| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January 03:59 - Jan 2 with 4334 views | Sceivious |
Obviously we don't produce a lot in the line of entertainment anymore so I have spent the last few games watching us closely from a tactical perspective, trying to understand our approach. I'm watching from abroad (Sydney) so unfortunately I don't get the full pitch perspective that one would get at the games, I'll give it a shot though.
Marti has not been shy about telling us that we will not be keeping the ball just for the sake of it. However, that is what we are seeing, a lot of very static possession between the back four and goalkeeper. There is clearly a huge conflict between what he is saying and what we are seeing. This appears to be a personnel issue more than anything else. We are certainly not as static up front as we were under Ainsworth and often when our back four receive the ball we see the players ahead of them running forward at varying angles, with purpose. I believe the purpose is to do enable the back four/deeper midfielders to do one of two things;
1) Play a ball over the top to turn the opposition around and prevent them from pressing our back four. Doing this a few times per game has teams second guessing whether they should be pressing or not and allows us to maintain possession deep in our half.
2) Play the ball into the feet of an attacker in "the hole" once the gap between the opposition defence and midfield is widened.
Unfortunately, due to a complete lack of technical quality and courage in the current squad this rarely seems to pan out. I'm sure that they have been told "if the opportunity isn't there rotate out and start again" and they use this get out clause frequently, more than Marti would like. This is abundantly clear when you listen to his post-match press conferences.
I came to the conclusion last night that we are not necessarily any better defensively under Marti than we were under Ainsworth. I think there is a misconception that we have gotten better defensively if you look at the number of goals conceded alone. However, we just have more of the ball and thus give opposition less opportunity to attack us. I feel that opposition still create a meaningful goalscoring opportunity any time they get the ball into the final third but they just have the ball there 40% less than they did before. Our players are aware of this frailty and thus no-one wants to be the guy that gives the ball away, making us frustratingly risk averse.
Clearly Marti's way of playing gives us much more of a chance of staying up than Ainsworth's insistence on us playing almost entirely without the ball. However, without some additions to the squad in key areas I can't see us picking up the necessary points in the second half of the season. Below in order of priority;
1) Goalscorer. Needless to say we need someone that can score goals. We simply will not stay up if we don't have a player that at least breaks double figures. Marti would probably want a striker comfortable on the ball who can link the play as well as having the physical attributes to occupy defenders and threaten in behind. However, beggers can't be choosers and if we can somehow convince a proven goalscorer to join us for the second half of the season he will have to take them.
2) Creative midfielder(s). If we don't score goals we won't stay up but I actually think this is the most important signing to make Marti's style work. This could be a "10" to play in the pockets we are creating between the lines currently or a "6" to receive the ball off the back four to get us playing forward, I suspect he would like both if possible. Currently Marti is stuck shoehorning Dozzell into those roles and he has not been consistently effective in either. Having a confident ball player in either of those positions completely transforms what is often sterile possession at the moment into purposeful possession in the oppositions half of the pitch.
3) Another ball playing defender. Without doubt our best combination at the back is Cook and Clarke-Salter. However, given the injury profile of both and the attritional nature of the championship, it is clear that we need someone to cover them that is not Jimmy Dunne. Having confidence on the ball both beats the oppositions press and also allows our defenders to step forward and draw a man if the opposition sit back. Rob Dickie in his prime was superb at this. If teams pressed him he would play a pass or turn past the attacker, if they backed off he would stride into midfield and take opportunity for a shot or cross. Himself and Barbet enabled the best of Warb's football. Marti would probably kill to have those two now.
4) Starting goalkeeper. I really don't expect this to happen given how much stock the club have put in Begovic but I'm sure Marti is pulling his hair out having to watch Begovic play with his feet in recent weeks. Similarly to our centre backs, if we had a keeper with a broader range of passing it would both nulify the opposition press and allow us to play through/over it. Currently, we often see the ball find it's way into the stand whenever any sort of pressure if exerted. Begovic is a passable shot stopper and this was fine for Ainsworth, it is not enough for Marti.
With the limited resources that we have I think it would be foolish to prioritise the full back positions or wide areas. Paal is probably our best player. Cannon is quality if he can stay fit. Smyth/Chair/Willock/Kolli/Adomah/Richards offer good depth in wide areas.
Interested to hear what others have thought of Marti's start and what they feel he needs to be successful. |  | | |  |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 05:25 - Jan 2 with 4229 views | bongo_king |
Agree with the theory both of what Marti's trying to do, and what we need. I fear the reality is a bit trickier.
Most loans will come with the requirement to play every game when fit and/or will have limited experience. Given our financial constraints, the loan market is where we're likely to be shopping. Unless we sell Chair, which creates a headache as we then have to replace him as well as get all the other players.
With that in mind, I think we may end up with a loaned young creative midfielder (maybe even two), as you describe. Possibly a loaned centre forward too, but that won't be an experienced one.
Centre back is trickier. We know JCS and Cook are the starting pair when fit, so we are looking at someone to rotate in when needed. That may well require a free agent signing. God knows who.
In an ideal world I agree we would get a new GK, but it's not going to happen. I'm not just worried about Begovic's play with the ball at his feet, but also his command of the box - IMO a big reason we keep conceding from set pieces is because he has very poor command of the area; yet he is the on the pitch captain. He rarely comes for the ball, which creates panic in defence; and when he does come... well we saw last night. Dieng had faults and a poor last season we probably had little choice but to sell him; but apart from the feet thing, he was also good at commanding his box. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 05:59 - Jan 2 with 4203 views | SydneyRs |
The challenge is also trying to do this with little or no money.
I do think Marti's style of play gives us a better chance of getting loans in then Ainsworth's attritional style though. He's clearly growing frustrated at the current lot not carrying out his instructions to the level he wants them to. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 08:32 - Jan 2 with 4051 views | traininvain |
I wouldn’t be surprised if a new keeper is one of Marti’s top priorities in January. For his style of football to work we need a keeper who is comfortable with the ball at his feet and willing to play outside the penalty area when in possession to allow the team to push further up the pitch.
This isn’t happening with Begovic who is ok with the ball at his feet in our penalty area but not mobile enough to play the sweeper keeper role. Look at Pep who replaced Hart as a priority when he joined Man City or Arteta replacing Ramsdale last summer. It’s a key position for this style of football.
Another example of why Ainsworth shouldn’t have been given the keys to the kingdom last summer as we got rid of a keeper perfect for this role and here we are 6 months later needing a Seny Dieng for the new manager’s style of football but probably don’t have the budget to make the change. |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 08:53 - Jan 2 with 3980 views | Tonto |
The list is long. The budget isn't. Its a big problem, so our expectations should.be low unless we sell someone, and even then why would anyone decent come to us?
We will have to prioritise. We speak about getting a goalscorer but we need to create chances first, so it's the midfield that is highest on my list. You could have Haarland up front but he would.score if the ball doesn't get to him in the right places. |  |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 08:59 - Jan 2 with 3957 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 08:32 - Jan 2 by traininvain |
I wouldn’t be surprised if a new keeper is one of Marti’s top priorities in January. For his style of football to work we need a keeper who is comfortable with the ball at his feet and willing to play outside the penalty area when in possession to allow the team to push further up the pitch.
This isn’t happening with Begovic who is ok with the ball at his feet in our penalty area but not mobile enough to play the sweeper keeper role. Look at Pep who replaced Hart as a priority when he joined Man City or Arteta replacing Ramsdale last summer. It’s a key position for this style of football.
Another example of why Ainsworth shouldn’t have been given the keys to the kingdom last summer as we got rid of a keeper perfect for this role and here we are 6 months later needing a Seny Dieng for the new manager’s style of football but probably don’t have the budget to make the change. |
Great post by the OP, agree with most of it.
No chance it was Ainsworth’s decision to ‘get rid’ of Dieng: this was surely an FFP decision from the board. Although Begovic’s style does not fit with the new manager and he has made a few huge mistakes recently he has also made a large number of decent saves to keep us in games. Replacing him is surely way down the list compared to one or two forwards, a Dozzell replacement and another CB. |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 09:00 - Jan 2 with 3941 views | stevec |
I find the idea that key to success is replace the keeper with a ball playing keeper as somewhat bizarre.
If you watch other sides in our league they just don’t bring the keeper into play anywhere near as much as we do. And the reason we do that is the incompetence of our central midfielders.
Whether Jimmy Dunne or Bergovic are good passers is neither here nor there when you’ve got Dozzell and Field as the ‘natural’ recipients of any pass out. Neither can turn in possession of the ball and both seemingly incapable of running into space with a view to turn when out of possession of the ball. In short, the defenders end up dithering about as there’s no other option apart from launching it. |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 09:44 - Jan 2 with 3833 views | Sceivious |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 05:25 - Jan 2 by bongo_king |
Agree with the theory both of what Marti's trying to do, and what we need. I fear the reality is a bit trickier.
Most loans will come with the requirement to play every game when fit and/or will have limited experience. Given our financial constraints, the loan market is where we're likely to be shopping. Unless we sell Chair, which creates a headache as we then have to replace him as well as get all the other players.
With that in mind, I think we may end up with a loaned young creative midfielder (maybe even two), as you describe. Possibly a loaned centre forward too, but that won't be an experienced one.
Centre back is trickier. We know JCS and Cook are the starting pair when fit, so we are looking at someone to rotate in when needed. That may well require a free agent signing. God knows who.
In an ideal world I agree we would get a new GK, but it's not going to happen. I'm not just worried about Begovic's play with the ball at his feet, but also his command of the box - IMO a big reason we keep conceding from set pieces is because he has very poor command of the area; yet he is the on the pitch captain. He rarely comes for the ball, which creates panic in defence; and when he does come... well we saw last night. Dieng had faults and a poor last season we probably had little choice but to sell him; but apart from the feet thing, he was also good at commanding his box. |
Yeah I was being idealistic and stating what we would need to implement Marti's style of play to the fullest. At least as I see it.
You are entirely correct that in reality it is going to be very hard to make good on that shopping list. Everyone in the Championship would like a goalscorer and they can all best us for budget.
Like you say adding a CB is a tough call too because if we can somehow source a free transfer then what can we promise them in terms of game time? In reality they will probably get a good number of starts between now and the end of the season but there is always the off chance that Cook and JCS stay fit and suddenly one player has to be unhappy every week. Bad enough we already have the rumours of discontent from Armstrong and Dunne without adding more disharmony to the squad.
We are going to be completely reliant on somehow securing loans and while the style of play certainly improves our chance of competing for talent, our league position and financial situation hinder us massively. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 09:55 - Jan 2 with 3781 views | calHoop |
I think defensively we've been a lot better, certainly in open play. Goals conceded count shows that, however, seems like we've had problems from set pieces for years. Who remember Mark "we don't work on corners" Bowen!! That is unforgivable for me, it's a huge part of the game now, especially in the Champ. The two goals conceded yesterday were unforgivable.
Today was Marti's first mistep for me. With no footballers in the team, we insisted on playing the same way, we should have mixed it up a lot more and gone a bit more direct, as Cardiff were shite. Try and win second balls higher up the pitch. PLaying out from the back can work when you have Chair and Willock to take pressure off, but you're not getting that with Larkeche and Smyth (unless the latter has a free run at the full back). The second goal was symptomatic of it. So slow taking the ball out, we lose it (no options), and then give away a ridiculous corner.
I think more than a striker is someone who links the play from midfield and joins the forward line with runs. Our 3 midfielders v Cardiff would drop so deep to receive the ball, there was no way of getting out. Dozzell was disgraceful, dropping in next to Dunne or JCS so often if was painful. I think he dropped in between midfield and attack, once and we moved it forward with menace for once. Someone who can drive us forward with the ball from midfield is a must, it'll make such a difference to Dykes too (who is shocking atm to be fair) but is so isolated.
I'd be looking for that and then a striker. Ideally both. | | | |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:17 - Jan 2 with 3633 views | sparkey |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 09:55 - Jan 2 by calHoop |
I think defensively we've been a lot better, certainly in open play. Goals conceded count shows that, however, seems like we've had problems from set pieces for years. Who remember Mark "we don't work on corners" Bowen!! That is unforgivable for me, it's a huge part of the game now, especially in the Champ. The two goals conceded yesterday were unforgivable.
Today was Marti's first mistep for me. With no footballers in the team, we insisted on playing the same way, we should have mixed it up a lot more and gone a bit more direct, as Cardiff were shite. Try and win second balls higher up the pitch. PLaying out from the back can work when you have Chair and Willock to take pressure off, but you're not getting that with Larkeche and Smyth (unless the latter has a free run at the full back). The second goal was symptomatic of it. So slow taking the ball out, we lose it (no options), and then give away a ridiculous corner.
I think more than a striker is someone who links the play from midfield and joins the forward line with runs. Our 3 midfielders v Cardiff would drop so deep to receive the ball, there was no way of getting out. Dozzell was disgraceful, dropping in next to Dunne or JCS so often if was painful. I think he dropped in between midfield and attack, once and we moved it forward with menace for once. Someone who can drive us forward with the ball from midfield is a must, it'll make such a difference to Dykes too (who is shocking atm to be fair) but is so isolated.
I'd be looking for that and then a striker. Ideally both. |
I disagree on the idea that we should have gone more direct.
The memory of Ainsworth tactics still remain in my head like a migraine & that is the worst football I have ever seen, also did not work in the slightest.
I like how Marti plays it his way or no way, will help us in the long run.
I do see your point though | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:26 - Jan 2 with 3589 views | traininvain |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 08:59 - Jan 2 by Ned_Kennedys |
Great post by the OP, agree with most of it.
No chance it was Ainsworth’s decision to ‘get rid’ of Dieng: this was surely an FFP decision from the board. Although Begovic’s style does not fit with the new manager and he has made a few huge mistakes recently he has also made a large number of decent saves to keep us in games. Replacing him is surely way down the list compared to one or two forwards, a Dozzell replacement and another CB. |
Fair point it was probably FFP that resulted in Dieng being sold but it doesn’t change the point that we signed a replacement keeper who is unsuited to the style of football the new manager wants to play. A situation that was predictable at the time and flagged by quite a few people on here.
This is why a director of football is needed to ensure continuity and avoid situations like this where we have a mishmash of players suited to different styles of football.
On the face of it, Begovic isn’t our biggest issue as he’s made some good saves recently despite a couple of howlers. But in terms of the style of football Marti wants the team to play, he’s completely unsuitable and will make it very difficult to implement his ideology hence why I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s replaced asap. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:31 - Jan 2 with 3567 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:26 - Jan 2 by traininvain |
Fair point it was probably FFP that resulted in Dieng being sold but it doesn’t change the point that we signed a replacement keeper who is unsuited to the style of football the new manager wants to play. A situation that was predictable at the time and flagged by quite a few people on here.
This is why a director of football is needed to ensure continuity and avoid situations like this where we have a mishmash of players suited to different styles of football.
On the face of it, Begovic isn’t our biggest issue as he’s made some good saves recently despite a couple of howlers. But in terms of the style of football Marti wants the team to play, he’s completely unsuitable and will make it very difficult to implement his ideology hence why I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s replaced asap. |
"This is why a director of football is needed to ensure continuity and avoid situations like this where we have a mishmash of players suited to different styles of football."
100%. Perfect example. |  |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:35 - Jan 2 with 3553 views | PunteR |
Its a really good OP.
As funds are limited I think midfield has to be priority one. Obviously a goal scorer is needed but if we're playing possession football we need to be able to move the ball forward and quickly. Teams know to press us high up the pitch and put our defence under pressure when we have the ball . Dozzell and Field hide to much in games and just don't create the outlets enough to receive the ball in good areas or good enough to turn and create attacking play fast enough. Opposition just drop back into shape in numbers by the time we're in the final third and they're all behind the ball.
I like Marti though. Good young manager that is clearly trying to learn about Championship football .He's obviously learning about his players and probably trying to suss out how to deal with his young English players and their inflated sense of entitlement. Ainsworth had no chance. Maybe he needs to be a bit more pragmatic with his decisions, i dunno, just play your best team and not try and rotate as much because clearly we haven't got enough decent players to play championship football. But then what do i know..? |  |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 10:45 - Jan 2 with 3503 views | Juzzie |
Although GA was clearly out of his depth, it's clear the problem is with the players, not whichever manager is in place.
I really hope Marti stays regardless of what division we are in next season but considering he's never been at a club longer than 18-24 months, I'm not hopeful. |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:09 - Jan 2 with 3424 views | lassel |
As said on the January thread where people were expecting deals to be all sorted and announced yesterday, who are these championship standard players that are fit, out of contract and willing to come to QPR?!
Also with the idea that’s been floated many times that we would dip into Scandinavia and pick up some bargains, there are players here that are good enough, out of contract and who would’ve bitten our arm off for a chance in England but the club didn’t ask for any info on them and realistically our recruitment team has never heard of them - Marti is a head coach, recruitment is not in his remit so he will get who Belk and Hoos provide him.
Unfortunately it’s very much a rock and a hard place situation now as if the club believes that it is possible to salvage this and starts looking at guys like McKenna or his fellow outcasts at Forest who have been very open in their happiness to sit out their crazy contracts, we will have to spend most of next years rebuilding budget now to tempt them to come in. Similarly if - which I suspect will happen - we go to Chelsea and ask for Castledine and Washington we spend next years budget today to get them in, and the above mentioned all only happen at the end of January anyway once we will in all likely hold be adrift at rock bottom.
The other option is the one QPR never takes, which is to be the adults in the room. You accept that there is only so much speedtape you can put on to cover structural failure, that this team and situation is irretrievable and accept your fate. You ask around for any offer you can get for Chair and maybe Dykes to have for next years rebuild. Maybe JCS (albeit unlikely). You accept Adomah was a horrible deal and you write off the £500k he is still due from us and he sees out his contract in the padded seats. You then throw in a few EDS players every game to see who sinks and who swims and can be relied upon in next years squad.
Essentially the decision is a stark one - be smart, accept we are gone and maybe make it a 2/3 year journey in L1 rebuilding, or blow next years budget trying to salvage the irretrievable and doom the club to a minimum 5 years gone and maybe a far greater fall through the divisions.
Happy new year. [Post edited 2 Jan 11:18]
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:17 - Jan 2 with 3383 views | Antti_Heinola |
A forward is vital. There are massive issues almost everywhere, but we're not going to be signing a ball-playing CB when we already have 4 CBs at the club, and Fox returning to fitness. Next season, yes. Now, with limited (if any) funds: no.
Midfield - if Colback ever gets fit I think he will make a difference in there and do the brave job we need of someone to take the ball from the CBs, on the turn, and get things shifting. EDB was the only one doing that yesterday.
But we need someone up front. I think the fact Marti is trying in almost every game to play Dykes behind a striker means that there is a spot there up top he wants to fill. I don't buy the 'not creating chances' and 'Haaland wouldn't score' - against Southampton 5 crosses flashed across the box with no one anywhere near them. A good striker with good movement would've converted one. Movement, directness, will make a huge difference for Chair, Willock and Smyth. But how we get someone like that on our budget I do not know.
I'd actually even say a winger too, which might allow us to move Chair into the centre as a 10. |  |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:19 - Jan 2 with 3352 views | TheChef |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:09 - Jan 2 by lassel |
As said on the January thread where people were expecting deals to be all sorted and announced yesterday, who are these championship standard players that are fit, out of contract and willing to come to QPR?!
Also with the idea that’s been floated many times that we would dip into Scandinavia and pick up some bargains, there are players here that are good enough, out of contract and who would’ve bitten our arm off for a chance in England but the club didn’t ask for any info on them and realistically our recruitment team has never heard of them - Marti is a head coach, recruitment is not in his remit so he will get who Belk and Hoos provide him.
Unfortunately it’s very much a rock and a hard place situation now as if the club believes that it is possible to salvage this and starts looking at guys like McKenna or his fellow outcasts at Forest who have been very open in their happiness to sit out their crazy contracts, we will have to spend most of next years rebuilding budget now to tempt them to come in. Similarly if - which I suspect will happen - we go to Chelsea and ask for Castledine and Washington we spend next years budget today to get them in, and the above mentioned all only happen at the end of January anyway once we will in all likely hold be adrift at rock bottom.
The other option is the one QPR never takes, which is to be the adults in the room. You accept that there is only so much speedtape you can put on to cover structural failure, that this team and situation is irretrievable and accept your fate. You ask around for any offer you can get for Chair and maybe Dykes to have for next years rebuild. Maybe JCS (albeit unlikely). You accept Adomah was a horrible deal and you write off the £500k he is still due from us and he sees out his contract in the padded seats. You then throw in a few EDS players every game to see who sinks and who swims and can be relied upon in next years squad.
Essentially the decision is a stark one - be smart, accept we are gone and maybe make it a 2/3 year journey in L1 rebuilding, or blow next years budget trying to salvage the irretrievable and doom the club to a minimum 5 years gone and maybe a far greater fall through the divisions.
Happy new year. [Post edited 2 Jan 11:18]
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Well there might be some players fit and willing to come to QPR (most likely loans) but I also doubt they will be any good.
Our issues are too deep to be fixed by the January window, I'm sorry to say. Total clear out/overhaul required and that won't be easy either. |  |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:24 - Jan 2 with 3319 views | Juzzie |
Not just a case of who are these players willing to come to QPR but in the opposite direction, who are the clubs willing to take our schit players off our hands? | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:27 - Jan 2 with 3283 views | rbee |
Unless we sell I don't see many incomings during the transfer windows.
Any Marti Nordic unknown gems I would have expected to have been announced already.
Any striker has to be a priority. |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:34 - Jan 2 with 3224 views | lassel |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:27 - Jan 2 by rbee |
Unless we sell I don't see many incomings during the transfer windows.
Any Marti Nordic unknown gems I would have expected to have been announced already.
Any striker has to be a priority. |
As above, there are no ‘Nordic gems’ that the club will have heard of and Marti is not in charge of recruitment.
The few gems that were available up here and would’ve come have all got new clubs now. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:35 - Jan 2 with 3219 views | mart_Goblin |
I agree with a lot of the original post .
I also agree that the keeper will be way down the priority list. Someone rightly said that no other team in the championship uses their keeper as much as us. Except our keeper is the only one who refuses to receive the ball out of his area. He doesn’t join in up the pitch like every other keeper. That has a knock on affect because if he stepped out of his box in between the centre backs then they could push on, the full backs can push on wide or into midfield and we can play in the opponents half and not pass across our own box for hours on end. It’s really basic. But it’s very important to where and how you get at teams . So the keeper is an issue.
But it’s not as important as a striker with any sort of goal scoring instinct, a midfielder who can get about the pitch who can break through lines with an eye for goal . Hard to find of course with no budget etc. but we can’t deny at least one is needed .
Dozzell is weak in mind and weak in body. Field is a good enforcer and breaks down play well but going forward is very limited indeed and is being found out now as we actually have the ball a little .
Was listening to Dean Saunders talking about Declan Rice this morning . Different world of course but said the 3 necessities for any midfielder are , be quicker than your opponent around the pitch , be a better footballer than your opponent mentally and win your duals..be stronger .
Made me think about our midfield and it’s one of the main reasons we have been so poor for so long. Our midfield doesn’t create anything, is slow around the park and Dozzell especially loses every dual.
And whilst we are on the subject , we saw yesterday why Chair holds on to the ball so long much to all of our annoyance at times. I was sat behind the goal in the school end yesterday which was strange in itself , but watching our defenders have the ball, piss off the fans from going side to side to side to side….but there was nothing in front of them . Only out ball occasionally was EDB who dropped so deep that he would then be in the same boat . No intelligence across the front in the runs they make or making space for others . It’s what Chair sees when he looks up .
He drives us all mad at times but my god, without him we are just clueless .
We saw yesterday, I think the true frustration in MC in his post match interview. You can coach some of this lot until the cows come home but if they don’t do what they are told then you’ll test your hair out. Seen some say that zonal marking, in what we were doing yesterday at corners lays the blame fully at MC’s door. It’s just not the case .
Zonal marking is a starting point only. But as soon as the whistle is blown its attack the ball ..beat the man…cleat your lines. Just look at the second goal yesterday? Kolli is out muscled and out jumped..you could ask why is he marking the guy but I’ve also read people say that he is better in the air than Dykes and should be starting . Begovic looked like what he is …old, immobile and not really bothered. I was sat behind that goal . For the rest of the game he showed no emotion. Not rallying the troops , not shouting at himself . Nothing .
But what the hell is JCS doing . Marking zonally. But that doesn’t mean you have to stay in some exclusion zone if you can win the ball which he could have done . Just watch it back and take a look.
It’s possibly the most bizarre and stupid bit of defending I’ve seen in a long time .
MC might set them up that way but there is no way on Earth he would tell JCS to ignore the ball if it’s not directly on his head if there is a goal threat .
It’s where we are with this bunch. They don’t have the quality or the footballing intelligence to do what’s needed at this level. MC doesn’t have a chance unless we get people in now..today . |  | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:48 - Jan 2 with 3161 views | rbee |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:34 - Jan 2 by lassel |
As above, there are no ‘Nordic gems’ that the club will have heard of and Marti is not in charge of recruitment.
The few gems that were available up here and would’ve come have all got new clubs now. |
Thanks for the reply.
Marti will have some input in to any recruitment as Beale did, as Gareth did.
Not surprised that we missed out on the few gems already in Scandinavia as the footy finished there around the time Marti joined us and of course we are skint. | | | |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 13:08 - Jan 2 with 3010 views | PunteR |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:35 - Jan 2 by mart_Goblin |
I agree with a lot of the original post .
I also agree that the keeper will be way down the priority list. Someone rightly said that no other team in the championship uses their keeper as much as us. Except our keeper is the only one who refuses to receive the ball out of his area. He doesn’t join in up the pitch like every other keeper. That has a knock on affect because if he stepped out of his box in between the centre backs then they could push on, the full backs can push on wide or into midfield and we can play in the opponents half and not pass across our own box for hours on end. It’s really basic. But it’s very important to where and how you get at teams . So the keeper is an issue.
But it’s not as important as a striker with any sort of goal scoring instinct, a midfielder who can get about the pitch who can break through lines with an eye for goal . Hard to find of course with no budget etc. but we can’t deny at least one is needed .
Dozzell is weak in mind and weak in body. Field is a good enforcer and breaks down play well but going forward is very limited indeed and is being found out now as we actually have the ball a little .
Was listening to Dean Saunders talking about Declan Rice this morning . Different world of course but said the 3 necessities for any midfielder are , be quicker than your opponent around the pitch , be a better footballer than your opponent mentally and win your duals..be stronger .
Made me think about our midfield and it’s one of the main reasons we have been so poor for so long. Our midfield doesn’t create anything, is slow around the park and Dozzell especially loses every dual.
And whilst we are on the subject , we saw yesterday why Chair holds on to the ball so long much to all of our annoyance at times. I was sat behind the goal in the school end yesterday which was strange in itself , but watching our defenders have the ball, piss off the fans from going side to side to side to side….but there was nothing in front of them . Only out ball occasionally was EDB who dropped so deep that he would then be in the same boat . No intelligence across the front in the runs they make or making space for others . It’s what Chair sees when he looks up .
He drives us all mad at times but my god, without him we are just clueless .
We saw yesterday, I think the true frustration in MC in his post match interview. You can coach some of this lot until the cows come home but if they don’t do what they are told then you’ll test your hair out. Seen some say that zonal marking, in what we were doing yesterday at corners lays the blame fully at MC’s door. It’s just not the case .
Zonal marking is a starting point only. But as soon as the whistle is blown its attack the ball ..beat the man…cleat your lines. Just look at the second goal yesterday? Kolli is out muscled and out jumped..you could ask why is he marking the guy but I’ve also read people say that he is better in the air than Dykes and should be starting . Begovic looked like what he is …old, immobile and not really bothered. I was sat behind that goal . For the rest of the game he showed no emotion. Not rallying the troops , not shouting at himself . Nothing .
But what the hell is JCS doing . Marking zonally. But that doesn’t mean you have to stay in some exclusion zone if you can win the ball which he could have done . Just watch it back and take a look.
It’s possibly the most bizarre and stupid bit of defending I’ve seen in a long time .
MC might set them up that way but there is no way on Earth he would tell JCS to ignore the ball if it’s not directly on his head if there is a goal threat .
It’s where we are with this bunch. They don’t have the quality or the footballing intelligence to do what’s needed at this level. MC doesn’t have a chance unless we get people in now..today . |
"Field is a good enforcer and breaks down play well but going forward is very limited indeed and is being found out now as we actually have the ball a little ."
Good point on Field. It does explain the apparent "loss of form" this season. | |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 13:15 - Jan 2 with 2990 views | ed_83 |
We're better under Marti than we were under Ainsworth or Critchley, but that's not saying much. I generally agree with your description of what we're trying to do: fast, passing-based attacking football.
But talking about strategy and signings misses the point. We're where we are because the mentality across the playing squad is consistently awful, and you don't change that by tweaking formations or signing a ball-playing centre back.
How many times have we seen this squad get bullied by more determined, organised or physically aggressive opponents? How often have we seen them retreat into their shells when things get tough? How often have they gone on long losing runs, under every single manager since McClaren? How many fundamentally talented players like Rob Dickie or Chris Willock have we turned into shadows of themselves?
These are systemic problems which point to a broken culture within the club. The players have no confidence, no bottle, no trust in themselves or the players around them, no willingness to take risks when they've got the ball, or fight for it when out of possession.
It doesn't matter who we sign in January: if you don't fix that culture, we'll just keep dragging new players down to our level. We need to change things on a much deeper level.
1.) We desperately need a credible and experienced DoF who can oversee transfer strategy but also drive standards up across the club.
2.) Our existing senior players need to step up and show some actual leadership, both on and off the pitch. Cook has been doing this, but Colback and Begovic have been useless.
3.) We need a fit playing squad. In terms of raw ability we've got 11 players capable of keeping us up, but we can't seem to get them on the pitch at the same time. Whether that's a problem with the medical team, training or recruitment, it needs fixing urgently.
4.) There needs to be a complete mindset shift in the dressing room: we have to get nastier, more aggressive, more physical, and stop allowing other teams to bully us. If we're going to get relegated anyway, then the least we can do is show a bit of fight.
5.) For a team this low on confidence and ability, we have to get set pieces right. I don't care if Chair and Paal have to do an extra three hours at the end of every training session until they can consistently get their corners past the first man.
6.) For a team with no money, the amount of dead weight in our playing squad is absurd. We have to get players like Richards, Adomah and Kelman off the wage bill, whatever it takes. Possibly controversial, but I'd include Willock in that group: he clearly doesn't want to be here, and the more he phones it in, the more it tells other players that they're entitled to do the same.
7.) Any players we do sign - presumably loans given our financial state - have to be capable of facing up to the fact that we're a sinking ship and likely to get relegated regardless of what happens, but still have the mental strength to dig in and fight tirelessly for the team despite that sense of futility.
Get all of the above right, and then maybe we can think about which positions we need to sign players in (the correct answer being "all of them") or how we want the team to play. Without those bigger changes, everything else is pointless. [Post edited 2 Jan 13:20]
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 13:18 - Jan 2 with 2971 views | PunteR |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 11:17 - Jan 2 by Antti_Heinola |
A forward is vital. There are massive issues almost everywhere, but we're not going to be signing a ball-playing CB when we already have 4 CBs at the club, and Fox returning to fitness. Next season, yes. Now, with limited (if any) funds: no.
Midfield - if Colback ever gets fit I think he will make a difference in there and do the brave job we need of someone to take the ball from the CBs, on the turn, and get things shifting. EDB was the only one doing that yesterday.
But we need someone up front. I think the fact Marti is trying in almost every game to play Dykes behind a striker means that there is a spot there up top he wants to fill. I don't buy the 'not creating chances' and 'Haaland wouldn't score' - against Southampton 5 crosses flashed across the box with no one anywhere near them. A good striker with good movement would've converted one. Movement, directness, will make a huge difference for Chair, Willock and Smyth. But how we get someone like that on our budget I do not know.
I'd actually even say a winger too, which might allow us to move Chair into the centre as a 10. |
Thats a massive IF, about Colback. Im not even sure he's mobile or creative enough when he does finally make it back on the pitch.
Good shout regarding Chair moving more central and getting a decent winger instead. Might be a cheaper alternative. | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 14:36 - Jan 2 with 2810 views | Sceivious |
| Early thoughts on Marti's QPR and what he needs in January on 13:15 - Jan 2 by ed_83 |
We're better under Marti than we were under Ainsworth or Critchley, but that's not saying much. I generally agree with your description of what we're trying to do: fast, passing-based attacking football.
But talking about strategy and signings misses the point. We're where we are because the mentality across the playing squad is consistently awful, and you don't change that by tweaking formations or signing a ball-playing centre back.
How many times have we seen this squad get bullied by more determined, organised or physically aggressive opponents? How often have we seen them retreat into their shells when things get tough? How often have they gone on long losing runs, under every single manager since McClaren? How many fundamentally talented players like Rob Dickie or Chris Willock have we turned into shadows of themselves?
These are systemic problems which point to a broken culture within the club. The players have no confidence, no bottle, no trust in themselves or the players around them, no willingness to take risks when they've got the ball, or fight for it when out of possession.
It doesn't matter who we sign in January: if you don't fix that culture, we'll just keep dragging new players down to our level. We need to change things on a much deeper level.
1.) We desperately need a credible and experienced DoF who can oversee transfer strategy but also drive standards up across the club.
2.) Our existing senior players need to step up and show some actual leadership, both on and off the pitch. Cook has been doing this, but Colback and Begovic have been useless.
3.) We need a fit playing squad. In terms of raw ability we've got 11 players capable of keeping us up, but we can't seem to get them on the pitch at the same time. Whether that's a problem with the medical team, training or recruitment, it needs fixing urgently.
4.) There needs to be a complete mindset shift in the dressing room: we have to get nastier, more aggressive, more physical, and stop allowing other teams to bully us. If we're going to get relegated anyway, then the least we can do is show a bit of fight.
5.) For a team this low on confidence and ability, we have to get set pieces right. I don't care if Chair and Paal have to do an extra three hours at the end of every training session until they can consistently get their corners past the first man.
6.) For a team with no money, the amount of dead weight in our playing squad is absurd. We have to get players like Richards, Adomah and Kelman off the wage bill, whatever it takes. Possibly controversial, but I'd include Willock in that group: he clearly doesn't want to be here, and the more he phones it in, the more it tells other players that they're entitled to do the same.
7.) Any players we do sign - presumably loans given our financial state - have to be capable of facing up to the fact that we're a sinking ship and likely to get relegated regardless of what happens, but still have the mental strength to dig in and fight tirelessly for the team despite that sense of futility.
Get all of the above right, and then maybe we can think about which positions we need to sign players in (the correct answer being "all of them") or how we want the team to play. Without those bigger changes, everything else is pointless. [Post edited 2 Jan 13:20]
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Although I agree with a lot of what you are saying in terms of what needs to change I think we have missed the boat with the DoF. If they were going to appoint someone then it needed to be done well in advance of January to have an impact. Rather than rush someone into the position now I would rather we have the correct person in place prior to the summer so that they can plan out a summer transfer window.
In the absence of a DoF we are relying on the recruitment department headed by Andy Belk to take the wheel. It will be interesting to see what they deliver because they are often lauded internally but haven't been utilised appropriately. We always seem to give priority to the manager of the time and allow them to sign their own players. You can't tell me that Dom Ball, Leon Balogun, Asmir Begovic, Jack Colback etc would have passed any sort of screening by an analyst. If their job is talent identification and ensuring that we sign cheap to sell high then our management and DoF have been undermining that for years. Maybe this is the first time that they can act unimpeded.
Again when you speak about things like the injury profile of the current squad this is something which would have been factored into the analytics on any players coming into the football club. I can only imagine that we are ignoring the reports but we are deeming it to be an acceptable level of risk, which it clearly isn't. Yes on some occasions you get a Sam Field type where clubs wouldn't touch him because of his injury record and we get a bargain, but more often than not you get a JCS or Tyler Roberts type player that spend prolonged spells on the sideline and provide no value.
Set pieces I personally cannot understand. How can you have an entire building full of professional footballers and no-one can deliver a set piece with any degree of accuracy or pace? Maybe they have defied all professional standards and there actually is no-one capable. This might explain why we've had a succession of managers that have created a number of short corner "routines" where we don't put the ball directly into the box. Like you say, it's quite terrifying to imagine that players are currently finishing set piece sessions and being told "well done, that'll do for today lads". | | | |
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