| Two Brits sentenced to death on 15:26 - Jun 9 with 3910 views | stowmarketrange |
They are British in name only if they’ve moved to the Ukraine years ago.But they are still entitled to be treated as pows after their capture in a war. |  | |  |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 15:33 - Jun 9 with 3861 views | Rs_Holy |
no doubt they can return to Britain if the Russian sanctions are dropped |  | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 15:58 - Jun 9 with 3755 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Their fate will be a part of the eventual peace process I'd imagine alongside recognition of the two breakaway states.
Solidarity with their families. [Post edited 9 Jun 2022 17:52]
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:11 - Jun 9 with 3703 views | Juzzie |
Surely the death penalty for being a mercenary (without actually having committed any supposed act/crime) is very much a case of 'the punishment not fitting the crime'?
Then add in the fact it seems like a kangaroo court.
On a side note, I find it quite intriguing that Russia seems to be hell bent on flattening an entire region that not only do they deem to be theirs but is highly populated by Russian people, many of whom I am sure have suffered greatly as well as their Ukrainian compatriots. Does Russia intend on rebuilding the whole region and if so, where will the money come from if they can't even finance their military properly and are facing huge international sanctions. |  | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:21 - Jun 9 with 3659 views | BklynRanger |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 15:26 - Jun 9 by stowmarketrange |
They are British in name only if they’ve moved to the Ukraine years ago.But they are still entitled to be treated as pows after their capture in a war. |
I wouldn't say they're British 'in name only' - I'm sure there are plenty of people posting on here who moved away years ago but would still consider themselves British.
I see these two moved there 4 and 8 years ago anyway for what it's worth. |  | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:39 - Jun 9 with 3593 views | BostonR |
Live by the sword and all that..............
An army that murders its own troops for falling back, will not blink in executing these Brits. Russia enjoys this callous approach. It's naive to think that the US and the Brits do not have troops in Ukraine. Special forces are all over Ukraine directing shelling, pin-pointing targets and protecting Zelensky .
In fact they have been there for years. |  | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:43 - Jun 9 with 3578 views | Northolt_Rs |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:11 - Jun 9 by Juzzie |
Surely the death penalty for being a mercenary (without actually having committed any supposed act/crime) is very much a case of 'the punishment not fitting the crime'?
Then add in the fact it seems like a kangaroo court.
On a side note, I find it quite intriguing that Russia seems to be hell bent on flattening an entire region that not only do they deem to be theirs but is highly populated by Russian people, many of whom I am sure have suffered greatly as well as their Ukrainian compatriots. Does Russia intend on rebuilding the whole region and if so, where will the money come from if they can't even finance their military properly and are facing huge international sanctions. |
Germany. |  |
| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 17:54 - Jun 9 with 3392 views | joe90 |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:39 - Jun 9 by BostonR |
Live by the sword and all that..............
An army that murders its own troops for falling back, will not blink in executing these Brits. Russia enjoys this callous approach. It's naive to think that the US and the Brits do not have troops in Ukraine. Special forces are all over Ukraine directing shelling, pin-pointing targets and protecting Zelensky .
In fact they have been there for years. |
I suspect they're worth more alive than dead. If they wanted to kill them, they'd be dead by now.
As mentioned by Bazza it could be part of the process of formally recognising the breakaway states. |  | | |
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 18:06 - Jun 9 with 3354 views | Cliff |
it's a bit rich calling them "foreign" mercenaries, They both have Ukrainian wives and have live there for a number of years. One of them has even served in the Ukrainian armed forces since 2018 |  | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 18:45 - Jun 9 with 3260 views | kensalriser |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:39 - Jun 9 by BostonR |
Live by the sword and all that..............
An army that murders its own troops for falling back, will not blink in executing these Brits. Russia enjoys this callous approach. It's naive to think that the US and the Brits do not have troops in Ukraine. Special forces are all over Ukraine directing shelling, pin-pointing targets and protecting Zelensky .
In fact they have been there for years. |
They're not British special forces, they're part of the regular Ukraine army. |  |
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| Two Brits sentenced to death (n/t) on 19:23 - Jun 9 with 3171 views | The_Beast1976 |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 18:45 - Jun 9 by kensalriser |
They're not British special forces, they're part of the regular Ukraine army. |
[Post edited 9 Jun 2022 19:25]
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 19:24 - Jun 9 with 3163 views | The_Beast1976 |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:39 - Jun 9 by BostonR |
Live by the sword and all that..............
An army that murders its own troops for falling back, will not blink in executing these Brits. Russia enjoys this callous approach. It's naive to think that the US and the Brits do not have troops in Ukraine. Special forces are all over Ukraine directing shelling, pin-pointing targets and protecting Zelensky .
In fact they have been there for years. |
Yep | | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 19:29 - Jun 9 with 3119 views | The_Beast1976 |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 16:11 - Jun 9 by Juzzie |
Surely the death penalty for being a mercenary (without actually having committed any supposed act/crime) is very much a case of 'the punishment not fitting the crime'?
Then add in the fact it seems like a kangaroo court.
On a side note, I find it quite intriguing that Russia seems to be hell bent on flattening an entire region that not only do they deem to be theirs but is highly populated by Russian people, many of whom I am sure have suffered greatly as well as their Ukrainian compatriots. Does Russia intend on rebuilding the whole region and if so, where will the money come from if they can't even finance their military properly and are facing huge international sanctions. |
With regards to your side note, I dont think Russia gives a stuff about the state of the relevant region and merely wants to ensure that said region is not controlled by the West (because it's right on Russia's dootstep). | | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 20:49 - Jun 9 with 2939 views | Miss_Terraces |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 19:29 - Jun 9 by The_Beast1976 |
With regards to your side note, I dont think Russia gives a stuff about the state of the relevant region and merely wants to ensure that said region is not controlled by the West (because it's right on Russia's dootstep). |
They're still on the doorstep just miles to the west now. Although I agree to the main point of your post | |
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 12:13 - Jun 10 with 2599 views | Juzzie |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 19:29 - Jun 9 by The_Beast1976 |
With regards to your side note, I dont think Russia gives a stuff about the state of the relevant region and merely wants to ensure that said region is not controlled by the West (because it's right on Russia's dootstep). |
I agree, which makes their whole mantra of 'liberating Donbas [from the nazi's]' a little bewildering whilst promptly flattening the place, regardless of whether Russian people are there or not.
I think there is a massive land grab going on too. It's a very profitable region. Coal, steel, agriculture.
Putin and his cronies bang on about taking back what's theirs but at what point do you determine what is 'yours' and what isn't? In the 1700's it was a lot, lot smaller and everything since then has been a massive conquering and land grab.
Since the break up of the Soviet Union it became smaller but is still the largest country in the world by land mass. Not enough clearly and Putin wants more.
[Post edited 10 Jun 2022 12:23]
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 13:49 - Jun 10 with 2470 views | stowmarketrange |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 12:13 - Jun 10 by Juzzie |
I agree, which makes their whole mantra of 'liberating Donbas [from the nazi's]' a little bewildering whilst promptly flattening the place, regardless of whether Russian people are there or not.
I think there is a massive land grab going on too. It's a very profitable region. Coal, steel, agriculture.
Putin and his cronies bang on about taking back what's theirs but at what point do you determine what is 'yours' and what isn't? In the 1700's it was a lot, lot smaller and everything since then has been a massive conquering and land grab.
Since the break up of the Soviet Union it became smaller but is still the largest country in the world by land mass. Not enough clearly and Putin wants more.
[Post edited 10 Jun 2022 12:23]
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This ploy was started by Israel who seem to think that they owned land 2000 years ago that they’re reclaiming bit by bit.Sorry Clive. | | | |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 12:38 - Jun 12 with 2153 views | LazyFan |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 12:13 - Jun 10 by Juzzie |
I agree, which makes their whole mantra of 'liberating Donbas [from the nazi's]' a little bewildering whilst promptly flattening the place, regardless of whether Russian people are there or not.
I think there is a massive land grab going on too. It's a very profitable region. Coal, steel, agriculture.
Putin and his cronies bang on about taking back what's theirs but at what point do you determine what is 'yours' and what isn't? In the 1700's it was a lot, lot smaller and everything since then has been a massive conquering and land grab.
Since the break up of the Soviet Union it became smaller but is still the largest country in the world by land mass. Not enough clearly and Putin wants more.
[Post edited 10 Jun 2022 12:23]
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What's not shown or mentioned much in the Western media is before Russia invaded Ukraine, the Donbas was being shelled hard by Ukrainian forces some of which were made up of mercenaries.
Mercs often have Nazi-type people in them (Mercs are mad people after all) so, this was a gift to Putin and why he makes these propaganda claims. This is where it's coming from. It is weak and lame, and not really the majority of people at all. But this is where Putin is drawing it from and of course, Russian media is hammering that message all the time on state TV.
Zelensky made many mistakes some of which were:
1) Assuming he could cosy up to Nato and this would not enrage Putin
2) letting Mercs into the Ukrainian forces who are well known to have Nazies in them, especially as Zelensky is Jewish
3) not believing Russia would invade when told so, by all of the Western intelligence agencies. Somehow he knew better.
Putin's mistakes were:
1) Assuming Ukraine had many Russians wanting to be liberated, they didn't and he could have seen that with the fighting in the Donbas
2) Assuming Russian forces were strong like the old Soviet era, when they were not (everyone lied to him, tough that's what happens when you kill everyone, no one wants to tell you the truth as it means death)
3) Thinking the West would do little in retaliation as they did with Crimea. Wrong, Crimea keeps Ukraine weak and dependent upon the West but Ukraine owned by Russia means too many commodities are owned by Russia and there is no way the West will let that happen.
Now of course both have wised up the hard way and we are in for a long 20-year war where many millions will die for no reason than ego maniacs like Putin wanting to caress their egos more. At the end of this war, both Ukraine and Russia will be devastated.
Ukraine I think will succeed and come through this and gain all lost ground from the Russians, but the Russian people won't see the other side of this for possibly 40 years or more. As the Western sanctions will bite hard and put them into poverty. Also in that time, the money they now get from Energy will be slowly but for sure removed from them. Not to mention technology wise they are going to have up-skill a population just for that and that will take 20 years alone. Russia will be put back into the dark ages and become a third-world country.
Who is at fault?
Putin clearly is the aggressor and he's a fascist. Some people sometimes say "oh people are not Evil, they just do bad things". Well, I don't agree, Putin is pure evil and he needs to be at least removed from any powers whatsoever, but ideally, I would like him tried at the war crimes tribunal in the Hague.
Putin even from his own point of view has totally failed, more countries will join Nato now, when before Nato was possibly being weakened and if he had left it another 20 years, many like Belarus might have wanted in with Russia rather than Nato. Zero chance of that now.
He will lose all the ground he has taken, possibly even Crimea and Belarus. It is a complete failure and many millions of people will die and more will be displaced. He has made Russia a worldwide hated country. He has pushed Russia back into the dark ages, rather than be a super power they may well end up a third-world country which may down the line cause more splits.
This is fascism for you, it's a total failure and not clever leadership at all.
Putin is scum. |  |
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| Two Brits sentenced to death on 13:26 - Jun 12 with 2098 views | wood_hoop |
| Two Brits sentenced to death on 12:38 - Jun 12 by LazyFan |
What's not shown or mentioned much in the Western media is before Russia invaded Ukraine, the Donbas was being shelled hard by Ukrainian forces some of which were made up of mercenaries.
Mercs often have Nazi-type people in them (Mercs are mad people after all) so, this was a gift to Putin and why he makes these propaganda claims. This is where it's coming from. It is weak and lame, and not really the majority of people at all. But this is where Putin is drawing it from and of course, Russian media is hammering that message all the time on state TV.
Zelensky made many mistakes some of which were:
1) Assuming he could cosy up to Nato and this would not enrage Putin
2) letting Mercs into the Ukrainian forces who are well known to have Nazies in them, especially as Zelensky is Jewish
3) not believing Russia would invade when told so, by all of the Western intelligence agencies. Somehow he knew better.
Putin's mistakes were:
1) Assuming Ukraine had many Russians wanting to be liberated, they didn't and he could have seen that with the fighting in the Donbas
2) Assuming Russian forces were strong like the old Soviet era, when they were not (everyone lied to him, tough that's what happens when you kill everyone, no one wants to tell you the truth as it means death)
3) Thinking the West would do little in retaliation as they did with Crimea. Wrong, Crimea keeps Ukraine weak and dependent upon the West but Ukraine owned by Russia means too many commodities are owned by Russia and there is no way the West will let that happen.
Now of course both have wised up the hard way and we are in for a long 20-year war where many millions will die for no reason than ego maniacs like Putin wanting to caress their egos more. At the end of this war, both Ukraine and Russia will be devastated.
Ukraine I think will succeed and come through this and gain all lost ground from the Russians, but the Russian people won't see the other side of this for possibly 40 years or more. As the Western sanctions will bite hard and put them into poverty. Also in that time, the money they now get from Energy will be slowly but for sure removed from them. Not to mention technology wise they are going to have up-skill a population just for that and that will take 20 years alone. Russia will be put back into the dark ages and become a third-world country.
Who is at fault?
Putin clearly is the aggressor and he's a fascist. Some people sometimes say "oh people are not Evil, they just do bad things". Well, I don't agree, Putin is pure evil and he needs to be at least removed from any powers whatsoever, but ideally, I would like him tried at the war crimes tribunal in the Hague.
Putin even from his own point of view has totally failed, more countries will join Nato now, when before Nato was possibly being weakened and if he had left it another 20 years, many like Belarus might have wanted in with Russia rather than Nato. Zero chance of that now.
He will lose all the ground he has taken, possibly even Crimea and Belarus. It is a complete failure and many millions of people will die and more will be displaced. He has made Russia a worldwide hated country. He has pushed Russia back into the dark ages, rather than be a super power they may well end up a third-world country which may down the line cause more splits.
This is fascism for you, it's a total failure and not clever leadership at all.
Putin is scum. |
Lazyfan, a well thought out post, their may be a few things that may change the time lines from your points, will Putin last that much longer? only rumors but health wise , supposedly he's not looking that great,
Is there another Putin like figure on the side lines ready to take over ?
I can't see a massive turn away from oil that all are aiming for in other eco fuels, too many countries are mainly dependent on the 'black gold' and the other gases, how are they going to finance to put in solar, wind, etc when they probably own $billions to the oil people as it is.
I agree with Baz, (good grief) the two men the Russians have got are bargaining chips ( well hopefully) and I don't think the current situation will go on that much longer, especially as Ukraine it seems are being allowed to join the EU in double quick time.
Who knows what our government will do then, plenty of the Brexity mob want the 'green taxes' dropped, the alternatives they are promoting to heat homes cost an arm and a leg,
electric vehicles the same in comparison to dark fuel options.
The whole thing is a mess imo, big buisness now rules our world completely and whatever governments are elected in the western world ,will be beholding to them, to a high degree. |  | | |
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