| tomorrow can't come quick enough 14:17 - Oct 16 with 2263405 views | batman |
Not for us, but for Bury.
i was credit checking a potential customer and decided to nosey onto
BFC's file and was (or maybe not) supprised to see a new CCJ for circa £22k lodged
only Wednesday this week.
looks like they are in need of a bumper crowd tomorrow to settle some bills |  | | |  |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:38 - Nov 7 with 8600 views | Daley_Lama |
That's why i wouldn't advise joining FB.
Their influence as you put it is reduced to 'they wont answer my questions'
I wish there was a slow hand clap icon |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:38 - Nov 7 with 8585 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:55 - Nov 7 by Daley_Lama |
The last thing i would advise Bury fans to do is join Forever Bury.
Forever Bury had their chance and they blew it. They orchestrated a NO vote from shareholders against a re-stucturing of the club.
They did a 180 degree turn last minute and voted YES on behalf of shareholders without consultation who had previously granted them power to represent as a NO vote.
The rest is history. The board was re-structured, the number of shares in the club was increased to a) marginalise existing shareholders influence and b) strenghthen Day's position.
I have sympathy for Joy, i 100% believe she has/had only good intentions but as far as i can see, FB misrepresented shareholders at the one time they could stand up and that chance will never come again. |
I made a similar point. They facilitated it. They allowed themselves to be used and smoothed over the entire process. FB are trying to get people to join, with a membership fee I presume, on the premise that it is the best way to help the club. That categorically isn't true. They've been part of the problem. It needed a Dale fan to give them the heads up re the petition ffs. Mr Sitter will be told by G. Thomas that it's an historical issue and nothing to worry about and Mr. Sitter, after pretending that such information is something that should be protected under the Official Secret Act, will then inform the fans of this information and how this represents a great deal for the supporters. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:54 - Nov 7 with 8536 views | 442Dale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:38 - Nov 7 by Daley_Lama |
That's why i wouldn't advise joining FB.
Their influence as you put it is reduced to 'they wont answer my questions'
I wish there was a slow hand clap icon |
At the moment is every question documented and the answers received or not also displayed on their site?
Until that happens and the club are aware of such a process, the benefits can't be established. It's all bits and pieces on a messageboard: Do it properly. What's gone before is one thing and I share similar concerns as others about how they may respond in the future, but we need only look how what has been posted on their fans forum has attracted our attention. If it's on the website of an official representation of those fans it will carry much more weight and attract attention on a much wider level. Local papers won't be taking quotes off a messageboard, but they'll certainly dig deeper if they see something on a site of a group that represents supporters.
If nothing changes, the members should then call an EGM of their own organisation. [Post edited 7 Nov 2015 10:59]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:20 - Nov 7 with 8479 views | TVOS1907 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:11 - Nov 7 by Daley_Lama |
it's all very confusing isn't it.
Pay day today though, FA Cup at home, all attendees paying cash with no ST getting in for nowt. Kerching!!!!
The FA and Wigan wont mind holding off a bit for their share as real, actual, tangible money comes in that can be given to the real, actual, big bad tax man.
6,000 paying £17 = 100K. They will find the rest down the back of the beautiful sofas Stewy's First Act of Benevolance brought. [Post edited 7 Nov 2015 10:14]
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Doubt they'll get 6,000 and as R17 has explained, the money quickly gets swallowed up by other parties such as the FA pool, Wigan and various expenditures.
But don't tell ShakerRyan. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:42 - Nov 7 with 8446 views | ParkinsGimp |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 23:07 - Nov 6 by R17ALE |
Fooking Hell, there's some gormless bastards about! Not you 442! Ryan!
A typical 1st round FA Cup game attracts much less cash for the home club than a league game.
On a league game you keep 80% of your cash take after the VAT has been paid.
On a cup game you pay out 20%, then matchday costs, then the FA pool (5% I think) and then you give 50% of the rest to the visitors.
So if they generate £67,500 in gate receipts, then minus £13,500 in Vat = £54,000. Minus £2700 to FA = £51,300. Minus say £15,000 in matchday costs = £36,300. Minus 50% to Wigan leaves £18,150.
Why can't bury fans do numbers? |
Do bury pay VAT?
Dont seem to pay anything else :-) | | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:20 - Nov 7 with 8347 views | aleanddale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 20:39 - Nov 6 by dingdangblue |
Belter this:
Depends whether your focus is on the pitch or off. On the pitch they have provided a promotion and a team that is at times a joy to watch. Off the pitch there have always been financial hurdles to overcome in the entire history of the club. As a rival supporter you wlll of course focus on the negatives off pitch. As a Bury supporter all has to be viewed in a balanced way.
Personally I think they dont like interference in their business dealings. They pay bills at latest opportunity. They may have a dispute over the tax bill and if lose in court will pay? If there was a real financial issue, we would have players not being paid, transfer embargo etc. Instead we are signing players and extending contracts, not the actions of a skint club about to go bust.
All the above is just pure speculation , guess work and my opinion (specially for Big Wills) |
I thought that!!
The tool does not get it that the product is better but they can't afford it...
Oh you can start to play " enjoy the ride " bingo again now over on beardyman!! [Post edited 7 Nov 2015 12:29]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:45 - Nov 7 with 8307 views | KenBoon |
That ShakerRyan is brilliant. I'm going to start reading the Berry forum just so I can appreciate his genius. The dude should be given his own car parking space and have their massive telly named after him. "The ShakerRyan-ShakerTron". #EnjoyTheRide #SavedFromAMythicalWhiteVanWithPadlocks #Obsessed |  | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:00 - Nov 7 with 8275 views | 1mark1 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:45 - Nov 7 by KenBoon |
That ShakerRyan is brilliant. I'm going to start reading the Berry forum just so I can appreciate his genius. The dude should be given his own car parking space and have their massive telly named after him. "The ShakerRyan-ShakerTron". #EnjoyTheRide #SavedFromAMythicalWhiteVanWithPadlocks #Obsessed |
He definitely seams to have missed out on education, especially maths when he was a kid, unless he is still a kid. Should be on the BFC board as Chur, or it's chief executive. |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:04 - Nov 7 with 8262 views | dingdangblue |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:20 - Nov 7 by aleanddale |
I thought that!!
The tool does not get it that the product is better but they can't afford it...
Oh you can start to play " enjoy the ride " bingo again now over on beardyman!! [Post edited 7 Nov 2015 12:29]
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The thread today about "what are you going to do when bury go bust" is just pathetic, whether its just taking the piss or being serious , the attitude of some saying they are looking forward to it and starting from scratch again will be some sort of 'adventure' - yeah just forget about those left in debt being owed by the football club when it happens. To have the attitude of 'overspend no matter the consequences because its a win/win situation ' is frankly very sad and worrying. |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:05 - Nov 7 with 8264 views | D_Alien |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:34 - Nov 7 by TalkingSutty |
This is why there is always a danger of supporters trusts/organisations getting too close to the Club itself. Whoever is sitting on the supporters board/committee is there to represent the best interests of its members and report back accordingly. Sometimes that will be at odds with the Clubs thinking/actions.
There has to be a line drawn and the independence of the supporters organisation needs to be preserved in order to be able to address and rectify some unpalatable truths that crop up from time to time. Jumping into bed with the powers that be just dilutes the independence of the supporters organisation and you end up toothless. If the members of FB have no confidence then maybe that stops them asking the question? |
Good post, and do I detect hints of matters a little closer to home there TS?
Not that I'd be comparing what's happening at Bury with Dale matters, but you're right to point out the principles that are at stake. |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:32 - Nov 7 with 8216 views | TalkingSutty |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:05 - Nov 7 by D_Alien |
Good post, and do I detect hints of matters a little closer to home there TS?
Not that I'd be comparing what's happening at Bury with Dale matters, but you're right to point out the principles that are at stake. |
Yes, i don't think Club staff should be on the Trust board but due to lack of interest from anybody else to join the board ( myself included), it seems there was no other option.
Its nothing personal, i have a lot of admiration for those who put themselves forward, all of who are dyed in the wool Dale fans. I just think it comprimises the Trust and its members. Its only my own opinion obviously. |  | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:51 - Nov 7 with 8172 views | isitme |
It's a bit of a thankless task for the trust really. Working full time and then attending meetings in the evenings as well as organising events and the like is hard work. So I can understand why people don't want to join the board. |  | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 14:01 - Nov 7 with 8150 views | 442Dale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 13:51 - Nov 7 by isitme |
It's a bit of a thankless task for the trust really. Working full time and then attending meetings in the evenings as well as organising events and the like is hard work. So I can understand why people don't want to join the board. |
Agree totally. What it needs is for members to offer help, they can assist in sharing the workload by offering assistance.
If any member has any specific areas of expertise or thinks they can save the Trust board members a job, you can't see why such an offer would ever be turned down. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 15:55 - Nov 7 with 8043 views | dingdangblue |
"All bull- club payed the debt off one day late and are infact owed 30k by from HMR! HMR will be removing this court order! So relax eh" | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 16:49 - Nov 7 with 7991 views | dingdangblue |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 23:07 - Nov 6 by R17ALE |
Fooking Hell, there's some gormless bastards about! Not you 442! Ryan!
A typical 1st round FA Cup game attracts much less cash for the home club than a league game.
On a league game you keep 80% of your cash take after the VAT has been paid.
On a cup game you pay out 20%, then matchday costs, then the FA pool (5% I think) and then you give 50% of the rest to the visitors.
So if they generate £67,500 in gate receipts, then minus £13,500 in Vat = £54,000. Minus £2700 to FA = £51,300. Minus say £15,000 in matchday costs = £36,300. Minus 50% to Wigan leaves £18,150.
Why can't bury fans do numbers? |
Local Derby crowd: 3856 | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 21:47 - Nov 7 with 7787 views | 442Dale |
http://www.gigglane.com/showthread.php/26690-Questions-for-Joy-Forever-Bury/page
"Our view at FB is that there is no money owing to HMRC. If the hearing does take place on 16 November, it will be dismissed for that reason. We will want to know more as to why this came to be in the first place, that is concerning in itself. I would not rest until I knew chapter and verse why HMRC are threatening a WUO, mistakenly or otherwise. But the most immediate thing is we have been assured we do not owe HMRC unpaid tax."
So will they be finding out why and letting their members know? | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 01:34 - Nov 8 with 7582 views | Daley_Lama |
Bury 4 Wigan 0
Even if they have recruited a load of mercenaries and are financed by Jeremy Kyle, that is an absolute cracking result for the buckets yesterday.
Leon Clarke is obviously very good but it seems Tom Pope is a force to be reckoned with once more as well, after a couple of years treading water.
I've never seen Danny Mayor play but opposing fans and pundits seem to be raving about him. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 08:34 - Nov 8 with 7471 views | JumeirahDale |
Seems that "assurances" have been made by the BFC board (but no physical proof or actual details/figures provided), and Forever Bury have in return handed over another chunk of members' cash, with potentially more to be donated in future (in return for shares of course) to fund investment in the club's youth facilities.
Whilst I admire the sentiment of focusing on a football production line rather than fantasy music festivals and made up hotels, I'd rather hand my cash over to an exiled Nigerian prince through my hotmail spam folder than Fat Boy and his cronies. Are they mad? |  | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:26 - Nov 8 with 7400 views | ColDale |
This was the theory that filled these pages two Summers ago, with one or two additions with no relation whatsoever to what is happening over at Bury FC:
1) A football club secure a sizeable loan with a mystery dormant company with an exceptionally and unusually high rate of interest
2)The stadium is used to guarantee that loan, despite the value of the stadium being worth far in excess of the size of the loan
3) The repayments are expensive due to the high interest rates but just about affordable so no real possibility of losing the stadium
4) The club then make the repayments unaffordable due to massively increasing the wage bill and taking on Premier League standard training facilities
5) Those asking questions are dismissed as everything on the pitch is peachy creamy. "You've never had it so good". Bit like what happened at Chesterfield.
6) The loan company is renamed / wound up to try and put distance between the loan companies and the board
7) Payments on the loan are eventually defaulted to the ever increasing expenditure by the Football Club, and the people behind the loan take the Football Club to the high court with a winding up order
8) The club is wound up and the people behind the loan secure the ground ahead of all other creditors after being the first people to put a charge on the ground
8 Alternative) The Supporters Trust are offered the chance to purchase whats left of the football club, complete with all debts but the ground is now in a third party's hands. The fans do so willingly, not wanting to see XXX years of tradition disappear |  | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:04 - Nov 8 with 7294 views | aleanddale |
There is another common theme / explanation amongst the deluded.
Don't worry that's the way Day operates ( pays under duress at the last possible minute ) - well what a fookin way to treat suppliers!. Tosser.
The problem keeps growing heads though as the 11 overpaid superstars who the club obviously can't afford keep delivering results on the pitch ( 4-0 v Wigan the latest example )
Hand to mouth existence in the hope of drawing United away in round 3.
What a way to run a club. The milky bar kid is a shyster of the highest order. | | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:06 - Nov 8 with 7207 views | RAFCBLUE |
The harsh economic reality is there is no free cashflow or significant cash reserves at bury football club to make all these bills go away. The "Investor" either doesn't exist or doesn't want to add to the debt pile loaned to date and secured against a piece of property.
The hand to mouth existence has run from week to week since the beginning, delaying payments to creditors which lead to winding up petitions is a significant sign of financial distress.
The short term isn't good either - only two home games in November and two home games in December. Burton, Scunthorpe, Chesterfield and Barnsley will not swell the away end attendance significantly.
Expect Leon Clarke not to play - a significant appearance fee per game means he will have a sore calf, hamstring, ankle for a few weeks. However Tom Pope, Nathan Cameron, Paddy Kenny, Chris Eagles, Danny Mayor are expensive and will want paying. From what I have no idea.
I can't believe how easily the buckets are being taken for mugs. I have no sympathy. I've seen them over the years boycott their club over much less!
My favourite twist - the Mortgage Debenture witnessed by one Gordon Sorfleet - the Press Officer. I really hope he understood the significant of what he was witnessing in 2013 because I suspect it might be brought up by quite a few bury fans in the very near future. |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 12:25 - Nov 8 with 7165 views | dingdangblue |
Where was Day yesterday? Normally when Manc Radio pull up he's always 1st to make an appearance? | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 16:43 - Nov 8 with 6985 views | 442Dale |
http://www.pafc.co.uk/news/article/not-up-to-scratch-2790277.aspx
Plymouth manager Derek Adams on Hallam Hope who scored for Carlisle at Plymouth yesterday while on-loan from Bury:
" Goal-scorer Hope, on loan from Everton, impressed in an attacking role for Carlisle, showing the sort of talent that convinced Derek to pursue the player for a loan deal earlier this season.Â
“The boy Hallam Hope, I thought, was excellent”, said Adams. “We tried to go for him but we couldn’t afford him. It’s that kind of thing that becomes difficult in this league.
“He was a target for me recently, because of the injuries we’ve had. We couldn’t afford to take him in.” "
#bottom4budget | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 17:19 - Nov 8 with 6929 views | RAFCBLUE |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 16:43 - Nov 8 by 442Dale |
http://www.pafc.co.uk/news/article/not-up-to-scratch-2790277.aspx
Plymouth manager Derek Adams on Hallam Hope who scored for Carlisle at Plymouth yesterday while on-loan from Bury:
" Goal-scorer Hope, on loan from Everton, impressed in an attacking role for Carlisle, showing the sort of talent that convinced Derek to pursue the player for a loan deal earlier this season.Â
“The boy Hallam Hope, I thought, was excellent”, said Adams. “We tried to go for him but we couldn’t afford him. It’s that kind of thing that becomes difficult in this league.
“He was a target for me recently, because of the injuries we’ve had. We couldn’t afford to take him in.” "
#bottom4budget |
A three year commitment made in January 2015 which means they have him for 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18.
I do hope Hallam has good PFA representation. I would wager that he won't be drawing a wage from bury FC come December 2017! | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 17:44 - Nov 8 with 6871 views | dingdangblue |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 17:19 - Nov 8 by RAFCBLUE |
A three year commitment made in January 2015 which means they have him for 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18.
I do hope Hallam has good PFA representation. I would wager that he won't be drawing a wage from bury FC come December 2017! |
I'm sure there was talk of a transfer fee involved getting Hope from Everton? 200k rings a bell. | |
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