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What was your first experience of football violence/crowd disturbance. and did that first experience have an effect on you.....not being involved, but as a by stander.
The first was at home to glasgow rangers, pre season friendly in 1969, as an 11 year old it was pretty hairy, and although not very violent in the ground, the atmosphere was intense. outside though plenty of trouble, in later years i've learnt that west ham and tottenham fans were there for trouble. it did have an immediate effect, one terrified but excited the same time, but that was when i was nearly home after.....just to add, 3 of us all 11 year olds went to the game on our own, from sutton esteate off north pole road.
First away experience was at leeds in 1973, 2-2 draw. we went by football special, 400 on the train in all, in them days everyone was a target, wearing your colours or getting caught out by your accent. we had trouble at the turnstiles before the game, no segregation, and lots of leeds fans in what we now call the away end. coming out was even worse, hundreds of leeds fans waiting outside to pick you off, and a few did get caught out and beaten up....thank god for the green buses back to the train station.
I consider myself rather fortunate to have avoided the worst of it. But impossible to have gone to football since the 70s and not seen some tasty situations.
But I prefer to recall this one. I had a Bristol City mate in London the year we popped them to go up in 2004. We met in a pub in Clapham to watch England, France in the Euros. There were three French fans in there and, if you recall, they sneaked it late and when they scored, some prat through a ladened glass over at them. Not unnaturally they panicked.
The landlord ordered the individual and chums out; the City fan and I couldn’t get to the front of the queue to lamp these yobs, such was the reaction from our fellow patrons as they were literally being kicked and punched out of the bar! Then the frightened Frogs, became even more scared when, after Zizou scored the winner, they were bombarded with beers but this time, in glasses to consume, as geezers left right and centre apologised, wished them well and left them with a stockpile.
We stayed with them and suggested they not leave until they and things had calmed down. Blokes still kept coming up to apologise and offering drinks. They just couldn’t fathom this out; in a short space of time they’d seen their worst fears about football hooligans being realised to leaving a bar as gassed as badgers without spending a penny and having witnessed the whole bar stick up for them by kicking out one of our own for being a c..t!
'Always In Motion' by John Honney available on amazon.co.uk
I was there but I don't recall it being violent, quite the opposite.
Polices & horses were there to keep order and I think it all passed off OK.
QPR fans in the west paddocks got moved into the Loft so the West Ham fans could go into there. I think there were even pockets of hammers in the loft but it was all quite good natured. I think that as this was still relatively soon after Heysel and Hillsborough, people were actually being civil for a change.
if i remember rightly, did`nt west ham fans have a load of counterfieit tickets for the game hence the school end being overflowing and them standing on the side of the pitch?
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Football Violence. on 16:01 - Nov 20 with 5179 views
if i remember rightly, did`nt west ham fans have a load of counterfieit tickets for the game hence the school end being overflowing and them standing on the side of the pitch?
Yup, about 2000 forged tickets I think.
Yes, it was before Hilsborough (but after Heysel) and tahnk god we didn't have 3m high fences like everywhere else.
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Football Violence. on 16:33 - Nov 20 with 5133 views
I was there but I don't recall it being violent, quite the opposite.
Polices & horses were there to keep order and I think it all passed off OK.
QPR fans in the west paddocks got moved into the Loft so the West Ham fans could go into there. I think there were even pockets of hammers in the loft but it was all quite good natured. I think that as this was still relatively soon after Heysel and Hillsborough, people were actually being civil for a change.
yeah, crowd disorder rather than crowd violence. counterfeit tickets were printed and used among the west ham lot.
german police were at the game to see how english policed the game over here due to the euro's being in west germany that year. right place at the right time.
I remember seeing Chelsea animals tossing a Mini car into the river outside Carrow Road back in 1973. Rumour had it that someone was still in the car when it happened. I didn't hang around long enough to find out. Chelsea had lost 1-0 to Norwich and they were cross. Near Brighton's old Gallstone Road stadium in the mid 70's, I witnessed a frightening looking Southend thugette giving some poor Brighton fan a right battering with a stilettoed boot. Lots of Southend skins running amok. In 1978 I had my scarf ripped off my neck by some Forest toe rags after an FA Cup match. Lucky it was only the scarf they took. Another poor R's fan was less fortunate. They couldn't get his scarf off him so he got a right pummelling. I was later told it was some Millwall fans who had infiltrated the Forest lot. I seem to recall they had London accents so there could have been some truth in this. Still didn't care where they were from, I just had a sore neck and a bad friction burn to boot. B%stards!! The Old Bill laying into an innocent R's fan in the old School End in the early 80's when Loftus Road was being rebuilt. We were playing Bolton that day. The said fan fell over on the stairs and rolled into an area where he wasn't supposed to roll into. Well not according to the Old Bill. They hammered the poor guy. They were not the flavour of the month in that stand with some R's fans chanting 'Are you Chelsea in disguise' for much of the game. Some of the Old Bill were smiling knowingly at this.
There aint half been some clever bastards.
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Football Violence. on 16:47 - Nov 20 with 5098 views
Anyone recall the top policeman who stood at the top of the loft stairs. A right bar steward, Ginger hair and number pc49 if I recall. Would regularly and indiscriminately through people out the ground.
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Football Violence. on 20:19 - Nov 20 with 4905 views
Does anyone else remember a trip to Cambridge when I guess we were losing and a mob left early and started lobbing vegetables from the allotments back into the ground?
Yes,I was there...bit of a scuffle outside as well i remember
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Football Violence. on 20:40 - Nov 20 with 4874 views
Southampton at the old Dell,don’t remember if it was a league game or Cup,but there was a great Rs turn out,and more than the local old bill were expecting,when the last of the cages in the away end was opened,it was 50/50 home and away.i was with my ex wife,and saw a young Saints lad running towards us,arms windmilling hitting anyone in his way,as he got close to my Mrs I managed to dodge his flaying arms and land a goodun right on his nose,sending him back from whence he came,just then a big,burly copper says “your nicked” and grabs my arm,luckily he gave us the option of leaving or getting arrested,we left. On the way out saw young Rs lad with a massive gash under his eye,and another with his nose splattered.
Southampton at the old Dell,don’t remember if it was a league game or Cup,but there was a great Rs turn out,and more than the local old bill were expecting,when the last of the cages in the away end was opened,it was 50/50 home and away.i was with my ex wife,and saw a young Saints lad running towards us,arms windmilling hitting anyone in his way,as he got close to my Mrs I managed to dodge his flaying arms and land a goodun right on his nose,sending him back from whence he came,just then a big,burly copper says “your nicked” and grabs my arm,luckily he gave us the option of leaving or getting arrested,we left. On the way out saw young Rs lad with a massive gash under his eye,and another with his nose splattered.
good turn out from us in '92 fa cup, just after we beat man utd at old trafford 4-1. could have been that, qpr everywhere that day.
I was there but I don't recall it being violent, quite the opposite.
Polices & horses were there to keep order and I think it all passed off OK.
QPR fans in the west paddocks got moved into the Loft so the West Ham fans could go into there. I think there were even pockets of hammers in the loft but it was all quite good natured. I think that as this was still relatively soon after Heysel and Hillsborough, people were actually being civil for a change.
After heysel before Hillsboro, was in the Beaumont arms before hand, was a great crack.
favourite cheese mature Cheddar. FFS there is no such thing as the EPL
I consider myself rather fortunate to have avoided the worst of it. But impossible to have gone to football since the 70s and not seen some tasty situations.
But I prefer to recall this one. I had a Bristol City mate in London the year we popped them to go up in 2004. We met in a pub in Clapham to watch England, France in the Euros. There were three French fans in there and, if you recall, they sneaked it late and when they scored, some prat through a ladened glass over at them. Not unnaturally they panicked.
The landlord ordered the individual and chums out; the City fan and I couldn’t get to the front of the queue to lamp these yobs, such was the reaction from our fellow patrons as they were literally being kicked and punched out of the bar! Then the frightened Frogs, became even more scared when, after Zizou scored the winner, they were bombarded with beers but this time, in glasses to consume, as geezers left right and centre apologised, wished them well and left them with a stockpile.
We stayed with them and suggested they not leave until they and things had calmed down. Blokes still kept coming up to apologise and offering drinks. They just couldn’t fathom this out; in a short space of time they’d seen their worst fears about football hooligans being realised to leaving a bar as gassed as badgers without spending a penny and having witnessed the whole bar stick up for them by kicking out one of our own for being a c..t!
I went to the England v France rugby match at twickenham about 5 years ago,and it was the game that was on the Saturday night with a late ko.I met my brother at a pub in Clapham Junction about 1pm and stayed there drinking Guinness most of the afternoon watching the other 6 nations games. We made our way to the railway station after drinking our fill of drink.We got to the platform as the fast twickenham train stopped and the doors opened.It was rammed to the rafters with French fans,and we really had to push our way onto the train to get in before the doors closed. This was a couple of weeks after the Chelshite fans had pushed that black guy off the train in Paris so it could’ve turned nasty as everyone was packed in tight. No sooner had the doors closed the party started.Somebody threw a chicken in the air and then the singing started.Drinks were also passed around to anyone who wanted more,and the journey passed by much quicker than it should’ve done being pressed up against a load of strangers. A real great night was had by all,at least until the match ended.
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Football Violence. on 22:50 - Nov 20 with 4765 views
I started going to games independently in the 1979-80 season. Although there was a lot of threats and menace at LR, the police always had seemed to have it under control and controlled contact at the ground. It was a different story at Brentford when I went with friends, you could still stroll around the ground and there were only about 2 policemen in attendance. Violence there was generally about six-a-side: the fighters were well-known, and when they went on the move to take on the Southend or Reading massive, a gang of kids would follow them to see what happened. The boot was on the other foot when Sheffield Wednesday came to town and everyone ran in terror when they spotted 10 or so skins in Crombie coats standing behind us. Something to talk about at school on Monday, much more thrilling than the actual game.
My first experience of violence at a Rangers game was away at Charlton that season. There were about 7,000 knocking around the Valley, which was hopelessly decrepit then. I guess our lot thought the odds looked favourable and set off across that huge terrace to meet the home fans in a pre-Iron Age battle of sticks and lumps of concrete. It continued in the streets outside after the game. I remember turning a corner and coming face to face with an enormous skinhead in Charlton colours. My 15 years flashed before my eyes, but he wasn't remotely interested in me.
Charlton 2-2 1980 mine too first ever QPR game. loved it. Far better than the match. As in that match not in general.
[Post edited 21 Nov 2020 19:30]
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Football Violence. on 00:40 - Nov 21 with 4705 views
who was at this one. no mobiles to phone home to say you were going to be an hour late, and the rest.....
Went to this one with my Dad, but he was up in the SAR seats and I was in the loft, as I had a season ticket in there at the time, right behind where Pizanti's goal hit the top corner.
Could have been a Hillsbrough type disaster if we'd had fences, a load of forged tickets lead to the away end spilling onto the pitch. Don't remember any trouble, the closest I recall was when they thought about trying to put some of the West Ham fans in the Loft and the reaction that got. They quickly turned to plan B.
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Football Violence. on 09:55 - Nov 21 with 4554 views
who was at this one. no mobiles to phone home to say you were going to be an hour late, and the rest.....
I was at that one. Pizanti had some relatives or fellow countrymen claiming to be relatives, in the row in front of me, they were treated to a corker from him that day. The guy shovelling up the horse crap was a character; he had his moment pretending to throw it at the crowd. His best time was when Chelsea invaded the pitch, the horses came on, he came on and the hard cases started to give him stick, he did his comedy poo throw and cleared a space at the school end that you could have driven a truck through.
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Football Violence. on 12:07 - Nov 21 with 4473 views
i took my son and his cousin (both 13) to this one, and although my son had been going since he was 6, it was his first encounter with trouble at football, my nephew on the other hand was terrified as we were seated in the upper loft near to that hole in the fence/ellerslie road where the pompey came through.
Man City away just after Pat Phoenix died and a real turgid 0-1 defeat. Only around 100 R's there, the tea hut didn't open until half time because some forgot to turn the urn on etc. At some point a few lads thought it would be funny to chant "Elsie is dead, Elsie is dead, hello, hello" which suddenly turned the atmosphere in the Kippax to a far more menacing level than it had previously been. I moved well away to the edge with my brothers and mate as you could see it turning ugly quick. Once the lads decided that "Are your children in the Moors?" was a good wind up, that was it; bits of bricks and slate came raining down on the R's fans and the police were turning a blind eye to it. There were quite a few with lumps and cuts on them but I vividly remember one bloke who must have caught a piece of slate to the side of his face as you could see into his mouth through the slice and as probably lucky not to be blinded. We stayed in the bogs long after the ground emptied and ran to the car once we were out so I don't know if there was any other shenanigans after the game outside.
The grass is always greener.
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Football Violence. on 14:13 - Nov 21 with 4353 views
Football Violence. on 12:26 - Nov 21 by Esox_Lucius
Man City away just after Pat Phoenix died and a real turgid 0-1 defeat. Only around 100 R's there, the tea hut didn't open until half time because some forgot to turn the urn on etc. At some point a few lads thought it would be funny to chant "Elsie is dead, Elsie is dead, hello, hello" which suddenly turned the atmosphere in the Kippax to a far more menacing level than it had previously been. I moved well away to the edge with my brothers and mate as you could see it turning ugly quick. Once the lads decided that "Are your children in the Moors?" was a good wind up, that was it; bits of bricks and slate came raining down on the R's fans and the police were turning a blind eye to it. There were quite a few with lumps and cuts on them but I vividly remember one bloke who must have caught a piece of slate to the side of his face as you could see into his mouth through the slice and as probably lucky not to be blinded. We stayed in the bogs long after the ground emptied and ran to the car once we were out so I don't know if there was any other shenanigans after the game outside.
It sounds like the same sort of idiots who sing “ You kill your prostitutes” to Ipswich fans a few years ago.
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Football Violence. on 17:11 - Nov 27 with 4057 views
When i was young i use to sell "the pink un" after games . The police would let the home crowd drift away then let the away fans out which is were i would try and flog the last few i had. The only trouble with selling to away fans was that there was invariably an ambush by the home fans. So many a saturday during the eighties i wouldnt just see a punch up,ruck,fight,,, i would be in the middle of it trying to fumble for change, Most smaller clubs would have a crew of 20 to 50 lads spoiling for a fight but teams like Leeds and West Ham would be a lot more all with their Kappa Fila Pringle gear on.
Back to Rangers and violence the most ive seen witnessed is QPR V QPR first hand West Brom semi final Leicester home on the White City estate and then the subway underneath the westway Maine Rd away Barnsley away
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Football Violence. on 13:59 - May 24 with 2677 views
Speaking about England, we all the time forget about one thing - in the United Kingdom there is no and there was no social protest base, as, for example, in the CIS countries. I even wrote a documented article about this ( and received a high rate for it) , on which students later spoke in extracurricular lessons. Tell me, what strata of English society rebelled in the stadiums? Sufficiently wealthy youth with their age-old inclinations for anarchism and rebellion. And in the CIS, numerous fan groups most often represent the embittered part of unsettled students, often under nationalist slogans.
[Post edited 24 May 2021 14:41]
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Football Violence. on 14:17 - May 24 with 2607 views
1968 I think. We lost at home to Derby 1-0 having outplayed them. Their supporters coach came down S Africa Road and got stoned. A few windows broken.
Leeds away in the FA Cup. Pelted with coins when we equalised. They eventually won it 2-1 We were kept in the ground for about 45 minutes after the game. God knows what would have happened if we'd won 2-1. I remember a massive W Yorkshire copper on a horse telling us "things are pretty ugly outside" and Rangers fans responding to the gates being opened by chanting "Keep us in, keep us in, keep us in".
A game at LR when a load of Chelsea got in the Loft End. A massive surge had people shoved down the terraces. Somebody could easily have been crushed to death.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky
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