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Linford Christie Stadium. on 10:35 - Nov 11 by francisbowles
Is it really a massive catchment area?
When we were finishing top of the old first division, (on the last Saturday of the season), our average home attendance was 23,850 (wiki, other sites may have different figures). This was in an era when there were, arguably, a lot less distractions and reasons for staying at home and football was considerably cheaper to attend. It was also a time when a lot more of our fans lived in, around and closer to Loftus Road.
On our recent premier league seasons we averaged about 17500.
I would suggest that interest in the club has waned gradually over time as fans have moved further away and the cost of attending is prohibitive for many who either attend occasionally of not at all. The age profile of our remaining supporters continues to increase. It is believed that not enough new younger fans are attending to replace those that have moved on. We are also in an era of armchair, fridge and snacks folks who prefer to spend their hard earned on Sky, BT Sport, beer, fast food deliveries and central heating.
I would also suggest that covid will have an impact on people attending in the future. I have no idea how many but I strongly feel that some will never return as they have lost the habit of travelling and attending, have aged and may have developed fears about safety in crowds etc.
I would be very surprised if our need was more than 20000 and that we will find it almost impossible to facilitate the planning regulations and objections of local residents to achieve anything in excess of that.
Impossible to disagree with.
I’d only add that our consistent ’QPRness’ can only exacerbate the waning process due to the high level of fatigue caused by years of support.
Which then begs the question: is there any point of moving?
'Always In Motion' by John Honney available on amazon.co.uk
I’d only add that our consistent ’QPRness’ can only exacerbate the waning process due to the high level of fatigue caused by years of support.
Which then begs the question: is there any point of moving?
100% yes.
LR is too small not just attendance wise but for the average adult human to watch football in. Queues in the concourse, lucky to get served at half time, inadequate corporate facilities (a real money spinner) and everything is just unfit for purpose. The club is getting left behind.
1
Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:45 - Nov 11 with 4296 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 10:35 - Nov 11 by francisbowles
Is it really a massive catchment area?
When we were finishing top of the old first division, (on the last Saturday of the season), our average home attendance was 23,850 (wiki, other sites may have different figures). This was in an era when there were, arguably, a lot less distractions and reasons for staying at home and football was considerably cheaper to attend. It was also a time when a lot more of our fans lived in, around and closer to Loftus Road.
On our recent premier league seasons we averaged about 17500.
I would suggest that interest in the club has waned gradually over time as fans have moved further away and the cost of attending is prohibitive for many who either attend occasionally of not at all. The age profile of our remaining supporters continues to increase. It is believed that not enough new younger fans are attending to replace those that have moved on. We are also in an era of armchair, fridge and snacks folks who prefer to spend their hard earned on Sky, BT Sport, beer, fast food deliveries and central heating.
I would also suggest that covid will have an impact on people attending in the future. I have no idea how many but I strongly feel that some will never return as they have lost the habit of travelling and attending, have aged and may have developed fears about safety in crowds etc.
I would be very surprised if our need was more than 20000 and that we will find it almost impossible to facilitate the planning regulations and objections of local residents to achieve anything in excess of that.
Towards the end of the 75/76 season the ground was rammed and the gates closed. I would say that for the Arsenal and Leeds games there was close to 35/40,000 crammed into LR with thousands outside. For both those games, I was in SAR and it was over-loaded.
We have always managed to pull big crowds at finals, in the 70's (v Leicester FA Cup - 36,000) and into the 90's - that great night v Arsenal in the FA Cup. In the 90's we done well with a reduced capacity.
LR is not fit for purpose and one huge step would be a better stadium with outstanding facilities. It's a must. Get that right, improve the team post Covid (the footy landscape will change). The supporters are out there.
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:06 - Nov 11 with 4151 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:45 - Nov 11 by BostonR
Towards the end of the 75/76 season the ground was rammed and the gates closed. I would say that for the Arsenal and Leeds games there was close to 35/40,000 crammed into LR with thousands outside. For both those games, I was in SAR and it was over-loaded.
We have always managed to pull big crowds at finals, in the 70's (v Leicester FA Cup - 36,000) and into the 90's - that great night v Arsenal in the FA Cup. In the 90's we done well with a reduced capacity.
LR is not fit for purpose and one huge step would be a better stadium with outstanding facilities. It's a must. Get that right, improve the team post Covid (the footy landscape will change). The supporters are out there.
I tried getting in that day also.
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:13 - Nov 11 with 4122 views
Would love it if we could move to Linford Christie and built a modern, updated version of Loftus Road, a bit more legroom, no restricted views, but essentially the same layout, about 20k. As long as they don't build one of those ugly bowl style stadiums!!!
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:14 - Nov 11 with 4120 views
I’d only add that our consistent ’QPRness’ can only exacerbate the waning process due to the high level of fatigue caused by years of support.
Which then begs the question: is there any point of moving?
Moving isn't about capacity per se as incremental income. Yield per head is probably atrocious. Lord knows I love having a pie at half time but in the paddocks that means missing some of the game I've paid to watch, and lord knows it's worse elsewhere in the ground.
LR also has no real further usage beyond being a stadium, whereas a new place could conference rooms, housing etc
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:25 - Nov 11 with 4083 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:45 - Nov 11 by BostonR
Towards the end of the 75/76 season the ground was rammed and the gates closed. I would say that for the Arsenal and Leeds games there was close to 35/40,000 crammed into LR with thousands outside. For both those games, I was in SAR and it was over-loaded.
We have always managed to pull big crowds at finals, in the 70's (v Leicester FA Cup - 36,000) and into the 90's - that great night v Arsenal in the FA Cup. In the 90's we done well with a reduced capacity.
LR is not fit for purpose and one huge step would be a better stadium with outstanding facilities. It's a must. Get that right, improve the team post Covid (the footy landscape will change). The supporters are out there.
All ticket games those, you had to write to the club with a cheque (or postal order!) enclosing a SSAE! I was there, awesome, never experience anything like it again although Oldham was pretty close?
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:39 - Nov 11 with 4040 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 19:04 - Nov 10 by Northernr
I've started walking past this on my way into the Bush during lockdown and I have to say even getting a 15,000 seat stadium on that site, and more importantly getting 15,000 people onto it and out of it once a week, looks like a real challenge to my untrained eye. Mind you, I suppose you'd say the same if Loftus Road was suggested as a location now too.
On this London Scottish thing though, would you not just develop it together? London Irish have moved into Brentford's. Could be a great solution, split some costs, new home for both. Why does it have to be a competitor bid?
This post has been edited by an administrator
My kid's school has sports days at LCS and I've always thought the same re: the site watching him and his acne'd mates heave themselves around the athletics track. Modern stadium architecture/engineering is one among the many things I'm completely unqualified to speak about but when you're actually on that site, the footprint definitely feels... bijou.
Are we happy having a running track around the pitch? Need to bear in mind that Harriers live and are training there all week, and even if you took the pitches next to it there's no way you'd be able to keep the athletics and the football separate. There's retractable seating, but on 4 sides would be expensive and potentially problematic over time if it's constantly being moved
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:56 - Nov 11 with 4005 views
A mate has just texted me,and he follows Rugby a bit,he says that Ealing Trailfinders rugby club have an agreement with a local football team to groundshare with that local football club,assuming the rugby club get promoted this season. Are they big enough to move in with us,or would they be thinking of a local non league team?
[Post edited 11 Nov 2020 17:07]
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Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:01 - Nov 11 with 3987 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:56 - Nov 11 by stowmarketrange
A mate has just texted me,and he follows Rugby a bit,he says that Ealing Trailfinders rugby club have an agreement with a local football team to groundshare with that local football club,assuming the rugby club get promoted this season. Are they big enough to move in with us,or would they be thinking of a local non league team?
[Post edited 11 Nov 2020 17:07]
So as I understand it cos the rugby Championship isn't happening this year, Saracens are basically promoted straight back, but Ealing can also go up if they pay for it. Their ground isn't up to Prem standard so they'd need to share a la London Welsh to do it
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Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:09 - Nov 11 with 3959 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:56 - Nov 11 by golborne
Are we happy having a running track around the pitch? Need to bear in mind that Harriers live and are training there all week, and even if you took the pitches next to it there's no way you'd be able to keep the athletics and the football separate. There's retractable seating, but on 4 sides would be expensive and potentially problematic over time if it's constantly being moved
I think the plan would be to have the track and football pitch alongside each other with a shared stand in between. Like they have at Headingley for Cricket and Rugby League. So no running track around the pitch.
Linford Christie Stadium. on 10:35 - Nov 11 by francisbowles
Is it really a massive catchment area?
When we were finishing top of the old first division, (on the last Saturday of the season), our average home attendance was 23,850 (wiki, other sites may have different figures). This was in an era when there were, arguably, a lot less distractions and reasons for staying at home and football was considerably cheaper to attend. It was also a time when a lot more of our fans lived in, around and closer to Loftus Road.
On our recent premier league seasons we averaged about 17500.
I would suggest that interest in the club has waned gradually over time as fans have moved further away and the cost of attending is prohibitive for many who either attend occasionally of not at all. The age profile of our remaining supporters continues to increase. It is believed that not enough new younger fans are attending to replace those that have moved on. We are also in an era of armchair, fridge and snacks folks who prefer to spend their hard earned on Sky, BT Sport, beer, fast food deliveries and central heating.
I would also suggest that covid will have an impact on people attending in the future. I have no idea how many but I strongly feel that some will never return as they have lost the habit of travelling and attending, have aged and may have developed fears about safety in crowds etc.
I would be very surprised if our need was more than 20000 and that we will find it almost impossible to facilitate the planning regulations and objections of local residents to achieve anything in excess of that.
As an outsider who's been going to various London grounds (i.e. not solely Brentford) since 1983, may I venture the opinion that were QPR to build a new ground, it should be a minimum of 25k, and imo 30k+. (That is assuming it was reasonably close to LR, and not some industrial estate out by the M25 or wherever).
People talk about the Glory Days (1970's), when QPR were getting crowds in the mid 20k's etc. And fair enough, in the peak season of 1974/75, when you finished 2nd in the top flight, your average attendance was 23,870.
But what this fails to take into account is that the top attendance anywhere that season was Man U on 54.6k, with Liverpool next on 41.6k. Random others were Man City on 34.2k, Newcatle 32.2k, Spurs 27.8k and Arsenal 26.9k: https://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-premier-league-1975-1976/1/
Crowds are now far higher than at any time since the immediate post-war boom when, frankly, there was sod-all else to do bar the pub or the pictures.
So that now, with PL games everywhere being 95% sold out, any London club could sell 25k seats a game in a new stadium to away fans, tourists, day trippers and ground-hoppers alone, never mind regular home fans - see eg Fulham, currently extending the Cottage.
I mean, even WHU get the guts of 60k a match at the God-awful Stratford Toilet Bowl (even if tickets are at giveaway prices).
Or look at Palace, currently on 25k capacity at Selhurst, but spending a bundle to get it up to 34k - and that's for a team which just avoids relegation in a good season, but gets caught out by it in a bad one.
So if QPR ever did have a choice, imo you'd be mad to settle for anything less than 30k.
3
Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:18 - Nov 11 with 3921 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:56 - Nov 11 by stowmarketrange
A mate has just texted me,and he follows Rugby a bit,he says that Ealing Trailfinders rugby club have an agreement with a local football team to groundshare with that local football club,assuming the rugby club get promoted this season. Are they big enough to move in with us,or would they be thinking of a local non league team?
[Post edited 11 Nov 2020 17:07]
I think you need to have 10,000 capacity to play in the Rugby Union Premiership so Ealing Trailfinders would have to move. I remember hearing talk that they might share with us a couple of years ago when they were close to promotion. Don’t think any non-league grounds in the area would be big enough. Apart from Griffin Park maybe
Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:18 - Nov 11 by CliveWilsonSaid
I think you need to have 10,000 capacity to play in the Rugby Union Premiership so Ealing Trailfinders would have to move. I remember hearing talk that they might share with us a couple of years ago when they were close to promotion. Don’t think any non-league grounds in the area would be big enough. Apart from Griffin Park maybe
No local non-league ground comes close to 10k. I can't see how/why they'd want to go further afield (Watford? Wycombe? Reading?), since they wouldn't cover the rent, even with the crowds they could expect in the Prem.
With Griffin Park going under the bulldozers as we speak, I can't think of any other local(ish) alternative to Loftus Road.
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:31 - Nov 11 with 3883 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:11 - Nov 11 by NewBee
As an outsider who's been going to various London grounds (i.e. not solely Brentford) since 1983, may I venture the opinion that were QPR to build a new ground, it should be a minimum of 25k, and imo 30k+. (That is assuming it was reasonably close to LR, and not some industrial estate out by the M25 or wherever).
People talk about the Glory Days (1970's), when QPR were getting crowds in the mid 20k's etc. And fair enough, in the peak season of 1974/75, when you finished 2nd in the top flight, your average attendance was 23,870.
But what this fails to take into account is that the top attendance anywhere that season was Man U on 54.6k, with Liverpool next on 41.6k. Random others were Man City on 34.2k, Newcatle 32.2k, Spurs 27.8k and Arsenal 26.9k: https://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-premier-league-1975-1976/1/
Crowds are now far higher than at any time since the immediate post-war boom when, frankly, there was sod-all else to do bar the pub or the pictures.
So that now, with PL games everywhere being 95% sold out, any London club could sell 25k seats a game in a new stadium to away fans, tourists, day trippers and ground-hoppers alone, never mind regular home fans - see eg Fulham, currently extending the Cottage.
I mean, even WHU get the guts of 60k a match at the God-awful Stratford Toilet Bowl (even if tickets are at giveaway prices).
Or look at Palace, currently on 25k capacity at Selhurst, but spending a bundle to get it up to 34k - and that's for a team which just avoids relegation in a good season, but gets caught out by it in a bad one.
So if QPR ever did have a choice, imo you'd be mad to settle for anything less than 30k.
I was talking to a hammers fan at my local non league teams game about 6 weeks ago and he said that there is a massive waiting list for season tickets at the London soup bowl.
1
Linford Christie Stadium. on 18:09 - Nov 11 with 3795 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 10:35 - Nov 11 by francisbowles
Is it really a massive catchment area?
When we were finishing top of the old first division, (on the last Saturday of the season), our average home attendance was 23,850 (wiki, other sites may have different figures). This was in an era when there were, arguably, a lot less distractions and reasons for staying at home and football was considerably cheaper to attend. It was also a time when a lot more of our fans lived in, around and closer to Loftus Road.
On our recent premier league seasons we averaged about 17500.
I would suggest that interest in the club has waned gradually over time as fans have moved further away and the cost of attending is prohibitive for many who either attend occasionally of not at all. The age profile of our remaining supporters continues to increase. It is believed that not enough new younger fans are attending to replace those that have moved on. We are also in an era of armchair, fridge and snacks folks who prefer to spend their hard earned on Sky, BT Sport, beer, fast food deliveries and central heating.
I would also suggest that covid will have an impact on people attending in the future. I have no idea how many but I strongly feel that some will never return as they have lost the habit of travelling and attending, have aged and may have developed fears about safety in crowds etc.
I would be very surprised if our need was more than 20000 and that we will find it almost impossible to facilitate the planning regulations and objections of local residents to achieve anything in excess of that.
Crowds back in the seventies and eighties were nothing to write home about. When I came here back in the eighties we would have nine or ten thousand at top flight games, albeit for the Coventrys and Southamptons of the world. I'd often go to Highbury with my Arsenal mate on other weekends. 20 odd thousand fans were regular occurrences for the lesser lights. It was a game for the working class in those days. I'd like to see a twenty thousand seat stadium with an option to increase. Build it and they will come!!
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 18:22 - Nov 11 with 5846 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:45 - Nov 11 by BostonR
Towards the end of the 75/76 season the ground was rammed and the gates closed. I would say that for the Arsenal and Leeds games there was close to 35/40,000 crammed into LR with thousands outside. For both those games, I was in SAR and it was over-loaded.
We have always managed to pull big crowds at finals, in the 70's (v Leicester FA Cup - 36,000) and into the 90's - that great night v Arsenal in the FA Cup. In the 90's we done well with a reduced capacity.
LR is not fit for purpose and one huge step would be a better stadium with outstanding facilities. It's a must. Get that right, improve the team post Covid (the footy landscape will change). The supporters are out there.
I was at both. I used to pay on the gate and for the Arsenal game, I didn't arrive until just before kick off. The gates were locked and for the only time in my life, I had to purchase from a tout, although I think I got it at face value. I ended up standing in the paddocks. For the Leeds game, I got there a bit earlier and got in the Loft.
As for the supporters being out there, I would suggest they are the ones that only turn up for 'glory games'. We surely can't decide on a suitable capacity to include many of them.
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 18:28 - Nov 11 with 5713 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:11 - Nov 11 by NewBee
As an outsider who's been going to various London grounds (i.e. not solely Brentford) since 1983, may I venture the opinion that were QPR to build a new ground, it should be a minimum of 25k, and imo 30k+. (That is assuming it was reasonably close to LR, and not some industrial estate out by the M25 or wherever).
People talk about the Glory Days (1970's), when QPR were getting crowds in the mid 20k's etc. And fair enough, in the peak season of 1974/75, when you finished 2nd in the top flight, your average attendance was 23,870.
But what this fails to take into account is that the top attendance anywhere that season was Man U on 54.6k, with Liverpool next on 41.6k. Random others were Man City on 34.2k, Newcatle 32.2k, Spurs 27.8k and Arsenal 26.9k: https://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-premier-league-1975-1976/1/
Crowds are now far higher than at any time since the immediate post-war boom when, frankly, there was sod-all else to do bar the pub or the pictures.
So that now, with PL games everywhere being 95% sold out, any London club could sell 25k seats a game in a new stadium to away fans, tourists, day trippers and ground-hoppers alone, never mind regular home fans - see eg Fulham, currently extending the Cottage.
I mean, even WHU get the guts of 60k a match at the God-awful Stratford Toilet Bowl (even if tickets are at giveaway prices).
Or look at Palace, currently on 25k capacity at Selhurst, but spending a bundle to get it up to 34k - and that's for a team which just avoids relegation in a good season, but gets caught out by it in a bad one.
So if QPR ever did have a choice, imo you'd be mad to settle for anything less than 30k.
I think chairman Jim Gregory wasn’t reporting the ‘true’ crowd figures back then. Phil Parkes said the players were on bonuses if the crowd was over a certain amount. They played one game when it was packed to the rafters, the next day he looked in the paper and he couldn’t believe the crowd was given as 19,000. He reckons Gregory had one turnstile for the club and one for himself.
Linford Christie Stadium. on 18:28 - Nov 11 by Nov77
I think chairman Jim Gregory wasn’t reporting the ‘true’ crowd figures back then. Phil Parkes said the players were on bonuses if the crowd was over a certain amount. They played one game when it was packed to the rafters, the next day he looked in the paper and he couldn’t believe the crowd was given as 19,000. He reckons Gregory had one turnstile for the club and one for himself.
My first Rs game was the Arsenal home game, Easter Monday 1976. The 'official' attendance that day was 31k. There was hardly an inch of room in LR that day even to my eleven year old eyes.
Linford Christie Stadium. on 18:09 - Nov 11 by Paddyhoops
Crowds back in the seventies and eighties were nothing to write home about. When I came here back in the eighties we would have nine or ten thousand at top flight games, albeit for the Coventrys and Southamptons of the world. I'd often go to Highbury with my Arsenal mate on other weekends. 20 odd thousand fans were regular occurrences for the lesser lights. It was a game for the working class in those days. I'd like to see a twenty thousand seat stadium with an option to increase. Build it and they will come!!
Even for some Man Utd games we only had 10,000 in the pre premier league days.But attendances really dipped after 1985 for a few seasons all over the country. I just googled it and the Andy Gray 3-2 win against them in May 1989 was watched by a crowd of 10,010.
[Post edited 11 Nov 2020 20:35]
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Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:48 - Nov 11 with 5468 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:26 - Nov 11 by stowmarketrange
Even for some Man Utd games we only had 10,000 in the pre premier league days.But attendances really dipped after 1985 for a few seasons all over the country. I just googled it and the Andy Gray 3-2 win against them in May 1989 was watched by a crowd of 10,010.
[Post edited 11 Nov 2020 20:35]
I think that game was postponed a couple of times by cup games and then post-Hillsborough shut down. It was a midweek end of season game with nothing on it. And the United bandwagon has rusted up for a few years!
1
Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:11 - Nov 11 with 5448 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:25 - Nov 11 by hantssi
All ticket games those, you had to write to the club with a cheque (or postal order!) enclosing a SSAE! I was there, awesome, never experience anything like it again although Oldham was pretty close?
This is news to me that these games were all ticket!
I certainly didn't get tickets in advance & I was there for both games. I even had two cousins with me for the Leeds game & that was the first match they saw that season.
The Arsenal game was a morning kick off on Easter Monday & I entered Portman Road just after the 3.00pm kick off to join my wife. How I laughed about how Stan had tripped himself up to get the winning penalty!
For the Leeds match I drove to Chesham & picked up my brother & cousins before driving to The Bush. We probably were in the queue to get in at about 2.00pm & managed to stand in the same small area of LR as we had done so since our first visit.
Prior to the start of the PL & all seating, the only matches that I can remember being all ticket were FA Cup 6th round matches.
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:27 - Nov 11 with 5411 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:11 - Nov 11 by terryb
This is news to me that these games were all ticket!
I certainly didn't get tickets in advance & I was there for both games. I even had two cousins with me for the Leeds game & that was the first match they saw that season.
The Arsenal game was a morning kick off on Easter Monday & I entered Portman Road just after the 3.00pm kick off to join my wife. How I laughed about how Stan had tripped himself up to get the winning penalty!
For the Leeds match I drove to Chesham & picked up my brother & cousins before driving to The Bush. We probably were in the queue to get in at about 2.00pm & managed to stand in the same small area of LR as we had done so since our first visit.
Prior to the start of the PL & all seating, the only matches that I can remember being all ticket were FA Cup 6th round matches.
I got the first72 bus from roehampton on the morning that the tickets went on sale.I got there about 6.30 and had to queue up for a few hours before the box office opened at 9am I think. I stood on the loft that day too so I don’t know why others didn’t buy tickets.Or is my memory playing tricks again?
0
Linford Christie Stadium. on 22:18 - Nov 11 with 5328 views
Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:11 - Nov 11 by terryb
This is news to me that these games were all ticket!
I certainly didn't get tickets in advance & I was there for both games. I even had two cousins with me for the Leeds game & that was the first match they saw that season.
The Arsenal game was a morning kick off on Easter Monday & I entered Portman Road just after the 3.00pm kick off to join my wife. How I laughed about how Stan had tripped himself up to get the winning penalty!
For the Leeds match I drove to Chesham & picked up my brother & cousins before driving to The Bush. We probably were in the queue to get in at about 2.00pm & managed to stand in the same small area of LR as we had done so since our first visit.
Prior to the start of the PL & all seating, the only matches that I can remember being all ticket were FA Cup 6th round matches.
It wasn’t just us. In the 80s I would go and watch anyone I wanted when we were away. Hoddle and Waddle at Spurs, McAvennie and Brooking at West Ham, Charlie Nicholas at Arsenal, Forest winning 6-2 at Chelsea.
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