| Corbyn 02:44 - Jun 9 with 13935 views | DaiHo0p |
Yes etc
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| Corbyn on 09:00 - Jun 13 with 2335 views | francisbowles |
| Corbyn on 08:46 - Jun 13 by derbyhoop |
The parliamentary maths goes
Torres 318 + Northern Irish fruit cakes 10 = 328
Labour + others, excl Sinn Fein = 317
Providing May can strike a deal with the DUP she gets all her non contentious plans through.
The fun and games is likely to come over the Irish border and how it is dealt with in the negotiations. If they ever get started. |
Something doesn't add up! You have the Conservatives with a one seat majority on their own? |  | | |
| Corbyn on 09:35 - Jun 13 with 2297 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 09:00 - Jun 13 by francisbowles |
Something doesn't add up! You have the Conservatives with a one seat majority on their own? |
The figures are correct , you just cant govern with the spectre of Sinn Fein turning up and voting against you which under they are entitled to do at any time .
Its unlikely but with the present Labour leadership in place more of a possibility than ever before .. |  | | |
| Corbyn on 09:43 - Jun 13 with 2283 views | johncharles |
| Corbyn on 09:35 - Jun 13 by essextaxiboy |
The figures are correct , you just cant govern with the spectre of Sinn Fein turning up and voting against you which under they are entitled to do at any time .
Its unlikely but with the present Labour leadership in place more of a possibility than ever before .. |
"the spectre of Sinn Fein" Scary stuff. Looks like a Sun headline and equally unbelievable. |  |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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| Corbyn on 09:44 - Jun 13 with 2281 views | Snipper |
| Corbyn on 09:35 - Jun 13 by essextaxiboy |
The figures are correct , you just cant govern with the spectre of Sinn Fein turning up and voting against you which under they are entitled to do at any time .
Its unlikely but with the present Labour leadership in place more of a possibility than ever before .. |
Sinn Fein can't just show up and vote. All MPs have to take an allegiance to the Queen before they can take their seat in the House of Commons.
There's more chance of me having a night of passion with the subject of my avatar, than of any SF MP taking the oath. |  | | |
| Corbyn on 09:51 - Jun 13 with 2268 views | francisbowles |
| Corbyn on 09:35 - Jun 13 by essextaxiboy |
The figures are correct , you just cant govern with the spectre of Sinn Fein turning up and voting against you which under they are entitled to do at any time .
Its unlikely but with the present Labour leadership in place more of a possibility than ever before .. |
I've just checked and it's Conservatives 317 = 10 DUP = 327. This gives an overall majority of four and more when you take out the seven Sinn Fein. | | | |
| Corbyn on 09:58 - Jun 13 with 2260 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 09:44 - Jun 13 by Snipper |
Sinn Fein can't just show up and vote. All MPs have to take an allegiance to the Queen before they can take their seat in the House of Commons.
There's more chance of me having a night of passion with the subject of my avatar, than of any SF MP taking the oath. |
I have learnt something this morning .
I just assumed that the mandate of the people to have their delegate voting would be sacrosanct . | | | |
| Corbyn on 10:02 - Jun 13 with 2247 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| Corbyn on 00:04 - Jun 13 by johncharles |
It's generally agreed that the DUP will ask for more money for NI. £400 million to make this scandal go away for a start. |
So they have a money tree |  |
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| Corbyn on 10:04 - Jun 13 with 2238 views | connell10 |
| Corbyn on 09:35 - Jun 13 by essextaxiboy |
The figures are correct , you just cant govern with the spectre of Sinn Fein turning up and voting against you which under they are entitled to do at any time .
Its unlikely but with the present Labour leadership in place more of a possibility than ever before .. |
And like the phoenix from the flames !   |  |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| Corbyn on 10:08 - Jun 13 with 2225 views | DannytheR |
Genuinely all a bit worrying to see the fall out over this Tory/DUP arrangement, which typically no-one in power appears to have thought through at all.
Power sharing between the Northern Irish parties over there had already broken down. Now you've got a situation where the basic principle of the Good Friday agreement - that Westminster government should treat the Unionists and Republicans even handedly —Â is going to look absurd. Throw in the return of Michael Gove, who was against the Good Friday agreement in the first place and who knows, maybe we'll be back to the bad old days.
Not good. [Post edited 13 Jun 2017 10:10]
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| Corbyn on 10:11 - Jun 13 with 2212 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 10:04 - Jun 13 by connell10 |
And like the phoenix from the flames ! |
How do you mean ? | | | |
| Corbyn on 10:24 - Jun 13 with 2189 views | QPR_John |
| Corbyn on 22:28 - Jun 12 by QPR_Jim |
Where did I say they wouldn't talk to the SNP?
I'm saying that the tory spin machine realise that coming out and saying that Labour would do a deal with the SNP for power (like they did 2 years ago) isn't as unpopular as the DUP, so now they are trying to link Labour with Sinn Fein as it's perceived as worse than the SNP and helps them to justify their deal with the DUP. In reality if Labour had the same number of seats as the cons, they would be talking to SNP or Lib Dems and wouldn't go anywhere near Sinn Fein. But don't let that get in the way of your hypothetical situation to justify your partys decision. |
I have not read anywhere where the Tories have suggested Labour would look to Sinn Fein to form a government. If Labour would talk to the SNP now why not in 2015 and if so why was it a scare tactic to say so. That is why I made the point you said it was a scare tactic implying it could not possibly be true. I am not justifying any decision my original post is my belief any party would talk to the devil to get power you feel Labour is above such machinations, to me this is not a party matter but simple politics. You have more faith than I do. | | | |
| Corbyn on 10:29 - Jun 13 with 2180 views | QPR_John |
| Corbyn on 08:46 - Jun 13 by derbyhoop |
The parliamentary maths goes
Torres 318 + Northern Irish fruit cakes 10 = 328
Labour + others, excl Sinn Fein = 317
Providing May can strike a deal with the DUP she gets all her non contentious plans through.
The fun and games is likely to come over the Irish border and how it is dealt with in the negotiations. If they ever get started. |
It would have shown less bias if put this way
The parliamentary maths goes
Torres 318 + Northern Irish fruit cakes 10 = 328
Labour + others, excl Sinn Fein the other Northern Irish fruit cakes = 317 | | | |
| Corbyn on 11:19 - Jun 13 with 2113 views | connell10 |
Just banter mate! | |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| Corbyn on 12:08 - Jun 13 with 2066 views | johncharles |
This whole SInn Fein thing is ludicrous. They are not going to form a pact with Labour and couldn't even if wanted to without swearing alligence to the Queen which they are sworn never to do.
Jeremy Corbyn spoke to them 20 years ago but right here and now Theresa May is inviting the DUP, the political wing of a terrorist organisation, to have tea at Downing Street. | |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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| Corbyn on 12:17 - Jun 13 with 2054 views | FDC |
I'd rather have a genuine government than a May-DUP one. |  | | |
| Corbyn on 12:19 - Jun 13 with 2053 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 11:19 - Jun 13 by connell10 |
Just banter mate! |
Ok Sorry .
I thought you meant that I had been hiding after the result . I gave my take on it in the "British voter " thread .
My views on Corbyn havn't changed a bit . He just played a great campaign aided by some brilliant social media support . He was up against the worst managed campaign in memory fronted by a PM who based it on personality while she hasnt got one . Who would have thought the Labour voters who wanted Brexit would go back to Labour once they got it ?
Hopefully lessons have been learnt and to use a phrase often heard at LR
"They cant be that bad again " | | | |
| Corbyn on 12:21 - Jun 13 with 2046 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 12:17 - Jun 13 by FDC |
I'd rather have a genuine government than a May-DUP one. |
Me too ,
But would a Labour/ SNP government be more "genuine" ?
Its how our system works | | | |
| Corbyn on 12:34 - Jun 13 with 2021 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Corbyn on 12:19 - Jun 13 by essextaxiboy |
Ok Sorry .
I thought you meant that I had been hiding after the result . I gave my take on it in the "British voter " thread .
My views on Corbyn havn't changed a bit . He just played a great campaign aided by some brilliant social media support . He was up against the worst managed campaign in memory fronted by a PM who based it on personality while she hasnt got one . Who would have thought the Labour voters who wanted Brexit would go back to Labour once they got it ?
Hopefully lessons have been learnt and to use a phrase often heard at LR
"They cant be that bad again " |
What does "lessons learnt" and "can't be that bad again" really mean? Is it a case of being better at hiding what you're really like to the public? I feel people voted on the actions and policies of the Tories and not because of some PR mishap.
Perhaps this bad campaign was because of bad policies as opposed to some inability to trick the public for a few weeks with PR spin and bullsh1t.
Was there no attempt at positivity because there was little to be had? I would use you and SteveC as examples. I asked both of you to explain to me how the Tory policies were good for the working class. You were unable/unwilling to reply despite being very visible on all the election threads. I don't blame you for not getting back to me, I think it was a big ask. |  | | |
| Corbyn on 13:50 - Jun 13 with 1939 views | stevec |
| Corbyn on 12:34 - Jun 13 by 1BobbyHazell |
What does "lessons learnt" and "can't be that bad again" really mean? Is it a case of being better at hiding what you're really like to the public? I feel people voted on the actions and policies of the Tories and not because of some PR mishap.
Perhaps this bad campaign was because of bad policies as opposed to some inability to trick the public for a few weeks with PR spin and bullsh1t.
Was there no attempt at positivity because there was little to be had? I would use you and SteveC as examples. I asked both of you to explain to me how the Tory policies were good for the working class. You were unable/unwilling to reply despite being very visible on all the election threads. I don't blame you for not getting back to me, I think it was a big ask. |
It wasn't just a big ask, simply impossible to answer! Mays manifesto was appalling, you don't shÃt on your own doorstep.
Defining the working class, my view is it's anybody who needs to go out and earn enough to pay the bills, in other words about 95% of us. That aside, I'd assume your talking about those on lowest incomes. In this election, May offered nothing, agreed.
Problem is, those of us (most of us) who've been around a long while have had the misfortune of seeing a Labour Government in action.
Things can only get better, they didn't. For the working class, Gordon Brown steadfastly refused to increase the tax threshold meaning 10 years ago the rate you started paying tax was less than HALF what it is now. Blair's immigration policy had a huge detrimental effect on low income earners and, at the same time, with more people coming into the country than houses being built led to the massive increase of house prices so that the young find it practically impossible to own their own home. Tuition fees? remind me who introduced that to the nations students. Irrespective of what happens under the Tories all this happened on Labours watch, the so called friend of the working class.
Now if I was under 30, all this was long enough back to have had no real impact, I'd have been at school, not paying tax, no mortgage or rent, something I'd glossed over in a history book.
There's no substitute for being on the sharp end. In my industry, employees were earning more in 1996 (before Labour got in) than they were in 2010 (when Labour got kicked out). Private pensions that had grown through the 80's and 90's collapsed in the period 1997 to 2010 as Brown picked the pockets of everyone who owned one.
Don't get carried away by the freebies Corbyn offers, he's come up with some very good policies, all he needs is a tax that actually pays for it. Income Tax and Corporation Tax increases NEVER raise anything substantial and when it all starts to unravel Labour will go back to what they always do, clobber the lot of us. |  | | |
| Corbyn on 16:14 - Jun 13 with 1839 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Corbyn on 13:50 - Jun 13 by stevec |
It wasn't just a big ask, simply impossible to answer! Mays manifesto was appalling, you don't shÃt on your own doorstep.
Defining the working class, my view is it's anybody who needs to go out and earn enough to pay the bills, in other words about 95% of us. That aside, I'd assume your talking about those on lowest incomes. In this election, May offered nothing, agreed.
Problem is, those of us (most of us) who've been around a long while have had the misfortune of seeing a Labour Government in action.
Things can only get better, they didn't. For the working class, Gordon Brown steadfastly refused to increase the tax threshold meaning 10 years ago the rate you started paying tax was less than HALF what it is now. Blair's immigration policy had a huge detrimental effect on low income earners and, at the same time, with more people coming into the country than houses being built led to the massive increase of house prices so that the young find it practically impossible to own their own home. Tuition fees? remind me who introduced that to the nations students. Irrespective of what happens under the Tories all this happened on Labours watch, the so called friend of the working class.
Now if I was under 30, all this was long enough back to have had no real impact, I'd have been at school, not paying tax, no mortgage or rent, something I'd glossed over in a history book.
There's no substitute for being on the sharp end. In my industry, employees were earning more in 1996 (before Labour got in) than they were in 2010 (when Labour got kicked out). Private pensions that had grown through the 80's and 90's collapsed in the period 1997 to 2010 as Brown picked the pockets of everyone who owned one.
Don't get carried away by the freebies Corbyn offers, he's come up with some very good policies, all he needs is a tax that actually pays for it. Income Tax and Corporation Tax increases NEVER raise anything substantial and when it all starts to unravel Labour will go back to what they always do, clobber the lot of us. |
You'll get absolutely no defending of Blair and Brown from me Steve, I never voted for them and never supported them. I know Tory Lites when I see them.
Seeing your reply shows why Corbyn did so much better than expected once the actual campaigning and listening to the manifestos got underway. You yourself admit you've got nothing positive to say about what the Tories have to offer, all you can do is attack your imaginary view of what would happen if Corbyn won. Which is what the Tories did. Which is why they did soooo much worse than May expected.
The money exists, I shouldn't have to keep putting up the link to how the top 1000 have more than doubled their wealth at the exact same time that we have had austerity, bank bailouts, deliberately underpriced public utility sell-offs, health care in crisis, the dismantling of Youth Service support, an "I Daniel Blake" benefit and food bank system, closure of community resources, etc etc etc.
The money is there we are just being sold the lie that the only CREDIBLE direction it is currently allowed to travel in is straight up to the wealthiest people on the planet. The message is constantly repeated that any system that may alter that is impossible and will lead to us being bankrupt.
This perceived wisdom that the only two choices we have are to either let the rich keep picking up more and more wealth whilst constantly lessening our social provision for communities OR going bankrupt is a f*cking joke mate. We can do better for ourselves. Corbyn and his policies may not be perfect but if we just keep acquiescing whilst this ridiculous wealth and power grab goes on, we'll be f*cked for good.
Can we count on your vote in October? X | | | |
| Corbyn on 17:47 - Jun 13 with 1749 views | essextaxiboy |
| Corbyn on 16:14 - Jun 13 by 1BobbyHazell |
You'll get absolutely no defending of Blair and Brown from me Steve, I never voted for them and never supported them. I know Tory Lites when I see them.
Seeing your reply shows why Corbyn did so much better than expected once the actual campaigning and listening to the manifestos got underway. You yourself admit you've got nothing positive to say about what the Tories have to offer, all you can do is attack your imaginary view of what would happen if Corbyn won. Which is what the Tories did. Which is why they did soooo much worse than May expected.
The money exists, I shouldn't have to keep putting up the link to how the top 1000 have more than doubled their wealth at the exact same time that we have had austerity, bank bailouts, deliberately underpriced public utility sell-offs, health care in crisis, the dismantling of Youth Service support, an "I Daniel Blake" benefit and food bank system, closure of community resources, etc etc etc.
The money is there we are just being sold the lie that the only CREDIBLE direction it is currently allowed to travel in is straight up to the wealthiest people on the planet. The message is constantly repeated that any system that may alter that is impossible and will lead to us being bankrupt.
This perceived wisdom that the only two choices we have are to either let the rich keep picking up more and more wealth whilst constantly lessening our social provision for communities OR going bankrupt is a f*cking joke mate. We can do better for ourselves. Corbyn and his policies may not be perfect but if we just keep acquiescing whilst this ridiculous wealth and power grab goes on, we'll be f*cked for good.
Can we count on your vote in October? X |
I agree about Blair and Brown , even I voted for them once . For anyone younger than me (56) they may not remember the last time we had a remotely left wing government and what happened when they realised we were going bust and tried to put the brakes on .
https://socialistworker.co.uk/art/11262/Winter+of+Discontent+1978+9%3A+We+struck | | | |
| Corbyn on 19:09 - Jun 13 with 1717 views | stevec |
| Corbyn on 16:14 - Jun 13 by 1BobbyHazell |
You'll get absolutely no defending of Blair and Brown from me Steve, I never voted for them and never supported them. I know Tory Lites when I see them.
Seeing your reply shows why Corbyn did so much better than expected once the actual campaigning and listening to the manifestos got underway. You yourself admit you've got nothing positive to say about what the Tories have to offer, all you can do is attack your imaginary view of what would happen if Corbyn won. Which is what the Tories did. Which is why they did soooo much worse than May expected.
The money exists, I shouldn't have to keep putting up the link to how the top 1000 have more than doubled their wealth at the exact same time that we have had austerity, bank bailouts, deliberately underpriced public utility sell-offs, health care in crisis, the dismantling of Youth Service support, an "I Daniel Blake" benefit and food bank system, closure of community resources, etc etc etc.
The money is there we are just being sold the lie that the only CREDIBLE direction it is currently allowed to travel in is straight up to the wealthiest people on the planet. The message is constantly repeated that any system that may alter that is impossible and will lead to us being bankrupt.
This perceived wisdom that the only two choices we have are to either let the rich keep picking up more and more wealth whilst constantly lessening our social provision for communities OR going bankrupt is a f*cking joke mate. We can do better for ourselves. Corbyn and his policies may not be perfect but if we just keep acquiescing whilst this ridiculous wealth and power grab goes on, we'll be f*cked for good.
Can we count on your vote in October? X |
I find myself agreeing with you even if I'm from the opposite spectrum.
The thing is until Corbyn identifies a method of taxing that works then he will fall back on the same old methods which eventually rebound on the very people he is supposed to help.
Income Tax and Corporation tax increases simply don't work. | | | |
| Corbyn on 20:58 - Jun 13 with 1658 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Corbyn on 19:09 - Jun 13 by stevec |
I find myself agreeing with you even if I'm from the opposite spectrum.
The thing is until Corbyn identifies a method of taxing that works then he will fall back on the same old methods which eventually rebound on the very people he is supposed to help.
Income Tax and Corporation tax increases simply don't work. |
Well if they don't work let's all keep putting our minds together until we find out what will work because one way or another this bullsh1t has got to stop.
And it will. | | | |
| Corbyn on 21:46 - Jun 13 with 1618 views | FredManRave |
| Corbyn on 20:58 - Jun 13 by 1BobbyHazell |
Well if they don't work let's all keep putting our minds together until we find out what will work because one way or another this bullsh1t has got to stop.
And it will. |
Time for a new , genuine, realistic third party?! |  |
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| Corbyn on 21:47 - Jun 13 with 1615 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| Corbyn on 21:46 - Jun 13 by FredManRave |
Time for a new , genuine, realistic third party?! |
Ask ukip or the LD about that
The DUP are doing rather well "owning" the Country [Post edited 13 Jun 2017 21:51]
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