| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” 12:33 - Sep 20 with 4329 views | jonahwhereru |
That is a quote of Hill’s that I remember.
So where do we stand. Well the kind early fixture list some had mentioned hasn’t materialised. Excusing Southend’s false position the average league position of our opponents to date is 12.3.
We are 8th with a goal difference of plus four. Having scored the joint 8th highest number of goals and conceded the joint 5th fewest.
Given the defence includes a youngster with less than 10 games experience and the quality of the centre halves on the bench I don’t see the defence deteriorating. Up front we have missed a player I thought would do really well at this level. Devante’s absence can’t be gauged, but I cannot put any expectation on him recovering his full health, fitness and form anytime soon. But on a personal level I wish him all the best on the journey back.
So overall better than thought at this stage. Although I did predict we would end the season with a positive goal difference.that said I also had a hunch Taylor would be in the NL team of the season, so still some way to go on that one.
Will some money come into the club that will enable us to bring in someone who could get us 12 goals by the end of the season. That could see us challenging for promotion.
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 12:55 - Sep 20 with 4213 views | NorthernDale |
If we finished in the playoffs, we have a chance of promotion. Grimsby finished 6th 2021-22 season and got promoted, and in the 2020-21 Hartlepool finished 4th and got promoted, so finishing in the playoffs gives us a chance to return to the EFL, which should be a target to aim for. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 13:15 - Sep 20 with 4151 views | 49thseason |
But, we need to remember that if we dont manage promotion this season, the cash available from the EFL falls again next season. Maybe this will be offset by income from transfers, but that will involve weàkening the squad unless MRKT still have some rabbits in their hat.
It is, of course, still possible that an investor will be found. I just feel that its going to take more investment in the squad to get out of this division, certainly in the forwards. |  | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 13:38 - Sep 20 with 4100 views | TalkingSutty |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 13:15 - Sep 20 by 49thseason |
But, we need to remember that if we dont manage promotion this season, the cash available from the EFL falls again next season. Maybe this will be offset by income from transfers, but that will involve weàkening the squad unless MRKT still have some rabbits in their hat.
It is, of course, still possible that an investor will be found. I just feel that its going to take more investment in the squad to get out of this division, certainly in the forwards. |
Things are a lot better than i expected on the pitch but i think the lack of depth in the squad will catch up with us unfortunately. With our best eleven on the field i would fancy us to finish in the top half of the league and maybe around the play off places. The recruitment over the summer has been very good, the coaching and management must also have improved because we look fitter, more organised and there is obviously a good spirit in the squad. We now probably have a few saleable assets also which is always handy. It's pointless speculating on how off field matters might impact this season because as fans we are kept in the dark and rarely hear anything from the Boardroom. In terms of enjoyment, I'm finding this season preferable to anything I watched over the last few years in the EFL and actually looking forward to games again and studying the league table. [Post edited 20 Sep 2023 13:42]
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 14:10 - Sep 20 with 4042 views | D_Alien |
BJ also said wait to see where we are after 10 games, which is much more relevant than anything said by previous managers. So, we're doing okay, but no better
There's still massive room for improvement in all areas, which is preferable to our busting a gut and having nothing further, so i remain optimistic but still surprised by our naivety at key moments. Yes, the coach and squad are new but it's not as if there's not experience there too, and i'd expect players like EEL, Clayton & Hendo (when on the pitch) to be putting themselves forward in helping the youngsters in managing the game
I'm looking at how things will look as the weather turns and heavier pitches make our passing game a bit more of a lottery, more injuries/suspensions kick in [Post edited 20 Sep 2023 14:13]
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 14:32 - Sep 20 with 3993 views | DaleiLama |
I would say there may be some merit to Hill's comment in some respects and not in others.
When you have as many changes to the squad as we had, I'm not sure 10 games is a big enough sample size to assess that, and BJ still makes some changes to starting line ups which don't always appear to be necessary, despite taking into account squad rotation, suggesting even the gaffer is still finding out exactly what he has.
What I would say we do know is we have a team that is watchable, competitive and is trying to be creative. It also seems to be growing in confidence and effectiveness, although both are fragile. We have speed down both wings, a decent back 4 (which is still allowing too many crosses and showing aerial vulnerability) and a midfield which looks comfortable on the ball and can distribute it effectively (as can EEL and especially young Nevett by the way - Edit and Moulden, who is also a huge asset between the sticks).
What we lack to date is a consistent and relentless willingness to get the ball into the box when given the chance (though this is improving) and a clinical finishing touch. I really want to get behind Kairo. He's been discussed on other threads and ATP makes a good point about his goal contribution, but at 25, I'm not sure how much more untapped potential improvement he/we can look forward to and/or how much he's more or less the finished product. My verdict so far is he's pushed off the ball too easily, doesn't hold the ball up as well as say a Kelvin Andrews (sic) and bizarrely (to me at least) he offers more value out of the box in link up play with wingers/strikers (excluding his goals of course). He frustrates me enormously with his inability to change direction at pace to try to lose a marker when we are breaking or in general play too. My gut is we are a stronger side with Devante in the starting X1, but no idea when this will happen again, so that doesn't help us to know where we stand.
Taking a helicopter view though, we are probably looking better as a side and a prospect and BJ has shown himself to be a better manager than most dared to hope for before we started this campaign. On that basis, I'm delighted to be where we are on the pitch. [Post edited 20 Sep 2023 14:34]
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 15:26 - Sep 20 with 3889 views | EllDale |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 13:15 - Sep 20 by 49thseason |
But, we need to remember that if we dont manage promotion this season, the cash available from the EFL falls again next season. Maybe this will be offset by income from transfers, but that will involve weàkening the squad unless MRKT still have some rabbits in their hat.
It is, of course, still possible that an investor will be found. I just feel that its going to take more investment in the squad to get out of this division, certainly in the forwards. |
There is always the possibility as well that a lot of the current squad won't be here this time next year.
Wil Clayton and Hendo play another season? Moulden's and East's loans will have expired and some players may be sold.
And would some of the out of contract players sign new deals next summer? The likes of EEL and John for example.
BJ said at the last forum that he would like to be able to see another two or three transfer windows but there could be a massive turnover of staff. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 16:46 - Sep 20 with 3738 views | Yorkshire_Dale |
We are currently averaging a (decent?) 1.5 points per game, 10= 15points. If we continue at this rate here on,we will accumulate 69 points which equates to Southend United finishing in 8th position last season. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 16:50 - Sep 20 with 3731 views | frenzied |
i think it took us 10 games last season before we won one..so its definitely a lot better.
Jims got off to a better start than i thought he would.
i still anticipate a bottom half finish..thin squad ,injuries will take a heavy toll on us.
At least we have players who we are excited to see such as Jez,Gilmour and others,whereas last season we constantly hoped that some of the players would deliver...none did.
Chesterfield and Southend games will again give us an idea of where we are at.
Id grade us at a B minus so far [Post edited 20 Sep 2023 19:39]
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 18:51 - Sep 20 with 3561 views | blackdogblue |
I don’t want to put a downer on the optimism of a swift return by the play offs which is a possibility but….. the “loan” will not see us through the close season and we may not have a club without investment….
That’s gone worryingly very quiet … |  |
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:21 - Sep 20 with 3317 views | TalkingSutty |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 18:51 - Sep 20 by blackdogblue |
I don’t want to put a downer on the optimism of a swift return by the play offs which is a possibility but….. the “loan” will not see us through the close season and we may not have a club without investment….
That’s gone worryingly very quiet … |
Great point and it's not just a case of trying to pop the balloon neither. Nobody can be sure what might happen to the club from one month to the next. It's a terrible situation and i think we have plenty of fans who don't really grasp the seriousness of the situation, they talk about expecting to return to the EFL and a place in the play offs like it's something normal. They must be suffering with ostrich syndrome and not have been taking notice of what's been happening over the last couple of years. We are in real danger of not having a club unless we get a investor, the right investor. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:57 - Sep 20 with 3273 views | D_Alien |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:21 - Sep 20 by TalkingSutty |
Great point and it's not just a case of trying to pop the balloon neither. Nobody can be sure what might happen to the club from one month to the next. It's a terrible situation and i think we have plenty of fans who don't really grasp the seriousness of the situation, they talk about expecting to return to the EFL and a place in the play offs like it's something normal. They must be suffering with ostrich syndrome and not have been taking notice of what's been happening over the last couple of years. We are in real danger of not having a club unless we get a investor, the right investor. |
Fully agree, which is why i'm not getting involved in the match to match debates too much, although i can appreciate some may see that as a good distraction. We're in the football business after all, and have always sold players to survive, so with young lads such as Nevett a potential asset there may be transfer income to help keep us going but it's all just a bit too precarious until new ownership is settled | |
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 19:52 - Sep 23 with 2579 views | EllDale |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:57 - Sep 20 by D_Alien |
Fully agree, which is why i'm not getting involved in the match to match debates too much, although i can appreciate some may see that as a good distraction. We're in the football business after all, and have always sold players to survive, so with young lads such as Nevett a potential asset there may be transfer income to help keep us going but it's all just a bit too precarious until new ownership is settled |
That’s spot on.
Perhaps the board, if potentially suitable investors haven’t identified themselves, are hoping for one of the two traditional ways of making money and balancing the books.
The first is a cup run.
Pray to God that we get a decent draw in the FA Cup. After all, we’re only one game off the first round proper.
Someone like Bolton or Derby at home might fill the Willbutts Lane stand. Or hope for two winnable games at home and sneak through to the third round and pull a plum tie there.
Someone asked on another thread how Boreham Wood are funded; didn’t they play at Everton the other year.
There’s the FA Trophy as well with the chance of reaching a Wembley final.
The second is a player sale.
As DA says Nevett is the obvious candidate here in January if needs must.
This may be unpalatable but the other saleable asset may well be Sinclair who is out of contract next summer and so could walk away and sign for someone else without a fee changing hands.
If he was to be offered a new contract his agent could probably put forward a good case for a pay rise. It could be the Danny Lloyd situation all over again. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:19 - Sep 23 with 2414 views | 49thseason |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 19:52 - Sep 23 by EllDale |
That’s spot on.
Perhaps the board, if potentially suitable investors haven’t identified themselves, are hoping for one of the two traditional ways of making money and balancing the books.
The first is a cup run.
Pray to God that we get a decent draw in the FA Cup. After all, we’re only one game off the first round proper.
Someone like Bolton or Derby at home might fill the Willbutts Lane stand. Or hope for two winnable games at home and sneak through to the third round and pull a plum tie there.
Someone asked on another thread how Boreham Wood are funded; didn’t they play at Everton the other year.
There’s the FA Trophy as well with the chance of reaching a Wembley final.
The second is a player sale.
As DA says Nevett is the obvious candidate here in January if needs must.
This may be unpalatable but the other saleable asset may well be Sinclair who is out of contract next summer and so could walk away and sign for someone else without a fee changing hands.
If he was to be offered a new contract his agent could probably put forward a good case for a pay rise. It could be the Danny Lloyd situation all over again. |
I would be offering Nevett a 2 year extension to his current contract and Sinclair too,. Clearly the money would need to be found, but it would be disappointing if there isn't a few quid inbound from Brierley's appearances on the Brentford bench.
I actually wouldn't mind a couple of seasons at this level if it meant we could find players we can sell in the future and play them for a season or two and create the genuine conveyor belt of talent that we will need if there are no investors on the horizon. At this level, our only option is to improve all aspects of the club, my worry would be to get promoted this season and recline back into a position where we just assume the income from the EFL can all be spent on players and not improve lots of other things and everything will be hunky dory. | | | |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:35 - Sep 23 with 2372 views | 442Dale |
What this season has proven so far is that, yet again, Dale are perfectly capable of competing when making the most of what we have. The credit goes to the manager for responding so well to create a squad with an identity in our current situation. |  |
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 22:10 - Sep 23 with 2275 views | D_Alien |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 21:19 - Sep 23 by 49thseason |
I would be offering Nevett a 2 year extension to his current contract and Sinclair too,. Clearly the money would need to be found, but it would be disappointing if there isn't a few quid inbound from Brierley's appearances on the Brentford bench.
I actually wouldn't mind a couple of seasons at this level if it meant we could find players we can sell in the future and play them for a season or two and create the genuine conveyor belt of talent that we will need if there are no investors on the horizon. At this level, our only option is to improve all aspects of the club, my worry would be to get promoted this season and recline back into a position where we just assume the income from the EFL can all be spent on players and not improve lots of other things and everything will be hunky dory. |
I really do think we should assume there won't be a suitable investor
From that position, the board should be able to work with the Trust and fanbase to rebuild, based upon a model that's served us well in the past (see 442's comments, and also the thread he started this morning)
What's been most annoying is the impression that the board have just given up the ghost, not even seeking to maximise what we already have. Someone commented about "the board should be pleased about today". BJ is their appointment, MRKT are identifying good signings, the academy continues to bring players through. The board need to show more confidence in what exists and stop treating the club like a hot potato | |
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| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 22:59 - Sep 23 with 2129 views | pioneer |
| Hill: “you know where you stand after 10 games” on 22:10 - Sep 23 by D_Alien |
I really do think we should assume there won't be a suitable investor
From that position, the board should be able to work with the Trust and fanbase to rebuild, based upon a model that's served us well in the past (see 442's comments, and also the thread he started this morning)
What's been most annoying is the impression that the board have just given up the ghost, not even seeking to maximise what we already have. Someone commented about "the board should be pleased about today". BJ is their appointment, MRKT are identifying good signings, the academy continues to bring players through. The board need to show more confidence in what exists and stop treating the club like a hot potato |
Agree with that…..my worry is that the interpretation of the word suitable might become ‘fluid’ …they have made it clear there is no more investment coming from them. | | | |
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