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Reply | The Academy stays for now
at 17:39 7 Feb 2020
I get the challenges you are facing reducing costs etc, but now you have it from the horses mouth how much it's costing you and £3 million is a no brainer for an academy producing the returns you are.
I think it's inevitable that Rodon will go this summer but looking at the size of the clubs showing interest in him, you are pretty much guaranteed to get a good return on him. So once again the investment is justified.
The stumbling block for you at present is the fact the first team and the academy are on different sites.
If you can get a good return on selling the site it would be wise to invest on one big site nearer the m4 corridor. |
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Reply | Academy Cat 1 - to Cat 3..
at 10:10 24 Jan 2020
Is this on record that Birch said this?
It's simply not true.
As a matter of fact when it comes to the younger age groups u9-u14 there is very little difference in fixtures between Category 1 and 2 but a massive difference between category 2 and category 3.
Swansea will currently play a standard fixture list of Cardiff, Southampton, Reading, Bristol City, West Brom, Birmingham, Wolves, Villa, Coventry but if they dropped to Category 3 then their standard fixture list would consist of teams like Bristol Rovers, Exeter, Plymouth etc.
The same would apply at u16s, u18s and u23s. There would be a noticeable drop in opposition at this level and you'd no longer play the likes of Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal etc if you dropped to Cat 2 but you wouldn't even play the likes of Cardiff, Bristol City, Leeds, Forest, Palace etc if you dropped to Category 3.
If you watch an interview with Stuart Webber and Stuart Weaver on YouTube when they were at Huddersfield they say that the only viable options for a club their size was category 1 or 2 or it would be pointless. (They soon scrapped their academy altogether)
I'm not sure I agree with Webber here but I do believe it would be a lot harder to produce players for championship football in today's environment through the category 3 programme.
Especially if Cardiff (not that I think you need to worry about that at this moment) or Bristol ever become category 1.
It costs a lot to run category 1 but it can also cost a lot not too, as was highlighted in the Rabbi Matondo situation at Cardiff. |
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Reply | Birch’s programme notes
at 12:44 31 Dec 2019
It's surely obvious though that a released player is gonna prefer to play Category 1 given the opportunity.
I'm not saying that you can't run a good category 2 academy but the weekly fixture list versus Arsenal, Spurs etc is bound to be more attractive for a players development.
I maintain that you could have your finger on the pulse better when it comes to released players. I've seen some of your recruits this season and haven't been very impressed.
The other option you have as a club (and one I'm sure your club is aware of down to Andy Scott) is to follow the Watford model in keeping Category 2 up to u16 (I think it is) then picking off friendly games against the the top British and European opposition. |
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Reply | Birch’s programme notes
at 11:46 31 Dec 2019
Some fair points but as you say the system is designed to benefit those at the top.
Clubs like Cardiff and Swansea could take advantage of that and I believe the one area where your club has lacked is in recruitment of players who have been released by other clubs.
If you're savvy enough you won't have to pay the fees you have been paying to supplement your local players. There will be players not given scholarships like David Brooks who are good enough to play for Swansea released every season. As the standard of player is going up at these top club then the standard of player being released should also go up.
The standard of Cat 2 is a massive drop from Cat 1 and as I've said on countless occasions on here, you'll find yourself playing Colchester instead of Chelsea!
The standard of Cat 3 teams are quite low from the young ages up and teams like Cambrian end up playing a lot of CST 3 teams.
I don't think it is deceptive argument regarding the academy paying for itself. The reason I say this is that is cos it's not only paying for itself but the 35 million from the sales of Mcburnie and James probably saved you from impending disaster. |
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Reply | Birch’s programme notes
at 18:11 30 Dec 2019
I do think you're underestimating how quickly football is advancing in this country. EPPP has had negative affects but it's also had positive affects and in my opinion English (and Welsh) are progressing at a rate that is unprecedented in this country.
You can see this in this years premier league where even some of the biggest teams (with unlimited resources) are shunning the transfer market and developing their own.
This is something Cardiff and Swansea can now replicate, and to be fair you already are, so why would you sacrifice that when it is currently funding itself? |
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Reply | Birch’s programme notes
at 16:27 30 Dec 2019
Good post but I also feel having a category 1 academy is more important to you (and Cardiff) due to our geographical location. As always in these discussions somewhere along the line someone will inevitably bring up the fact that Brentford scrapped their academy and they are still unearthing players.
I feel there are two points to counter the Brentford argument regarding geographical location.
1) Brentford are situated in West London and though they were very good at identifying and developing players from a very young age these players were being poached regularly by the top clubs. You are less likely to face this situation as this would often mean uprooting the whole family to move to London or up North etc.
2) You wouldn't have the same pulling power in attracting players that have been released by clubs due to the fact that you're 3-4 hours away from London, Birmingham etc.
Neath mentioned in his post that the owners will want to make the club as attractive as possible to potential buyers and for me as an outsider, the only thing that would be attractive to any prospective investors would be that you have a cat 1 academy that is functional and making a profit and producing assets.
The more I think about it the more I'm inclined to think that the facilities at Landore and Fairwood were vanity projects.
The ideal would have been to have one bigger site that touches the m4 (preferably as far East as possible) then it would reduce a lot of players daily commute (who live in the Vale etc) and would also give you greater pull in attracting better kids from Cardiff, RCT, Newport etc.
Cat 1 doesn't only give you better chance of attracting and holding on to the players you've got but should in theory attract better coaches, more time coaching the kids, better facilities, better fixture programme and other things which should produce better quality players to be prepared for first team football. |
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Reply | Birch’s programme notes
at 18:32 29 Dec 2019
I've posted on here regarding your academy and I believe it's good for the youth of South Wales and the Wales national team to have two thriving academy's in South Wales.
Nobody on here has convinced me that your academy is not self sufficient therefore it shouldn't even be in contention when it comes to cuts.
It's your main (maybe only) hope of developing assets and it's fair to say that you haven't even seen the full benefits of a being a cat 1 academy yet.
I think it's a bizarre move and it's basically your owners throwing your future away for a quick return |
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Reply | U23's v Sunderland
at 07:40 23 Sep 2019
I watched that game (in and out) on a link. You were very good value for your win and it should have been 3 or 4.
You have some very young players in that squad and it isn't the established u23 squad of 2 years ago. (I watched them a few times and after watching the final against Villa I came away think "good build up play but couldn't hit a barn door with a banjo"!)
I think one of the players you are alluding to who missed a couple of chances was 16 ffs.
I think there are players in the u23s who could definitely make the step up given a bit of patience but not so convinced by your u18s. |
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Reply | Academy.
at 09:05 21 Sep 2019
I find it bizarre how people on here are so quick to undermine the achievements of your academy.
If you take the example of Southampton whose academy is lauded in this country.
Just a brief look this morning and I've found out that Theo Walcott was taken from Swindon, Luke Shaw was rejected by Chelsea academy and put in their development and Adam Lallana was stolen from Bournemouth.
If a team like Millwall were to develop the next Steven Gerrard do you honestly think he'd still be at Millwall when he was 21?
It's very naive to say that Dan James was already developed when he came to Swansea when he was 15.
He still had 5 years of development before he broke into the first team. Even players who had previously experienced first team football elsewhere were still developed in your academy.
That's the beauty of having an identity so you can identify players who can suit your system then hone them further to fit your model. |
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Reply | The Cardiff Rivalry
at 09:58 18 Sep 2019
I'm not from Cardiff mate.
There are some decent football posts on here and I genuinely love the sport.
I'm interested in seeing young Welsh footballers develop and I think your club is currently a good place for that to happen with your philosophy and management team.
The 80s, 90s and even early 2000s were a different time and the rivalry as it was then is pretty much gone.
Nobody I know is interested in doing 5 years for throwing one or two punches anymore!
I don't say I hate everyone from London cos London gets everything. It's the rational of children. |
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Reply | The Cardiff Rivalry
at 09:45 18 Sep 2019
You're probably 50+ and you act like you're 18! It's not clever mate, it's pathetic.
We all like a bit of rivalry but saying things like every Cardiff fan makes you sick to your stomach is evidence that you've got serious issues.
I'd go get some counselling or get a girlfriend or something |
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Reply | The Cardiff Rivalry
at 09:21 18 Sep 2019
Think you need to get a grip of yourself lad ffs |
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Reply | Above the Bluebirds in all Leagues!!
at 19:19 6 Sep 2019
This is my last post on the subject cos I couldn't really give a shit but you cannot say we'll go down to 15k cos we consistently kept 18k i believe under Russell Slade a few years after being relegated, and if you think Warnock's football is bad then you never witnessed us then! |
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Reply | Above the Bluebirds in all Leagues!!
at 17:33 6 Sep 2019
I don't think we're a big club. I honestly think we have decent potential if we were run right. I think our catchment is better than yours basically cos there are more people nearer Cardiff than there are Swansea.
But there hasn't been much differences in our crowds though you have had a lot more success in recent times than us. |
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Reply | Above the Bluebirds in all Leagues!!
at 16:53 6 Sep 2019
I'm not one to come on here to look for an argument but I don't understand what relevance % of stadium is?
More people have watched Cardiff than Swansea and that's the head and tail of it. Add to that the complete and utter dross being served up by Warnock and Paterson as our 'playmaker' then how we get over 5k is amazing! |
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