| Sensationalism vs realism 12:43 - Feb 20 with 4031 views | Sheffield_dale |
"I've been a season ticket holder for 40 years and this is the last straw"
Ok, that may not be a direct quote but I have been seeing this kind of rhetoric on here and on social media recently. I'm left scratching my head as to why. There seems to be a trend in society/politics etc to sensationalise a viewpoint for increased attention/column inches (see Brexit) and feel this has seaped into football fandom.
For the record I accept there are issues with the board who are rightly scrutinised. I accept we didn't sign a left back. I accept the team are in poor form.
But I'm not throwing my scarf away in disgust.
I happen to work for a club in South Yorkshire and trust me, their boardroom issues FAR outweigh ours. Dale also seem to be in a ok financial position in the circumstances.
When we started the season (with all the releases) I feared we would really struggle. In fact we are just above the relegation zone, which is surely where most of us expected we would be.
The club are also recruiting roles behind the scenes which I see as a massive positive. Many others seem disgusted at this. Some of these advertised roles I actually work in...20k wage bringing in 150k income for my particular football employers. Isn't this good for our club?
We are in league 1 and have been for a while now. I love this club and will support them as best I can to stay in this excellent league and play Sunderland and Sheffield Wednesday 🙃 each week. The last few years have been incredible for Dale and I just don't understand the chronic negativity from many fans. Maybe I'm missing something.
I've paid my £10 and bought my beers for the game this afternoon to support the lads. Let's all get behind them and criticise proportionately.
Up the dale
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 12:50 - Feb 20 with 3992 views | 442Dale |
Everyone is entitled to how they feel, whichever side of the positive/negative fence they sit on and irrespective how long they’ve been there. Does giving it from an “I will/won’t” individual perspective always help? Possibly not, but it’s understandable.
Looking at it as a bigger picture is crucial. |  |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:00 - Feb 20 with 3921 views | D_Alien |
"20k wage bringing in 150k income for my particular football employers"
You make some valid points, but if recent additions to our admin side are achieving anything like the above, or adding value to what we see on the football field, it needs to be spelled out when these announcements are made - if indeed that's the objective (to help generate income) |  |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:13 - Feb 20 with 3867 views | DaleiLama |
You make some valid points, and as 442 said there will be opinions all over the map. As DA points out, if all the back office, support staff and management appointments are adding value, tell us how, why and what is the vision behind them. Cos at the mo, to extend my Titanic analogy on the other thread, it feels like a deckchair shuffling exercise from the outside looking in.
In terms of realism, most folk see a club with a small fan base, a season card price increase which deterred many from renewing, a post-pandemic further contraction almost inevitable, staring into the potential abyss of relegation further contraction and posts like that of Big Kindo suggesting the board are fiddling while Rome burns.
Less fans, less game day revenue, fewer people to advertise to and the real possibility of relegation. That's the realism the board has to react to. Now. [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:14]
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:34 - Feb 20 with 3765 views | Dale92 |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:13 - Feb 20 by DaleiLama |
You make some valid points, and as 442 said there will be opinions all over the map. As DA points out, if all the back office, support staff and management appointments are adding value, tell us how, why and what is the vision behind them. Cos at the mo, to extend my Titanic analogy on the other thread, it feels like a deckchair shuffling exercise from the outside looking in.
In terms of realism, most folk see a club with a small fan base, a season card price increase which deterred many from renewing, a post-pandemic further contraction almost inevitable, staring into the potential abyss of relegation further contraction and posts like that of Big Kindo suggesting the board are fiddling while Rome burns.
Less fans, less game day revenue, fewer people to advertise to and the real possibility of relegation. That's the realism the board has to react to. Now. [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:14]
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The club has needed to evolve for a while, now that can go 2 ways in football. Forward or Backwards. Off the field weve had many employees undertake different roles from within the mantra. That had to change, in modern football were ast the point off having 4 people run a club, if u want to suceed you need the best people in each positions on and off the pitch and looking at who's ben appointmented you csnt fault they're credentials.
On the pitch, I feel is were the real animosity comes from. In the summer we were saying the board had reinvested the money saved from hendo, camps etc in newby and Humphreys and we even paid money for some. Now more recruitment is needed and the club will now that, not having a backup lb target has bit us on the arse. But we still have big earners on money that CD and KH have out.
The need of a Sporting Director could be a way forward. It goes without saying now BBM is highly respected in the game, and yes his philosophy is questionable but its brave none the less, a possession based team on a low budget. A wise experienced footballing person who can help bridge the gap between the board and the coaching staff and players would be the bridge. We have Hilly who wanted to do it al maybe Brian doesnt.
Christ Mk Don's have Cameron Jerome and Will Grigg up front that's probably the budget of out starting 11, still being a league 1 team when fans return has to be the aim. |  |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:36 - Feb 20 with 3761 views | tony_roch975 |
Absolutely right SheffieldDale. We seem to have grown a society where rights are shouted very loud but responsibilities hardly get a whisper - I got slated on here a while back for criticising those who claim to be hardcore fans but seem to find every opportunity to have a moan. Yes, they're are problems (the greatest being the self-defeating lack of communication from the Club) and the yoyo form is worrying but above all as James said, let's get behind our team in sprit if not in person - and by all means separately advocate for a virtual AGM, Fans Forum or Trust EGM. | |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:36 - Feb 20 with 3759 views | Nigeriamark |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:13 - Feb 20 by DaleiLama |
You make some valid points, and as 442 said there will be opinions all over the map. As DA points out, if all the back office, support staff and management appointments are adding value, tell us how, why and what is the vision behind them. Cos at the mo, to extend my Titanic analogy on the other thread, it feels like a deckchair shuffling exercise from the outside looking in.
In terms of realism, most folk see a club with a small fan base, a season card price increase which deterred many from renewing, a post-pandemic further contraction almost inevitable, staring into the potential abyss of relegation further contraction and posts like that of Big Kindo suggesting the board are fiddling while Rome burns.
Less fans, less game day revenue, fewer people to advertise to and the real possibility of relegation. That's the realism the board has to react to. Now. [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:14]
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The big decision the board have to make is to stick or twist on BBM. They did it 2 years ago with Hill & it worked. If they stick then they absolutely need to stay in the division to avoid a mutiny. If they fire him & we go down they'll still get stick but some credit for trying something new which is not happening now.
Regarding Sheffs post, Ive been on the Dale message board for about 15 years + A lot of the positivity or negativity seems to have a direct relationship to the position we are in & the football we are playing. I'm pretty sure what the non-playing staff do day in and day out, & decisions they make are similar whether we are 5th from bottom or 5th from top. However response from fans is different from reasoned debate to out and out hostility & statements of fact that are just opinion. It's the same with every club, I would bet across all 4 divisions, the message boards reflect position & entertainment. When we played with no fear, were getting promoted etc, hardly a negative peep. Yet during those last 2 years of the CD/KH era ( in my opinion the best double act this club has ever had by far) there was criticism of both again ranging from reasoned to unsubstantiated
I'm as frustrated as anyone this season & I think there is some good debate on here but ultimately I'm with SD, and i'll be supporting them whatever league they are in . I'll also go into today's game with some hope that it's the day we turn it around. Perhaps delusional !!! but again ourselves & other clubs have done it "out of the blue" [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:49]
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:36 - Feb 20 with 3759 views | 442Dale |
What needs clarifying is what the direction of the club is, again. Things have changed since that forum last year which provided a good insight, so we need to know exactly what the long term plan is, especially with the lack of certainty involved right now. And if we are insisting on making comparisons with other clubs may or not be doing, let’s stick with like for like - Accrington are surely the blueprint with no delusions of grandeur achieving results on the pitch whilst looking at riding out the current storm to get to the other side and then seeing where the land lies. Not sure why any club of a similar size would be thinking differently, and if they are tell us why. | |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:58 - Feb 20 with 3666 views | SuddenLad |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:13 - Feb 20 by DaleiLama |
You make some valid points, and as 442 said there will be opinions all over the map. As DA points out, if all the back office, support staff and management appointments are adding value, tell us how, why and what is the vision behind them. Cos at the mo, to extend my Titanic analogy on the other thread, it feels like a deckchair shuffling exercise from the outside looking in.
In terms of realism, most folk see a club with a small fan base, a season card price increase which deterred many from renewing, a post-pandemic further contraction almost inevitable, staring into the potential abyss of relegation further contraction and posts like that of Big Kindo suggesting the board are fiddling while Rome burns.
Less fans, less game day revenue, fewer people to advertise to and the real possibility of relegation. That's the realism the board has to react to. Now. [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:14]
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Emperor Nero.............brilliant.
To re-iterate - these advertised jobs are being filled and then followed by a fanfare of 'haven't we done well'.
These employees are welcome, their credentials or suitability for their respective roles is not in question.
The point is, that whilst these salaries are being distributed, the team seems to have been proportionately neglected and subject to a budget cut. Asking BBM to do a job, with insufficient resources and then advertising a job for another level of supervision is ridiculous.
Give him a better budget, get behind him, support him and let him get on with the job he is employed to do, with full available resources.
Or, maybe we should employ a Senior Chief Executive Officer to oversee and assist those who are supposed to be running the show. ....... I wonder how well that idea would be received? |  |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:59 - Feb 20 with 3665 views | sxdale |
I am one of those who mentioned the length of time I have been a supporter, not cos l feel my views are more important but to try to add some context to why I feel this way.
I am not one to criticise or boo the players. I can remember the only time. Mark Stuart flicking the finger at Dale fans at Darlington, I had to be held back from running on the pitch and punching him but that is beside the point.
We are making the same mistakes game after game after game. We are told we are performing well, it's a results industry, bollox performing well don't treat me like a muppet.
I am not that bothered about the off field appointments, but don't plead poverty on one hand and increase expenditure on the other, or at least tell us how this is going to work and what benefits it will bring.
This forum is the place to air our views and disagreement is healthy. All views are valid this just happens to be mine. | | | |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 14:23 - Feb 20 with 3602 views | 56years |
Hooray - a sensible view for once - fully support your point of view! Some of the posters on here seem to participate in every thread ( do they have anything else in their lives?) and bring out the same tired points often about things that happened years ago. Anything positive is the only time they are strangely quiet - ‘well balanced’ they are certainly not.
I will be watching the match today and yes I have bought my halfway time draw tickets. I hope we win, and put in a performance we can be proud of. Frankly there are some on here who I suspect would almost be happier if we lose, so they can release some more vitriol..... | | | |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 14:27 - Feb 20 with 3578 views | DaleiLama |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 13:36 - Feb 20 by Nigeriamark |
The big decision the board have to make is to stick or twist on BBM. They did it 2 years ago with Hill & it worked. If they stick then they absolutely need to stay in the division to avoid a mutiny. If they fire him & we go down they'll still get stick but some credit for trying something new which is not happening now.
Regarding Sheffs post, Ive been on the Dale message board for about 15 years + A lot of the positivity or negativity seems to have a direct relationship to the position we are in & the football we are playing. I'm pretty sure what the non-playing staff do day in and day out, & decisions they make are similar whether we are 5th from bottom or 5th from top. However response from fans is different from reasoned debate to out and out hostility & statements of fact that are just opinion. It's the same with every club, I would bet across all 4 divisions, the message boards reflect position & entertainment. When we played with no fear, were getting promoted etc, hardly a negative peep. Yet during those last 2 years of the CD/KH era ( in my opinion the best double act this club has ever had by far) there was criticism of both again ranging from reasoned to unsubstantiated
I'm as frustrated as anyone this season & I think there is some good debate on here but ultimately I'm with SD, and i'll be supporting them whatever league they are in . I'll also go into today's game with some hope that it's the day we turn it around. Perhaps delusional !!! but again ourselves & other clubs have done it "out of the blue" [Post edited 20 Feb 2021 13:49]
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I also go into every game hoping this is the one too. I have just lost some of the belief (for obvious reasons). I've still watched every league game this year and I'll continue to do so cos that's the only way I can support the club.
Frustrated is an understatement as i dont feel we should be involved in a relegation scap with a striker like Humphreys in the team and ability at many positions - although I'm reminded of the Parcellsism - we are exactly what our record says we are | |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 14:28 - Feb 20 with 3565 views | 442Dale |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 14:23 - Feb 20 by 56years |
Hooray - a sensible view for once - fully support your point of view! Some of the posters on here seem to participate in every thread ( do they have anything else in their lives?) and bring out the same tired points often about things that happened years ago. Anything positive is the only time they are strangely quiet - ‘well balanced’ they are certainly not.
I will be watching the match today and yes I have bought my halfway time draw tickets. I hope we win, and put in a performance we can be proud of. Frankly there are some on here who I suspect would almost be happier if we lose, so they can release some more vitriol..... |
Why is any view more sensible than another? As long as a point is argued with the club in mind, there’s no reason whatsoever that it isn’t valid, even if we may not agree.
What really doesn’t help are divisive comments about how people may live their lives - applies to everyone btw - or remarks like the last one. Again, only an opinion. | |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 15:30 - Feb 20 with 3386 views | kel |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 14:23 - Feb 20 by 56years |
Hooray - a sensible view for once - fully support your point of view! Some of the posters on here seem to participate in every thread ( do they have anything else in their lives?) and bring out the same tired points often about things that happened years ago. Anything positive is the only time they are strangely quiet - ‘well balanced’ they are certainly not.
I will be watching the match today and yes I have bought my halfway time draw tickets. I hope we win, and put in a performance we can be proud of. Frankly there are some on here who I suspect would almost be happier if we lose, so they can release some more vitriol..... |
You’ll have read all the threads to come to that conclusion then? One could argue you don’t seem to have anything else in your life either. |  | | |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 15:32 - Feb 20 with 3371 views | TVOS1907 |
| Sensationalism vs realism on 15:30 - Feb 20 by kel |
You’ll have read all the threads to come to that conclusion then? One could argue you don’t seem to have anything else in your life either. |
Maybe he's not in lockdown, Kev. |  |
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| Sensationalism vs realism on 08:59 - Feb 21 with 2908 views | Barrowdale |
My issue is not the winning or losing, the off field problems, the money or any of the other topics raised apart from one thing: the style of play.
The boring tippy tappy slow defensive possession football is horrible to watch and not worth watching. It is evident that after the greater part of the season BBM might have now realised and is looking for a way out. As evidenced by all short goalkicks now seemingly removed but Keoghane et al will still pass backwards everytime by choice.
Stop this boring style and I’d renew my SC whatever league we are in, but I cant stomach much more of this. |  | | |
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