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Firstly, credit to the players and the staff for getting a point when we have so few players available at present. We can break down the tactics, style of play and other such things for forever, but we’re in the top half with about 14/15 first teamers available.
The biggest issue is the overall state of the club and where we stand. The lack of clarity around this and the way we waste weeks and months as supporters continue to seek answers on what the situation is and what we can do to help is, quite obviously, unacceptable.
It’s extremely disappointing that, despite an obvious commitment from many fans and constant requests for that clarity, we now need to focus on this week’s AGM to try and move forward. The time that has been wasted could prove critical, far too many let it pass, however we hope that there’s still some light at the end of what seems a very long tunnel of uncertainty and apathy.
Different times and a different game I admit but look at the famous photo of the 1968/69 promotion squad and count how many players are on that. And I think that the team that started Brian Green’s final season was equally as threadbare.
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 19:28 - Dec 16 with 8283 views
After match thread: York. Our football club on 19:15 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
"Total dominance" according to the manager.
Good quiz question on the year Liverpool won the league and reached a European final with just 14 players.
We’d probably have won with more striking options. However a period of poor decision making and management of the club has unfortunately led to this moment though, where a few injuries have left us really short.
Without pointing the finger directly at the Trust surely the whole purpose of such groups is to provide a clear link between fans and the board and a level of accountability, there appears to be neither happening consistently and hasn't for some time,
I'm currently not a member for no other reason than I didn't renew from last season, but I'd be mightily pissed knowing I'm paying (granted not much!) for a voice when ultimately its next to useless clearly with the current board.
[Post edited 16 Dec 2023 19:51]
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 19:46 - Dec 16 with 8158 views
The AGM has to instill some clarity of how long the cash runway is and what options there are. If there is an opportunity for fans to support the club financially, the BoD has to be specific about how much is required right now and what will be required to become a sustainable club going forwards. I think there will have to be some tough choices made. If there is no sign of a takeover or investment, then we might be back to buying shares, perhaps this time we will be more aware of the urgency and see some optimism which was noticably lacking from the last, rather botched, attempt to get fans to buy shares. As for this afternoon, the band was inaudible and the ball-in-the-bin thing was, once again, too far away from most home fans to have any idea what was going on, I thought this was the entertainment industry, but apparently not...perhaps the microphone should have been with the band??
The game was very poor for the first hour and although we improved in the final 30 minutes, we never actually looked like winning it. Once again, Jimmy proved he isn't a left back, and Sinclair made every wrong choice possible, Henderson fluffed another header and EEL and Nevitt seemed to have their own little game going on to see who could pass to the other the most. Once again the referee was simply inept but probably the Wilbutts lino in the second half took the Specsavers award for utter incompetence. And so, now we all hold our breath........and see what happens next.
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:17 - Dec 16 with 7984 views
Clayton going off was a blow. He might just have unlocked that defence. Did Sinclair play in this position in the National League last season? York were merely competent simple as. One other thing….have we changed dugouts? Was BJ getting stick from the Main Stand hence the move?
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:20 - Dec 16 with 7972 views
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:07 - Dec 16 by 49thseason
The AGM has to instill some clarity of how long the cash runway is and what options there are. If there is an opportunity for fans to support the club financially, the BoD has to be specific about how much is required right now and what will be required to become a sustainable club going forwards. I think there will have to be some tough choices made. If there is no sign of a takeover or investment, then we might be back to buying shares, perhaps this time we will be more aware of the urgency and see some optimism which was noticably lacking from the last, rather botched, attempt to get fans to buy shares. As for this afternoon, the band was inaudible and the ball-in-the-bin thing was, once again, too far away from most home fans to have any idea what was going on, I thought this was the entertainment industry, but apparently not...perhaps the microphone should have been with the band??
The game was very poor for the first hour and although we improved in the final 30 minutes, we never actually looked like winning it. Once again, Jimmy proved he isn't a left back, and Sinclair made every wrong choice possible, Henderson fluffed another header and EEL and Nevitt seemed to have their own little game going on to see who could pass to the other the most. Once again the referee was simply inept but probably the Wilbutts lino in the second half took the Specsavers award for utter incompetence. And so, now we all hold our breath........and see what happens next.
That linesman was terrible. Second half, all a York City player had to do was raise a hand and he gave offside whether it was or not. He allowed them to take / advance throw ins from wherever they liked and gave an absolutely ridiculous foul against us when it was clear Jez had his legs taken from under him.
Agree with 49th's summary of the game. If there as a neutral, I'd have gone home after 60 minutes as both teams were lack lustre. However, given first team squad numbers are so low, (even lower after Clayton going off) the best of Dale is harder to achieve and this needs to be appreciated, or sorted.
After match thread: York. Our football club on 19:28 - Dec 16 by 442Dale
We’d probably have won with more striking options. However a period of poor decision making and management of the club has unfortunately led to this moment though, where a few injuries have left us really short.
We aren't the only club in the National League short of money and numbers at this time of the season. There are a number.
For example, Southend today lost at home to Bromley with 11 plus one sub. The one sub came on for the goalkeeper in the 63rd minute and they played their right back in goal for the remainder of the game.
In purely sporting terms, Maher's Southend are two points better off then us from two fewer games.
In the EFL, West Bromwich Albion, Sheffield Wednesday, Morecambe, Derby, Reading and Wigan are all on the brink.
We're not alone, though I can see why we might think we are.
George Bernard Shaw had it right:
"He who can does; he who cannot, teaches."
https://www.visittheusa.co.uk/
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:07 - Dec 16 by 49thseason
The AGM has to instill some clarity of how long the cash runway is and what options there are. If there is an opportunity for fans to support the club financially, the BoD has to be specific about how much is required right now and what will be required to become a sustainable club going forwards. I think there will have to be some tough choices made. If there is no sign of a takeover or investment, then we might be back to buying shares, perhaps this time we will be more aware of the urgency and see some optimism which was noticably lacking from the last, rather botched, attempt to get fans to buy shares. As for this afternoon, the band was inaudible and the ball-in-the-bin thing was, once again, too far away from most home fans to have any idea what was going on, I thought this was the entertainment industry, but apparently not...perhaps the microphone should have been with the band??
The game was very poor for the first hour and although we improved in the final 30 minutes, we never actually looked like winning it. Once again, Jimmy proved he isn't a left back, and Sinclair made every wrong choice possible, Henderson fluffed another header and EEL and Nevitt seemed to have their own little game going on to see who could pass to the other the most. Once again the referee was simply inept but probably the Wilbutts lino in the second half took the Specsavers award for utter incompetence. And so, now we all hold our breath........and see what happens next.
It is indeed an opportunity for the BoD to provide some clarity, but there's absolutely nothing to stop them doing so today, tomorrow, last week following the collapse of JNG, three months ago...
There's nothing on the agenda that suggests the required clarity is willing to be addressed, so where is it going to come from? The floor? There appears to be no effort to mobilise to that effect, either by the Trust or any other party
The right thing to do would be to set out those financial requirements you specify ahead of the meeting. The Trust, tbf, asked for clarity in terms of financial updates on a monthly basis. That doesn't appear to have happened, but when i referred to a lack of communication this is precisely the type of thing i had in mind. If the BoD has turned down the Trust's request, nothing has been updated to the membership (unless i've missed it again) and therefore the only conclusion is that the Trust is prepared to acquiesce in being knocked back
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:24 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
We aren't the only club in the National League short of money and numbers at this time of the season. There are a number.
For example, Southend today lost at home to Bromley with 11 plus one sub. The one sub came on for the goalkeeper in the 63rd minute and they played their right back in goal for the remainder of the game.
In purely sporting terms, Maher's Southend are two points better off then us from two fewer games.
In the EFL, West Bromwich Albion, Sheffield Wednesday, Morecambe, Derby, Reading and Wigan are all on the brink.
We're not alone, though I can see why we might think we are.
There were no comparisons being made to other clubs. We are where we are, constantly avoiding what we could and should have done better both in the past and today is a reason for this.
Until all those involved in Rochdale AFC start recognising how Rochdale AFC could and should be better, nothing will ever change.
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:20 - Dec 16 by Sandyman
That linesman was terrible. Second half, all a York City player had to do was raise a hand and he gave offside whether it was or not. He allowed them to take / advance throw ins from wherever they liked and gave an absolutely ridiculous foul against us when it was clear Jez had his legs taken from under him.
Agree with 49th's summary of the game. If there as a neutral, I'd have gone home after 60 minutes as both teams were lack lustre. However, given first team squad numbers are so low, (even lower after Clayton going off) the best of Dale is harder to achieve and this needs to be appreciated, or sorted.
I thought both teams were happy with a point from about 3.15 Sandyman.
York are clearly building and attempting to become a solid mid-table team under Neil Ardley.
We and our documented squad size didn't look to win the game but equally didn't look to lose it either. McNulty says very clearly "we couldn't have played any other way".
16 more points needed to get to 50 and that will be safety assured.
As much as we say we want to get into the playoffs can you imagine getting back into League 2 without a suitable rebuilding exercise? We all know we'd be fodder as we'd need effectively a whole new squad.
And only the first 0-0 draw too since Barrow (a) at the start of 2023. We were shipping goals a month or so ago so a clean sheet is a welcome positive.
George Bernard Shaw had it right:
"He who can does; he who cannot, teaches."
https://www.visittheusa.co.uk/
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:34 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
I thought both teams were happy with a point from about 3.15 Sandyman.
York are clearly building and attempting to become a solid mid-table team under Neil Ardley.
We and our documented squad size didn't look to win the game but equally didn't look to lose it either. McNulty says very clearly "we couldn't have played any other way".
16 more points needed to get to 50 and that will be safety assured.
As much as we say we want to get into the playoffs can you imagine getting back into League 2 without a suitable rebuilding exercise? We all know we'd be fodder as we'd need effectively a whole new squad.
And only the first 0-0 draw too since Barrow (a) at the start of 2023. We were shipping goals a month or so ago so a clean sheet is a welcome positive.
A deduction of 10pts for going into administration shouldn't be discounted
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:28 - Dec 16 by D_Alien
It is indeed an opportunity for the BoD to provide some clarity, but there's absolutely nothing to stop them doing so today, tomorrow, last week following the collapse of JNG, three months ago...
There's nothing on the agenda that suggests the required clarity is willing to be addressed, so where is it going to come from? The floor? There appears to be no effort to mobilise to that effect, either by the Trust or any other party
The right thing to do would be to set out those financial requirements you specify ahead of the meeting. The Trust, tbf, asked for clarity in terms of financial updates on a monthly basis. That doesn't appear to have happened, but when i referred to a lack of communication this is precisely the type of thing i had in mind. If the BoD has turned down the Trust's request, nothing has been updated to the membership (unless i've missed it again) and therefore the only conclusion is that the Trust is prepared to acquiesce in being knocked back
[Post edited 16 Dec 2023 20:58]
Having a director on the BoD is a two edged sword. Much as I like Murray, I actually think he is more valuable to the club helping to lead the trust than being tied by the secrecy surrounding the Board and the clubs financial goings on. Its hard to imagine that we are not in a bad place financially, and that hanging on for a saviour might actually finish us off. It would be unforgivable to go down without a fight of some sort and a plan for what then happens. Better to make the plans and not have to use them than arrive at a moment when you need them and not have one ready.
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:43 - Dec 16 with 7774 views
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:41 - Dec 16 by 49thseason
Having a director on the BoD is a two edged sword. Much as I like Murray, I actually think he is more valuable to the club helping to lead the trust than being tied by the secrecy surrounding the Board and the clubs financial goings on. Its hard to imagine that we are not in a bad place financially, and that hanging on for a saviour might actually finish us off. It would be unforgivable to go down without a fight of some sort and a plan for what then happens. Better to make the plans and not have to use them than arrive at a moment when you need them and not have one ready.
Indeed
I hope you voted accordingly in the Trust ballot regarding the AGM
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:39 - Dec 16 by D_Alien
A deduction of 10pts for going into administration shouldn't be discounted
That statement is probably true for half of the National League DA.
I think we will end up selling George Nevett and that sale will bring in money and reinforcements to get us through to May. What it won't bring is the numbers that McNulty is seeking because why would you burn cash now to finish mid-table in the National League?
We'd be better off writing off this season and spending early 2024 planning for 2024/25 on a different basis. Next year the EFL funding reduces, Chesterfield look like they will be gone and in infrastructure terms we will be one of the bigger clubs in the National League depending on who comes down from League 2.
Could the Trust raise £250,000 and take their stake to 25%? That would be a shift.
We will also need another Director appointing to replace Jamie Sarsfield from the AGM given the Articles of Association state there are to be 7. Who will that be?
George Bernard Shaw had it right:
"He who can does; he who cannot, teaches."
https://www.visittheusa.co.uk/
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:52 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
That statement is probably true for half of the National League DA.
I think we will end up selling George Nevett and that sale will bring in money and reinforcements to get us through to May. What it won't bring is the numbers that McNulty is seeking because why would you burn cash now to finish mid-table in the National League?
We'd be better off writing off this season and spending early 2024 planning for 2024/25 on a different basis. Next year the EFL funding reduces, Chesterfield look like they will be gone and in infrastructure terms we will be one of the bigger clubs in the National League depending on who comes down from League 2.
Could the Trust raise £250,000 and take their stake to 25%? That would be a shift.
We will also need another Director appointing to replace Jamie Sarsfield from the AGM given the Articles of Association state there are to be 7. Who will that be?
I think we could have as many as 15 Directors, so why not bring in 2 or 3 or 4? Maybe its time to invite Chris Dunphy back with a mate or two. I have been critical in the past but needs must when the devil drives.... Offer Chris a vice-chair position, and use his experience if it is felt it has any relevance. Maybe Chris could concentrate on finding an investor or buyer whilst others concentrate on running the club. I don't know what the current headcount is at the club but it must surely be down from the 130+ levels mentioned in the last accounts. Now is the time for the Trust to start compiling the data from the fans about what shares they hold, where they work and what can they do if the event that we don't want to think about has to happen... At what point would the 10 point deduction happen if we go into Admin? can we delay it long enough to start -10 in this division next season and spend the spring and summer fund raising?
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After match thread: York. Our football club on 21:23 - Dec 16 with 7573 views
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:52 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
That statement is probably true for half of the National League DA.
I think we will end up selling George Nevett and that sale will bring in money and reinforcements to get us through to May. What it won't bring is the numbers that McNulty is seeking because why would you burn cash now to finish mid-table in the National League?
We'd be better off writing off this season and spending early 2024 planning for 2024/25 on a different basis. Next year the EFL funding reduces, Chesterfield look like they will be gone and in infrastructure terms we will be one of the bigger clubs in the National League depending on who comes down from League 2.
Could the Trust raise £250,000 and take their stake to 25%? That would be a shift.
We will also need another Director appointing to replace Jamie Sarsfield from the AGM given the Articles of Association state there are to be 7. Who will that be?
If we had any indication the BoD were interested in anything other than recouping some of their outlay (for which no-one blames them), that would be a reasonable plan
As it stands, the sale Of Nevett would see the club through to 24/25 without further financial input from the board, but whether they have the inclination or skillset to make plans beyond that is another matter entirely
After match thread: York. Our football club on 20:52 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
That statement is probably true for half of the National League DA.
I think we will end up selling George Nevett and that sale will bring in money and reinforcements to get us through to May. What it won't bring is the numbers that McNulty is seeking because why would you burn cash now to finish mid-table in the National League?
We'd be better off writing off this season and spending early 2024 planning for 2024/25 on a different basis. Next year the EFL funding reduces, Chesterfield look like they will be gone and in infrastructure terms we will be one of the bigger clubs in the National League depending on who comes down from League 2.
Could the Trust raise £250,000 and take their stake to 25%? That would be a shift.
We will also need another Director appointing to replace Jamie Sarsfield from the AGM given the Articles of Association state there are to be 7. Who will that be?
Regarding your point about spending to finish mid-table in the national league, it's a fair point.
It is however worth noting we spent £186,000 in January 2022 to finish bottom half of League Two.
If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor
1
After match thread: York. Our football club on 22:49 - Dec 16 with 7254 views
“the club has a stable financial platform and cash reserves to be well positioned for next season. We have returned during 2021/22 to being a properly and prudently run football club…” “The Board is planning for a significantly increased playing budget for next season.”
After match thread: York. Our football club on 22:28 - Dec 16 by ChaffRAFC
Regarding your point about spending to finish mid-table in the national league, it's a fair point.
It is however worth noting we spent £186,000 in January 2022 to finish bottom half of League Two.
That's true Chaff, but that number needs to be put into context.
It is £186,000 found from the residual monies of the sales of Beesley and Morley (and others) generate transfer revenue of just under £1m.
You can only assume the difference of over £0.8m went into running the club and even then the the club spent £467,356 more than it earned in an attempt to survive in the EFL.
In 2022/23 where the figures aren't yet known, you'd have to conclude we spent more than we earned. Knocked out at Bristol Rovers in the FA Cup, and the sale of Ethan Brierley not covering the operational losses. We did get undisclosed fees according to reports for Charman, Mullarkey and O'Donnell as well but sacked two managers in Stockdale and then Bentley.
This season - are we spending more than we earn? I'd wager we probably are. We had the debacle of Hereford away and there is no real one off income into the club over the summer.
Some say "earn more", others say "spend less". The reality is there is a minimum level of cost locked in.
We must become financially sustainable. That is going to be, regrettably a combination of reducing the outgoings and increasing ticket prices or volume of supporters.
George Bernard Shaw had it right:
"He who can does; he who cannot, teaches."
https://www.visittheusa.co.uk/
After match thread: York. Our football club on 22:53 - Dec 16 by RAFCBLUE
That's true Chaff, but that number needs to be put into context.
It is £186,000 found from the residual monies of the sales of Beesley and Morley (and others) generate transfer revenue of just under £1m.
You can only assume the difference of over £0.8m went into running the club and even then the the club spent £467,356 more than it earned in an attempt to survive in the EFL.
In 2022/23 where the figures aren't yet known, you'd have to conclude we spent more than we earned. Knocked out at Bristol Rovers in the FA Cup, and the sale of Ethan Brierley not covering the operational losses. We did get undisclosed fees according to reports for Charman, Mullarkey and O'Donnell as well but sacked two managers in Stockdale and then Bentley.
This season - are we spending more than we earn? I'd wager we probably are. We had the debacle of Hereford away and there is no real one off income into the club over the summer.
Some say "earn more", others say "spend less". The reality is there is a minimum level of cost locked in.
We must become financially sustainable. That is going to be, regrettably a combination of reducing the outgoings and increasing ticket prices or volume of supporters.
“the club has a stable financial platform and cash reserves to be well positioned for next season.”
Ahead of 2022/23 where we were “ planning for a significantly increased playing budget”.
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