| Big Elephant in the room.. 14:12 - Oct 26 with 17901 views | Pommyhoop |
It was touched on by a poster who replied to Clive's match report on the home page.
Could racism be a factor in the non stop and over the top abuse Chris Ramsey is getting?
Hey just putting it out there guys( I know that will go down well on Disco's irritation thread)
Don't shoot the messenger etc etc...
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 12:51 - Oct 27 with 2397 views | JacksDad |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 12:29 - Oct 27 by CHUBBS |
Interesting concept,however I take it this racial "programming" isn't discriminate and is also a natural behaviour of black people toward white?
In fact I know it is as I've often been treated differently when around some groups of black people.
Can't say I cared as it's just "normal" and not racist as you say. |
Totally agree which is why said not the same ethnicity - all races are capable of it. The problem being a white heterosexual male is that most of the wrongs in the world can be laid at the feet of my forefathers and my multitude of uncles |  | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:59 - Oct 27 with 2293 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 12:05 - Oct 27 by Mvpeter |
Apologies.
Thank god we have enlightened non-white people to determine who and who isn't allowed to identify themselves as black on the internet.
Much better.
1. He's not black because his beliefs were strongly held and he believed that the failure of a high profile black manager in an environment where it is alleged that black managers will struggle to gain high profile would be extremely detrimental to the 'movement' If it was believed that such failure would influence the decisions of chairman and with few other examples to counteract this incidence, it is possible to have a significant negative effect. Now I don't personally believe this to be true but I don't discount the possibility for other to do so.
2. Another poster has accused me of it to. It was a common attempt to squash dissenting voices by pretending they were all the same person. Doesn't happen now because it's evident that most supporters aren't best pleased.
3.He didn't want to meet you. Big deal.
In conclusion a poster made a claim you didn't like, someone else made an unfounded accusation about him and he didn't want a pint. Therefore you have the right to accuse him of lying about being black.
Your assumption leads me to the same conclusion. |
I was about to launch into the big explanation and then I realised that you're the person who was so insistent that everyone should be offended by the Irish fellow who didn't turn to the flag for the national anthem that he ended up telling people that they were offended but they just don't know it!! It's going to be a long night trying to reason with you.
So enough pussy footing around, I'll just put this out there. Benny the Ball I don't believe you are black, I believe you posted your social experiment accusation, realised it went too far and thought you'd be able to back track and get out of it by pretending to be black. Unfortunately for you the language used in your main backtracking post didn't seem realistic and in some places was very over the top. Having enjoyed yourself in the cut and thrust of the back and forth, the minute I offer to meet you to discuss your beliefs you completely disappeared. Shat yourself basically. And rightly so because what you did was f**king low.
Of course if I'm wrong, I would still love to meet up. After which I promise to make profuse apologies to you and of course my beloved MVPeter on this site.
What do you say Benny? |  | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:52 - Oct 28 with 2214 views | TacticalR |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 18:53 - Oct 26 by WatfordR |
In a recent article by DaveMc about Ramsey's unpopularty, it was very noticeable (to me anyway!) that he mentioned five or six times
"...but because Ramsey's face doesn't fit..."
without explaining what he meant by that. I'd be interested to know exactly what he was alluding to. |
His face certainly didn't fit as far as the Daily Mail was concerned...
Chris Ramsey, Tottenham Coach, Airbrushed Out Of Daily Mail 'Salute' Picture
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/04/08/tottenham-coach-airbrushed-mail_n_510
Exactly why that was will have to remain one of the great mysteries of our time. |  |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 10:20 - Oct 28 with 2195 views | Discodroids |
Its only a matter of time before Chris can clam some kind of reparation from the sickening waycithism he has suffered at the hands from the boys of brazil gene pool, that seems to have taken root on LFW, And at Loftus road like Japanese knotweed.
If only the Right honorable Elijah Mohammed and his devine presence was here to curse the blue eyed,thin boned, white haired devil when we questioned the wisdom of single black gloved Chris , in signing Oscar Gobern.
Perhaps we can make amends by installing 'Yakub', The big head scientist and omega man of Africa, According to the Nation of Islam, as chairman to support chris when things get a bit rough. This might be a bit difficult as 'yakub' is currently 6,600 years old and lives on the Island of 'Patmos', a step down surely for the Black God who would No doubt take a dim view of the springbok's ropey pint of Guinness and lack of Dominoes.
by any means Necessary , el shabazz Chris. [Post edited 28 Oct 2015 10:29]
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| The Duke Of New York. A-Number One.
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:11 - Oct 28 with 2135 views | Mvpeter |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:59 - Oct 27 by 1BobbyHazell |
I was about to launch into the big explanation and then I realised that you're the person who was so insistent that everyone should be offended by the Irish fellow who didn't turn to the flag for the national anthem that he ended up telling people that they were offended but they just don't know it!! It's going to be a long night trying to reason with you.
So enough pussy footing around, I'll just put this out there. Benny the Ball I don't believe you are black, I believe you posted your social experiment accusation, realised it went too far and thought you'd be able to back track and get out of it by pretending to be black. Unfortunately for you the language used in your main backtracking post didn't seem realistic and in some places was very over the top. Having enjoyed yourself in the cut and thrust of the back and forth, the minute I offer to meet you to discuss your beliefs you completely disappeared. Shat yourself basically. And rightly so because what you did was f**king low.
Of course if I'm wrong, I would still love to meet up. After which I promise to make profuse apologies to you and of course my beloved MVPeter on this site.
What do you say Benny? |
You're talking absolute bol1ocks. I said McLeans a w****r. I didn't 'tell people they were offended even if they didn't know it'
You are deflecting, you've done it twice. That is anathema to reason but feel free to go about town with an unearned sense of satisfaction. | |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:24 - Oct 28 with 2114 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:38 - Oct 26 by baz_qpr |
Copy and pasted from another thread. Nothing to do with Racism and the suggestion it is, is frankly desperate. No one has ever talked about Race other than Ramsey and Ferdinand
Atmosphere is bad because:
a) Expectations are high
b) Crowd has never bought into Ramsey who it seems was brought into manage relegation and did so removing any flair or "foreign" players from the team and playing pump it long to Bobby. When Vargas is scoring at the Copa America, Zarate doing well at West Ham, yet neither could get in a terrible QPR team
c) We've not played well once under Ramsey at home (that I can remember), majority of the crowd have turned, I dont know about anyone else but if I think of the nearest 20 people around me they've all turned.
d) Getting thrashed 4-0 against a poor Fulham side in the Championship, it was not just the loss but the way we lost. Not many managers would come back from that
e) Some very strange subs
f) The total unwillingness to alter the system regardless of situation
g) Perception that Ramsey got the job because he was Ferdinands mate not because he was the most qualified candidate
When you put all those things together that is why you've got a toxic atmosphere |
I think if we can examine the points raised in the post quoted, then we'll avoid an awful lot of things that are not germane to the issues of whether CR is the right man for the job and/or why some are concerned that he isn't. |  |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:26 - Oct 28 with 2060 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:59 - Oct 27 by 1BobbyHazell |
I was about to launch into the big explanation and then I realised that you're the person who was so insistent that everyone should be offended by the Irish fellow who didn't turn to the flag for the national anthem that he ended up telling people that they were offended but they just don't know it!! It's going to be a long night trying to reason with you.
So enough pussy footing around, I'll just put this out there. Benny the Ball I don't believe you are black, I believe you posted your social experiment accusation, realised it went too far and thought you'd be able to back track and get out of it by pretending to be black. Unfortunately for you the language used in your main backtracking post didn't seem realistic and in some places was very over the top. Having enjoyed yourself in the cut and thrust of the back and forth, the minute I offer to meet you to discuss your beliefs you completely disappeared. Shat yourself basically. And rightly so because what you did was f**king low.
Of course if I'm wrong, I would still love to meet up. After which I promise to make profuse apologies to you and of course my beloved MVPeter on this site.
What do you say Benny? |
To answer the thread, repeated failure on and off the pitch despite the millions spent has understandably created a deep frustration for some fans. Naturally they want to see a fix but are skeptical whether this inexperienced team can deliver. On the one hand I feel for Ramsey because he's on a hiding to nothing but on the other hand he would have been mindful of this when accepting an opportunity he scarcely deserved.
To answer Bobby, I was clear about my race from the outset and I have nothing to prove to you. At no point did I backtrack or disappear; if you're under any illusions about this then let me be clear.
My concern is whether people appointed in their roles are there on merit and free of conflict of interest, irrespective of race. However, the lack of BAME managers in the game is an issue and there is a movement to attempt to address this including exploring options such as the Rooney rule. In light of this backdrop, Les plumping for an all black line-up that is largely inexperienced is a gamble because failure will give rise to threads such as this one. Given this risk, I would have preferred Les to explore more credible options with no personal links to Les, such as Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink.
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with this view but to make it personal is frankly deplorable and only serves to steer attention from the real issues. We will struggle to move forward unless we're prepared to invite open, intelligent discussion on such matters without fear of reproach. |  | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:34 - Oct 28 with 2045 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:26 - Oct 28 by Benny_the_Ball |
To answer the thread, repeated failure on and off the pitch despite the millions spent has understandably created a deep frustration for some fans. Naturally they want to see a fix but are skeptical whether this inexperienced team can deliver. On the one hand I feel for Ramsey because he's on a hiding to nothing but on the other hand he would have been mindful of this when accepting an opportunity he scarcely deserved.
To answer Bobby, I was clear about my race from the outset and I have nothing to prove to you. At no point did I backtrack or disappear; if you're under any illusions about this then let me be clear.
My concern is whether people appointed in their roles are there on merit and free of conflict of interest, irrespective of race. However, the lack of BAME managers in the game is an issue and there is a movement to attempt to address this including exploring options such as the Rooney rule. In light of this backdrop, Les plumping for an all black line-up that is largely inexperienced is a gamble because failure will give rise to threads such as this one. Given this risk, I would have preferred Les to explore more credible options with no personal links to Les, such as Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink.
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with this view but to make it personal is frankly deplorable and only serves to steer attention from the real issues. We will struggle to move forward unless we're prepared to invite open, intelligent discussion on such matters without fear of reproach. |
Yay, you've arrived! What took you so long? Why did you disappear before?
Anyway, never mind that, I'm all for an intelligent open discussion on such matters without fear of reproach, which is exactly why (in the heat of our 'battle') I offered to meet you for a few pints and listen properly to where you were coming from. My interest in how you see 'a movement being destabilised' (I'm paraphrasing) is genuine.
I should be making the Preston game. How about it?
An extra plus is that you and MVPeter will be getting the biggest apology ever seen on this site. | | | |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:05 - Oct 28 with 1975 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:26 - Oct 28 by Benny_the_Ball |
To answer the thread, repeated failure on and off the pitch despite the millions spent has understandably created a deep frustration for some fans. Naturally they want to see a fix but are skeptical whether this inexperienced team can deliver. On the one hand I feel for Ramsey because he's on a hiding to nothing but on the other hand he would have been mindful of this when accepting an opportunity he scarcely deserved.
To answer Bobby, I was clear about my race from the outset and I have nothing to prove to you. At no point did I backtrack or disappear; if you're under any illusions about this then let me be clear.
My concern is whether people appointed in their roles are there on merit and free of conflict of interest, irrespective of race. However, the lack of BAME managers in the game is an issue and there is a movement to attempt to address this including exploring options such as the Rooney rule. In light of this backdrop, Les plumping for an all black line-up that is largely inexperienced is a gamble because failure will give rise to threads such as this one. Given this risk, I would have preferred Les to explore more credible options with no personal links to Les, such as Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink.
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with this view but to make it personal is frankly deplorable and only serves to steer attention from the real issues. We will struggle to move forward unless we're prepared to invite open, intelligent discussion on such matters without fear of reproach. |
Struggling to understand how JFH is a more 'credible' option (someone who had been manager of one club in a lower league for half a season at the time Ramsey was appointed).
As for the all black line-up, I'm still a bit baffled.
Steve Gallen was promoted to first team coach, otherwise would still have been in charge of the U21s.
The goalie coach, Paul Crichton, is white
The Head of Coaching, Simon Ireland, is white.
The Head of Academy Recruitment, Gary Karsa, is white.
The Head of the Academy, Perry Suckling, is white.
Then we have Ramsey, Les, Impey, Furlong and Hall in the other coaching roles. It seems remarkably balanced to me. You could certainly argue about experience - but how is Hasselbaink 'experienced'? How do any young coaches become 'experienced' except by being given chances - chances, which we know for a fact, that have been in extremely short supply for BAME coaching candidates.
All in all, it's an odd argument to take up, even given the fact that Karsa was appointed after your initial comments. |  |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:25 - Oct 28 with 1958 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:05 - Oct 28 by Antti_Heinola |
Struggling to understand how JFH is a more 'credible' option (someone who had been manager of one club in a lower league for half a season at the time Ramsey was appointed).
As for the all black line-up, I'm still a bit baffled.
Steve Gallen was promoted to first team coach, otherwise would still have been in charge of the U21s.
The goalie coach, Paul Crichton, is white
The Head of Coaching, Simon Ireland, is white.
The Head of Academy Recruitment, Gary Karsa, is white.
The Head of the Academy, Perry Suckling, is white.
Then we have Ramsey, Les, Impey, Furlong and Hall in the other coaching roles. It seems remarkably balanced to me. You could certainly argue about experience - but how is Hasselbaink 'experienced'? How do any young coaches become 'experienced' except by being given chances - chances, which we know for a fact, that have been in extremely short supply for BAME coaching candidates.
All in all, it's an odd argument to take up, even given the fact that Karsa was appointed after your initial comments. |
Not forgetting the ethnic origins of our owners.
I think the clear issue remains, that from Ramsey up, there isn't much experience among several individuals holding key positions at QPR.
By-the-by, how is this Hoos chap doing? | |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:28 - Oct 28 with 1954 views | PunteR |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:25 - Oct 28 by PlanetHonneywood |
Not forgetting the ethnic origins of our owners.
I think the clear issue remains, that from Ramsey up, there isn't much experience among several individuals holding key positions at QPR.
By-the-by, how is this Hoos chap doing? |
Warnock? |  |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 21:41 - Oct 28 with 1863 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:28 - Oct 28 by PunteR |
Warnock? |
Are we still on 'The Social Experiment'? I reckon a Social Experiment would last about thirty seconds.
FERDINAND: "'Ere, Tone, just a thought, what about we try to employ just black candidates? It could help racial attitudes."
FERNANDES: "Racial attitudes? League table attitudes is what you should be worrying about! Have you seen how much f*cking money we owe???!!! When that wedge comes out of YOUR pocket, you can employ FATHER F*CKING CHRISTMASES for all I care. Until then, GO DO YOUR F*CKING JOB!" |  |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 03:50 - Oct 29 with 1759 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:05 - Oct 28 by Antti_Heinola |
Struggling to understand how JFH is a more 'credible' option (someone who had been manager of one club in a lower league for half a season at the time Ramsey was appointed).
As for the all black line-up, I'm still a bit baffled.
Steve Gallen was promoted to first team coach, otherwise would still have been in charge of the U21s.
The goalie coach, Paul Crichton, is white
The Head of Coaching, Simon Ireland, is white.
The Head of Academy Recruitment, Gary Karsa, is white.
The Head of the Academy, Perry Suckling, is white.
Then we have Ramsey, Les, Impey, Furlong and Hall in the other coaching roles. It seems remarkably balanced to me. You could certainly argue about experience - but how is Hasselbaink 'experienced'? How do any young coaches become 'experienced' except by being given chances - chances, which we know for a fact, that have been in extremely short supply for BAME coaching candidates.
All in all, it's an odd argument to take up, even given the fact that Karsa was appointed after your initial comments. |
JFH was just an example but if you must be picky then bear in mind that Ramsey was only caretaker last season. The real appointment happened this summer by which time JFH had guided a modest club to the League 2 title in his first season in charge. This is the right level for young managers to cut their teeth. A championship club with ambitions of returning to the Premier League should not be taking a gamble on a coach with no managerial experience just because he's mates with the DoF (who himself has no experience of his role). This is the reason why some fans are disillusioned, nothing to do with Ramsey's colour. | | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 03:53 - Oct 29 with 1756 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 17:28 - Oct 28 by PunteR |
Warnock? |
Who has been brought in because of their inexperience. | | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 05:23 - Oct 29 with 1724 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 03:50 - Oct 29 by Benny_the_Ball |
JFH was just an example but if you must be picky then bear in mind that Ramsey was only caretaker last season. The real appointment happened this summer by which time JFH had guided a modest club to the League 2 title in his first season in charge. This is the right level for young managers to cut their teeth. A championship club with ambitions of returning to the Premier League should not be taking a gamble on a coach with no managerial experience just because he's mates with the DoF (who himself has no experience of his role). This is the reason why some fans are disillusioned, nothing to do with Ramsey's colour. |
So you're abandoning the 'Social Experiment' idea, and we're back to 'Les' inexperienced mate'?
Good. Guess what, CR isn't doing badly. Thirteen games into a 46 game season, we're tenth with a WDL record of 5-4-4. Come back when the wheels fall off and I might even support you. Until then... | |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 08:40 - Oct 29 with 1647 views | Mvpeter |
I'd look beyond the first team, almost every youth coach was released and replaced (by letter.) I think this is where the 'social experiment' claims come from. It could be racially motivated but it's certainly jobs for the ex-tottenham assistant boys. [Post edited 29 Oct 2015 8:40]
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:05 - Oct 29 with 1612 views | captainmycaptian |
Disco power is what I say | | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:07 - Oct 29 with 1605 views | Discodroids |
Perhaps a' Black History Month' and Public Enemy over the Tannoy at W12 will help El Shabazz Chris fight the power.Its been a while since Ken Livingstone broke down in tears on TV over the slave trade as well, he aint up to much now, he can help Poor chris with his weekly Pressers before calling for Darcus Howe to made first team conditioning coach . [Post edited 29 Oct 2015 9:13]
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| The Duke Of New York. A-Number One.
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:23 - Oct 29 with 1593 views | TheBlob |
Dear god,has this board turned into "I'm the only black in the village" now? |  |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:32 - Oct 29 with 1582 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 08:40 - Oct 29 by Mvpeter |
I'd look beyond the first team, almost every youth coach was released and replaced (by letter.) I think this is where the 'social experiment' claims come from. It could be racially motivated but it's certainly jobs for the ex-tottenham assistant boys. [Post edited 29 Oct 2015 8:40]
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I fail to see how employing ex-Tottenham staff qualifies for the description 'social experiment' (his phrase, not mine), but you believe what you want.
Getting back to the main point, the question of whether or not CR should be replaced: for me the evidence says 'definitely not yet'. | |
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| Big Elephant in the room.. on 09:49 - Oct 29 with 1562 views | captainmycaptian |
darcus say "power to the disco" you have powerful backers disco friends in low places ect | | | |
| Big Elephant in the room.. on 10:05 - Oct 29 with 1541 views | captainmycaptian |
on a serious note any idiot that thinks that if CR was winning / playing well that the crowd would not be behind him is a fool. social experiments are for libtard who sip mocha coffees sourced from fair traded cats feces while thinking they are saving the world. anyway I think...... | | | |
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