| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport 07:56 - Mar 22 with 26872 views | bosh67 |
Numbers injured, just up on the news. |  |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 12:01 - Mar 23 with 1647 views | Konk |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 11:11 - Mar 23 by BrianMcCarthy |
I've been very quiet on this thread. Don't know why. Nothing new to say. No-one has. We all have our minds made up. Kill them. Integrate them. Brexit. Work together. Minds made up. Maybe we're all suffering from battle fatigue or something.
Konk, your post hit a chord, though. It's almost identical to a phone chat I had last night with a fellow 'plastic' Irishman. We were both born in London, spent years there, struggled with our identities. Perfect balance like Linford Christie. Chip on both shoulders.
I gave money to the IRA once. In a pub in Kilburn. I said no at first. Big brave teenager. He showed me the butt of his gun. I fumbled for change. I pulled out the Queen, smiling, beguiling. Low point of my life, that.
We both had our cars pulled apart when we got the ferry 'home', by both Irish and English customs. Both sat or stood in the rain as they fugged our gear all over the puddled tarmac. Criminals. Criminal race.
We both got $hit from Orangemen, Provos, Tans, Coppers, got beaten up for having the wrong accent, wrong County, wrong Country. My brother got locked up a couple of times. I lost the accent for a while and lied about my surname if I had to.
We were the Muslims. Neither of us cared about the North really. Maybe deep down, but it wasn't worth a drop of blood, or worth the endless, mind-numbing grief and hostility. Just wanted a pint, a smoke, a woman. Our countrymen and women bombed and maimed, the Brits bombed and maimed back. Both sides felt moral outrage. Both owned the moral high ground. Both suffered unimaginable pain. Once, the IRA set off a bomb, and minutes later set off a second where they knew people would be fleeing to. That was my first thought when I heard about the second Brussels bomb.
Internment? The British tried that after 1916 and lost twenty-six counties ina horror of violence. They tried it in the six counties and lost them, too. More violence. I have no idea what the answer is, but we know it doesn't lie down that road anyway.
The parallels between Ireland and the Middle East are striking, humbling, terrifying.
About fifteen or so years ago this self-same friend was travelling to the U.S. with his new girlfriend. Matt has an Irish surname, Meehan is a gang surname. He was used to being stopped. Instead, they pulled in his girlfriend, Narissa Mohammed. The baton had been passed.
Sorry, I'm just rambling now.
RIP.
edit - spell check. [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 11:16]
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Great post Brian. I’ve spent God knows how many hours in Irish pubs around Archway, Kentish Town, Tufnell Park, Holloway and Finsbury Park and I have heard some seriously offensive comments made about “The Brits” and various IRA outrages by individuals and felt deeply uncomfortable in a couple of those pubs, but I have also spent a shedload of time in the company of Irish/2nd Generation Irish mates and their families and knew that they better represented the Irish amongst us, than the bitter hypocrites who I’d sometimes hearing mouthing off in the pubs.
I could be naïve, but I think the three Islamist idiots I see “preaching” on my local high street are fair less representative of the British Muslim population than the dozen British Muslims I work with, for instance, who seem more interested in discussing Premier League football, cricket, property prices and school catchment areas than they do discussing Jihad. |  |
| Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 12:11 - Mar 23 with 1628 views | kensalriser |
Thanks for the sane posts, Konk and Brian.
I find the bilious knee-jerk anger almost as depressing as the outrages.
No doubt these death cult nutcases are furiously self-abusing every time they hear of all muslims being blamed for their crimes, as it brings their ultimate wet dream of the armageddon day showdown with the Crusader infidels another day closer. [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 12:13]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 13:37 - Mar 23 with 1523 views | themodfather |
like paris before, this is sad news.. and i'm sick of it, but what to do?
seriously does anyone think we'd be safer if new plans for no border controls across europe go ahead? people can move freely from turkey to say calais unopposed..... |  | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 13:50 - Mar 23 with 1494 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
One man's unpalatable stuff is another man's bread and butter.
Whats the unpalatable stuff? Is it illegal in the UK or UN's eyes? |  | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 14:30 - Mar 23 with 1425 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
I'm a bit relieved Clive, I was expecting some kind of genocide.
I've never read anywhere that it's illegal to slow down or stop immigration from non EU countries. A few central and eastern european countries are limiting their refugee intake to Christian only as well.
I think a lot of people 'on the right' are getting their own way a lot of the time but don't realise it.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33986738 [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 14:31]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 14:53 - Mar 23 with 1361 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
In short, all developing countries, regardless of religion (but mostly Islamic and sub Saharan Christian) are having rapid drops in fertility while Western countries like ours have stabilised or even increased slightly.
I'm not disputing your less than 50% White British claim. This true in Brent, Newham, and Tower Hamlets right now and i'd expect a few more boroughs will join them.
But it's plateauing, and throw in increased atheism within the Islamic community due to the freedoms and education afforded to people now Islam in the UK will decelerate and soften. The Islam of violence will dwindle and disappear as the IRA did, as ETA did, as FARC is.
In the mean time, educate educate educate and stop bombing countries and making Jihadism the best paid industry around.
I know you think i'm a lefty prick, but Islam need to be criticised when it's due (Rochdale, Terrorism, or DD's favourite FGM) but let's not get a panic about it because its not called for yet.
I know it's a cliche but the majority are decent. [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 15:01]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 14:54 - Mar 23 with 1357 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
It suited Germany at the time as it has an ageing population. They have since turned the tap off. | | | |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:07 - Mar 23 with 1335 views | kensalriser |
Clive, do you see London becoming less than 50% white British as a negative thing? | |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:19 - Mar 23 with 1310 views | paulparker |
The Islam of violence will dwindle and disappear as the IRA did, as ETA did, as FARC is.
where is the evidence that this will happen, I would have thought it will get worse
we have been having these problems now since 2001 I cant see it ever ending , if anything some countries in Europe could descend into civil war in the next 20 or 30 years |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:26 - Mar 23 with 1284 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Yes that is fair.
I also said every generation will be 'less Muslim' . See Irish, African, and Caribbean immigration since the 50s.
It's not wishful thinking. Granted Islam places a greater taboo on apostasy or disbelief than other religions and cultures, but again this will soften.
I have no idea about the trend in terror attacks. Does anyone? But going on previous terrorism campaigns by other groups it will eventually disappear. I'll admit this is no consolation to the victims in the mean time.
Degree education and social education are different things. The London, Paris and Brussels bombers etc, were used for their warped and exceptional backwards thinking and i'd say no amount of education would have helped them. There will always be those like that. Gun massacres in the states were committed by kids educated about gun safety. Although victims of terrorism number in the hundreds of thousands, the perpetrators would barely fill the Paddocks at LR. They are the exception etc.
It is 100% a ideology problem, but ideologies die. Sometimes suddenly. | | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:27 - Mar 23 with 1282 views | timcocking |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:07 - Mar 23 by kensalriser |
Clive, do you see London becoming less than 50% white British as a negative thing? |
"Clive, do you see London becoming less than 50% British as a negative thing? "
If you remove the word white from your post, now what do you think the answer should be? |  | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:35 - Mar 23 with 1265 views | Konk |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:19 - Mar 23 by paulparker |
The Islam of violence will dwindle and disappear as the IRA did, as ETA did, as FARC is.
where is the evidence that this will happen, I would have thought it will get worse
we have been having these problems now since 2001 I cant see it ever ending , if anything some countries in Europe could descend into civil war in the next 20 or 30 years |
As with Bosnia & Herzegovina, that's a possibility if noisy extremists, unrepresentative of the majority populations are allowed to spread disharmony and fear. People really ought to think on when they demonise several million people on account of the actions of a minority. If you ban any further Muslim migration, then what does that say to the 2m Muslims who are already here, most of whom having been born and bred in the UK? That they're unwanted? Unwelcome? Second class citizens? Considered alien? How exactly will that help? You might think the country would be better of with no Muslims, but it's not going to happen, so surely we all have a responsibility to strive for peaceful coexistence, regardless of the actions of a few hundred extremists.
As has been said, ISIS and the like hope to spread division in the West because they know that hugely suits their interests. | |
| Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:38 - Mar 23 with 1259 views | Pommyhoop |
Is it too early to say the Belgian police/security forces dont seem up to much. They had a gunfight with them 8 days ago and they slipped away FFS.
They arrested that Paris bomber a couple of days ago and they must have
gone up to Def Con 5.But still they let 3 ( or is it 4 now) young Arab males
waltz into the airport unchallenged. I mean how sus do those blokes in the pic look? There's no way that would've happened in the UK . [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 15:39]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:39 - Mar 23 with 1252 views | kensalriser |
I didn't know where you were going with it as I didn't really see it as being very relevant to the topic of a growing Muslim population.
Bearing in mind that London's population is always in flux I'm wondering what the evidence is for this 'mass flight of native population'? I'm not sure how you're defining 'native' but where I live there are noticeably more white people than there were 20 years or even 10 years ago although obviously other areas will have different trends.
You seem a bit sensitive about being called a racist. | |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:55 - Mar 23 with 1213 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 15:19 - Mar 23 by paulparker |
The Islam of violence will dwindle and disappear as the IRA did, as ETA did, as FARC is.
where is the evidence that this will happen, I would have thought it will get worse
we have been having these problems now since 2001 I cant see it ever ending , if anything some countries in Europe could descend into civil war in the next 20 or 30 years |
I'm using the past precedents I mentioned as evidence.
What evidence are you using to say it will get worse?
2001 was 15 years ago. I never said it will be quick.
The IRA operated (with serious bombing) for 40 years. | | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:03 - Mar 23 with 1200 views | Pommyhoop |
This is nothing like the IRA.
It's like saying The Boer War in on par with WW2 | |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:03 - Mar 23 with 3227 views | Juzzie |
I think the biggest problem is that on the global scale the British Isles is small in both actual size and population. It really is.
India and the Asian sub-continent is huge. China is huge, the middle east is huge, Africa is huge.
If everyone comes over here then irrespective of the politics and religion, there simply isn't enough room & infrastructure. We simply cannot cope. That's before all the issues of having all these different cultures, faiths etc all trying (or not) to intergrate.
IMO there's too much guilt & pressure being put on us (from the Empire days) to accommodate the world's population from its own problems. |  | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:12 - Mar 23 with 3206 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:03 - Mar 23 by Juzzie |
I think the biggest problem is that on the global scale the British Isles is small in both actual size and population. It really is.
India and the Asian sub-continent is huge. China is huge, the middle east is huge, Africa is huge.
If everyone comes over here then irrespective of the politics and religion, there simply isn't enough room & infrastructure. We simply cannot cope. That's before all the issues of having all these different cultures, faiths etc all trying (or not) to intergrate.
IMO there's too much guilt & pressure being put on us (from the Empire days) to accommodate the world's population from its own problems. |
It hasn't suddenly appeared though has it? It's taken 200 years since the invention of the steam boat to get to 12% non British. | | | |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:14 - Mar 23 with 3203 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:03 - Mar 23 by Pommyhoop |
This is nothing like the IRA.
It's like saying The Boer War in on par with WW2 |
Scale is different obviously. But fundamentally the same. Wholesale murder in the name of nationalism, religion, and politics. [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 16:17]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:34 - Mar 23 with 3167 views | Pommyhoop |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:14 - Mar 23 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Scale is different obviously. But fundamentally the same. Wholesale murder in the name of nationalism, religion, and politics. [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 16:17]
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I'm glad you've acknowledged that the bombings has something to do with religion i.e Islam.
You don't hear that very often these days, especially from a self confessed lefty/ liberal.  [Post edited 23 Mar 2016 16:35]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:40 - Mar 23 with 3150 views | Juzzie |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:12 - Mar 23 by BazzaInTheLoft |
It hasn't suddenly appeared though has it? It's taken 200 years since the invention of the steam boat to get to 12% non British. |
Population increase is exponential though.
UK;
World;
Same pattern.
200 hundred years ago there were just under 1 billion people, now it's 8 billion+.
This planet, let alone the UK, cannot cope with this rise.
I read an article a few years about "underground sun". If I recall it was alluding that population growth is linked to our ability to tap into underground resources; oil, iron ore, gold, silver and all other metals, rock of all kinds, salt, coal, minerals, even deep sea fishing.
All the while we could just use surface resources (mainly farming/agriculture etc) the population was fairly level.
Once the industrial revolution kicked in and we got better & better at drawing on underground resources the population exploded.
One day they'll all start running out.
[Post edited 23 Mar 2016 16:43]
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:47 - Mar 23 with 3121 views | Pommyhoop |
Anyone got a chart for London? | |
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| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:51 - Mar 23 with 3108 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Two explosions this morning at Brussels Airport on 16:40 - Mar 23 by Juzzie |
Population increase is exponential though.
UK;
World;
Same pattern.
200 hundred years ago there were just under 1 billion people, now it's 8 billion+.
This planet, let alone the UK, cannot cope with this rise.
I read an article a few years about "underground sun". If I recall it was alluding that population growth is linked to our ability to tap into underground resources; oil, iron ore, gold, silver and all other metals, rock of all kinds, salt, coal, minerals, even deep sea fishing.
All the while we could just use surface resources (mainly farming/agriculture etc) the population was fairly level.
Once the industrial revolution kicked in and we got better & better at drawing on underground resources the population exploded.
One day they'll all start running out.
[Post edited 23 Mar 2016 16:43]
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The world population is predicted to plateau at 11 billion in 2100.
There will be problems (climate change, migration, water and energy demand) but nothing current and future technology can't cope with.
I put a link to him earlier but research Hans Rosling if you can. | | | |
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