| Self employed 13:58 - Mar 24 with 4873 views | builthjack |
Still no announcement, so people will go out to work to get money to live.
Why are they taking so long to help these people?
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| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 11:42 - Mar 27 with 1119 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 11:32 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
Yes, he's one of the unfortunate ones. I have no doubt that coming up with a plan for the self-employed was extremely challenging. Out of curiosity, what would you have done?
On the broader subject of freelancers/self-employed. I worked in an industry where there were/are a lot of freelancers/contractors - I don't know if they were technically self-employed and/or what the difference is. One-man companies I suppose. They always earned about twice what us permies were earning. Paid themselves as little a salary as possible and then big dividends. IR35 tried to crack down on it but was largely unsuccessful. Their argument was that they had no job security, whereas in reality some of the contractors had been in place longer than a lot of the permanent staff. Financially, it was very attractive but I never had the balls to do it because I had a wife and kids to support. The only way I would have taken the option would have been if I had a large nest-egg to fall back on in times of hardship. |
I would have given every working person minimum wage of 40 hours a week.
Treat everyone the same.
Going onto your other bits, I would point out that self employed get no holiday pay, no bank holidays, no sickness as they rarely claim, no pension, and plenty of other things. So they should get at least half as much of what they would get on the cards. | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 12:34 - Mar 27 with 1070 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 11:42 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
I would have given every working person minimum wage of 40 hours a week.
Treat everyone the same.
Going onto your other bits, I would point out that self employed get no holiday pay, no bank holidays, no sickness as they rarely claim, no pension, and plenty of other things. So they should get at least half as much of what they would get on the cards. |
And how do you identify "every working person"?
Re your second point - agreed about sick and holidays, etc, but in my business they were earning twice what the permies were. And they'd come to work when they were sick, and spread their germs around, because they didn't want to lose money. Like I said, I wish I'd had the balls to do it myself, but I wouldn't have without a serious amount of savings to fall back on. That's just me though - fiscally careful. |  | | |
| Self employed on 13:26 - Mar 27 with 1038 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 12:34 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
And how do you identify "every working person"?
Re your second point - agreed about sick and holidays, etc, but in my business they were earning twice what the permies were. And they'd come to work when they were sick, and spread their germs around, because they didn't want to lose money. Like I said, I wish I'd had the balls to do it myself, but I wouldn't have without a serious amount of savings to fall back on. That's just me though - fiscally careful. |
Every self employed or employed person.
Don't blame you not going self employed. It's high risk, and no security. | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 13:54 - Mar 27 with 1022 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 13:26 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
Every self employed or employed person.
Don't blame you not going self employed. It's high risk, and no security. |
I'm no expert, but how do you identify all the self-employed - especially the '"recently self-employed". It's easy if they've submitted tax returns or VAT returns or whatever else they have to do. | | | |
| Self employed on 14:04 - Mar 27 with 1014 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 13:54 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
I'm no expert, but how do you identify all the self-employed - especially the '"recently self-employed". It's easy if they've submitted tax returns or VAT returns or whatever else they have to do. |
You register for self employment, so they should know. [Post edited 27 Mar 2020 14:05]
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| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 14:08 - Mar 27 with 1011 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 14:04 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
You register for self employment, so they should know. [Post edited 27 Mar 2020 14:05]
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So, in your scheme, could I register for self-employment and claim some money? Even though I have no intention of working and they have no idea what my likely income is (not) going to be? | | | |
| Self employed on 15:00 - Mar 27 with 975 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 14:08 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
So, in your scheme, could I register for self-employment and claim some money? Even though I have no intention of working and they have no idea what my likely income is (not) going to be? |
I guess you will get paid | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 15:37 - Mar 27 with 950 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 15:00 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
I guess you will get paid |
In that case, I like your scheme because I have no intention of doing anything - just claiming the money. Thanks! | | | |
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| Self employed on 15:40 - Mar 27 with 950 views | longlostjack |
| Self employed on 14:08 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
So, in your scheme, could I register for self-employment and claim some money? Even though I have no intention of working and they have no idea what my likely income is (not) going to be? |
Anybody who had registered by Feb 1st 2020 would be the answer to that. I agree with Builth though. A flat rate for everybody would be fairer (I think in Belgium it's € 350 per week) or 70% of net income based on previous tax returns whichever is the higher. The 10% difference from self employed AND employees due under the current scheme could go towards funding the flat rate for those who don't get anything as it stands. [Post edited 27 Mar 2020 15:44]
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| Self employed on 15:42 - Mar 27 with 947 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 15:37 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
In that case, I like your scheme because I have no intention of doing anything - just claiming the money. Thanks! |
Prick | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 16:01 - Mar 27 with 925 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 15:42 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
Prick |
No need for that mate. Just trying to show how difficult it is to come up with any scheme for the self-employed. Even Andy Chamberlain of the IPSE yesterday was fairly complimentary, while acknowledging that it wasn't perfect. I defy you to come up with a perfect scheme. Crack on with the name calling though. | | | |
| Self employed on 16:02 - Mar 27 with 923 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 16:01 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
No need for that mate. Just trying to show how difficult it is to come up with any scheme for the self-employed. Even Andy Chamberlain of the IPSE yesterday was fairly complimentary, while acknowledging that it wasn't perfect. I defy you to come up with a perfect scheme. Crack on with the name calling though. |
You sounded as if you are ok jack, so Fck the ones who get nothing. | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 16:30 - Mar 27 with 908 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 16:02 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
You sounded as if you are ok jack, so Fck the ones who get nothing. |
Not at all. I just think it's incredibly difficult to please all the people all of the time. Supposedly the measures introduced yesterday cover 95%. There will always be edge cases. Women's pension age, etc. Andy Chamberlain said something like "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good".
I'm not sure the 5% get nothing either. There's other support available, no?
My general point about the self-employed was: I bet there are loads of people, working for other people or companies, that think they could set out on their own and earn more money by cutting out their current boss and keeping more of the money the client pays. Well, yes, normally. Except when a catastrophe like this happens. So, personally, I'd never take on the risk without having a fallback plan. It's like people complaining that their investments have gone down and they're ruined. Those people shouldn't have been investing in the first place. | | | |
| Self employed on 17:14 - Mar 27 with 887 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 16:30 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
Not at all. I just think it's incredibly difficult to please all the people all of the time. Supposedly the measures introduced yesterday cover 95%. There will always be edge cases. Women's pension age, etc. Andy Chamberlain said something like "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good".
I'm not sure the 5% get nothing either. There's other support available, no?
My general point about the self-employed was: I bet there are loads of people, working for other people or companies, that think they could set out on their own and earn more money by cutting out their current boss and keeping more of the money the client pays. Well, yes, normally. Except when a catastrophe like this happens. So, personally, I'd never take on the risk without having a fallback plan. It's like people complaining that their investments have gone down and they're ruined. Those people shouldn't have been investing in the first place. |
I agree it's difficult. But it's not difficult if they give everyone the same. It's damn easy.
What should be difficult is having the tenacity to not give some a single penny. They know that these people will have to carry on working. It must be part of the master plan. Mad. | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 17:54 - Mar 27 with 856 views | Jack59 |
| Self employed on 19:04 - Mar 24 by Cooperman |
I think we have to be a little more patient whilst Boris and his team work all of this out. They haven't had the luxury of being able to go the the shelf and pick out the manual on how to implement the solution. No government has been afforded this situation.
What they have managed to accomplish in a very few short days has been nothing short of miraculous and there is much more to come (let's not confuse this subject with the lock down topic). Regardless of whether we are talking about personnel on PAYE or the self employed, the sheer volume of IT work going on in the background to make all this happen is truly staggering.
This is not a party political broadcast by the Conservative Party. It is simply a reflection on the need to work out these solutions right first time. |
Yes, good to see someone has some sense. There will for sure also be tens of thousands of fraudulent claims, and this is public money after all. There has to be some safeguards put in place.
I spent over twenty years of my life self employed. I barely made a living in any of those years. but there was certainly no time that I couldn't have gone a month or two without income, I can't believe there are genuine people in such a situation, but if there are, then maybe they are not cut out for self employment. They don't know the basics. | | | |
| Self employed on 02:09 - Mar 28 with 782 views | STID2017 |
| Self employed on 11:42 - Mar 27 by builthjack |
I would have given every working person minimum wage of 40 hours a week.
Treat everyone the same.
Going onto your other bits, I would point out that self employed get no holiday pay, no bank holidays, no sickness as they rarely claim, no pension, and plenty of other things. So they should get at least half as much of what they would get on the cards. |
So someone who has recently turned self employed, may not be able to prove income, you'd give them 40 hours pay.
I have my own company (employ no one), but haven't worked this year.
Would I qualify for 40 hours pay as I cannot prove my income for the previous tax year ? |  |
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| Self employed on 07:54 - Mar 28 with 737 views | ItchySphincter |
| Self employed on 16:30 - Mar 27 by ploppy |
Not at all. I just think it's incredibly difficult to please all the people all of the time. Supposedly the measures introduced yesterday cover 95%. There will always be edge cases. Women's pension age, etc. Andy Chamberlain said something like "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good".
I'm not sure the 5% get nothing either. There's other support available, no?
My general point about the self-employed was: I bet there are loads of people, working for other people or companies, that think they could set out on their own and earn more money by cutting out their current boss and keeping more of the money the client pays. Well, yes, normally. Except when a catastrophe like this happens. So, personally, I'd never take on the risk without having a fallback plan. It's like people complaining that their investments have gone down and they're ruined. Those people shouldn't have been investing in the first place. |
You’ve obviously got a chip in your shoulder about the self employed. Your insinuation is that self employment is all about tax avoidance.
Builth got you summed up in one word. |  |
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| Self employed on 10:07 - Mar 28 with 665 views | ploppy |
| Self employed on 07:54 - Mar 28 by ItchySphincter |
You’ve obviously got a chip in your shoulder about the self employed. Your insinuation is that self employment is all about tax avoidance.
Builth got you summed up in one word. |
Not particularly. I just think people should go into it with their eyes open. | | | |
| Self employed on 10:53 - Mar 28 with 645 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 02:09 - Mar 28 by STID2017 |
So someone who has recently turned self employed, may not be able to prove income, you'd give them 40 hours pay.
I have my own company (employ no one), but haven't worked this year.
Would I qualify for 40 hours pay as I cannot prove my income for the previous tax year ? |
You would be a very rare case G. The large majority of self employed have to work, as they would have no money otherwise. They don't go self employed to sit at home.
They would also have had the cost of setting up a business, so for them now to be left with no income whatsoever , in my opinion, is a disgusting decision from the government.
As I have said previously, they are now forced to work or starve. | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 11:05 - Mar 28 with 633 views | NotLoyal |
| Self employed on 10:53 - Mar 28 by builthjack |
You would be a very rare case G. The large majority of self employed have to work, as they would have no money otherwise. They don't go self employed to sit at home.
They would also have had the cost of setting up a business, so for them now to be left with no income whatsoever , in my opinion, is a disgusting decision from the government.
As I have said previously, they are now forced to work or starve. |
There is no reason whatsoever why people should be starving in the UK, none at all.
It won’t happen, admittedly the freebies given to some and not others are unequal, but the belief people will die as a result of this is somewhat incorrect. |  |
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| Self employed on 11:11 - Mar 28 with 625 views | raynor94 |
| Self employed on 10:53 - Mar 28 by builthjack |
You would be a very rare case G. The large majority of self employed have to work, as they would have no money otherwise. They don't go self employed to sit at home.
They would also have had the cost of setting up a business, so for them now to be left with no income whatsoever , in my opinion, is a disgusting decision from the government.
As I have said previously, they are now forced to work or starve. |
But in fairness, how can you say, pay somebody who say they have gone self employed since April last year? |  |
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| Self employed on 11:16 - Mar 28 with 618 views | ItchySphincter |
| Self employed on 10:07 - Mar 28 by ploppy |
Not particularly. I just think people should go into it with their eyes open. |
Or those that have no idea of what their talking about keep their mouths shut.
No one could have seen this coming, or made provisions for it, but you’re one of the ‘I’m alright jack’ lucky ones. Just because you didn’t have the balls to go self employed it doesn’t mean those of us that did deserve to fall through the cracks, and I can assure you I pay all my tax, completely up to date, most likely considerably more than you too, so you can go f*ck yourself, prick. | |
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| Self employed on 11:19 - Mar 28 with 613 views | ItchySphincter |
| Self employed on 10:53 - Mar 28 by builthjack |
You would be a very rare case G. The large majority of self employed have to work, as they would have no money otherwise. They don't go self employed to sit at home.
They would also have had the cost of setting up a business, so for them now to be left with no income whatsoever , in my opinion, is a disgusting decision from the government.
As I have said previously, they are now forced to work or starve. |
I can’t work, my industry has collapsed. My clients aren’t paying their bills or answering their phones/emails, and the gov has left us swinging. We are the workforce they wanted and encouraged. Yet some arseholes think we had it coming because we should have had our eyes open. [Post edited 28 Mar 2020 11:21]
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| Self employed on 11:20 - Mar 28 with 610 views | builthjack |
| Self employed on 11:05 - Mar 28 by NotLoyal |
There is no reason whatsoever why people should be starving in the UK, none at all.
It won’t happen, admittedly the freebies given to some and not others are unequal, but the belief people will die as a result of this is somewhat incorrect. |
Just have a word with my neighbour who put his life savings into going self employed in January. Now, unless he works, he won't get a penny. He won't starve, as he could go to food banks, you are right.
My point was why should he get nothing and the rest get everything.
Do you think it right? | |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Self employed on 11:22 - Mar 28 with 603 views | dickythorpe |
A few self-employed people I know have said they now will be putting themselves on the books , so they'd be declaring that they pay themselves a salary.
It's incredibly tough times.
I know one bloke with a very niche business in falconry. He doesn't make that much(less than 4k profit a year,) but he's applying for universal credit as he has 2 young kids and his wife only earns minimum wage .
I think I heard he's had to pay a fee to get universal credit?
Horrible messy time. [Post edited 28 Mar 2020 11:23]
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