| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling 12:47 - Jul 16 with 6402 views | aleanddale |
Looks like the ISIS Bride will be given a reprieve.
Latest ruling today is that she should be given a chance to bring the appeal in person to the UK.
It should be so easy... Look we know your young but this is serious. We cant stop you going and if its what you want to do be our guest! BUT you will be giving up your British citizenship and you will NEVER set foot in this country ever again whatever your circumstances.
We are so multi cultural and that is to be applauded and welcome as we have plenty of non white British people & immigrant asylum seekers who do wonderful things for this counrty. Any person though travelling to an area that is ISIS controlled needs to know there will be grave consequence for these actions. |  | | |  |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:03 - Jul 17 with 1740 views | isitme |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:10 - Jul 17 with 1723 views | isitme |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 09:58 - Jul 17 by rochdaleriddler |
Ouch! I don’t understand why hundreds of others have returned having not had their citizenship revoked if it is to do with national security. |
So do I. Surely everyone who goes off to join ISIS should have their citizenship revoked and not be allowed back in the country? They can become citizens of whatever teritory ISIS holds at that time, which thankfully now is not very much.
In reality the reason why they haven't is that they can only do so when an individual holds/is eligble for dual citizenship. See the case below about Jack Letts who has Canadian citizenship.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49385376
Why has there not been the same uproar about him losing his citizenship? [Post edited 17 Jul 2020 10:24]
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:58 - Jul 17 with 1677 views | rod_leach |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:10 - Jul 17 by isitme |
So do I. Surely everyone who goes off to join ISIS should have their citizenship revoked and not be allowed back in the country? They can become citizens of whatever teritory ISIS holds at that time, which thankfully now is not very much.
In reality the reason why they haven't is that they can only do so when an individual holds/is eligble for dual citizenship. See the case below about Jack Letts who has Canadian citizenship.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49385376
Why has there not been the same uproar about him losing his citizenship? [Post edited 17 Jul 2020 10:24]
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Probably because he was legally an adult when he went and already had dual nationality, so it wasn't illegal to strip him of his UK citizenship |  | | |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:00 - Jul 17 with 1633 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:03 - Jul 17 by isitme |
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As a leftie I can assure you I have little sympathy with Her, and nothing but contempt for child groomers |  |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:15 - Jul 17 with 1617 views | Ancoats_Blue |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:03 - Jul 17 by isitme |
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What a load of shite. You don’t have to pick a side and denounce one abhorrence over the other you know. Who is actually doing that?
15 year old white girls being sexually groomed by Muslim men. Bad.
15 year old Asian girls being politically and religiously groomed by Muslim men. Also bad.
An example is being made of her, fair enough. But who are the recruiters? Who’s peddling evil to children and sending them off to be underage brides in the Middle East? The real aim in all this should be to find out. |  | | |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:32 - Jul 17 with 1584 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 10:03 - Jul 17 by isitme |
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Can I ask you what the purpose was of posting this? Was it to prove that you’re more outraged than everybody else? That it’s the fault of people who you think are not as outraged as you? Why do you have to turn this into a divisive issue between who’s more outraged than the other?
Nobody is condoning what she’s done and everybody finds what she’s done is abhorrent. However, just posting rage doesn’t really get us anywhere does it? Why don’t you let people discuss what is a tricky legal and security situation? | |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:53 - Jul 17 with 1558 views | isitme |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:32 - Jul 17 by BigDaveMyCock |
Can I ask you what the purpose was of posting this? Was it to prove that you’re more outraged than everybody else? That it’s the fault of people who you think are not as outraged as you? Why do you have to turn this into a divisive issue between who’s more outraged than the other?
Nobody is condoning what she’s done and everybody finds what she’s done is abhorrent. However, just posting rage doesn’t really get us anywhere does it? Why don’t you let people discuss what is a tricky legal and security situation? |
I posted it as I thought it was an interesting perspective on what is, as evidenced by this thread a very polarising and complex issue. That's not to say I necessarily agree with what the author says. It's a perspective to be debated and questioned. Ancoats has already provided a well reasoned response. Personally I think as is his way, he has been deliberately provocative, but in places does raise some valid points. I also think that this board is not really a hotbed of the 'woke left' and that posters such as yourself and Riddler are more traditional left.
I have already stated my position on the issue earlier in the thread, which some will share and others won't. [Post edited 17 Jul 2020 12:54]
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:57 - Jul 17 with 1549 views | judd |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 09:13 - Jul 17 by TipperaryDale |
Fook off to where? |
Not particularly bothered. |  |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 13:03 - Jul 17 with 1537 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:53 - Jul 17 by isitme |
I posted it as I thought it was an interesting perspective on what is, as evidenced by this thread a very polarising and complex issue. That's not to say I necessarily agree with what the author says. It's a perspective to be debated and questioned. Ancoats has already provided a well reasoned response. Personally I think as is his way, he has been deliberately provocative, but in places does raise some valid points. I also think that this board is not really a hotbed of the 'woke left' and that posters such as yourself and Riddler are more traditional left.
I have already stated my position on the issue earlier in the thread, which some will share and others won't. [Post edited 17 Jul 2020 12:54]
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But it’s not though is it? It’s just a provocative rant seeking to stir up racial and religious tension. Nobody is shedding tears for her and nobody is comparing her situation to those poor girls who were groomed. It’s a ludicrous comparison that only the author of the post, and nobody else, is making.
I’m genuinely surprised you can’t see that the whole point of this post is to stir up tension. | |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 13:08 - Jul 17 with 1526 views | jonahwhereru |
The government view of treating IS terrorists is the only thing I actually agree with Donald Trump on. He had the foresight to see it is simple unrealistic to expect the war torn country and mad leadership of Azad that is Syria to deal appropriately with IS. Remember it was Azad who realeased a shed load of fundamentals and armed them to deal with a little local difficulty for him. Then lost control of it when later they fought the regime.
Trump wanted all IS prisoners back, and I know the US has hell holes where they can control their intake. But he is right each country needs to deal with it’s own citizens who fought for IS. Closing our eyes as a nation and saying we don’t want to deal with our own shite will do nothing to bring about the end of the Is force and idles. It’s a massive challenge even if countries man up and do the unpalatable, it’s impossible if they remain in denial.
With Begum what gives us the right the cite Bangladesh as an option, and please don’t say the law. She is a product of a British system, she is ours to deal with. Spare a thought for her parents, who had nothing but distress, anguish and unjustified hatred to deal with for the last 5 years. Not to mention the death of 3 grandchildren. | | | |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 15:51 - Jul 17 with 1462 views | SuddenLad |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 13:08 - Jul 17 by jonahwhereru |
The government view of treating IS terrorists is the only thing I actually agree with Donald Trump on. He had the foresight to see it is simple unrealistic to expect the war torn country and mad leadership of Azad that is Syria to deal appropriately with IS. Remember it was Azad who realeased a shed load of fundamentals and armed them to deal with a little local difficulty for him. Then lost control of it when later they fought the regime.
Trump wanted all IS prisoners back, and I know the US has hell holes where they can control their intake. But he is right each country needs to deal with it’s own citizens who fought for IS. Closing our eyes as a nation and saying we don’t want to deal with our own shite will do nothing to bring about the end of the Is force and idles. It’s a massive challenge even if countries man up and do the unpalatable, it’s impossible if they remain in denial.
With Begum what gives us the right the cite Bangladesh as an option, and please don’t say the law. She is a product of a British system, she is ours to deal with. Spare a thought for her parents, who had nothing but distress, anguish and unjustified hatred to deal with for the last 5 years. Not to mention the death of 3 grandchildren. |
Difficult as it is for her family and friends, however tough it has been (and it has), none of that is relevant and shouldn't cloud the issue.
Begum has been granted permission (pending appeal) only to come to the UK to fight her case for citizenship. She has not at this stage been granted citizenship.
Yes, she is a product of a system that enabled her to be recruited by IS and all that took place here, in the UK. What we do with her, as a terrorist is a difficult question with no easy or obvious solution.
The UK Government understandably doesn't want her back here. She is a known terrorist. She will no doubt claim that she was only a 'vulnerable child' when recruited and had her head filled with a toxic ideology and she didn't realise the gravity of the situation. Her lawyers will allege that she should have been given 'greater protection' by the UK and it's various organisations, Police, social services, schools etc., etc., - the usual predictable targets and sob stories.
The UK Government will argue that she breached every possible condition of her terms of residence and that she was rightly stripped of her citizenship.
Both arguments may have some merit and will be debated and discussed furiously by some of the best legal brains in the country. If she stays here, her life will be in danger forever. She will become a serious, and in their view, a legitimate target for extremists who will be bent on revenge. She will be a prize scalp. It will cost many hundreds of thousands of pounds to get her a new identity, to rehouse her at sufficiently secure accommodation and to provide anonymity for her for the rest of her life. Why should we be responsible, as taxpayers, for the horrendous costs of all that?
We shouldn't, but even if she is ultimately refused permission to reside here, the UK Government will probably still have to arrange with her chosen host country, the costs of the same requirements to keep her safe from harm. On the other hand, she may not be accepted elsewhere.
Taxpayers will still pick up the tab, whichever outcome is chosen. Emotions, sob-stories and pity shouldn't have any bearing on what happens. It needs cold, clear decisions.
Personally, I don't want her here at all and I don't think that as a result of her actions, she has any right to remain, but the reality is there are many others like her waiting in the wings, enjoying all the freedoms our society has to offer them, whilst they plot and plan to destroy us.
The HR lawyers are in for a bumper payday, whilst the rest of us have no say about who should be here. We'll have to like it or lump it, whatever our views. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 16:35 - Jul 17 with 1423 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 15:51 - Jul 17 by SuddenLad |
Difficult as it is for her family and friends, however tough it has been (and it has), none of that is relevant and shouldn't cloud the issue.
Begum has been granted permission (pending appeal) only to come to the UK to fight her case for citizenship. She has not at this stage been granted citizenship.
Yes, she is a product of a system that enabled her to be recruited by IS and all that took place here, in the UK. What we do with her, as a terrorist is a difficult question with no easy or obvious solution.
The UK Government understandably doesn't want her back here. She is a known terrorist. She will no doubt claim that she was only a 'vulnerable child' when recruited and had her head filled with a toxic ideology and she didn't realise the gravity of the situation. Her lawyers will allege that she should have been given 'greater protection' by the UK and it's various organisations, Police, social services, schools etc., etc., - the usual predictable targets and sob stories.
The UK Government will argue that she breached every possible condition of her terms of residence and that she was rightly stripped of her citizenship.
Both arguments may have some merit and will be debated and discussed furiously by some of the best legal brains in the country. If she stays here, her life will be in danger forever. She will become a serious, and in their view, a legitimate target for extremists who will be bent on revenge. She will be a prize scalp. It will cost many hundreds of thousands of pounds to get her a new identity, to rehouse her at sufficiently secure accommodation and to provide anonymity for her for the rest of her life. Why should we be responsible, as taxpayers, for the horrendous costs of all that?
We shouldn't, but even if she is ultimately refused permission to reside here, the UK Government will probably still have to arrange with her chosen host country, the costs of the same requirements to keep her safe from harm. On the other hand, she may not be accepted elsewhere.
Taxpayers will still pick up the tab, whichever outcome is chosen. Emotions, sob-stories and pity shouldn't have any bearing on what happens. It needs cold, clear decisions.
Personally, I don't want her here at all and I don't think that as a result of her actions, she has any right to remain, but the reality is there are many others like her waiting in the wings, enjoying all the freedoms our society has to offer them, whilst they plot and plan to destroy us.
The HR lawyers are in for a bumper payday, whilst the rest of us have no say about who should be here. We'll have to like it or lump it, whatever our views. |
Lawyers always make a shilling | |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:35 - Jul 17 with 1380 views | TVOS1907 |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 12:57 - Jul 17 by judd |
Not particularly bothered. |
Well it's a long way to Tipperary, apparently. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:37 - Jul 17 with 1375 views | judd |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:35 - Jul 17 by TVOS1907 |
Well it's a long way to Tipperary, apparently. |
Wouldn't send her to Ireland tbh.
Well, perhaps Ballymun.
Or Craggy Island. | |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:38 - Jul 17 with 1375 views | SuddenLad |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:35 - Jul 17 by TVOS1907 |
Well it's a long way to Tipperary, apparently. |
Where from? | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:41 - Jul 17 with 1368 views | blackdogblue |
Send the SAS in, take her out & blame the death on Covid then we can get back to talking about football (if there not too busy planning a hit on Maxwell) |  |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:44 - Jul 17 with 1354 views | TVOS1907 |
| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 17:38 - Jul 17 by SuddenLad |
Where from? |
London | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Shamima Begum the ISIS Bride New High Court Ruling on 22:47 - Jul 17 with 1267 views | dalenumber2 |
Hmmm, when a white girl is groomed, people are outraged at those who have taken advantage of a vulnerable youngster. Shamina Begum was groomed as a 15 yr old, and after, effectively used as a sex-slave, and has now lost her third child. Our government’s response seems to want to persecute her instead of seeking to rehabilitate her. |  | | |
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