| Injuries. 09:28 - Mar 5 with 6539 views | PunteR |
Is our long term injury list total BS or are we just very unlucky. ?
I nearly posted in the Conspiracy theory thread about this.
What is really going on?
Chair
Willock
Paal
Laird
Amos
Balagun (yeh right)
Dykes
Clarke Salter.
Roberts
Anyone else I've missed ?
To have both Paal and Laird out who were instrumental in our high flying days under Beale just seems to me that there's a lot of BS going and I can't for the life of me think why players refuse to play under a different manager.. Balagun is blatantly obvious he's a Beale Bitch.
The Willock one is interesting , is this guy seriously hampered or is he holding out to get a move in the summer. ?
Chair is definitely legit. Amos is ..Well Amos so naturally he's injured. But the rest .. hmm I'm not so sure. |  |
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| Injuries. on 20:07 - Mar 5 with 1851 views | davman |
| Injuries. on 20:03 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
So Norf, what you are basically saying is that they are all feigning injury and they are all not bothering to play because their 'daddy' has left and they are all basically unhappy and on strike.
Well, I do not believe that is true and if it was then there would be a rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour.....it just is not right what is being suggested. It doesn't happen, they cannot all be feigning injury.
And, if you and other posters think they are feigning injury which is not and cannot be right, then the Club would invoke disciplinary action. |
The proof one way or the other is if they can be bothered gracing us with their presence in the next 2-3 weeks and then whether they stick a shift in. If they do that, it'll be clear my view is wrong on this. If, however, they come back and act pathetically or we don't see them, I suspect it is right.
I hope to God your view is right and mine is way, way off the mark. The two teams Gareth has put out has no chance in this league... |  |
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| Injuries. on 20:07 - Mar 5 with 1852 views | PunteR |
| Injuries. on 20:03 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
So Norf, what you are basically saying is that they are all feigning injury and they are all not bothering to play because their 'daddy' has left and they are all basically unhappy and on strike.
Well, I do not believe that is true and if it was then there would be a rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour.....it just is not right what is being suggested. It doesn't happen, they cannot all be feigning injury.
And, if you and other posters think they are feigning injury which is not and cannot be right, then the Club would invoke disciplinary action. |
So players dont feign injury?
Hey mate, did you know the earth is flat? | |
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| Injuries. on 20:09 - Mar 5 with 1832 views | gazza1 |
| Injuries. on 18:48 - Mar 5 by davman |
No beef from me, gazza - content that you are only passing on what you have heard.
Too much of a coincidence that all of the players bar Willock and Amos are all Beale's buddies and all seem to be innocuous reeking of "I didn't come here for this". Hopefully, they are genuine and, as GA says, hoping that the cavalry is coming, but then you know what hope does to you here... |
Why are the Beales 'buddies'??? He was involved in signing them and that does not make them his 'buddies' or as Norf suggests their 'Daddy!!!! |  | | |
| Injuries. on 20:11 - Mar 5 with 1819 views | PunteR |
| Injuries. on 20:09 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
Why are the Beales 'buddies'??? He was involved in signing them and that does not make them his 'buddies' or as Norf suggests their 'Daddy!!!! |
I think you've dug your heels in too deep here. Pinner will be along again to help pull you out im sure. | |
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| Injuries. on 20:12 - Mar 5 with 1804 views | gazza1 |
| Injuries. on 20:07 - Mar 5 by PunteR |
So players dont feign injury?
Hey mate, did you know the earth is flat? |
They may do during a match to gain an advantage but not on Monday morning when they arrive for work/training.....it just doesn't happen to the extent what is being suggested. | | | |
| Injuries. on 20:13 - Mar 5 with 1809 views | supahoopsa |
| Injuries. on 20:03 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
So Norf, what you are basically saying is that they are all feigning injury and they are all not bothering to play because their 'daddy' has left and they are all basically unhappy and on strike.
Well, I do not believe that is true and if it was then there would be a rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour.....it just is not right what is being suggested. It doesn't happen, they cannot all be feigning injury.
And, if you and other posters think they are feigning injury which is not and cannot be right, then the Club would invoke disciplinary action. |
Well said Gazza. There seems to be a lot of people on here that "know" these guys are faking injuries. As you said, no one would let them get away with that. |  |
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| Injuries. on 20:25 - Mar 5 with 1780 views | PunteR |
| Injuries. on 20:13 - Mar 5 by supahoopsa |
Well said Gazza. There seems to be a lot of people on here that "know" these guys are faking injuries. As you said, no one would let them get away with that. |
Can you explain 4 months out for a broken bone in a foot then please ?
With the best medical support , sports physios.?
You know as much as i do. Ive been watching football for 40 years and i dont think ive ever come across this sort of injury record to a team. If we were still in the playoffs do you honestly believe the treatment room would be this full? | |
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| Injuries. on 20:35 - Mar 5 with 1748 views | gazza1 |
| Injuries. on 20:25 - Mar 5 by PunteR |
Can you explain 4 months out for a broken bone in a foot then please ?
With the best medical support , sports physios.?
You know as much as i do. Ive been watching football for 40 years and i dont think ive ever come across this sort of injury record to a team. If we were still in the playoffs do you honestly believe the treatment room would be this full? |
No I cannot explain, nor can anyone of the posters here because we know nothing about the injury......Norf tells me it was a calf injury, I was told it was a broken bone in his foot (Lots of bones in the foot).
Our injury list is long, I agree.
What I would say is that medical stuff is well advanced nowadays and doctors, physio's, coaches, fitness guys, etc are around all the time at the training ground, etc, etc.......& if they were feigning injury then they would soon be found out. [Post edited 5 Mar 2023 20:36]
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| Injuries. on 20:47 - Mar 5 with 1716 views | Northernr |
| Injuries. on 20:03 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
So Norf, what you are basically saying is that they are all feigning injury and they are all not bothering to play because their 'daddy' has left and they are all basically unhappy and on strike.
Well, I do not believe that is true and if it was then there would be a rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour.....it just is not right what is being suggested. It doesn't happen, they cannot all be feigning injury.
And, if you and other posters think they are feigning injury which is not and cannot be right, then the Club would invoke disciplinary action. |
Ok well, look, a few things here. It's an emotional time because we're all pissd off, and I lash out with the best of them as you know having had the misfortune to sit next to me for the last 25 years, so let me try and summarise where I am on this. This won't be brief, because it's me, but here I go anyway...
1 - no I don't believe they are "all feigning injury" as you say. You look at Chair and Willock when they went off and they were obviously in pain and hamstring injuries are a nightmare and so on and so forth. You'd do well to fake pneumonia, I think. So, respectfully, don't put words in my mouth, I haven't said they're "all feigning injury".
2 - I think we have a general problem with injuries at this club, and have for a while. If you don''t like me writing that, ignore me, and listen to the manager we started the season with - he said the same thing. Now, whether that's a sport science issue, a treatment issue who knows, but Beale was pissd off with it. Tony Fernandes said on record in interview a couple of seasons back that we would be overhauling the sport science department at the club because we constantly had so much payroll sitting in the stand. Is our injury treatment, rehab, sport science where it needs to be? I ask that as an open ended question because how would I know? I know I sat in a meeting with Mick Beale in August where he admitted playing people in the Boro home game who he'd been told weren't ready to play, and keeping them on for longer than he'd been advised, because he wanted a result to "get this thing going". He got that result, but Chris Willock didn't play for three weeks afterwards and has never been right IMO, and Luke Amos hasn't been seen since. Are we looking after our assets? In that circumstance in particular, no.
3 - We have deliberately in the past signed players with dodgy injury records - Clarke-Salter, Field, Thomas - because it's a way for us to get value in the market and we trust our medical team to get them right. Again, not my words, they've said this in interview - Warburton and Belk. We had an incredible run in the Covid years of nobody getting sick, or injured, which led to our best form in ten years and they got a lot of praise for that idea - I gave them heaps, because I'm a happy clapper in the club's pocket. The club were happy to talk up this policy at the time, go back and read my interview with Andy Belk. If you're signing for QPR there's something wrong with you, if there wasn't you'd be playing for a club higher up for more money, they've admitted they weren't intimidated by injury prone players because it was a way to get value. In some cases, Field barely misses a game, that's worked. But has it now backfired on them? I would suggest it has. You ditch Barbet, who played nigh on 100 consecutive games, some of them with a broken shoulder, because he's 30, on a good contract, no resale value, and you replace him with JCS who is younger, better prospect, better pedigre, more resale value. Makes sense, sure, we praised them for the ideal. But JCS record, as I wrote when we signed him, was intimidating - he's never managed 30 games in a season in his life, and won't again this year. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, sometimes it's just a fcking duck, and we've signed a few ducks this year. Is that just us doing what we have to do out of necessity? Perhaps.
4 - I think the way the injury list throughout the last four months has been weighted towards those players Beale brought here is pretty bloody stark. Much like their performances - Laird at Watford, Paal at Millwall, Tim against Reading - prior to Beale leaving and after are stark. I think it tells a story. You're always going to have more durable players and more fragile ones, but you're also always going to have players desperate to play and those less so - Ainsworth played in the same team as Marc Nygaard, and ask your mate Rowly about him...
5 - You say such behaviour would spark a "rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour." Let's play a game... hypothetically, what would such a rebellion look like? What would it look like if the players who were here before and the players Beale brought in are now divided and pissed off with each other. What would it look like, for instance, if Rob Dickie was angry about this, and thought "fck it, if that's acceptable, I'm sacking it off as well, if they can't be arsed, neither can I"? Might it look like one win in 20 games? Might it look like players we previously considered some of the best in the division now playing as they are now?
6 - Very, very frequently, players who are ruled out with injury in this team are described as minor, not long term, just a muscle injury, just a calf, nothing to be too worried about, and then disappear for literally months. Now, perhaps this a problem in communication, perhaps we're keeping it vague for the opposition. You have said today Balogun has broken his foot, but that's not what they said when he left the game against Huddersfield four months ago with "a calf problem" nor what they said in January when Dave Mc reported he would be seeing a specialist for his "calf problem". Perhaps they're lying to us, in which case I would say the PR strategy has failed because it's turned a lot of supporters against our own players. Tyler Roberts, who arrived with "a calf problem" that disrupted his pre-season, and has missed essentially the whole season with "a calf problem", walked off at Hull with "a calf problem" again. Nearly four weeks ago now Neil Critchley said in his interview pre-match "Tyler didn't feel he was quite right for Saturday". That was nearly a month ago, and that's not me saying it or making things up, that's what the manger said publicly. The same manager said after Middlesbrough that some of the injured players would "have to put their hand up to play". Again, not my words, that's the manager speaking. He certainly felt there were players who could play, and are choosing not to.
7 - You know better than most on here having played to a reasonable level, how it works. If the going is tough, if results are bad, if the crowd is angry, then there are players, weaker characters or whatever, who will hide. That little calf twinge you'd be desperate to play through if it was a cup quarter final this weekend, or you'd won five in a row, or you'd scored five in your last six, suddenly becomes a big problem if you've lost six in a row, if the crowd are on your back, if it's a long awayday. Listen to Under The Cosh, ex pros have a few beers with Parky and Browny and do big belly laughs over how they got out of this game because they thought the manager was a cnt, or ducked out of that game because they wanted to go on Minty's stag do. It happens all the time, everywhere, at every club, and I know you're bullshitting me if you tell me you don't think it's happening here now because I know you better than that and I know you get football and footballers. I'm not talking about Gareth Ainsworth running off the spiral fracture of a shin, but there are players this season who could definitely have put their hands up to play and haven't. And, again, don't take my word for it, critchley said it several times publicly.
8 - If you're out of contract this summer, hoping for a move this summer, or only on loan here and therefore hoping to either play for your parent club next season or get a decent loan next season, how keen really are you to risk jeopardising that by chucking yourself on the line to play for this team, in this form, after Beale abandoned them? If you're Ethan laird, who has now gone off in three games with nothing more than "tightness" according to the club, most recently in a Tuesday night game before we had to got to Middlesbrough on Saturday, you are looking at next season as either make or break at Man Utd or possibly a chance to break into the Prem through a loan. If you've got any slight doubt about your hamstring or anything else, are you playing for QPR now? Of course you're not. And, once more, don't take my word for it, look what happened in the lockdown fixtures - Marc Pugh, Grant Hall, Lyle Taylor, loads of out of contract players flat out refused to play for risk of ruining next year's big contract. In Taylor's case it condemned Charlton to relegation, but he got his £40k a week at Forest so happy days. People like Angel Rangel, who played regardless and blew out his achilles to end his career prematurely, are increasingly rare heroes in the modern sport. Look at that injury list - every single one of them is either coming out of contract, coming out of loan, hoping for a move, or a combination of all three.
9 - Look at the injuries they're getting. Like I say, it's never a ruptured ACL, or a broken leg. It's always "tightness" or "a calf problem". Now, again, maybe the club are lying to us, and if they are then that has failed as a PR strategy because if we go down this season some of these players are going to struggle to set foot in the place for the rest of their careers because they're increasingly blamed and hated. You say the club would discipline them, take action, medical team wouldn't have it... How? If a player comes in, says his hamstring is tight, has the massage, has the scan, nothing much wrong with it, he says it doesn't feel right, doesn't want to risk it, what you going to do? In the modern game? You're going to chuck him out there and make him play regardless? He'd sit down in the first ten minutes. The power is entirely with the players, they know it, we know it, the club know it. You try fining them for it, see what happens, see how the PFA react, it would blow up. If the player doesn't want to play, he won't play. Again, I'm surprised at you doubting this mate, because you know the game better than most. Rarely an episode of Under The Cosh goes by where the old pros don't admit doing this at some point in their career, because they hated Phil Brown, or they wanted paying up at the end of the year, or they wanted a contract somewhere else in the summer.
10 - In many ways, it's our fault. If you try and get value in the market by signing players with bad injury records then for every pat on the back you get when Sam Field proves a good 'un, you'll get a Jake Clarke-Salter. It's our fault for allowing Beale to bring his own players in. Our fault for relying on so many loan players. Our fault for making the club out to be merely a stepping stone in your career, rather than a place you should be proud to play for regardless. Our fault for focusing so much on that development and sell on, and not on character and basics of putting a team together and pride first and foremost.
In conclusion, you look at that injury list and tell me it's an unlucky coincidence? I say take a friend with you when you go to buy a used car.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Injuries. on 21:10 - Mar 5 with 1637 views | toboboly |
If Balogun has a broken bone it's cos he keeps hitting his foot with a hammer every 4 weeks |  |
| Sexy Asian dwarves wanted. |
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| Injuries. on 21:22 - Mar 5 with 1610 views | gazza1 |
| Injuries. on 20:47 - Mar 5 by Northernr |
Ok well, look, a few things here. It's an emotional time because we're all pissd off, and I lash out with the best of them as you know having had the misfortune to sit next to me for the last 25 years, so let me try and summarise where I am on this. This won't be brief, because it's me, but here I go anyway...
1 - no I don't believe they are "all feigning injury" as you say. You look at Chair and Willock when they went off and they were obviously in pain and hamstring injuries are a nightmare and so on and so forth. You'd do well to fake pneumonia, I think. So, respectfully, don't put words in my mouth, I haven't said they're "all feigning injury".
2 - I think we have a general problem with injuries at this club, and have for a while. If you don''t like me writing that, ignore me, and listen to the manager we started the season with - he said the same thing. Now, whether that's a sport science issue, a treatment issue who knows, but Beale was pissd off with it. Tony Fernandes said on record in interview a couple of seasons back that we would be overhauling the sport science department at the club because we constantly had so much payroll sitting in the stand. Is our injury treatment, rehab, sport science where it needs to be? I ask that as an open ended question because how would I know? I know I sat in a meeting with Mick Beale in August where he admitted playing people in the Boro home game who he'd been told weren't ready to play, and keeping them on for longer than he'd been advised, because he wanted a result to "get this thing going". He got that result, but Chris Willock didn't play for three weeks afterwards and has never been right IMO, and Luke Amos hasn't been seen since. Are we looking after our assets? In that circumstance in particular, no.
3 - We have deliberately in the past signed players with dodgy injury records - Clarke-Salter, Field, Thomas - because it's a way for us to get value in the market and we trust our medical team to get them right. Again, not my words, they've said this in interview - Warburton and Belk. We had an incredible run in the Covid years of nobody getting sick, or injured, which led to our best form in ten years and they got a lot of praise for that idea - I gave them heaps, because I'm a happy clapper in the club's pocket. The club were happy to talk up this policy at the time, go back and read my interview with Andy Belk. If you're signing for QPR there's something wrong with you, if there wasn't you'd be playing for a club higher up for more money, they've admitted they weren't intimidated by injury prone players because it was a way to get value. In some cases, Field barely misses a game, that's worked. But has it now backfired on them? I would suggest it has. You ditch Barbet, who played nigh on 100 consecutive games, some of them with a broken shoulder, because he's 30, on a good contract, no resale value, and you replace him with JCS who is younger, better prospect, better pedigre, more resale value. Makes sense, sure, we praised them for the ideal. But JCS record, as I wrote when we signed him, was intimidating - he's never managed 30 games in a season in his life, and won't again this year. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, sometimes it's just a fcking duck, and we've signed a few ducks this year. Is that just us doing what we have to do out of necessity? Perhaps.
4 - I think the way the injury list throughout the last four months has been weighted towards those players Beale brought here is pretty bloody stark. Much like their performances - Laird at Watford, Paal at Millwall, Tim against Reading - prior to Beale leaving and after are stark. I think it tells a story. You're always going to have more durable players and more fragile ones, but you're also always going to have players desperate to play and those less so - Ainsworth played in the same team as Marc Nygaard, and ask your mate Rowly about him...
5 - You say such behaviour would spark a "rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour." Let's play a game... hypothetically, what would such a rebellion look like? What would it look like if the players who were here before and the players Beale brought in are now divided and pissed off with each other. What would it look like, for instance, if Rob Dickie was angry about this, and thought "fck it, if that's acceptable, I'm sacking it off as well, if they can't be arsed, neither can I"? Might it look like one win in 20 games? Might it look like players we previously considered some of the best in the division now playing as they are now?
6 - Very, very frequently, players who are ruled out with injury in this team are described as minor, not long term, just a muscle injury, just a calf, nothing to be too worried about, and then disappear for literally months. Now, perhaps this a problem in communication, perhaps we're keeping it vague for the opposition. You have said today Balogun has broken his foot, but that's not what they said when he left the game against Huddersfield four months ago with "a calf problem" nor what they said in January when Dave Mc reported he would be seeing a specialist for his "calf problem". Perhaps they're lying to us, in which case I would say the PR strategy has failed because it's turned a lot of supporters against our own players. Tyler Roberts, who arrived with "a calf problem" that disrupted his pre-season, and has missed essentially the whole season with "a calf problem", walked off at Hull with "a calf problem" again. Nearly four weeks ago now Neil Critchley said in his interview pre-match "Tyler didn't feel he was quite right for Saturday". That was nearly a month ago, and that's not me saying it or making things up, that's what the manger said publicly. The same manager said after Middlesbrough that some of the injured players would "have to put their hand up to play". Again, not my words, that's the manager speaking. He certainly felt there were players who could play, and are choosing not to.
7 - You know better than most on here having played to a reasonable level, how it works. If the going is tough, if results are bad, if the crowd is angry, then there are players, weaker characters or whatever, who will hide. That little calf twinge you'd be desperate to play through if it was a cup quarter final this weekend, or you'd won five in a row, or you'd scored five in your last six, suddenly becomes a big problem if you've lost six in a row, if the crowd are on your back, if it's a long awayday. Listen to Under The Cosh, ex pros have a few beers with Parky and Browny and do big belly laughs over how they got out of this game because they thought the manager was a cnt, or ducked out of that game because they wanted to go on Minty's stag do. It happens all the time, everywhere, at every club, and I know you're bullshitting me if you tell me you don't think it's happening here now because I know you better than that and I know you get football and footballers. I'm not talking about Gareth Ainsworth running off the spiral fracture of a shin, but there are players this season who could definitely have put their hands up to play and haven't. And, again, don't take my word for it, critchley said it several times publicly.
8 - If you're out of contract this summer, hoping for a move this summer, or only on loan here and therefore hoping to either play for your parent club next season or get a decent loan next season, how keen really are you to risk jeopardising that by chucking yourself on the line to play for this team, in this form, after Beale abandoned them? If you're Ethan laird, who has now gone off in three games with nothing more than "tightness" according to the club, most recently in a Tuesday night game before we had to got to Middlesbrough on Saturday, you are looking at next season as either make or break at Man Utd or possibly a chance to break into the Prem through a loan. If you've got any slight doubt about your hamstring or anything else, are you playing for QPR now? Of course you're not. And, once more, don't take my word for it, look what happened in the lockdown fixtures - Marc Pugh, Grant Hall, Lyle Taylor, loads of out of contract players flat out refused to play for risk of ruining next year's big contract. In Taylor's case it condemned Charlton to relegation, but he got his £40k a week at Forest so happy days. People like Angel Rangel, who played regardless and blew out his achilles to end his career prematurely, are increasingly rare heroes in the modern sport. Look at that injury list - every single one of them is either coming out of contract, coming out of loan, hoping for a move, or a combination of all three.
9 - Look at the injuries they're getting. Like I say, it's never a ruptured ACL, or a broken leg. It's always "tightness" or "a calf problem". Now, again, maybe the club are lying to us, and if they are then that has failed as a PR strategy because if we go down this season some of these players are going to struggle to set foot in the place for the rest of their careers because they're increasingly blamed and hated. You say the club would discipline them, take action, medical team wouldn't have it... How? If a player comes in, says his hamstring is tight, has the massage, has the scan, nothing much wrong with it, he says it doesn't feel right, doesn't want to risk it, what you going to do? In the modern game? You're going to chuck him out there and make him play regardless? He'd sit down in the first ten minutes. The power is entirely with the players, they know it, we know it, the club know it. You try fining them for it, see what happens, see how the PFA react, it would blow up. If the player doesn't want to play, he won't play. Again, I'm surprised at you doubting this mate, because you know the game better than most. Rarely an episode of Under The Cosh goes by where the old pros don't admit doing this at some point in their career, because they hated Phil Brown, or they wanted paying up at the end of the year, or they wanted a contract somewhere else in the summer.
10 - In many ways, it's our fault. If you try and get value in the market by signing players with bad injury records then for every pat on the back you get when Sam Field proves a good 'un, you'll get a Jake Clarke-Salter. It's our fault for allowing Beale to bring his own players in. Our fault for relying on so many loan players. Our fault for making the club out to be merely a stepping stone in your career, rather than a place you should be proud to play for regardless. Our fault for focusing so much on that development and sell on, and not on character and basics of putting a team together and pride first and foremost.
In conclusion, you look at that injury list and tell me it's an unlucky coincidence? I say take a friend with you when you go to buy a used car.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Didn't men to rattle your cage that much Norf!!!! but thank you for your thoughts. It is making me think but think I will. | | | |
| Injuries. on 21:26 - Mar 5 with 1594 views | Northernr |
| Injuries. on 21:22 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
Didn't men to rattle your cage that much Norf!!!! but thank you for your thoughts. It is making me think but think I will. |
Hasn't rattled my cage mate, I respect what you think and say, known each other a long time so if you ask me a question I'll give you a proper answer. | | | |
| Injuries. on 08:48 - Mar 6 with 1375 views | QPROslo |
| Injuries. on 20:03 - Mar 5 by gazza1 |
So Norf, what you are basically saying is that they are all feigning injury and they are all not bothering to play because their 'daddy' has left and they are all basically unhappy and on strike.
Well, I do not believe that is true and if it was then there would be a rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour.....it just is not right what is being suggested. It doesn't happen, they cannot all be feigning injury.
And, if you and other posters think they are feigning injury which is not and cannot be right, then the Club would invoke disciplinary action. |
Basically I agree with you Gazza. We don't know the state of their injuries and if someone is refusing to play without the medical people at the Club seeing any medical problem, as you say the Club would surely take disciplinary action. If they are doing that though, then possibly it would be kept quiet until the end of the season. I also thought Balogun was reported as having an ankle or foot injury. If it was a broken bone in that area he could easily be out for months. I damaged the soft bone tissue inside my heel once playing football on a hard surface, not even a break, but I had to wear a special support under my heel for at least a year afterwards. | | | |
| Injuries. on 09:33 - Mar 6 with 1320 views | CamberleyR |
| Injuries. on 08:48 - Mar 6 by QPROslo |
Basically I agree with you Gazza. We don't know the state of their injuries and if someone is refusing to play without the medical people at the Club seeing any medical problem, as you say the Club would surely take disciplinary action. If they are doing that though, then possibly it would be kept quiet until the end of the season. I also thought Balogun was reported as having an ankle or foot injury. If it was a broken bone in that area he could easily be out for months. I damaged the soft bone tissue inside my heel once playing football on a hard surface, not even a break, but I had to wear a special support under my heel for at least a year afterwards. |
If that's the case with him (which I still heavily doubt), he's not going to play for us again with his contract up in the summer. We may as well try and negotiate a settlement with him for the remainder of his contract, see if we can save a few quid. Maybe then his sugar daddy might pick him up. |  |
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| Injuries. on 17:34 - Mar 6 with 1107 views | Harbour |
| Injuries. on 20:47 - Mar 5 by Northernr |
Ok well, look, a few things here. It's an emotional time because we're all pissd off, and I lash out with the best of them as you know having had the misfortune to sit next to me for the last 25 years, so let me try and summarise where I am on this. This won't be brief, because it's me, but here I go anyway...
1 - no I don't believe they are "all feigning injury" as you say. You look at Chair and Willock when they went off and they were obviously in pain and hamstring injuries are a nightmare and so on and so forth. You'd do well to fake pneumonia, I think. So, respectfully, don't put words in my mouth, I haven't said they're "all feigning injury".
2 - I think we have a general problem with injuries at this club, and have for a while. If you don''t like me writing that, ignore me, and listen to the manager we started the season with - he said the same thing. Now, whether that's a sport science issue, a treatment issue who knows, but Beale was pissd off with it. Tony Fernandes said on record in interview a couple of seasons back that we would be overhauling the sport science department at the club because we constantly had so much payroll sitting in the stand. Is our injury treatment, rehab, sport science where it needs to be? I ask that as an open ended question because how would I know? I know I sat in a meeting with Mick Beale in August where he admitted playing people in the Boro home game who he'd been told weren't ready to play, and keeping them on for longer than he'd been advised, because he wanted a result to "get this thing going". He got that result, but Chris Willock didn't play for three weeks afterwards and has never been right IMO, and Luke Amos hasn't been seen since. Are we looking after our assets? In that circumstance in particular, no.
3 - We have deliberately in the past signed players with dodgy injury records - Clarke-Salter, Field, Thomas - because it's a way for us to get value in the market and we trust our medical team to get them right. Again, not my words, they've said this in interview - Warburton and Belk. We had an incredible run in the Covid years of nobody getting sick, or injured, which led to our best form in ten years and they got a lot of praise for that idea - I gave them heaps, because I'm a happy clapper in the club's pocket. The club were happy to talk up this policy at the time, go back and read my interview with Andy Belk. If you're signing for QPR there's something wrong with you, if there wasn't you'd be playing for a club higher up for more money, they've admitted they weren't intimidated by injury prone players because it was a way to get value. In some cases, Field barely misses a game, that's worked. But has it now backfired on them? I would suggest it has. You ditch Barbet, who played nigh on 100 consecutive games, some of them with a broken shoulder, because he's 30, on a good contract, no resale value, and you replace him with JCS who is younger, better prospect, better pedigre, more resale value. Makes sense, sure, we praised them for the ideal. But JCS record, as I wrote when we signed him, was intimidating - he's never managed 30 games in a season in his life, and won't again this year. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, sometimes it's just a fcking duck, and we've signed a few ducks this year. Is that just us doing what we have to do out of necessity? Perhaps.
4 - I think the way the injury list throughout the last four months has been weighted towards those players Beale brought here is pretty bloody stark. Much like their performances - Laird at Watford, Paal at Millwall, Tim against Reading - prior to Beale leaving and after are stark. I think it tells a story. You're always going to have more durable players and more fragile ones, but you're also always going to have players desperate to play and those less so - Ainsworth played in the same team as Marc Nygaard, and ask your mate Rowly about him...
5 - You say such behaviour would spark a "rebellion with the other players that are representing the club and senior members of the Club would not be accepting that type of behaviour." Let's play a game... hypothetically, what would such a rebellion look like? What would it look like if the players who were here before and the players Beale brought in are now divided and pissed off with each other. What would it look like, for instance, if Rob Dickie was angry about this, and thought "fck it, if that's acceptable, I'm sacking it off as well, if they can't be arsed, neither can I"? Might it look like one win in 20 games? Might it look like players we previously considered some of the best in the division now playing as they are now?
6 - Very, very frequently, players who are ruled out with injury in this team are described as minor, not long term, just a muscle injury, just a calf, nothing to be too worried about, and then disappear for literally months. Now, perhaps this a problem in communication, perhaps we're keeping it vague for the opposition. You have said today Balogun has broken his foot, but that's not what they said when he left the game against Huddersfield four months ago with "a calf problem" nor what they said in January when Dave Mc reported he would be seeing a specialist for his "calf problem". Perhaps they're lying to us, in which case I would say the PR strategy has failed because it's turned a lot of supporters against our own players. Tyler Roberts, who arrived with "a calf problem" that disrupted his pre-season, and has missed essentially the whole season with "a calf problem", walked off at Hull with "a calf problem" again. Nearly four weeks ago now Neil Critchley said in his interview pre-match "Tyler didn't feel he was quite right for Saturday". That was nearly a month ago, and that's not me saying it or making things up, that's what the manger said publicly. The same manager said after Middlesbrough that some of the injured players would "have to put their hand up to play". Again, not my words, that's the manager speaking. He certainly felt there were players who could play, and are choosing not to.
7 - You know better than most on here having played to a reasonable level, how it works. If the going is tough, if results are bad, if the crowd is angry, then there are players, weaker characters or whatever, who will hide. That little calf twinge you'd be desperate to play through if it was a cup quarter final this weekend, or you'd won five in a row, or you'd scored five in your last six, suddenly becomes a big problem if you've lost six in a row, if the crowd are on your back, if it's a long awayday. Listen to Under The Cosh, ex pros have a few beers with Parky and Browny and do big belly laughs over how they got out of this game because they thought the manager was a cnt, or ducked out of that game because they wanted to go on Minty's stag do. It happens all the time, everywhere, at every club, and I know you're bullshitting me if you tell me you don't think it's happening here now because I know you better than that and I know you get football and footballers. I'm not talking about Gareth Ainsworth running off the spiral fracture of a shin, but there are players this season who could definitely have put their hands up to play and haven't. And, again, don't take my word for it, critchley said it several times publicly.
8 - If you're out of contract this summer, hoping for a move this summer, or only on loan here and therefore hoping to either play for your parent club next season or get a decent loan next season, how keen really are you to risk jeopardising that by chucking yourself on the line to play for this team, in this form, after Beale abandoned them? If you're Ethan laird, who has now gone off in three games with nothing more than "tightness" according to the club, most recently in a Tuesday night game before we had to got to Middlesbrough on Saturday, you are looking at next season as either make or break at Man Utd or possibly a chance to break into the Prem through a loan. If you've got any slight doubt about your hamstring or anything else, are you playing for QPR now? Of course you're not. And, once more, don't take my word for it, look what happened in the lockdown fixtures - Marc Pugh, Grant Hall, Lyle Taylor, loads of out of contract players flat out refused to play for risk of ruining next year's big contract. In Taylor's case it condemned Charlton to relegation, but he got his £40k a week at Forest so happy days. People like Angel Rangel, who played regardless and blew out his achilles to end his career prematurely, are increasingly rare heroes in the modern sport. Look at that injury list - every single one of them is either coming out of contract, coming out of loan, hoping for a move, or a combination of all three.
9 - Look at the injuries they're getting. Like I say, it's never a ruptured ACL, or a broken leg. It's always "tightness" or "a calf problem". Now, again, maybe the club are lying to us, and if they are then that has failed as a PR strategy because if we go down this season some of these players are going to struggle to set foot in the place for the rest of their careers because they're increasingly blamed and hated. You say the club would discipline them, take action, medical team wouldn't have it... How? If a player comes in, says his hamstring is tight, has the massage, has the scan, nothing much wrong with it, he says it doesn't feel right, doesn't want to risk it, what you going to do? In the modern game? You're going to chuck him out there and make him play regardless? He'd sit down in the first ten minutes. The power is entirely with the players, they know it, we know it, the club know it. You try fining them for it, see what happens, see how the PFA react, it would blow up. If the player doesn't want to play, he won't play. Again, I'm surprised at you doubting this mate, because you know the game better than most. Rarely an episode of Under The Cosh goes by where the old pros don't admit doing this at some point in their career, because they hated Phil Brown, or they wanted paying up at the end of the year, or they wanted a contract somewhere else in the summer.
10 - In many ways, it's our fault. If you try and get value in the market by signing players with bad injury records then for every pat on the back you get when Sam Field proves a good 'un, you'll get a Jake Clarke-Salter. It's our fault for allowing Beale to bring his own players in. Our fault for relying on so many loan players. Our fault for making the club out to be merely a stepping stone in your career, rather than a place you should be proud to play for regardless. Our fault for focusing so much on that development and sell on, and not on character and basics of putting a team together and pride first and foremost.
In conclusion, you look at that injury list and tell me it's an unlucky coincidence? I say take a friend with you when you go to buy a used car.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Thanks Norf did not realise the Amos and Willock injuries stemmed back to the boro game. The club I think I read or saw somewhere they considered if the players were the “right sort” before signing this philosophy looks to have gone out the window with this latest bunch of signings. Your last sentence summed it up perfectly..it’s not all about sell on value character and pride are as important. a big learning lesson for the club I am praying we do not pay an heavy price with relegation for these mistakes. | | | |
| Injuries. on 17:53 - Mar 6 with 1098 views | PunteR |
| Injuries. on 16:43 - Mar 6 by PinnerPaul |
Thanks for that, why not the insult the guy who actually posted what he was actually told about the injury as opposed to your opinion.
In fact why insult another fan full stop?
Another on the ignore list - sigh |
Uh oh.. looks like I got a red card from the resident referee... lol
Pinners post was a smarmy provoking insinuation towards myself and others. Making out I was just looking to blame the club for something unwarranted.
Those pesky QPR fans, demanding answers to why the club is getting relegated. Not the first time Pinners done that either.
On the ignore list.. ? sigh!.
Get over yourself mate( if you can still read this.)
Anyway , I think Norf put into words a thousand times better than I could and summed up our ridiculous situation. | |
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