| McClaren incoming on 10:34 - May 2 with 4423 views | QPR_John |
Its all very well saying Holloway must stay but he only has a year left on his contract. I think many people simply want Holloway to stay for as long as he wants. So what will the position next season will you want the club to give him a new three year contract and if not why. Do you want an improvement or would you be happy if we were mid table. Let's for a minute take the emotion out of the debate. |  | |  |
| McClaren incoming on 10:39 - May 2 with 4377 views | LunarJetman |
Isn't McClaren in the running for the Sunderland job? |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 10:41 - May 2 with 4372 views | daveB |
| McClaren incoming on 10:34 - May 2 by QPR_John |
Its all very well saying Holloway must stay but he only has a year left on his contract. I think many people simply want Holloway to stay for as long as he wants. So what will the position next season will you want the club to give him a new three year contract and if not why. Do you want an improvement or would you be happy if we were mid table. Let's for a minute take the emotion out of the debate. |
I don't think he should be here forever, I think he's done enough to get another year and then see how he gets on but can understand why a change might happen. My bigger issue would be with hiring Mcclaren as his replacement. |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 10:42 - May 2 with 4368 views | Northernr |
| McClaren incoming on 10:34 - May 2 by QPR_John |
Its all very well saying Holloway must stay but he only has a year left on his contract. I think many people simply want Holloway to stay for as long as he wants. So what will the position next season will you want the club to give him a new three year contract and if not why. Do you want an improvement or would you be happy if we were mid table. Let's for a minute take the emotion out of the debate. |
Ok, what did we want this season? His job was to hack into the wage bil,, get rid of more big earners, blood youngsters, and not get relegated doing it. Done that, and more, never been in relegation trouble, actually in the end looked pretty good with lots of the kids coming into the team and playing well.
Next season we need to go on a bit further, fine, set him that target, and if he doesn't do it then his contract is up and off he goes. To fulfil the remit and get the shove anyway (if that's what's going to happen) seems harsh. Maybe he has decided to take a step back, but from what I gather it's the board that aren't sure.
I'm very, very iffy on McClaren if it's going to be him.
The only positive I will say is we've broken the cycle of changing managers midseason all the time, and now is exactly the right time to be assessing whether we have the right manager for the following year - at least they're doing that right. |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 10:42 - May 2 with 4364 views | Dorse |
I want Ollie to stay. Much like Colin, he has come in at a critical juncture and done everything he was asked to do. If they are bringing in Schteve, please let it be as well as rather than in replacement to Ollie. |  |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| McClaren incoming on 10:56 - May 2 with 4297 views | daveB |
| McClaren incoming on 10:42 - May 2 by Northernr |
Ok, what did we want this season? His job was to hack into the wage bil,, get rid of more big earners, blood youngsters, and not get relegated doing it. Done that, and more, never been in relegation trouble, actually in the end looked pretty good with lots of the kids coming into the team and playing well.
Next season we need to go on a bit further, fine, set him that target, and if he doesn't do it then his contract is up and off he goes. To fulfil the remit and get the shove anyway (if that's what's going to happen) seems harsh. Maybe he has decided to take a step back, but from what I gather it's the board that aren't sure.
I'm very, very iffy on McClaren if it's going to be him.
The only positive I will say is we've broken the cycle of changing managers midseason all the time, and now is exactly the right time to be assessing whether we have the right manager for the following year - at least they're doing that right. |
If he's being pushed a week after his Mum died, I'm sorry but that is disgusting from the club. I know that shouldn't come into it but just seems a heartless decision.
Will be the second time he has come in and done a very good job and been tossed aside to get us to the next level, Worked out well last time, we were almost relegated in the next two seasons and never finished higher than Holloway managed until Warnock came in four years later. | | | |
| McClaren incoming on 11:05 - May 2 with 4245 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
I know there is the Olly haters out there that will never change their mine but if you think McClaren is better you are deluded.
I'm in no doubt he is a journeyman like so many others, want to spend, not his squad not his staff and endless excuses. had big budgets at a number of clubs and failed.
It's a big fat NO from me. [Post edited 2 May 2018 11:08]
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| McClaren incoming on 11:21 - May 2 with 4134 views | swisscottage |
I'd be really disappointed if Olly was pushed. I think he's done a good job this season with significant defensive injuries in the first half of the season, and lack of striking talent he's managed to steady the ship, never really been in any danger of relegation and we're seeing the most exciting set of youngsters come through since the likes of Allen and Goddard in my opinion.
Saturday's match reminded me of our 5-1 thrashing of Coventry when Allen scored a hat-trick on his debut when we were as good as relegated. I may have only been 10 years old but its still one of those matches that you remember.
since the turn of the year we Won 9 Lost 9 and drawn 2 in the league. That's just shy of play-off form, whilst bringing through a bevvy of youngsters. If anyone says that is not a job well done and deserving of a chance to see through next season what he's started this season, then quite frankly they're the sort of person that can never be satisfied.
Yes there's the odd perplexing team selection, however those selections are just as likely to surprise as not, with Saturday being a case in point.
That being said, if Olly was to go, I wouldn't be too disappointed with the Brolly Wally.
I though the job he did in his first season with Derby was excellent with a team of exciting youngsters, however it tailed off in the following season as expectation grew and they started to fork out more money. I think he's the sort of manager, like Olly, where he does his best work when he hasn't got any money to spend but instead can concentrate on developing what is now an extremely young team. allowing Les, Penrice and Johnson to concentrate on player recruitment. | | | |
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| McClaren incoming on 11:26 - May 2 with 4090 views | PeterHucker |
| McClaren incoming on 10:42 - May 2 by Northernr |
Ok, what did we want this season? His job was to hack into the wage bil,, get rid of more big earners, blood youngsters, and not get relegated doing it. Done that, and more, never been in relegation trouble, actually in the end looked pretty good with lots of the kids coming into the team and playing well.
Next season we need to go on a bit further, fine, set him that target, and if he doesn't do it then his contract is up and off he goes. To fulfil the remit and get the shove anyway (if that's what's going to happen) seems harsh. Maybe he has decided to take a step back, but from what I gather it's the board that aren't sure.
I'm very, very iffy on McClaren if it's going to be him.
The only positive I will say is we've broken the cycle of changing managers midseason all the time, and now is exactly the right time to be assessing whether we have the right manager for the following year - at least they're doing that right. |
If Olly has decided to step away then fair enough.
If he's being pushed then I think that's a pity. He has delivered on what he was asked to do this season, there are signs of a really good team being built and I think we'd improve our League position again next year with him in charge.
If he's going though, not sure about McLaren. Would like to see Ainsworth given the job but he might feel that now is not the right time for him to leave Wycombe? |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 11:28 - May 2 with 4082 views | Phildo |
| McClaren incoming on 11:05 - May 2 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
I know there is the Olly haters out there that will never change their mine but if you think McClaren is better you are deluded.
I'm in no doubt he is a journeyman like so many others, want to spend, not his squad not his staff and endless excuses. had big budgets at a number of clubs and failed.
It's a big fat NO from me. [Post edited 2 May 2018 11:08]
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To a certain extent they are all short termers now- who thinks ' I will go into football management for job security' these days. It seems whatever they accomplish or achieve at a club 3, 4, 5 poor results and they are on the way out. There are a lot of good candidates in football who have no interest in management now and are they are seeking out roles as academy directors or other more stable positions as they have families to support. That makes the manager pool self selecting and explains why Hughes Pardew Pulis keep falling into jobs. Once they hit that level it is lucrative to do a job for a year and get a big sacking pay off.
In Olly we have a club man- no one can claim he does not get upset when we lose. It is worrying sometimes as he seems volatile but he has a big heart for the club. Whatever happens next I wish him well and have nothing but fondness for him.
Once the article appeared in the paper suggesting he was under threat I thought he was in trouble but no point adding to the mill.
It looks to me as if we will have a first team coach with the DOF making bigger decisions for now-until the next re design |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 11:28 - May 2 with 4082 views | ElHoop |
I can't believe that we'd appoint McClaren as manager without going through a proper process, so for me the story is unlikely to be true. If he's coming in as assistant and/or coach then it's more likely to be true, and that might well be a good idea if everyone is comfortable with it. I think that Hoos might resign if we just dump Ollie and recruit McClaren with no process. How can Hoos take the club forward if that is how it works? Wouldn't he feel inclined to say 'sod this for a game of soldiers'? |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 11:33 - May 2 with 4052 views | DesertBoot |
I think with McClaren there would be another Hughes and Redknapp air of "I'm doing you a massive favour being here" around his appointment. |  |
| Wish I could be like David Watts |
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| McClaren incoming on 11:50 - May 2 with 3960 views | Mick_S |
| McClaren incoming on 11:33 - May 2 by DesertBoot |
I think with McClaren there would be another Hughes and Redknapp air of "I'm doing you a massive favour being here" around his appointment. |
Shometimes he talks Dutch/Hollandish. [Post edited 2 May 2018 11:56]
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| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| McClaren incoming on 12:00 - May 2 with 3900 views | rsonist |
| McClaren incoming on 11:33 - May 2 by DesertBoot |
I think with McClaren there would be another Hughes and Redknapp air of "I'm doing you a massive favour being here" around his appointment. |
Maybe when his stock was high and he still looked a very poor man's Kennedy. I doubt he'll be anything other than grateful for the opportunity at this point. |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 12:03 - May 2 with 3886 views | TheChef |
| McClaren incoming on 10:18 - May 2 by Hayesender |
I could be wrong here, but wasn't this rumour started by a fake Twitter account? |
Exactly, where does this come from? Is the bloke who posted on WATRB a typical 'in the know' WUM, or does he have previous for being accurate on these things?
Not seen anything as yet from Dave Mc, and he usually ends up being right with his QPR stories. |  |
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| McClaren incoming on 12:05 - May 2 with 3882 views | Antti_Heinola |
| McClaren incoming on 11:33 - May 2 by DesertBoot |
I think with McClaren there would be another Hughes and Redknapp air of "I'm doing you a massive favour being here" around his appointment. |
I don't think so. He seems a humble guy liked by players and is obviously a very good coach, I suspect particularly with younger players.
But I'm with the majority here. After the Forest game, I absolutely thought come the end of the season a change was needed. But since then he's totally turned things round and there are things genuinely to be excited about next season. He's earned the right to coach us next year, and if it goes tits up, then look at replacing him, or, if we meander through the season and finish 15th-18th again, his contract is up and it's time for someone else to have a go.
McClaren I don't think would do a bad job - he's competent and his teams play good football. I'm not anti him at all. He had weird spells at Derby, but Newcastle was a tough one - it's taken a brilliant manager to go in there and turn things around. Who knows. Worrying that Clive thinks there may be legs to this. As others have said, if the stress is too much for Ollie, then I'd rather he left and kept himself healthy and then McClaren would be a sensible replacement. But sacking Ollie for McClaren... doesn't seem fair, or worth it.
Sometimes teams do sack managers doing relatively well - for all the fun poked at Rodgers, Liverpool were doing better than they had done in years under him, but he went because they knew they could get Klopp. Now if there genuinely was a cast-iron great young manager available, then the Board would be right to at least look at it. But that's not McClaren. |  |
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| McClaren incoming on 12:19 - May 2 with 3808 views | RANGERS4EVER |
5 pages of this- anyone know whether this has any actual truth?
Is there concrete evidence, because a guy saying it on WATRB is as truthful to me as a story in the Mirror |  |
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| McClaren incoming on 12:25 - May 2 with 3771 views | WatfordR |
| McClaren incoming on 12:05 - May 2 by Antti_Heinola |
I don't think so. He seems a humble guy liked by players and is obviously a very good coach, I suspect particularly with younger players.
But I'm with the majority here. After the Forest game, I absolutely thought come the end of the season a change was needed. But since then he's totally turned things round and there are things genuinely to be excited about next season. He's earned the right to coach us next year, and if it goes tits up, then look at replacing him, or, if we meander through the season and finish 15th-18th again, his contract is up and it's time for someone else to have a go.
McClaren I don't think would do a bad job - he's competent and his teams play good football. I'm not anti him at all. He had weird spells at Derby, but Newcastle was a tough one - it's taken a brilliant manager to go in there and turn things around. Who knows. Worrying that Clive thinks there may be legs to this. As others have said, if the stress is too much for Ollie, then I'd rather he left and kept himself healthy and then McClaren would be a sensible replacement. But sacking Ollie for McClaren... doesn't seem fair, or worth it.
Sometimes teams do sack managers doing relatively well - for all the fun poked at Rodgers, Liverpool were doing better than they had done in years under him, but he went because they knew they could get Klopp. Now if there genuinely was a cast-iron great young manager available, then the Board would be right to at least look at it. But that's not McClaren. |
Really just making posts here with points as I think of them, since no one seems to know exactly what may or may not be happening.
Just wondering though whether people's views might change if the Board are looking at Olly and thinking they might need to make a decision for the sake of Olly's health and wellbeing?
I mean I'm obviously not itk, but let's say it's apparent to the people around Olly, who know him, maybe even some of his own family, that he is under increasing strain from what has happened to him personally recently. Let's say he refuses to acknowledge it. Does it not perhaps then fall on his employers to take the decision away from him for his own good?
Some of the posters here may know exactly what is going on. Most have no real clue,and are jumping to conclusions, in many cases to support their own opinions of TF, LF or whoever. But if you are not party to what's actually going on, then it's all to easy to come to conclusions that don't represent the reality of what may be any number of factors behind decisions that are made. |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 12:29 - May 2 with 3745 views | Monahoop |
| McClaren incoming on 12:05 - May 2 by Antti_Heinola |
I don't think so. He seems a humble guy liked by players and is obviously a very good coach, I suspect particularly with younger players.
But I'm with the majority here. After the Forest game, I absolutely thought come the end of the season a change was needed. But since then he's totally turned things round and there are things genuinely to be excited about next season. He's earned the right to coach us next year, and if it goes tits up, then look at replacing him, or, if we meander through the season and finish 15th-18th again, his contract is up and it's time for someone else to have a go.
McClaren I don't think would do a bad job - he's competent and his teams play good football. I'm not anti him at all. He had weird spells at Derby, but Newcastle was a tough one - it's taken a brilliant manager to go in there and turn things around. Who knows. Worrying that Clive thinks there may be legs to this. As others have said, if the stress is too much for Ollie, then I'd rather he left and kept himself healthy and then McClaren would be a sensible replacement. But sacking Ollie for McClaren... doesn't seem fair, or worth it.
Sometimes teams do sack managers doing relatively well - for all the fun poked at Rodgers, Liverpool were doing better than they had done in years under him, but he went because they knew they could get Klopp. Now if there genuinely was a cast-iron great young manager available, then the Board would be right to at least look at it. But that's not McClaren. |
Got to agree with all that.
Rumour or not, it will be sad to see Ollie go, so long as it not the route of a feckless sacking just to bring in someone with a relatively big name tag to the club. Someone like Rodgers would be fine, but no chance there. If there is a replacement inbound, then I would accept McClaren, though I'm not a great admirer of him. At least Pardew's name hasn't been connected to the club. Has it? |  |
| There aint half been some clever bastards. |
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| McClaren incoming on 12:34 - May 2 with 3707 views | RBlock |
| McClaren incoming on 12:03 - May 2 by TheChef |
Exactly, where does this come from? Is the bloke who posted on WATRB a typical 'in the know' WUM, or does he have previous for being accurate on these things?
Not seen anything as yet from Dave Mc, and he usually ends up being right with his QPR stories. |
Have a look on his twitter account. He is up there discussing it with people - apparently Les, TF, LH in agreement that McClaren would be a decent choice, and it's 50-50 whether IH stays or not. |  | | |
| McClaren incoming on 12:44 - May 2 with 3633 views | PinnerPaul |
| McClaren incoming on 12:34 - May 2 by RBlock |
Have a look on his twitter account. He is up there discussing it with people - apparently Les, TF, LH in agreement that McClaren would be a decent choice, and it's 50-50 whether IH stays or not. |
How anyone would know what TF, LF and LH views on McClaren are?!!!!!!!!!!! | | | |
| McClaren incoming on 12:55 - May 2 with 3552 views | RBlock |
| McClaren incoming on 12:44 - May 2 by PinnerPaul |
How anyone would know what TF, LF and LH views on McClaren are?!!!!!!!!!!! |
No idea, but that is clearly what Dave Mc is saying mate, and he tends to have his finger on the pulse. | | | |
| McClaren incoming on 13:04 - May 2 with 3488 views | bosh67 |
No one has asked the question could the club afford McClaren? Given that we are trying to run on a shoestring until the FFP is worked out one way or another on appeal, why would the board change a manager who they can afford and who still has a year of contract to run. If Olly was pushed he would still need to be paid off so I think this may all be a bit of kiddology and misquoting of TF.
TF said they would be asking if Ollie was happy with the board and its expectations going forward and that he made a mistake ditching Warnock. Given that we were quite comfortable and that in his own barking mad way Ollie managed to cut the wage bill, play the kids and do all this amidst personal crisis shows the mark of the man really. Without senior pros here junior players will look even more for seniors who have the club at heart and number one will be Ollie.
I can only imagine Ollie going if he needs a personal break from management or if he feels the expectations of the club next season are unrealistic. Surely the goal has to be that the team progresses in the top half of the table, creates a bigger pool of u23 talent coming through and fixes a more attacking style from the first team down through the levels. Whether we like him or not Ollie probably is best placed to carry on that mission for now. |  |
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| McClaren incoming on 13:25 - May 2 with 3357 views | A40Bosh |
| McClaren incoming on 12:25 - May 2 by WatfordR |
Really just making posts here with points as I think of them, since no one seems to know exactly what may or may not be happening.
Just wondering though whether people's views might change if the Board are looking at Olly and thinking they might need to make a decision for the sake of Olly's health and wellbeing?
I mean I'm obviously not itk, but let's say it's apparent to the people around Olly, who know him, maybe even some of his own family, that he is under increasing strain from what has happened to him personally recently. Let's say he refuses to acknowledge it. Does it not perhaps then fall on his employers to take the decision away from him for his own good?
Some of the posters here may know exactly what is going on. Most have no real clue,and are jumping to conclusions, in many cases to support their own opinions of TF, LF or whoever. But if you are not party to what's actually going on, then it's all to easy to come to conclusions that don't represent the reality of what may be any number of factors behind decisions that are made. |
The older and more experienced I get I am more of the impression now that the pot on top of the cooker that is more likely to explode is the one where there is not constant stream coming out of the sides of the lid.
Ollie is emotional, verbose and it is normally evident when he is overjoyed, reasonably happy or clearly upset. Normally these are the people who when letting off steam are the ones who can often handle it in the long run. His previous with Palace may have been more an acceptance that he was not up to the job rather than some emotional meltdown. So I would be surprised if the Board and LF & LH did not know what he is like behind the scenes and felt they needed to pull the plug on his behalf for his health.
Giving him a three year cushion but with very firm 2 year goals may mean that for a number of weeks prior to the loss of WIlkens and then his mum, the conversations may have been ongoing with IH about this thoughts on needing to take things to the next level in year 3 and getting his buy in that things need ramping up in terms of progress.
As I said before, I don't care what TF says publicly, I suspect that behind the long haul sentiments the board and investors want back in to the promised land. They have accepted a couple of years of rebuilding and adjustment to life under the threat off FFP but what they will want now is someone who can take the Freeman, Symthe, Eze, Manning, Shidipo, Lumley, BOS et al to the point where they can hit the playoffs this term without having to spend much on additions to the squad during the summer.
I think Ollie has been asking for time (publicly when talking/ranting post-matches) and stating that the chopping and changing is a result of us having to adjust our 11 each week in an attempt to counter what he feels the other side's game will present week by week as we have not got to the stage where we wil simply impose our game (a la Man City) on the opposition regardless of who they are. Hence why our away form is so dreadful apart from the odd occasion where his approach/tactics has paid off.
So I think TF and the board what us imposing ourselves on the oppositon and tearing the division apart in the same way Fulham pressed the accelorator after Christmas and they are talking/have talked to Ollie about his ability to do that. Perhaps Ollie is now at the stage where he feels he cannot handle the additional remit because of where he is emotionally, where as another manager may simply pour all their energy and emotion in to their job to bury their hurt.
After listening to the excellent TF Open All R's podcast, I straight away picked up on the TF comments and thought that Ollie was potentially on his way out, so this rumour, whether true or not, does not surprise me.
Perhaps the missing link is the person with the ability to coach the existing and developing squad but they cant afford to have both from a financial perspective or a management set up perspective.
If Ollie is going I woud like to think that it will be public before Sunday so that the fans going up to Leeds get a chance to thank him for a thankless task he has undertaken and not really left us any worse than what we were like - and if you like, has actually made progress, albeit not as fast as some fans and perhaps the board would like. |  |
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| McClaren incoming on 13:26 - May 2 with 3342 views | WestbourneR |
| McClaren incoming on 02:07 - May 2 by timcocking |
For the record, when people say "he's a good number two but not a manager" i usually roll my eyes somewhat. That's more media speak that isn't real as often as not.
It might be true, but none of us or the journalists would know and it's a very unlikely thing. That's just a lazy line they write. Oh, he's not been successful, he's obviously a good number two can't be number one." The only difference in the roles is you are responsible for picking the team.
Just sometimes things work, sometimes they don't. Very rarely could a man who could one not do the other. |
Well maybe stop rolling your eyes and think about it Tim.
'The only difference in the roles is you are responsible for picking the team.' - wrong.
There are many differences between a number two and the manager - many blindingly obvious. So for the benefit of your tired eyes.
a) The 'only' difference you mention - picking the team. That's a huge and crucial job.
b) Tactics
c) Man management and motivation
d) Team talks
e) Transfers
I think that covers the basics.
McLaren, as he has shown at Man Utd, QPR and Derby, is a better coach / number 2 than manager. When he is manager his teams are possession obsessed and soft. [Post edited 2 May 2018 15:23]
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