Forum | Tactics and playing players out of position by tylagarwjack

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Tactics and playing players out of position 15:20 - Feb 2 with 2455 views

After yesterday's very poor showing I have the following thoughts:-

- West Ham away is always a difficult fixture, even if they have struggled this season. We will struggle to deal with Carroll in that sort of form but there is struggling to deal with him and not having anyone within yards of him when he wins the ball in the air, two different things!

- As much as recent results have not been unexpected, and injuries have affected the fluidity of the team, in general we have been able to put out an 11 from the first team squad. The performance levels of the team are dropping, with too many poor displays, where is the zip in our passing? We can't expect to win at West Ham but what we can expect is the team playing closer to its potential more often than we have been seeing in recent weeks.

- Too often, ML is playing the game to stifle the opposition, not to play to our strengths, Amat in midfield was a classic example when Leon was on the bench (this tactic not only didnt play to our strengths but was fatally flawed as Amat is not actually that good in the air anyway). Spurs home was another example where instead of playing Pozuelo behind Bony and Lamah and Routledge we started with two players (Pozuelo and Amat) out of position with a natural winger sitting on the bench, as once again ML's containment policy against the big teams didn't work.

- Michu is close to a return so with a bit of luck we will have a fully fit squad soon, so for the rest of the season we surely must play Michu behind Bony in as many games as possible, don't play players out of position unless there really is no choice, and go out to try and win games rather than try to stay in them until the last half hour then look to change it, we seem to "die wondering" too often for my liking.

- my concern is that when JJS plays as the CAM this is not his best position, and while he is a goal threat he is better being one of the deeper midfielders, breaking forward, with a CAM playing as well. We don't have enough goal threat without a genuine CAM playing, oft said but still the case. When JJS does play deeper we lose some defensive stability as we then don't have two CDM's so catch 22 to an extent.

- Will we see a more attacking philosophy? Not for me, another example of ML's negativity came against Fulham where at 0 0 they were quicker to throw an extra attacking player (Bent) on than we were, even though we were home to a relegation zone team (our winless run will maybe have contributed to the cautious approach but Fulham have also been struggling).

- Am I concerned about the quality of our squad? No, we have more than enough to stay up. Am I concerned about us getting the best out of what we have got, I would have to say yes at the moment.

How ML sets up next week is key, should Pozuelo start at CAM? I'm not sure whether ML trusts him yet in as big a game as that one.

Finally, hypothetical question, if we had a fully fit Michu would both he and Bony start next week, I would say yes but not sure ML would do the same.

[Post edited 2 Feb 2014 15:26]

Tactics and playing players out of position on 16:33 - Feb 2 with 2375 views

therealme

I'm with you on Shelvey, I also think JdG's best position is CAM

Francesco's black and white army âšªï¸âš«ï¸

Tactics and playing players out of position on 16:42 - Feb 2 with 2339 views

Chief

Tactics and playing players out of position on 16:33 - Feb 2 by therealme
I'm with you on Shelvey, I also think JdG's best position is CAM

- I don't think we can afford to keep playing JDG, especially if Michu comes back and plays with Bony every week. JDG just doesn't have the heart for relegation fight and is too much of a luxury in my opinion. he really does shite out of tackles every gamed now.

- Play Leon Britton every week, a no brainer.

- Drop Chico and play Amat centre back, Chico's defending this season has been terrible. Everytime he makes a mistake we concede. we cannot afford to keep this up.

Poll:

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Tactics and playing players out of position on 16:47 - Feb 2 with 2320 views

magicdaps10

Our wingers should play as wingers and not come in field so much. If they get width and supply crosses into Bony and a fit Michu then they will score and in turn create more space for them..................by coming in field they help congest the opposistions centre of defence wich helps the opposistion.

Also the full backs are getting caught out when the opposition are counter attacking because Rangel and Davies are asked to go to far up the field to make up for our wingers going infield.

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Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:01 - Feb 2 with 2293 views

TenkosBlondeWig

I agree, we should be players in their natural positions

Lets face it Pouzelo has been playing out of position most of the season. He should play behind Bony not out wide. (regardless of our wingers coming inside)

If everyone was fit it should be

BRITTON CANAS
MICHU
BONY

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:03 - Feb 2 with 2289 views

therealme

Tactics and playing players out of position on 16:47 - Feb 2 by magicdaps10

Again, I couldn't agree more with your first point

There was a time against Fulham when Routledge was literally standing on top of Shelvey and was told to piss off out wide basically. Wayne had the beating of their RB aswell which made it even more bizarre

Francesco's black and white army âšªï¸âš«ï¸

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:04 - Feb 2 with 2286 views

Dr_Winston

Nicely put.

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:09 - Feb 2 with 2252 views

Dyfnant

Agree with the OP except for the Shelvey bit

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Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:11 - Feb 2 with 2238 views

exiledclaseboy

I'm still getting over the fact that we played a defender, Amat, in midfield yesterday when an apparently fully fit Leon Britton was available and on the bench. That's neglect on an almost criminal scale.

Poll:

Tory leader

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:13 - Feb 2 with 2227 views

Dr_Winston

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:11 - Feb 2 by exiledclaseboy
I'm still getting over the fact that we played a defender, Amat, in midfield yesterday when an apparently fully fit Leon Britton was available and on the bench. That's neglect on an almost criminal scale.

Worrying more about containing the opposition rather than ensuring we play our own game.

A Laudrup specialty.

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:16 - Feb 2 with 2201 views

Swanfan1

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:01 - Feb 2 by TenkosBlondeWig
I agree, we should be players in their natural positions Lets face it Pouzelo has been playing out of position most of the season. He should play behind Bony not out wide. (regardless of our wingers coming inside) If everyone was fit it should be BRITTON CANAS MICHU BONY

actually it wouldnt be accordding to ML
it would be
De Guzman - Canas
Michu
Bony

I dont like De Guzman as deep lying midfielder, he does not have the strength to work hard as a defensive unit with Canas.

my biggest gripe with ML is the fact that he insist on playing De Guzman as deep lying midfielder.

Poll:

BonyÂ´s lack of goals, whose to blame ?.

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:17 - Feb 2 with 2198 views

exiledclaseboy

For what it's worth when everyone is available my team would be

Vorm
Rangel Amat Williams Davies
Britton Shelvey
Michu
Dyer Bony Routledge

Bench - Tremmel, de Guzman, Canas, Hernandez, Chico, Ngog, Taylor.

Poll:

Tory leader

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:27 - Feb 2 with 2166 views

JackFish

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:11 - Feb 2 by exiledclaseboy
I'm still getting over the fact that we played a defender, Amat, in midfield yesterday when an apparently fully fit Leon Britton was available and on the bench. That's neglect on an almost criminal scale.

As soon as I heard that Amat was in midfield yesterday I knew we'd lose. Never mind whether or not we look better defensively with him in there, and that's definitely debatable for me anyway, we completely lose any fluidity that we have going forward and don't keep the ball anywhere near as well when he's playing. Plus for the first goal he got caught ball watching and left Nolan completely free on the edge of an area.

I'm not blaming Amat because I think as a centre half he's definitely got potential to get Chico's place in the team, but the experiment hasn't worked in the past and it didn't work yesterday.

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:27 - Feb 2 with 2166 views

tylagarwjack

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:16 - Feb 2 by Swanfan1
actually it wouldnt be accordding to ML it would be De Guzman - Canas Michu Bony I dont like De Guzman as deep lying midfielder, he does not have the strength to work hard as a defensive unit with Canas. my biggest gripe with ML is the fact that he insist on playing De Guzman as deep lying midfielder.

I think the problem with JDG is that he is a CM rather than a CDM (lacks tackling and the ability to intercept) or a CAM (lacks the shooting ability) and so he is not suited to the 4231 narrow that ML favours, as the fullbacks bombing on necessitates the need for two genuine CDM's.

The fact that both JDG and JJS have been deployed in the deeper role and both like to get forward (at the same time as the fullbacks) is part of the reason we have looked vulnerable defensively at home this season, even against the smaller teams.

Tactics and playing players out of position on 17:33 - Feb 2 with 2129 views

JackFish

Agree. I do like JDG and he does a very good job of keeping the ball moving and linking attack and defence, but we certainly look move vulnerable than in previous seasons. We used to have Leon and Joe Allen in midfield with Dyer on the wing, and they would all put a shift in defensively. Now if we play Hernandez, JDG and Pozuelo together for example there's very little in the way of defensive effort from them, and Shelvey is pretty prone to going wandering off or being knackered.

Personally I'd like to see a midfield three of Leon, Canas and Michu.

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