| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! 13:04 - Jun 16 with 13341 views | oldhoop |
We only have;
2 keepers - Green & McCarthy (1 needed)
5 defenders - Hill, Caulker, Onuoha, Suk-Young & Traore (at least 4 more needed)
8 Midfielders - Phillips (staying?), Henry (re-signing?),Hoillet, Fer (staying?), Sandro (???), Luongo, Gladwin & now Mackie (before departures 2 more needed)
2 Forwards - Austin (soon to go) & JET (3 needed)
A total squad of 17 (plus possibly the youngsters Greco-Cox, Doughty, Ehmer and Furlong)
That looks extremely, worryingly, thin!!!
Bear in mind the extra games in the Championship and no 25 man restriction boy do we need some extra resource!!!
At least 10 more players and pronto.(plus replacements for any further leavers)
This has all the hallmarks of another disaster and I am completely not taken in by the "new world" mantra. We have had 11 leavers so far and have recruited just 4. (if Mackie goes ahead) with bigger squads in the Championship we are woefully short of numbers and the season is 6/7 weeks away.
Please please lets not go into another season with just a couple of forwards, the successful clubs have at least 5 we surely can't fall into that trap again, can we?
Come on Les get your finger out or we will struggle to stay in this division let alone contend for promotion! |  | | |  |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:49 - Jun 17 with 1963 views | connell10 |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 14:32 - Jun 17 by Mvpeter |
I don't think people quite understand the financial catastrophe we are experiencing. We need promotion as soon as possible. |
We need promotion at the moment like a hole in the head, we go up we will come straight back down! We have to build a strong team and that might take years! |  |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:57 - Jun 17 with 1943 views | GetMeRangers |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:36 - Jun 17 by Mvpeter |
Orr signed on the 26th of July, that's not late. Taarabt was signed on the 5th of August after spending a year and a half settling in on loan.
' Phillips and Smith were right at the end of the window' and were not ready to play for a long time.
Here's the list of players signed late in the last couple years.
Rob Hulse, Pascal Chimbonda, Danny Shittu, Joey Barton, Luke Young, Armand Traore, Anton Ferdinand, SWP, Djibril Cisse, Bobby Zamora, Jose Bosingwa, Julio Cesar, Esteban Granero, Stephane M'Bia, Chris Samba, Jermaine Jenas, Andros Townsend, Aaron Hughes, BAE, the boy Tom Carroll, Niko Kranjcar, Guillherme Dellatorre, Modibo Maiga, Will Keane, Kevin Doyle, Sandro, Niko Kranjcar....again.
Depressing reading but it's more depressing that there are those that haven't learnt from this. |
Odd. I remember those late signings when TF took over and the Newcastle game, JB debut, and a rampant SWP... I seriously thought we were going to have a great season. One of the best games I have seen in recent years
Adel settled in? He spent most of the first half of the season managing about 65-70 mins, but it didnt seem to do us too much harm.
Given the nature of how many have left, with the added 'silence' about the targets they have, makes me think that they will not only add, but are hard at it getting them
Personally, I ma glad that the days of every player being linked to us and splashed all over the tabloids are behind us. 17th June and greatly encouraged by what they have got in so far |  | | |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:58 - Jun 17 with 1939 views | WeaverQPR |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:49 - Jun 17 by connell10 |
We need promotion at the moment like a hole in the head, we go up we will come straight back down! We have to build a strong team and that might take years! |
Relegation from the PL is not the end of the world providing you have not gambled your clubs future on massive signings and astronomical wages! |  |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:03 - Jun 17 with 1922 views | Mvpeter |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:28 - Jun 17 by Antti_Heinola |
i don't think the date matters much. Better to get them early, but you can sign bad players at any time and good players at any time. Obviously better to have the vast majroity of the squad together for all of pre-season, but it's not always possible. And sometimes a bargain is available late on if a club needs to sell. |
Absolutely this. I'm not saying that you must sign all players in May and never sign anyone near the end of the season. What I am saying is that we have relied heavily on signing late, far more than any other club and the evidence for the success of that practice is damning.
In fact the less players you sign late the more likely it is that those that are signed late will be successful. This is because they are at least walking into a settled group with an existing culture as opposed to other new arrivals and cultural chaos.
It's also evidence of poor preparedness and desperation. |  |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:06 - Jun 17 with 1915 views | Mvpeter |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:49 - Jun 17 by connell10 |
We need promotion at the moment like a hole in the head, we go up we will come straight back down! We have to build a strong team and that might take years! |
If we go up and come straight back down that is better than not going up at all.
We do not have years. We are staring at the abyss here. It's terrifying thinking about what next years accounts will look like. [Post edited 17 Jun 2015 16:06]
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:09 - Jun 17 with 1901 views | Mvpeter |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:57 - Jun 17 by GetMeRangers |
Odd. I remember those late signings when TF took over and the Newcastle game, JB debut, and a rampant SWP... I seriously thought we were going to have a great season. One of the best games I have seen in recent years
Adel settled in? He spent most of the first half of the season managing about 65-70 mins, but it didnt seem to do us too much harm.
Given the nature of how many have left, with the added 'silence' about the targets they have, makes me think that they will not only add, but are hard at it getting them
Personally, I ma glad that the days of every player being linked to us and splashed all over the tabloids are behind us. 17th June and greatly encouraged by what they have got in so far |
I don't think you know what I mean by settling in and really you only provide me with more evidence.
I don't know what gave you the impression I want a load of media stories. I just wish for us to continue at this pace. Hopefully two or three more in the next two weeks, preferably at the back. | |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:25 - Jun 17 with 1891 views | PhilmyRs |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 14:39 - Jun 17 by Hunterhoop |
We're not really disagreeing.
You're just struggling with understanding the difference between a target set for the team and our expectations as fans, which based on precious posts over the years surprises me Philmy.
They are different.
Target: competing for the play off
Expectations: we are in this league again next year, ie. we don't get relegated, AND all the players give 100%, AND they have a go and play attacking football.
There is no "setting the bar low", as you continually allude to.
The point I'm trying to make is that, as things stand, losing all the players we have, losing the players we all know will be off, signing 3 young players from League 1, plus Mackie, you cannot expect us to challenge for the play-offs.
Bring in more quality, don't lose everyone we might, and yes, we can reasses expectations. But at present, the point is, we should not be unhappy if ALL those constituent parts of my definition of "expectations" happen. We should be pleased. |
In my previous post I was specifically alluding to expectations not objectives.
Your expectations (what you’ll be happy with) is a committed team, playing good football and one that manages to stay in the league. You think it’s naive/delusional to expect more than that due to the change that has taken place at the club. Fair enough. I would argue that significant change (in playing staff especially) took place after the previous relegation and expectations were that we’d get promoted, which we ultimately did. I appreciate this relegation feels different but the point I’m making is change shouldn’t automatically dampen expectations.
Personally, I look at the team we could be fielding against Charlton (assuming our transfer business is good) and it looks strong. Relatively speaking we’ll still be one of the biggest spenders and have one of the largest squads to choose from in the league come the start of the season. That in itself should increase expectations. I think where there is confusion and which you alluded to at the bottom of your post is I believe we’ll only lose Charlie and possibly Fer (of the ones we care about) and add a few more whereas you expect to lose more and only add up and coming talent. Of course lose Phillips, Caulker, Fer and Greene and only add promising talent and my expectations would change.
As is, turning up at HQ with Caulker and Ned in the middle, Yun and a newbie at full backs, Sandro or Henry holding with the Swindon boys in front and Phillips and Mackie either side of a new striker (possibly the Brentford lad) and I’d expect to win the majority of home games with that team and get a few wins on the road. To do otherwise, would not meet my expectations. | | | |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:34 - Jun 17 with 1870 views | JonDoeman |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:58 - Jun 17 by WeaverQPR |
Relegation from the PL is not the end of the world providing you have not gambled your clubs future on massive signings and astronomical wages! |
Ooops !! |  |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 17:16 - Jun 17 with 1833 views | AgedR |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 16:06 - Jun 17 by Mvpeter |
If we go up and come straight back down that is better than not going up at all.
We do not have years. We are staring at the abyss here. It's terrifying thinking about what next years accounts will look like. [Post edited 17 Jun 2015 16:06]
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While the debt is being serviced it isn't a problem (look at Utd).
I think the truth is, the debt is unlikely to go down unless they do a Mo Fo and convert it to equity.
Operating income will unquestionably go down, but, so is operating cost.
No abyss unless they leave and demand repayment and if that happens the division we're in is irrelevant.
They're in it to make a bundle and I think they have realised that consistent premier league status is not achievable without a decent infrastructure.
I'm no blind optimist, but, I am happy with what's been done post season so far. [Post edited 17 Jun 2015 17:18]
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 18:30 - Jun 17 with 1797 views | SpiritofGregory |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 17:16 - Jun 17 by AgedR |
While the debt is being serviced it isn't a problem (look at Utd).
I think the truth is, the debt is unlikely to go down unless they do a Mo Fo and convert it to equity.
Operating income will unquestionably go down, but, so is operating cost.
No abyss unless they leave and demand repayment and if that happens the division we're in is irrelevant.
They're in it to make a bundle and I think they have realised that consistent premier league status is not achievable without a decent infrastructure.
I'm no blind optimist, but, I am happy with what's been done post season so far. [Post edited 17 Jun 2015 17:18]
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Utd have a 70 thousand seater stadium, are in the Premier League, Champions League, have a world brand, of course they can service their debt. We on the other hand... Even when we were in the Championship with players on low wages we still made a loss. We need to get back to the Premier League and set a wage structure. |  | | |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 19:20 - Jun 17 with 1754 views | DylanP |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 15:49 - Jun 17 by WilloW4 |
Defence:hill, caulker onuoha , suk-Young ,furlong and (wait for it)..Traore ... That looks ok... No it doesn't Dlyanp...that mixed up line up will leak a shed load of goals...!! |
Football is a game of opinons and clearly we have different opinions on the defense.
That back line wasn't good enough for the Premiership. But we aren't in the Premiership any more. I think that back line will be more than good enough for the Championship. The Championship doesn't have the speed or quality to expose our defense in the way their were exposed last year. 2 of Caulker, Onouha and Hil lin the middle and two of YSY, Traore, and Furlong on the outside is a good starting point for our defense.
Last time we were in the Championship, we were promoted with one of the best defensive records in the division. Who did we have that season that was so much better than the current line-up? |  |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 23:23 - Jun 17 with 1675 views | AgedR |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 18:30 - Jun 17 by SpiritofGregory |
Utd have a 70 thousand seater stadium, are in the Premier League, Champions League, have a world brand, of course they can service their debt. We on the other hand... Even when we were in the Championship with players on low wages we still made a loss. We need to get back to the Premier League and set a wage structure. |
Don't disagree with you SoG (there I've said it  ).
However, my point is that the debt is irrelevant while it continues to be serviced. And it doesn't matter whether this is through income from global brand merchandising or the deep pockets of a mystery Malaysian consortium with some fairly non committal Indian oligarchical support.
If your point is that the club is less of a saleable asset than Msn Utd, then, you know what, I'm going to agree with you. | |
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| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 09:11 - Jun 18 with 1620 views | Mvpeter |
| Les & Co need to pull their finger out! on 23:23 - Jun 17 by AgedR |
Don't disagree with you SoG (there I've said it ).
However, my point is that the debt is irrelevant while it continues to be serviced. And it doesn't matter whether this is through income from global brand merchandising or the deep pockets of a mystery Malaysian consortium with some fairly non committal Indian oligarchical support.
If your point is that the club is less of a saleable asset than Msn Utd, then, you know what, I'm going to agree with you. |
Continue to be serviced?
It grew despite the one off write off which appears to have been purely done to cheat the system.
Need a lot more servicing to allay fears. | |
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