 631 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Not sure what people are reading.
I said “patience doesn’t come into it”. It’s about learning and learning quickly.
Being patient with a flawed system is pointless, can be as patient as you like but it’s not going to change.
What has changed is we are going more direct. That’s not patience, that’s change. A change that many of us called for 35+ games ago.
Shouldn’t have taken anywhere near this long and I’m still not convinced he won’t revert to type, he did against Millwall. Thankfully we came away with a rare win from that system. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:24 - Apr 8 with 599 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 22:27 - Apr 8 by Dr_Parnassus |
Not sure what people are reading.
I said “patience doesn’t come into it”. It’s about learning and learning quickly.
Being patient with a flawed system is pointless, can be as patient as you like but it’s not going to change.
What has changed is we are going more direct. That’s not patience, that’s change. A change that many of us called for 35+ games ago.
Shouldn’t have taken anywhere near this long and I’m still not convinced he won’t revert to type, he did against Millwall. Thankfully we came away with a rare win from that system. |
We have won 13 other league games this season, prior to Cardiff.
My guess is Martin and his team must have done something right in those games ?
He has not suddenly discovered a winning formula ( like say Newcastle under Eddie Howe ) and got a very poor side winning ?
The 54 points accrued have been over the season.
So I would say patience is very much the key.
He is giving us a good foundation to build on and ( though unlikely ) could even sneak into the playoffs ( al a Cooper style ) and face the Florists ? | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:28 - Apr 8 with 595 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:24 - Apr 8 by STID2017 |
We have won 13 other league games this season, prior to Cardiff.
My guess is Martin and his team must have done something right in those games ?
He has not suddenly discovered a winning formula ( like say Newcastle under Eddie Howe ) and got a very poor side winning ?
The 54 points accrued have been over the season.
So I would say patience is very much the key.
He is giving us a good foundation to build on and ( though unlikely ) could even sneak into the playoffs ( al a Cooper style ) and face the Florists ? |
We have, but the majority of those games have been when we have ditched the 70% and 700 passes stuff and actually looked to play effective and direct football rather than just keep ball.
So patience has not paid off because the style we were told to be patient with still doesn’t work and is still clearly not our most effective way of playing.
Patience with the right style is not an issue, patience with the wrong one is just ludicrous - is what many were saying. That appears to be the case as Martin has now switched from that style to a direct and mixed one.
He still does revert to the Martinball style now and again, then it’s a lottery with regards to the result. It’s far more net negative outcome than positive though.
We look our best when we sacrifice pass number and possession for effective and direct attacking. Opponents say this also. Because it’s true.
That is what we were saying long ago. We persisted with the old style for far too long, that’s frustrating to many. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:35 - Apr 8 with 587 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Just to add on to the above.
I’m still away for this weekend so won’t be researching the data, but can when I return if anyone is interested.
But if we take our wins, and our non wins. Average each section off in terms of pass number and possession.
I would bet anything that when we win, we generally have less possession and less passes than when we don’t. That’s because we are far more dangerous and successful when we move away from the style that is recognised as “Martinball”.
A poster earlier in the thread put it very well when he said “doing something with the ball rather than just keeping it”. When we do the latter we struggle to win, because naturally everything becomes slow and there isn’t any focus on breaking the lines.
Very important to point out that the early disgruntlement was not against Martin but against the system he brought. Many were hoping he would learn quickly and change it. He didn’t, and people started to then naturally get annoyed with him.
If he’s learned then no issue. Let’s move forward.
But the narrative that those calling for patience are being rewarded is wrong. It’s more accurate to say those that called for the very changes we are now seeing are being rewarded.
Those that showed patience have simply wasted 6 months hoping a flawed system would work that has been, in the main, ditched. | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:36 - Apr 8 with 587 views | STID2017 |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:28 - Apr 8 by Dr_Parnassus |
We have, but the majority of those games have been when we have ditched the 70% and 700 passes stuff and actually looked to play effective and direct football rather than just keep ball.
So patience has not paid off because the style we were told to be patient with still doesn’t work and is still clearly not our most effective way of playing.
Patience with the right style is not an issue, patience with the wrong one is just ludicrous - is what many were saying. That appears to be the case as Martin has now switched from that style to a direct and mixed one.
He still does revert to the Martinball style now and again, then it’s a lottery with regards to the result. It’s far more net negative outcome than positive though.
We look our best when we sacrifice pass number and possession for effective and direct attacking. Opponents say this also. Because it’s true.
That is what we were saying long ago. We persisted with the old style for far too long, that’s frustrating to many. |
Is the perceived change down to a change in assistants?
I cant imagine why after so many games Martin would suddenly have an epiphany and change his style ?
We'll have to agree to disagree on the patience thing then.
You have your view and I have mine.
One thing we can both agree on is that we hope this is the start of a successful run of good performances and gives us something to build upon next season | |
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| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:43 - Apr 8 with 582 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| A big round of applause for Russell Kenneth Alexander Martin on 23:36 - Apr 8 by STID2017 |
Is the perceived change down to a change in assistants?
I cant imagine why after so many games Martin would suddenly have an epiphany and change his style ?
We'll have to agree to disagree on the patience thing then.
You have your view and I have mine.
One thing we can both agree on is that we hope this is the start of a successful run of good performances and gives us something to build upon next season |
Well it’s not the first time he changed the style to what we are seeing now. He did so before Xmas when we went on our run. He then reverted to type again and started the 700+ pass games and we naturally went on a horrendous run.
So I’d say it’s unlikely it’s down to an assistant manager, as that happened when he was still here.
That pattern has happened again too as after the last few decent results he reverted to Martinball at Millwall too. Thankfully we managed to get a win, so I wouldn’t be too shocked to see us try it again tonight (tomorrow for you).
So I’ll keep my powder dry on that one, not enough data to suggest he’s changed styles for the good. As it’s equally likely he hasn’t and is just another phase of doing so before reverting to type.
From now until the end of the season I don’t want to be seeing any more games with 750 or 800 passes and 5% long balls. If we don’t see any more then I’ll start to believe, until that time I’m skeptical.
I have no idea if this is true or not, but to me is seems like he gets a few wins under his belt playing a decent and sensible way… feels he has some wiggle room with the fans so then reverts to type again and does the 700 pass thing until people start getting angry with it… then changes back to get a few wins…
It seems very cyclical. But that could be way off the mark too, just seems to be what the pattern is. | |
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