| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? 11:48 - Aug 17 with 8731 views | shawclough_dale |
Just finished the excellent overcoat men. A bit before my time but interesting parallels to Bury now. The book certainly hints at, but stops short of the notion that Hindle was a wrongun, any older fans have an opinion of him good or bad, would be interesting to hear. [Post edited 17 Aug 2019 11:49]
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| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 13:09 - Aug 17 with 8582 views | Yorkshire_Dale |
Off topic Shawclough, but is your avatar the very fine ice version of Stadt de Gigg?
I remember the story from some years ago......it might be a collectors item when the bulldozers move in?
Not read the book yet so can't comment on your question......others will. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 13:21 - Aug 17 with 8551 views | EllDale |
I got the book this week and will probably devour it in a couple of days when I'm on holiday in a fortnight.
I was always told that Andrew Hindle was certainly a villain of the piece via his Euroway (?) car group when he only wanted to allegedly get his hands on the land.
In fact he has always been painted to me in a worse light than Tommy Cannon.
Without knowing the full facts of the matter the above is merely hearsay of course. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 15:15 - Aug 17 with 8423 views | Sheffdale |
Mark's book is very even-handed with all protagonists. I was away from Rochdale at the time so it's very good to read such a thorough account. In an interview with Hindle he says that he should never have got involved with a football club as rugby union was his first love. Went on to be chair at West Hartlepool (with not much success). Portrayed as a bit of a cold fish by contemporaries although Mark said he smiled more than he expected. Euroway went down the pan so I think we have a lot to thank Killy and Graham Morris for. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 19:39 - Aug 17 with 8261 views | rhf |
B.Andrew Hindle was part of the ‘secret six’ new board members who took over and ultimately ousted Fred Ratcliffe with all the usual promises of cash etc. We finished bottom of the league in 79/80 and infamously got re-elected over Altrincham by 1 vote (26-25) with Luton and Grimsby not voting. Hindle/ Euroway allegedly had the ground, all that was needed was for us to get voted out and that would have been that! We didn’t of course and then enter kilpatrick and Morris who we owe our very existence to as we do Peter Madden who somehow got a team together out of nothing and we finished 15th in 80/81. Friend or foe- the latter ! | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 21:38 - Aug 24 with 7851 views | PotterDale |
Having just finished the book, I think he could have no qualms about being put closer to the foe end of the scale. I'd also say David Wrigley fitted the description of "wrongun", based on the books account of the period. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 14:14 - Aug 27 with 7525 views | diver |
Cyril took some stick as well | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 07:53 - Sep 5 with 7259 views | EllDale |
I've just finished reading the book whilst on holiday.
I left Rochdale in 1979 after the Doug Collins team just dodged re-election so was only able to keep up with news via the Observer.
I was 24 then so very much a child of the RAP generation and also knew most of the main characters in this book one way or another.
RAP was always having a pop at Fred Ratcliffe; a lot of this was down to the claims that he was making a lot of money from his business and lording it round the Crimble whilst some of his workforce were allegedly being paid a pittance.
David Wrigley was also a frequent target.
The one man who doesn't seem to come across particularly well at times is Bob Stokoe.
His second time at Spotland was obviously nothing like his first spell. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 08:29 - Sep 5 with 7191 views | soulboy |
Just started this book and it looks like a fascinating read, whether you were around at the time or not. Seveal great photos that I've never seen before, the one of Les Barlow makes him look like someone out of a Dickens novel! It didnt take very long after the events unfolded for us to realise how devious and cunning some of the characters were, thank God for Mr Kilpatrick and Mr Morris in particular. |  | | |
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| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 10:47 - Sep 5 with 7098 views | SuddenLad |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 08:29 - Sep 5 by soulboy |
Just started this book and it looks like a fascinating read, whether you were around at the time or not. Seveal great photos that I've never seen before, the one of Les Barlow makes him look like someone out of a Dickens novel! It didnt take very long after the events unfolded for us to realise how devious and cunning some of the characters were, thank God for Mr Kilpatrick and Mr Morris in particular. |
I spoke to Les Barlow 2 weeks ago and he still looks like someone out of a Dickens novel  |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 19:03 - Sep 6 with 6829 views | The_Knightowl |
Read this in a full sitting. More towards foe I thought. Now a follow up would be interesting on the machinations of the Tommy Cannon era. I wonder if the potential sale of the ground gained inspiration from the said previous escape. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 16:56 - Sep 17 with 6515 views | modelboydave |
David Kilpatrick certainly looks at Hindle as a friend. he is in no doubt he had the best interests of the club at heart.
thats good enough for me. |  |
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| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 17:48 - Sep 17 with 6441 views | fermin |
I've just finished the book as well,, which I found fascinating. I was aware of the basic story but the detail and background regarding the club and the characters involved was eye-opening. It added a lot of colour to the whole period.
As someone who has never lived in Rochdale I also found it interesting to read about the social/economic situation around the town at the time and the effect that had on the club. I knew the club was not very well off in those days but I don't think I really appreciated how much of a shoestring it was run on with quite a lot of the senior players (not just the short-term ones) having second jobs to make ends meet. It seems we were effectively semi-professional at that time, but perhaps some of our competitors were in a similar state. If I remember the book correctly, the PFA dispute with Bob Stokoe over fining half the wages revealed that the players earned a lot less than an unskilled labourer.
Back on topic I find it hard to see Andrew Hindle as a complete foe, having read the book. Obviously there is the issue with the ground, which on the surface looks like some sort of insurance policy if the club had gone bust as looked likely, but on the other hand he did put quite a bit of money in which kept the club going. The impression I had in advance was that he was up to no good from the start but I didn't get that from the book. As the previous poster says if Kilpatrick (who knew him) doesn't think he was bad then I will go with him.
I would also like to see a follow-up about the Cannon era as originally that was what I thought the book would be about.
Anyway, the lesson is don't lose control over your ground!
Just remembered something rather surprising I read in the epilogue, that Kilpatrick and Morris had their complimentary season tickets revoked in September 2018 (but later restored) - that seems very petty given what they did for the club. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 18:28 - Sep 17 with 6405 views | finberty |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 17:48 - Sep 17 by fermin |
I've just finished the book as well,, which I found fascinating. I was aware of the basic story but the detail and background regarding the club and the characters involved was eye-opening. It added a lot of colour to the whole period.
As someone who has never lived in Rochdale I also found it interesting to read about the social/economic situation around the town at the time and the effect that had on the club. I knew the club was not very well off in those days but I don't think I really appreciated how much of a shoestring it was run on with quite a lot of the senior players (not just the short-term ones) having second jobs to make ends meet. It seems we were effectively semi-professional at that time, but perhaps some of our competitors were in a similar state. If I remember the book correctly, the PFA dispute with Bob Stokoe over fining half the wages revealed that the players earned a lot less than an unskilled labourer.
Back on topic I find it hard to see Andrew Hindle as a complete foe, having read the book. Obviously there is the issue with the ground, which on the surface looks like some sort of insurance policy if the club had gone bust as looked likely, but on the other hand he did put quite a bit of money in which kept the club going. The impression I had in advance was that he was up to no good from the start but I didn't get that from the book. As the previous poster says if Kilpatrick (who knew him) doesn't think he was bad then I will go with him.
I would also like to see a follow-up about the Cannon era as originally that was what I thought the book would be about.
Anyway, the lesson is don't lose control over your ground!
Just remembered something rather surprising I read in the epilogue, that Kilpatrick and Morris had their complimentary season tickets revoked in September 2018 (but later restored) - that seems very petty given what they did for the club. |
"Just remembered something rather surprising I read in the epilogue, that Kilpatrick and Morris had their complimentary season tickets revoked in September 2018 (but later restored) - that seems very petty given what they did for the club."
Agreed. This proves the often-repeated view of the journalist Richard Littlejohn, which holds that any person placed in a position of power will always, always abuse it. Seems like that rule held sway, at least for a short time, here.
It wasn't that they should have revoked them - it was that they 'could'. And so 'did'.
A disgrace, in my view. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 18:39 - Sep 17 with 6388 views | RespectTheChemistry |
Bill Goodwin's doing, I believe. Thoroughly good riddance to the man.
The fact that Chris Dunphy still holds him in high regard should perhaps not be forgotten. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? (n/t) on 09:43 - Jan 25 with 3128 views | DaleiLama |
[Post edited 25 Jan 11:28]
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| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 11:41 - Jan 25 with 2949 views | turnthescrew |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 18:28 - Sep 17 by finberty |
"Just remembered something rather surprising I read in the epilogue, that Kilpatrick and Morris had their complimentary season tickets revoked in September 2018 (but later restored) - that seems very petty given what they did for the club."
Agreed. This proves the often-repeated view of the journalist Richard Littlejohn, which holds that any person placed in a position of power will always, always abuse it. Seems like that rule held sway, at least for a short time, here.
It wasn't that they should have revoked them - it was that they 'could'. And so 'did'.
A disgrace, in my view. |
Season tickets AND car park permits. Petty and spiteful in the extreme, but the culprit for that decision was the then 'Emperor of Spotland'. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 14:52 - Jan 25 with 2709 views | BigKindo |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 07:53 - Sep 5 by EllDale |
I've just finished reading the book whilst on holiday.
I left Rochdale in 1979 after the Doug Collins team just dodged re-election so was only able to keep up with news via the Observer.
I was 24 then so very much a child of the RAP generation and also knew most of the main characters in this book one way or another.
RAP was always having a pop at Fred Ratcliffe; a lot of this was down to the claims that he was making a lot of money from his business and lording it round the Crimble whilst some of his workforce were allegedly being paid a pittance.
David Wrigley was also a frequent target.
The one man who doesn't seem to come across particularly well at times is Bob Stokoe.
His second time at Spotland was obviously nothing like his first spell. |
I seem to recall that at some time in the past Fred Ratcliffe actually owned the Crimble. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 16:56 - Jan 25 with 2579 views | Duckegg |
Just bought the overcoat men and looking forward to that read.
What is the longest winter book like by fritzo as i'm thinking of getting that aswell..... |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 00:36 - Jan 26 with 2245 views | pioneer |
Its a good read and like with most things its probably worth avoiding painting individuals as entirely black (or white).
I am more concerned about some glaring errors in the book. Two which caught my eyes
The 1971 Coventry cup tie was not played on a Monday afternoon because of power shortages caused by a miners strike. There were no power shortages that winter and no miners strike. The game was ordered to be played on a Monday afternoon by the FA after Coventry manager Noel Cantwell ( yes thats an ‘a’ not a ‘u’) refused to play under the spotland floodlights. As one of the most controversial events in the clubs history I am astonished this escaped the proof checking.
The 1948 Olympics hosted 1 game of Lacrosse GB v USA as a demonstration sport. David Walkden did not play in the game and was not part of the GB squad according to Olympic records. | | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 01:17 - Jan 26 with 2237 views | Sandyman |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 00:36 - Jan 26 by pioneer |
Its a good read and like with most things its probably worth avoiding painting individuals as entirely black (or white).
I am more concerned about some glaring errors in the book. Two which caught my eyes
The 1971 Coventry cup tie was not played on a Monday afternoon because of power shortages caused by a miners strike. There were no power shortages that winter and no miners strike. The game was ordered to be played on a Monday afternoon by the FA after Coventry manager Noel Cantwell ( yes thats an ‘a’ not a ‘u’) refused to play under the spotland floodlights. As one of the most controversial events in the clubs history I am astonished this escaped the proof checking.
The 1948 Olympics hosted 1 game of Lacrosse GB v USA as a demonstration sport. David Walkden did not play in the game and was not part of the GB squad according to Olympic records. |
The first point you make about the Coventry game is 100% correct regarding C**twell's frumpiness about our floodlights. Cantwell also remarked on the 3rd round draw "Where's Rochdale?" , even though he'd played for Manchester United. He must have been a geographical ignoramus as well as a p!$$poor manager.
A song arose on the terraces, given the game's proximity to the festive season about their lightweight, ignorant, overly cocky and ultimately losing manager:
"Noel, Noel, Noel Noel,
That is the name of that b@$t@rd Cantwell"
2-1 Noel. 2-1. |  | | |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 04:51 - Jan 26 with 2209 views | D_Alien |
| Andrew Hindle friend or foe? on 01:17 - Jan 26 by Sandyman |
The first point you make about the Coventry game is 100% correct regarding C**twell's frumpiness about our floodlights. Cantwell also remarked on the 3rd round draw "Where's Rochdale?" , even though he'd played for Manchester United. He must have been a geographical ignoramus as well as a p!$$poor manager.
A song arose on the terraces, given the game's proximity to the festive season about their lightweight, ignorant, overly cocky and ultimately losing manager:
"Noel, Noel, Noel Noel,
That is the name of that b@$t@rd Cantwell"
2-1 Noel. 2-1. |
C*ntwell knew perfectly well where Rochdale was. His younger brother was a priest at St. John's RC church in the late 1960s. He was just being a tw@t [Post edited 26 Jan 4:52]
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