| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:02 - Jan 29 with 7157 views | 442Dale |
On one subject in there:
<<“ iii) Volunteer Army
➢ What have been the positive outcomes achieved since the Volunteer Army meeting in October (with specific reference to the proposed routes forward in the report from the meeting)?
1) Dale Directory – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
2) Matchday – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
3) One Off Projects – some response to calls for assistance on areas such as Christmas Draw, Boxing Day Ticket Promotion, Display Cabinet renovation, etc.
4) Recurring Projects – Reasonable response in some cases, but as is the nature with volunteering, this can be quite transient. Fanbase contribution has been limited, though. For example, we had a recent graduate volunteering with us for one day per week in an administrative role, however after a couple of months he secured permanent employment elsewhere, and we have been unable to replace with anyone of a similar calibre.
Our partnership with UCFB has been enhanced, and we have a small pool of current students who are undertaking a range of tasks.
Redwood School continue to be an excellent partner, and have extended their duties recently to include cleaning and preparation of Academy kit, for example.
Staff from the Community Trust continue to fill many valuable matchday roles at no cost to the club.”>>
- How much “website content” was there after the initial report from the meeting?
- How many “social media posts” were there? When was the last one?
Then this:
<<“ What future plans do the club have in place to utilise the myriad of different skills across the fanbase to ensure all possible revenue streams are maximised?
We remain open to speaking to anyone and everyone. We have appealed to the fanbase on several occasions, however response rate so far has been very low. We will keep trying. On a couple of occasions, prospective volunteers have met with the club to share their ideas, but do not have the capacity to execute their ideas personally. Ideas are well received, but we need volunteers to actually undertake them.”>>
“response so far has been very low”
So has the the response to all the hours of work put in by supporters last year during the fans meeting with the Trust.
What exactly have the club done about all that?
Attitude is everything. |  |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:15 - Jan 29 with 7103 views | 442Dale |
<<“ Will the club confirm they are aware of and can commit to ensuring previously agreed fan engagement meetings take place as scheduled?
All have taken place so far as scheduled, other than a kit and merchandise focus group that was originally scheduled for 30/11/23. It was deemed necessary to postpone, given events at that time. We would hope that there is sufficient support from the fanbase, as last year this event attracted a low number, for reasons we have never established”>>
Since September:
Thursday 28th September 2023
Focus Group - Volunteer Army
TOOK PLACE ON 5/10/23.
Thursday 26th October 2023
Club Board/Staff Reps & Dale Trust - meeting three
POSTPONED TWICE. TOOK PLACE 23/11/23.
Thursday 30th November 2023
Focus Group - 24/25 playing kit, merchandise, etc
POSTPONED. STILL TO TAKE PLACE.
Thursday 21st December 2023
Club Board/Staff Reps & Dale Trust - meeting four
POSTPONED. NIGHT OF THE CLUB AGM.
Thursday 25th January 2024
Fans Forum
POSTPONED. NOW SCHEDULED FOR 29/2/24.
Thursday 29th February 2024
Club Board/Staff Reps & Dale Trust - meeting five
NOW THE DATE OF THE FANS FORUM.
So was the Trust meeting with the board on 25/1 “meeting four” or “meeting five”?
——
Looking at facts helps to paint a clearer picture. Something previous regimes at Spotland were rightly held accountable for as well. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:21 - Jan 29 with 7070 views | RAFCBLUE |
"As we are all aware, the club continues to trade as a direct result of on-going financial support from Simon Gauge and Richard Knight."
"Simon was keen to explore how the Trust, as the largest shareholder in the club, could bring financial support to the table."
The minutes are really good and a real insight, but that's the crux. |  |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:30 - Jan 29 with 7033 views | 442Dale |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:21 - Jan 29 by RAFCBLUE |
"As we are all aware, the club continues to trade as a direct result of on-going financial support from Simon Gauge and Richard Knight."
"Simon was keen to explore how the Trust, as the largest shareholder in the club, could bring financial support to the table."
The minutes are really good and a real insight, but that's the crux. |
Yep, a real insight indeed.
Not sure why we don’t know anything further about protecting the pitch, and therefore the ground, should the Trust be unsuccessful in their Community Asset Fund bid. The question was simple enough. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:45 - Jan 29 with 6987 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:30 - Jan 29 by 442Dale |
Yep, a real insight indeed.
Not sure why we don’t know anything further about protecting the pitch, and therefore the ground, should the Trust be unsuccessful in their Community Asset Fund bid. The question was simple enough. |
Suggest you email the Trust 442. Perhaps there isn't an obvious answer to sell a prime asset for well below market value?
The Trust's minutes do show the startling reality is starting to hit home of at this level in the non-league:
23/24 season: Acadamy costs the club - £154,000 being the difference between a grant of £499,000 less required expenditure of £654,000.
24/25 season: Academy will cost the club - £404,500 being the difference between a grant which reduces to £249,500 less the required expenditure of £654,000.
25/26 season: No funding.
So someone will have to find a way to fund an incremental £250,500 for the Academy to stand still from 1st July, assuming conditionally we are not back in the EFL and noting that the £654,000 has to be committed at the outset to obtain the funding in the first place.
How many Academy players have featured this season to justify that £154,000? | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:50 - Jan 29 with 6963 views | 442Dale |
I did. It was simple enough.
Thanks. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:15 - Jan 29 with 6890 views | Rodingdale |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:02 - Jan 29 by 442Dale |
On one subject in there:
<<“ iii) Volunteer Army
➢ What have been the positive outcomes achieved since the Volunteer Army meeting in October (with specific reference to the proposed routes forward in the report from the meeting)?
1) Dale Directory – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
2) Matchday – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
3) One Off Projects – some response to calls for assistance on areas such as Christmas Draw, Boxing Day Ticket Promotion, Display Cabinet renovation, etc.
4) Recurring Projects – Reasonable response in some cases, but as is the nature with volunteering, this can be quite transient. Fanbase contribution has been limited, though. For example, we had a recent graduate volunteering with us for one day per week in an administrative role, however after a couple of months he secured permanent employment elsewhere, and we have been unable to replace with anyone of a similar calibre.
Our partnership with UCFB has been enhanced, and we have a small pool of current students who are undertaking a range of tasks.
Redwood School continue to be an excellent partner, and have extended their duties recently to include cleaning and preparation of Academy kit, for example.
Staff from the Community Trust continue to fill many valuable matchday roles at no cost to the club.”>>
- How much “website content” was there after the initial report from the meeting?
- How many “social media posts” were there? When was the last one?
Then this:
<<“ What future plans do the club have in place to utilise the myriad of different skills across the fanbase to ensure all possible revenue streams are maximised?
We remain open to speaking to anyone and everyone. We have appealed to the fanbase on several occasions, however response rate so far has been very low. We will keep trying. On a couple of occasions, prospective volunteers have met with the club to share their ideas, but do not have the capacity to execute their ideas personally. Ideas are well received, but we need volunteers to actually undertake them.”>>
“response so far has been very low”
So has the the response to all the hours of work put in by supporters last year during the fans meeting with the Trust.
What exactly have the club done about all that?
Attitude is everything. |
Thanks for posting this and of course well done to the trust for holding the club to account and putting the fans questions.
But what comes across is the complete lack of enthusiasm and not much short of contempt the board have for fan involvement. Their interest in the trust boils down to just wanting cash.
I’ve been critical of SG since the Jan 2023 New Year Statement ‘we need to move away from fan owned model’. His approach has resulted in us playing at the lowest level ever in the clubs history, we can no longer say we are well run, the ground, the team all being run down. Ominously - the board now blaming fan apathy, to do so is so disappointing given the fans have consistently supported the club irrespective of what’s offered up over our history, we don’t have a choice - were fans.
Seeking an investor isn’t working is it? I personally can’t see why anyone would pay £2.35/share, and if we are in so precarious a position, then surely its a matter of when we go bust not if. We own the ground which is a positive, but we need a fan led club, with the club engaging fans and the wider community properly, maybe playing at a lower level - at every opportunity Gauge demonstrates he’s absolutely not the man for that job. He’s not for turning. He just doesn’t get what the club means to so many people, he's had enough and wants out and that all that matters to him.
If someone can post a more optimistic outlook then I’d like to hear it, because it feels like we’re slipping away now. |  | | |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:22 - Jan 29 with 6867 views | D_Alien |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:15 - Jan 29 by Rodingdale |
Thanks for posting this and of course well done to the trust for holding the club to account and putting the fans questions.
But what comes across is the complete lack of enthusiasm and not much short of contempt the board have for fan involvement. Their interest in the trust boils down to just wanting cash.
I’ve been critical of SG since the Jan 2023 New Year Statement ‘we need to move away from fan owned model’. His approach has resulted in us playing at the lowest level ever in the clubs history, we can no longer say we are well run, the ground, the team all being run down. Ominously - the board now blaming fan apathy, to do so is so disappointing given the fans have consistently supported the club irrespective of what’s offered up over our history, we don’t have a choice - were fans.
Seeking an investor isn’t working is it? I personally can’t see why anyone would pay £2.35/share, and if we are in so precarious a position, then surely its a matter of when we go bust not if. We own the ground which is a positive, but we need a fan led club, with the club engaging fans and the wider community properly, maybe playing at a lower level - at every opportunity Gauge demonstrates he’s absolutely not the man for that job. He’s not for turning. He just doesn’t get what the club means to so many people, he's had enough and wants out and that all that matters to him.
If someone can post a more optimistic outlook then I’d like to hear it, because it feels like we’re slipping away now. |
Further to that:
"Community ownership fund acquisition of the pitch – although our expression of interest had been accepted, the business plan put forward had not. Further investigation of the requirements highlighted the need for a substantial business plan to be put forward and consequently needs some serious thought. There is no one on the Trust board with the necessary skillset to devise such a plan on their own so external, and probably professional, help is required. The Trust will investigate any potential help and associated costs"
I appreciate the business plan would need to come from the Trust, but the fact that we have no-one (seemingly) on the BoD who might have the requisite skillset to assist with the development of a sound business plan says a great deal. It's not just the Trust that might need help with the Community Ownership Fund... |  |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:39 - Jan 29 with 6814 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:22 - Jan 29 by D_Alien |
Further to that:
"Community ownership fund acquisition of the pitch – although our expression of interest had been accepted, the business plan put forward had not. Further investigation of the requirements highlighted the need for a substantial business plan to be put forward and consequently needs some serious thought. There is no one on the Trust board with the necessary skillset to devise such a plan on their own so external, and probably professional, help is required. The Trust will investigate any potential help and associated costs"
I appreciate the business plan would need to come from the Trust, but the fact that we have no-one (seemingly) on the BoD who might have the requisite skillset to assist with the development of a sound business plan says a great deal. It's not just the Trust that might need help with the Community Ownership Fund... |
The Community Ownership Fund does run a full support programme, accepting that most who apply for funding do not always have the skills or resource to attempt such an application.
1) https://www.uk.coop/blog/tips-bidding-community-ownership-fund
2) https://mycommunity.org.uk/community-ownership-fund | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:52 - Jan 29 with 6752 views | 442Dale |
Suggest you email the Trust, RAFCBLUE.
And you could enquire further why the club found it oh so difficult to answer whether they will explore other options to try and ensure the Trust can gain ownership of the pitch should any bid be unsuccessful. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:53 - Jan 29 with 6742 views | D_Alien |
Might one presume these resources have been known for some time, including during the course of the initial (unsuccessful) bid? | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 23:08 - Jan 29 with 6688 views | 49thseason |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:22 - Jan 29 by D_Alien |
Further to that:
"Community ownership fund acquisition of the pitch – although our expression of interest had been accepted, the business plan put forward had not. Further investigation of the requirements highlighted the need for a substantial business plan to be put forward and consequently needs some serious thought. There is no one on the Trust board with the necessary skillset to devise such a plan on their own so external, and probably professional, help is required. The Trust will investigate any potential help and associated costs"
I appreciate the business plan would need to come from the Trust, but the fact that we have no-one (seemingly) on the BoD who might have the requisite skillset to assist with the development of a sound business plan says a great deal. It's not just the Trust that might need help with the Community Ownership Fund... |
https://www.startupdonut.co.uk/business-planning/write-a-business-plan/essential
Its onerus but not rocket science provided the information needed is at hand and the money making elements are well thought through. A retired accountant or similar could probably do it if the information could be pulled together.
Alongside a business plan,the club would do well to take a deep dive into its marketing plans and options.
Whatever happens next, we need to work through the optiins and scenarios or we are back to hoping something will turn up, a player sale, a 3rd round cup tie , an investor....
I [Post edited 30 Jan 23:24]
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 23:20 - Jan 29 with 6648 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 22:53 - Jan 29 by D_Alien |
Might one presume these resources have been known for some time, including during the course of the initial (unsuccessful) bid? |
Yes. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 12:21 - Jan 30 with 6179 views | dingdangblue |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 21:45 - Jan 29 by RAFCBLUE |
Suggest you email the Trust 442. Perhaps there isn't an obvious answer to sell a prime asset for well below market value?
The Trust's minutes do show the startling reality is starting to hit home of at this level in the non-league:
23/24 season: Acadamy costs the club - £154,000 being the difference between a grant of £499,000 less required expenditure of £654,000.
24/25 season: Academy will cost the club - £404,500 being the difference between a grant which reduces to £249,500 less the required expenditure of £654,000.
25/26 season: No funding.
So someone will have to find a way to fund an incremental £250,500 for the Academy to stand still from 1st July, assuming conditionally we are not back in the EFL and noting that the £654,000 has to be committed at the outset to obtain the funding in the first place.
How many Academy players have featured this season to justify that £154,000? |
Maybe we'll get £150,000 for George Nevett then we'll just be £4000 short. 👍 |  |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:17 - Jan 30 with 6053 views | James1980 |
I do hope that I am very wrong about this but there is a pachyderm in the vicinity and that is the town and wider community just doesn't care enough about it's football club. Oh there are very passionate supporters in many guises from all over the world who will be devastated if the worse were to happen. But imo the wider community could well be struck by a dose of Big Yellow Taxi syndrome. Now is the time for a rallying cry, so everyone in the borough knows what they've got, before it is gone.
(Sorry for this southern upstart criticising the good burghers of Rochdale) | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:41 - Jan 30 with 5993 views | 442Dale |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:17 - Jan 30 by James1980 |
I do hope that I am very wrong about this but there is a pachyderm in the vicinity and that is the town and wider community just doesn't care enough about it's football club. Oh there are very passionate supporters in many guises from all over the world who will be devastated if the worse were to happen. But imo the wider community could well be struck by a dose of Big Yellow Taxi syndrome. Now is the time for a rallying cry, so everyone in the borough knows what they've got, before it is gone.
(Sorry for this southern upstart criticising the good burghers of Rochdale) |
It has been pointed out at Trust meetings with fans how apathy could be the biggest danger going forward. The reasons for this apathy have nothing to do with a fanbase who have shown real commitment to improve their club.
Attitudes influence that apathy. Its all there. | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 14:01 - Jan 30 with 5942 views | D_Alien |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:17 - Jan 30 by James1980 |
I do hope that I am very wrong about this but there is a pachyderm in the vicinity and that is the town and wider community just doesn't care enough about it's football club. Oh there are very passionate supporters in many guises from all over the world who will be devastated if the worse were to happen. But imo the wider community could well be struck by a dose of Big Yellow Taxi syndrome. Now is the time for a rallying cry, so everyone in the borough knows what they've got, before it is gone.
(Sorry for this southern upstart criticising the good burghers of Rochdale) |
Go onto any Fb page that's about Rochdale (e.g. "Rochdale Past and Present") and the Comments sections are filled with locals only too willing to run the town down. The irony - that they're the problem - completely passes them by | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 14:05 - Jan 30 with 5926 views | James1980 |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:41 - Jan 30 by 442Dale |
It has been pointed out at Trust meetings with fans how apathy could be the biggest danger going forward. The reasons for this apathy have nothing to do with a fanbase who have shown real commitment to improve their club.
Attitudes influence that apathy. Its all there. |
The fan base are fantastic but it needs to increase for the club to thrive, we all know this though. Did the board expect having fought of the hostile takeover, very little input/encouragement would be needed for the community to rally to the cause? | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 15:20 - Jan 30 with 5793 views | ChaffRAFC |
The answers given, to me at least just show how low the club think of the fanbase. |  |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 15:43 - Jan 30 with 5747 views | James1980 |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 15:20 - Jan 30 by ChaffRAFC |
The answers given, to me at least just show how low the club think of the fanbase. |
And that attitude won't encourage new/fairweather/floating fams | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:04 - Jan 30 with 5533 views | 49thseason |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 13:17 - Jan 30 by James1980 |
I do hope that I am very wrong about this but there is a pachyderm in the vicinity and that is the town and wider community just doesn't care enough about it's football club. Oh there are very passionate supporters in many guises from all over the world who will be devastated if the worse were to happen. But imo the wider community could well be struck by a dose of Big Yellow Taxi syndrome. Now is the time for a rallying cry, so everyone in the borough knows what they've got, before it is gone.
(Sorry for this southern upstart criticising the good burghers of Rochdale) |
You are correct, of course, James. The problem we have now is the manifestation of 100 years of underinvestment in the club specifically and sport in general within the Borough.
The stark lack of success over a century has resulted in a generational cynicism and often amusement at the plight of the club as other nearby clubs have benefited from the resulting outflow of cash and energy, Shawforth and Whitworthers have gone to Burnley, Heywooders to Bury and Bolton, Middleton folk have gone to City and United. Anywhere except the club nearest to them. Yes they have turned up for the. " big" games where a good result has sometimes been achieved, but they disappear the week after, essentially because there has never been a serious attempt to bring people into their local club..... until the £1 offer a few games ago...
Historically there has been no attempt to "market" the club, players have been sold too quickly because the economics demanded it, consequently any promotional success has been squandered.
We need a prolonged period of success, albeit at this level, we need to be invincible on our own patch. We need to keep our best players for longer periods of time and maximise their value, what would Brierley be worth now compared to pre season? We have to massively improve the matchday experience and the communications with new and existing fans.
The current board are trapped in a cash crunch, overheads are to high, income too low and getting lower.
We now need a tough discussion about what we can achieve on a very small budget.
Prices need to rise, tough in a very poor town. Overheads will have to be slashed and should have been months ago. More fundraising is needed from non football sources, they have admitted as much, but local businesses are generally finding things tough too.
The Academy will, in my opinion, have to be closed, and thats not to say we cannot replace it with a different model, perhaps calling them apprentices or trainees and making them part of the day to day Platt Lane environment assuming of course we keep Platt Lane. But the "apprentices" will be half a dozen promising 16 year olds attracted from other clubs rather than school age kids. I can foresee an annual "summer trials camp" during the 6 week school holidays being the means to sifting the potantial apprentices.
The situation is dire without investment, but what we really need is smart investment that takes hold by the scruff of the neck and shakes out all the old ways and habits and drags the club into a marketing-led era into which people can become excited by the prospect of a visit to Spotland and keen to be part of a success story just as they are at Stockport, Wrexham and Notts County. | | | |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:43 - Jan 30 with 5460 views | 442Dale |
On tonight’s edition of ‘Analysis of the Laughable’:
<<“ In relation to a half season ticket, we do have this ready to go, but due to the Wealdstone promotion, we were waiting to get that game out of the way first as to not have two campaigns running simultaneously. This will launch prior to the Dagenham & Redbridge home game…”>>
Prior to the Wealdstone game that was postponed, we had played 14 home games. If that game had been played we would have had 8 home games left. As it is, we have 9 home games left.
“half season ticket”.
Presumably, as they’re launching the ‘half season ticket’ that’s actually a ‘9 games out of 23 games but it’s sort of half if you don’t look closely enough ticket’ will be advertised on the OS this week, the Observer and in Saturday’s programme? | |
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| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:47 - Jan 30 with 5435 views | SaxonDale |
Absolute excuse culture seems to have manifested. In footballing terms it compares to one of Bentley’s or Stockdale’s interviews. |  | | |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:55 - Jan 30 with 5397 views | Rodingdale |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:43 - Jan 30 by 442Dale |
On tonight’s edition of ‘Analysis of the Laughable’:
<<“ In relation to a half season ticket, we do have this ready to go, but due to the Wealdstone promotion, we were waiting to get that game out of the way first as to not have two campaigns running simultaneously. This will launch prior to the Dagenham & Redbridge home game…”>>
Prior to the Wealdstone game that was postponed, we had played 14 home games. If that game had been played we would have had 8 home games left. As it is, we have 9 home games left.
“half season ticket”.
Presumably, as they’re launching the ‘half season ticket’ that’s actually a ‘9 games out of 23 games but it’s sort of half if you don’t look closely enough ticket’ will be advertised on the OS this week, the Observer and in Saturday’s programme? |
On a line by line basis the responses are predominantly bullshit.
But the season ticket one is spectacular in its dimensions. Only a marketing ignoramus would try to sell a half year season ticket in February. It will however prove how disengaged the fans are, which I assume is the real objective of the current board. | | | |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 20:25 - Jan 30 with 5220 views | TVOS1907 |
| Trust meeting with the board report on 18:43 - Jan 30 by 442Dale |
On tonight’s edition of ‘Analysis of the Laughable’:
<<“ In relation to a half season ticket, we do have this ready to go, but due to the Wealdstone promotion, we were waiting to get that game out of the way first as to not have two campaigns running simultaneously. This will launch prior to the Dagenham & Redbridge home game…”>>
Prior to the Wealdstone game that was postponed, we had played 14 home games. If that game had been played we would have had 8 home games left. As it is, we have 9 home games left.
“half season ticket”.
Presumably, as they’re launching the ‘half season ticket’ that’s actually a ‘9 games out of 23 games but it’s sort of half if you don’t look closely enough ticket’ will be advertised on the OS this week, the Observer and in Saturday’s programme? |
I'm going to print first thing in the morning and haven't had anything yet. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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