| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 07:51 - Jun 7 with 5103 views | Philothesuperhoop |
Thanks Clive. Great piece.
I feel very similar to you really.
Last season was sooooo awful that I’d be happy to have almost an entire clear out. If we kept Field, Chair, Paal, Sinclair-Armstrong and one or two others and had a complete rebuild would at least be exciting and give us the chance to be unrealistically optimistic! Especially with GA at the helm. it’s really interesting that the crowds have been good since Ainsworth took over so I do feel that his enthusiasm is contagious.
However the massive BUT is that I can see we will be putting together almost an entire new team for pennies….I just can’t see that being possible, but we will see.
The only thing we know for certain is that it isn’t going to be dull. |  | |  |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:47 - Jun 7 with 4973 views | kropotkin41 |
I feel like LFW is a great place to come to sensibly manage expectations about next season. Fully expecting nothing from next season except getting battered regularly and then relegated at least means zero disappointment. Not quite sure what I'll do with the money I'll save not bothering to go to Swansea, Cardiff and Bristol City.......
Anyway, interesting piece. 50 years ago I was an optimistic little fella, so it can't have been that I became a QPR fan because of my fascination for apocalyptic scenarios. How odd then, that my football team have come to align so closely with my grown-up self's sandwich-board, End of Days, catastrophist pessimism. |  |
| ‘morbid curiosity about where this is all going’ |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:48 - Jun 7 with 4970 views | slmrstid |
Due to amortisation I wouldn't be surprised if our accounts for the 23/24 year show a profit being made on the sale of Rob Dickie, even if on a cost-to-cost basis its a loss. |  | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:52 - Jun 7 with 4957 views | mcqpr10 |
An excellent balanced read.
I remember before signing one of the guys on the Not the top 20 podcast raved about this guy. Seemed sure he would go on to be a prem player. As soon as i saw him play regularly I thought he was just an above average championship centre back. Slow and sometimes ponderous. Did love his driving runs but they went missing during the warbs meltdown. |  | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:52 - Jun 7 with 4959 views | Northernr |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:48 - Jun 7 by slmrstid |
Due to amortisation I wouldn't be surprised if our accounts for the 23/24 year show a profit being made on the sale of Rob Dickie, even if on a cost-to-cost basis its a loss. |
Bit of a stretch though isn't it? You pay £1.5m+ for a player, pay his wages for three years, sell him for £700k and tell everybody that's a profit due to amortisation. I wish my bank account worked like that. |  | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 09:30 - Jun 7 with 4828 views | SimonD |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 08:52 - Jun 7 by Northernr |
Bit of a stretch though isn't it? You pay £1.5m+ for a player, pay his wages for three years, sell him for £700k and tell everybody that's a profit due to amortisation. I wish my bank account worked like that. |
Slmrstid is right though, the 2023/24 accounts will show a profit on Dickie.
If we accept he cost £1.8m, that will have been amortised at £0.45m per season over his 4 year contract. 3 years have passed so his book value is down to £0.45m, so the accounts for 23/23 will show a profit of £0.25m.
The previously amortisations and his wages are all in previous years' accounts.
While I obviously understand what you are saying, it is £0.25m towards the £10m we need. Only £9.75m to go! | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 09:42 - Jun 7 with 4794 views | PhilmyRs |
Good write-up and agree with the final sentiment — probably best for all concerned that he moves on.
Agree with you too that in a 3 he’s decent and that having a centre back that can bring the ball out and play has major benefits. It’s this that worries me most. I think we were targeting the right type of player — a central defender that is comfortable in possession — and it wasn’t the worst signing in the world, with at one point them being linked with a move away for decent profit. Now, I think we’re going to be going down the ‘no nonsense defending’ market which has some positives but longer term is a real shame. We were on the right track with Dickie, just for various reasons it didn’t work out exactly as we wanted, although given the game time we got from him, plus some cash back, wasn’t the worst signing we’ve ever made either. Interesting/worrying times ahead. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:03 - Jun 7 with 4732 views | loftboy |
Your work is getting high praise on Bristols forum Clive. |  |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:10 - Jun 7 with 4711 views | Northernr |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:03 - Jun 7 by loftboy |
Your work is getting high praise on Bristols forum Clive. |
Given the grief it gets on QPR Twitter I might put in for a transfer. They like me in Sunderland too  | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:36 - Jun 7 with 4613 views | JordanFoster |
Really good piece, Clive.
I've certainly been a bit surprised that we've seen no one leave their role behind the scenes. Even when Lee Hoos was doing a Fortnite dance down Bloemfontein you might have thought he's probably had enough now if you were his senior, but obviously not.
Dickie's a strange one, the narrative when he was sh*t hot that he was going to play for England, I mean that was a regular tweet from fans all over. Respected people were seriously saying this. He had a hot patch, much like Willock at the start of this year, where everything he hit ended up in the top corner and then retracted to normal but it's interesting how momentum can change narratives.
I don't think we have any other choice than to be a development club, but we seem to be restricting development to buying the likes of Dickie, Bonne, Washington from League 1/2 clubs. It doesn't have to be like that to be a development club.
Sunderland made a lot of shrewd moves this season by basically just scouting the best talents in PL2 and then bringing players through that had profiles that would work in the Championship (most likely physicality).
There's a few things here, but arguably these players wage demands are likely to be less (if you accept you're merely a stepping stone) and their ceiling likely to be higher. The issue is however, how many of these academy boys are going to want to come through and play 80s football? That's a long way from the touch-pass-tempo shouts they have bred into them from the age of 7.
Now if you had a Beale/Warbs/Critchley and you're a club thats philosophy and mantra is very much "it's you vs you", get back to the top, grind mindset, be the best you etc etc then you can kind of be a PL2 development club (this is what I think Beale's idea was and something he's half trying to develop at Rangers, players like Laird, Roberts et al but then when he f*cks off it's over) spinning these players every couple of years and just bringing them through. Supplemented with loans and big pre-season games, like we saw with Man Utd, you're along the right lines.
It's also a very different pond because EVERYONE is aware of the lad scoring for fun in League 1 and every Championship club would have him so his price just rockets.
But then again does it resonate when Ainsworth is saying hamper expectations, we are the underdog, some massive teams in this league.. I'm scared. Probably not. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:58 - Jun 7 with 4559 views | kropotkin41 |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:10 - Jun 7 by Northernr |
Given the grief it gets on QPR Twitter I might put in for a transfer. They like me in Sunderland too |
Contracted for life. No escape. | |
| ‘morbid curiosity about where this is all going’ |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 11:00 - Jun 7 with 4548 views | Northernr |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:58 - Jun 7 by kropotkin41 |
Contracted for life. No escape. |
Nearly as long as Hamalainen's deal. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 11:28 - Jun 7 with 4439 views | francisbowles |
Thanks Clive. You've got that spot on as usual. I too, was at Bournemouth that night and saw that error right in front of me and have also traced his mental decline, with us, back to then.
So the conclusion is that for all his talents, he is a flawed player both physically, mainly in terms of pace, as well as mentally. He is also a key member of a defence that continually loses opponents and concedes from set pieces.
The question that I haven't seen asked is how many of these weaknesses did he display at Oxford? Did we scout him often enough to see his fairly obvious lack of pace. Did we not spot his head dropping after errors, or was that something that only happened after arriving at Loftus Road? Or, did we know all this but were convinced that these failings were marginal and it was worth paying £1.5m or whatever for this player, as with the right players along side him he could flourish anyway?
I'm a bit divided on whether he was a good signing or not. Apart from this season, the proof is in the performances and stats. However, I don't see much chance that you can develop a player, (imho one of the slowest centre backs I have seen in the modern game) into an asset that can be sold to a 'bigger' club for a profit. We now find that the outcome is that we can't.
I also think Bristol City should go well next season. They looked very comfortable at Loftus Road, even after our two away wins! They are taking a gamble on Dickie but it is a lesser one than we took, given the price and, as you point out, the three years experience he has gained at this level. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 11:44 - Jun 7 with 4362 views | E15Hoop |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:36 - Jun 7 by JordanFoster |
Really good piece, Clive.
I've certainly been a bit surprised that we've seen no one leave their role behind the scenes. Even when Lee Hoos was doing a Fortnite dance down Bloemfontein you might have thought he's probably had enough now if you were his senior, but obviously not.
Dickie's a strange one, the narrative when he was sh*t hot that he was going to play for England, I mean that was a regular tweet from fans all over. Respected people were seriously saying this. He had a hot patch, much like Willock at the start of this year, where everything he hit ended up in the top corner and then retracted to normal but it's interesting how momentum can change narratives.
I don't think we have any other choice than to be a development club, but we seem to be restricting development to buying the likes of Dickie, Bonne, Washington from League 1/2 clubs. It doesn't have to be like that to be a development club.
Sunderland made a lot of shrewd moves this season by basically just scouting the best talents in PL2 and then bringing players through that had profiles that would work in the Championship (most likely physicality).
There's a few things here, but arguably these players wage demands are likely to be less (if you accept you're merely a stepping stone) and their ceiling likely to be higher. The issue is however, how many of these academy boys are going to want to come through and play 80s football? That's a long way from the touch-pass-tempo shouts they have bred into them from the age of 7.
Now if you had a Beale/Warbs/Critchley and you're a club thats philosophy and mantra is very much "it's you vs you", get back to the top, grind mindset, be the best you etc etc then you can kind of be a PL2 development club (this is what I think Beale's idea was and something he's half trying to develop at Rangers, players like Laird, Roberts et al but then when he f*cks off it's over) spinning these players every couple of years and just bringing them through. Supplemented with loans and big pre-season games, like we saw with Man Utd, you're along the right lines.
It's also a very different pond because EVERYONE is aware of the lad scoring for fun in League 1 and every Championship club would have him so his price just rockets.
But then again does it resonate when Ainsworth is saying hamper expectations, we are the underdog, some massive teams in this league.. I'm scared. Probably not. |
Even I cringed when GA said that on Talksport for the very reason you just said, Jordan.
No need for him to say it at all, when you've got the evidence of the Burnley performance in recent memory. The messaging should consistently be "We've shown we can beat anybody on our day. Come and join us, and we'll give the Big Boys a bloody nose together, and take this division by surprise". "I'm scared" doesn't really cut it in that context. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 11:51 - Jun 7 with 4345 views | CateLeBonR |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 11:00 - Jun 7 by Northernr |
Nearly as long as Hamalainen's deal. |
Without the LA and Brazil bit.
Thanks Clive great sum up and this feels like the right move for all involved.
In terms of making signings this year I wonder if we’ll have a few more Taylor Richards type deals (although hopefully more successful obviously). Loans with a view to buy therefore pushing any transfer fees down the road a bit. |  | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:01 - Jun 7 with 4301 views | Monkey_Roots |
Great read, thanks Clive.
It makes me think that even if nobody vacates their position, as shite as that would feel, at least come out and declare a plan, a strategy — give us some hope that we're not just bouncing around a sinking ship trying to plug the many leaks that have sprung up with the most luxurious, absorbent toilet paper they can find.
Were we to give GA the players he wants, for however he wants to play — you're right, the risk is that we end up binning him off by October, going with someone else, and have them try to fit square pegs in round holes, and then the merry-go-round continues.
Have a plan, a way of playing — whatever that is — and stick to it. Bring in players who compliment it, and if need be, when you hire the next manager they reinforce it. It really does highlight how bad or inexperienced our DoF has been — to abandon our strategy and bring in a manager who, historically, play a style counter to what the previous, at least 3, managers have played with, is just madness. Unless it was a quick fix, keep us up, thanks very much Big Sam, onto the next one type appointment, but it clearly isn't.
It is a total mess.
I can get onboard with having to cut our cloth due to FFP, free signings, some loans, a couple of risks taken on injury-prone players to navigate our way around FFP, but I can't forgive the lack of plan or strategy, the departure from our model of being a development club, the failure to develop anyone - even 1 player to come in and do a job while Dykes was out — its quite embarrassing, and I don't know how there aren't red faces at every level of this football club.
There's certainly no mirrors around the place - the lack of self awareness, personal responsibility and the nerve to accept a pay packet for the utter rubbish that they've all turned in, speaks to a complete lack of respect for the fans of this football club.
All we get in silence, or at least a silence punctuated with the deafening departure at a financial loss. Was it the right move? Probably, and the reasons you gave back it up, but still — where is the PR guru that says 'we better get a good news story out there before we put season tickets up for s... oh, you've done that already'.... 'ooh, before we sell Rob, let's put some good news out about how we ha... oh, you've done that already'...
Depressing. |  | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:04 - Jun 7 with 4289 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 10:10 - Jun 7 by Northernr |
Given the grief it gets on QPR Twitter I might put in for a transfer. They like me in Sunderland too |
And Swansea, as I told you ;)
Fantastic piece Clive, thank you. |  |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:40 - Jun 7 with 4133 views | TheChef |
Just another point re Dickie is he looked far better for us in a back three.
Not sure which formation Brizzle are going with next season, but if it's two CBs then Dickie will need a proper leader/organiser alongside him. |  |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:55 - Jun 7 with 4074 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:40 - Jun 7 by TheChef |
Just another point re Dickie is he looked far better for us in a back three.
Not sure which formation Brizzle are going with next season, but if it's two CBs then Dickie will need a proper leader/organiser alongside him. |
Well, Pearson was a great CB. Maybe he'll transform him a bit. | |
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| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 12:55 - Jun 7 with 4074 views | terryb |
Of course we have made an overall loss on Rob Dickie, but I suspect most clubs make a loss on the majority of their players they have purchased after adding wages etc to the transfer fee difference.
However, in this years accounts we are currently in the black regarding him! That will stay this way provided we don't pay out more for a replacement. As if we would!
I am using figures that I've seen on this board for the transfer fees & have guessed at his salary for the sake of my calculations. I have also "invented" all figures for the cost of a new signing. By all means change the figures, but the principle is the same.
Rob Dickie
Transfer fee paid £1.8 million
Transfer fee received £700k
Salary £600k (£12k (per week rounded down)
A N Other (4 year contract)
Replacement fee paid £500k
Signing on fee £250k
Salary £400k
With these figures we have made a saving of £1.3 million on Dickie for this year. Amortisation £250k profit instead of £450k loss plus no salary.
A N Other will cost this years account £775k - Amortisation £125k plus signing on plus salary.
This would leave the acccounts £525k better off, but a long way short of where we need to be! We would need to repeat this 20 more times to reach the £10m shortfall, or 12 times to achive Sakura's £6m savings.
Just as important is whether A N Other is good enough to be playing in The Championship & how many times he will be in the starting team. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 13:26 - Jun 7 with 3975 views | francisbowles |
I appreciate all the financial experts on here, off which I am not one.
However, my thoughts are that FFP/P&S is largely divorced from formal accounts. The whole of any fee received for Dickie plus the savings on his salary will go towards the FFP /P&S target for the relevant year (season?) in the three year cycle. Therefore, the £10m nominal amount is reduced by £700k + wages saved.
Of course, any replacements wages and costs will cut into that reduction. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 13:39 - Jun 7 with 3905 views | terryb |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 13:26 - Jun 7 by francisbowles |
I appreciate all the financial experts on here, off which I am not one.
However, my thoughts are that FFP/P&S is largely divorced from formal accounts. The whole of any fee received for Dickie plus the savings on his salary will go towards the FFP /P&S target for the relevant year (season?) in the three year cycle. Therefore, the £10m nominal amount is reduced by £700k + wages saved.
Of course, any replacements wages and costs will cut into that reduction. |
FB, you managed to say this far more effectively than I did! And in far less words! | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 13:58 - Jun 7 with 3841 views | francisbowles |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 13:39 - Jun 7 by terryb |
FB, you managed to say this far more effectively than I did! And in far less words! |
Thanks Terryb, I was just hoping that I had it right. | | | |
| Rob Dickie’s M4 odyssey — Column on 15:39 - Jun 7 with 3555 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
Great piece. Good that you highlighted the fact we have failed to sell a single player when they are bang in form.
Compare that to Brentford who did this consistently for 4/5 years, stuck to the plan etc.....
No one in the senior management team has left which would be shocking in any other place of work. But this is QPR. | | | |
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