| Hornets on Sunday 19:31 - Feb 24 with 302276 views | EllDale |
They’re tweeting that their “matchday operations” are being restricted for the home game against Barrow on Sunday for reasons that they don’t want to divulge at the moment.
The bottom line is that the crowd capacity is limited to 920 and there will be no cash admissions on the day.
Wonder what that’s all about? |  | | |  |
| Hornets on Sunday on 16:17 - May 31 with 4005 views | judd |
| Hornets on Sunday on 10:59 - May 31 by BigKindo |
Jeez! Hopefully the Stadium Company aren't one of the trade/'other' creditors. |
At the last Trust meeting with the Directors, it was stated that Hornets were fully up to date with rent payments.
On Twitter earlier I noticed that one poster who went to the Doncaster game thought that putting all the fans in one stand was a great idea in generating a good atmosphere. |  |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 19:07 - May 31 with 3785 views | pioneer |
Latest posts on the Hornets site have identified the problem . Its the Dale chairman and board who are responsible for hornets crowds crashing to 300 per game.
No one willing to explain why though! That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet. Maybe he is one of the 600 former fans who have given up going. Meanwhile Joe 90 says they the clubs communications are among the best in the league (arf)
but…..no explanation for
why last two home games played on Saturday
why attendence not published for several days
why attendance restricted to 920
It seems like anything the board doesnt want to address publicly is deemed to be “dirty washing”. They need to get that laundry done. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:19 - May 31 with 3752 views | MoonyDale |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:07 - May 31 by pioneer |
Latest posts on the Hornets site have identified the problem . Its the Dale chairman and board who are responsible for hornets crowds crashing to 300 per game.
No one willing to explain why though! That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet. Maybe he is one of the 600 former fans who have given up going. Meanwhile Joe 90 says they the clubs communications are among the best in the league (arf)
but…..no explanation for
why last two home games played on Saturday
why attendence not published for several days
why attendance restricted to 920
It seems like anything the board doesnt want to address publicly is deemed to be “dirty washing”. They need to get that laundry done. |
"Latest posts on the Hornets site have identified the problem . Its the Dale chairman and board who are responsible for hornets crowds crashing to 300 per game"
I heard the same at the final home game from someone inside the club, again no reason given but it was added that the board were not happy with the egg chasers... |  |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 19:29 - May 31 with 3705 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:07 - May 31 by pioneer |
Latest posts on the Hornets site have identified the problem . Its the Dale chairman and board who are responsible for hornets crowds crashing to 300 per game.
No one willing to explain why though! That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet. Maybe he is one of the 600 former fans who have given up going. Meanwhile Joe 90 says they the clubs communications are among the best in the league (arf)
but…..no explanation for
why last two home games played on Saturday
why attendence not published for several days
why attendance restricted to 920
It seems like anything the board doesnt want to address publicly is deemed to be “dirty washing”. They need to get that laundry done. |
Aside from it being the football close season, where nothing much happens, does anyone really care too much?
The full economic reality of rugby league in England is that it is a dying game. The RFL turned the tap off on the TV money during Covid and were too embeded with Sky and now smaller teams are feeling the pinch. Rochdale Hornets is one of those teams.
In the Autumn the "World Cup" takes place and lets look at the teams:
* England
* France
* Greece
* Samoa
* Australia
* Fiji
* Italy
* Scotland
* Ireland
* Jamaica
* Lebanon
* New Zealand
* Cook Islands
* Papua New Guinea
* Wales
* Tonga
The draw is already rigged in favour of the hosts and so that, if all goes to plan, New Zealand have to play Australia in the semi-final whereas England don't have to play either of the teams concerned until the final.
It's a bad do when the quarter finals of the competition are not competitive fixtures.
The world rankings are laughable:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRL_Men%27s_World_Rankings |  |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 19:51 - May 31 with 3644 views | pioneer |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:29 - May 31 by RAFCBLUE |
Aside from it being the football close season, where nothing much happens, does anyone really care too much?
The full economic reality of rugby league in England is that it is a dying game. The RFL turned the tap off on the TV money during Covid and were too embeded with Sky and now smaller teams are feeling the pinch. Rochdale Hornets is one of those teams.
In the Autumn the "World Cup" takes place and lets look at the teams:
* England
* France
* Greece
* Samoa
* Australia
* Fiji
* Italy
* Scotland
* Ireland
* Jamaica
* Lebanon
* New Zealand
* Cook Islands
* Papua New Guinea
* Wales
* Tonga
The draw is already rigged in favour of the hosts and so that, if all goes to plan, New Zealand have to play Australia in the semi-final whereas England don't have to play either of the teams concerned until the final.
It's a bad do when the quarter finals of the competition are not competitive fixtures.
The world rankings are laughable:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRL_Men%27s_World_Rankings |
Quarter finals not competitive…..look at the semi finals. Aussies v Fiji
2013 64-0
2017 54-6 | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 20:40 - May 31 with 3594 views | HullDale |
From the Hornets board:
Sadly it would appear that this is affecting our attendances as we can no longer sit in our preferred seats.
That makes zero sense but, if true, suggests a wider problem in their fanbase commitment. That isn't a fan reaction to a singular club decision (like we saw when home fans were going to be moved for a one off game against (I think?) Sunderland)... its a conscious decision to not support the team or watch the game based on what they are claiming is a decision being taken in bad faith by the Dale board and not their own.
A boycott because you have to sit a few seats down in an empty stand just isn't logical... the logical step would be to drive attendances forward, show the football club the upside potential of getting more fans in and (in what I'd argue is true Hornets style) prove 'The AFC' wrong. IF it is a boycott based on not having a preferred seat, and those shocking attendance numbers are correct, all it is doing is proving the decision to limit access to the stand to be the right one!
This happening at the same time as our mate Andy is throwing hospitality around to the descendants of somebody who made just 7 (seven!) appearances for Hornets. Not this Hornets though, as its a new firm... one of the old ones that went bust.
|  | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 21:02 - May 31 with 3576 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:51 - May 31 by pioneer |
Quarter finals not competitive…..look at the semi finals. Aussies v Fiji
2013 64-0
2017 54-6 |
That's not competitive or good for the game and its why IMO people don't watch rugby at that level.
Sport is supposed to be competitive.
When Cornwall or West Wales Raiders play at Spotland later this year Hornets are expected to put 50+ points past them.
Who is going to pay £16 to watch that? Not many. | |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 21:15 - May 31 with 3536 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday on 20:40 - May 31 by HullDale |
From the Hornets board:
Sadly it would appear that this is affecting our attendances as we can no longer sit in our preferred seats.
That makes zero sense but, if true, suggests a wider problem in their fanbase commitment. That isn't a fan reaction to a singular club decision (like we saw when home fans were going to be moved for a one off game against (I think?) Sunderland)... its a conscious decision to not support the team or watch the game based on what they are claiming is a decision being taken in bad faith by the Dale board and not their own.
A boycott because you have to sit a few seats down in an empty stand just isn't logical... the logical step would be to drive attendances forward, show the football club the upside potential of getting more fans in and (in what I'd argue is true Hornets style) prove 'The AFC' wrong. IF it is a boycott based on not having a preferred seat, and those shocking attendance numbers are correct, all it is doing is proving the decision to limit access to the stand to be the right one!
This happening at the same time as our mate Andy is throwing hospitality around to the descendants of somebody who made just 7 (seven!) appearances for Hornets. Not this Hornets though, as its a new firm... one of the old ones that went bust.
|
If you look at Keighley who are riding high, they have found a formula that works for crowds.
They have the following attendances on Rugby League Records:
vs Doncaster - 863
vs Swinton - 1233
vs London Skolars - 1148
vs Rochdale Hornets - 1847
vs Midlands Hurricanes - 1126
TOTAL: 6217
Hornets on the other hand are showing on Rugby League Records:
vs North Wales - 448
vs Hunslet - 415
vs Oldham - 920
vs Midlands Hurricanes - 327
vs Doncaster - 354
TOTAL: 2,464
Keighley must be doing something right to get roughly two and half times the crowd Hornets do playing the same standard of opposition.
You'd have though that Hornets would be giving out 400+ free tickets based on games other than Oldham - but then I suspect they would have to admit they couldn't shift those even if they gave them all away for free. | |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 21:19 - May 31 with 3521 views | EllDale |
And Keighley haven’t a catchment area with 200k potential customers in either…… | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 21:29 - May 31 with 3495 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday on 21:19 - May 31 by EllDale |
And Keighley haven’t a catchment area with 200k potential customers in either…… |
Only an out of towner would make a naive comment like that.
And comments like these:
https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/rochdale-has-everything-in-place-to-be-cham
"We took the club believing it is a Championship club, so we never wanted to be hanging around in League 1 too long and we believe we’ve got everything in place to be a Championship club.
I can't think of a Championship club that has gates of circa 400. | |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 21:44 - May 31 with 3459 views | EllDale |
He’s presumably working on the theory that if Hornets were in the Championship then the gates would be drastically increased by away support from the likes of Leigh, Featherstone, Halifax and Bradford.
But not if you’re restricted to 920 spectators including complimentaries. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 22:50 - May 31 with 3388 views | kel |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:07 - May 31 by pioneer |
Latest posts on the Hornets site have identified the problem . Its the Dale chairman and board who are responsible for hornets crowds crashing to 300 per game.
No one willing to explain why though! That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet. Maybe he is one of the 600 former fans who have given up going. Meanwhile Joe 90 says they the clubs communications are among the best in the league (arf)
but…..no explanation for
why last two home games played on Saturday
why attendence not published for several days
why attendance restricted to 920
It seems like anything the board doesnt want to address publicly is deemed to be “dirty washing”. They need to get that laundry done. |
“That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet”
Aye. Anyone seen that HUGE Dale fan RochdaleGlory who only ever commented on a thread about the rugger boys? Funny that.
On another note, I was speaking to a Hornets player today who tells me Mazey likes to act like “one of the lads” after the ruggers have played and he goes drinking with them. He used the word ‘cringeworthy’ on more than one occasion. How very sad, Andy. |  | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 08:50 - Jun 1 with 3202 views | pioneer |
| Hornets on Sunday on 22:50 - May 31 by kel |
“That poster Hornet seems to have gone awfully quiet”
Aye. Anyone seen that HUGE Dale fan RochdaleGlory who only ever commented on a thread about the rugger boys? Funny that.
On another note, I was speaking to a Hornets player today who tells me Mazey likes to act like “one of the lads” after the ruggers have played and he goes drinking with them. He used the word ‘cringeworthy’ on more than one occasion. How very sad, Andy. |
I dont know if Mayfield publish their attendance but there cannot be much difference between them and Hornets now. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 13:16 - Jun 1 with 3054 views | pioneer |
Gone back into overdrive…..one “guessing” about what lies behind their current issues….’guessing’ that its all the Dale boards fault. Another questioning the local roots of Dales Board. Well they would know all about that wouldnt they!
The a-maze-ing retreads from out of town who are now in charge of hornets…at least until they decide to move on to another club as they have done repeatedly …always leaving clubs in poor shape.
Its all beginning to look a bit like Gigg Lane to me….no one there willing to ask questions of the board and some of the 300 drinking the koolaid. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 13:54 - Jun 1 with 3018 views | kel |
| Hornets on Sunday on 13:16 - Jun 1 by pioneer |
Gone back into overdrive…..one “guessing” about what lies behind their current issues….’guessing’ that its all the Dale boards fault. Another questioning the local roots of Dales Board. Well they would know all about that wouldnt they!
The a-maze-ing retreads from out of town who are now in charge of hornets…at least until they decide to move on to another club as they have done repeatedly …always leaving clubs in poor shape.
Its all beginning to look a bit like Gigg Lane to me….no one there willing to ask questions of the board and some of the 300 drinking the koolaid. |
Funny that The Hornet has reappeared within 24 hours of being mentioned on here. Dim as fook that bloke  | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 14:01 - Jun 1 with 2990 views | HullDale |
'The Hornet' on the rugby forum has a very similar writing style / tone / syntax as 'Rochdale Glory' on here.
'Rochdale Glory' on here has a very similar writing style / tone / syntax to @andy_mazey on twitter.
They couldn't be one and the same, could they? As a lot of what The Hornet and Rochdale Glory have written are potentially damaging to the football club, and maybe not entirely accurate - the comments made could end up damaging relations between the 2 clubs on a permanent basis, which would not look good if being made by a director or Hornets. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 14:33 - Jun 1 with 2955 views | D_Alien |
| Hornets on Sunday on 14:01 - Jun 1 by HullDale |
'The Hornet' on the rugby forum has a very similar writing style / tone / syntax as 'Rochdale Glory' on here.
'Rochdale Glory' on here has a very similar writing style / tone / syntax to @andy_mazey on twitter.
They couldn't be one and the same, could they? As a lot of what The Hornet and Rochdale Glory have written are potentially damaging to the football club, and maybe not entirely accurate - the comments made could end up damaging relations between the 2 clubs on a permanent basis, which would not look good if being made by a director or Hornets. |
It's not beyond the bounds of possibility that those involved in the attempted hostile takeover have been in touch with 'representatives' of Hornets, in an attempt to unsettle/destabilise Dale
I've no idea who this Andy Mazey bloke is, but a brief look into his record suggests he might just be susceptible to such an approach. I could, of course, be wrong, and he's only got the best interests of Hornets at heart, rather than his own...
[Post edited 1 Jun 2022 14:34]
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| Hornets on Sunday on 14:41 - Jun 1 with 2941 views | TyroneShoelaces |
| Hornets on Sunday on 13:16 - Jun 1 by pioneer |
Gone back into overdrive…..one “guessing” about what lies behind their current issues….’guessing’ that its all the Dale boards fault. Another questioning the local roots of Dales Board. Well they would know all about that wouldnt they!
The a-maze-ing retreads from out of town who are now in charge of hornets…at least until they decide to move on to another club as they have done repeatedly …always leaving clubs in poor shape.
Its all beginning to look a bit like Gigg Lane to me….no one there willing to ask questions of the board and some of the 300 drinking the koolaid. |
re the Directors being 'out of towners', Lets look at the facts as
I understand them. Some facts taken from their interviews on the Official Site
Gauge - Southerner who married a local lass, Dale fan for circa 10 years after his son preferred Spotland to OT
Knight - Yorkshireman who has lived here 40+ years. ST holder for 25 years
Sarsfield - Originally from Littleborough. Amateur footballer for St Clements i believe
Wormald - Whitworth lad. His dad one of the best known boxers from this area
Pockney - Southerner (?) Dale connections apart from his Directorship unknown but lived
in Bamford for a good number of years.
Kelly - Surely no one needs telling of Andrews connections to the town
Courtney - Unknown quantity to me
apologies if i've missed anybody, but I think that stacks up uite well against Mazey, Hayes,
Sheridan and Smith (had to google Co House for the other 3 Directors | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday on 15:13 - Jun 1 with 2899 views | judd |
An interesting post by Anita_Bath on the Hornets forum, possibly very insightful:
"More local than the Hornets board. It really doesnt add up, a football club in need of funds trying to get rid of a tenant that allegedly is a source of substantial revenue.
With folks on hear now speculating ( someeven “guessing”) about the explanation it is time some facts were made public."
"...allegedly is a source of substantial revenue"
There is a tenancy agreement in place with agreed terms and conditions. I remember at the time the AFC acquired the stadium, former Directors & major shareholders were furious at the deal that was done. We can only speculate as the source of the fury, but perhaps the rental agreement is not as substantial as some might think? Or the costs associated with hosting home games without restricted numbers because those costs are borne by the AFC and not Hornets?
Perhaps someone from Hornets can put us all in the know, as they seem to be the ones sinned against.
Does anyone know how Hornets fared under lockdown in terms of government funding etc? | |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 19:34 - Jun 1 with 2724 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday on 15:13 - Jun 1 by judd |
An interesting post by Anita_Bath on the Hornets forum, possibly very insightful:
"More local than the Hornets board. It really doesnt add up, a football club in need of funds trying to get rid of a tenant that allegedly is a source of substantial revenue.
With folks on hear now speculating ( someeven “guessing”) about the explanation it is time some facts were made public."
"...allegedly is a source of substantial revenue"
There is a tenancy agreement in place with agreed terms and conditions. I remember at the time the AFC acquired the stadium, former Directors & major shareholders were furious at the deal that was done. We can only speculate as the source of the fury, but perhaps the rental agreement is not as substantial as some might think? Or the costs associated with hosting home games without restricted numbers because those costs are borne by the AFC and not Hornets?
Perhaps someone from Hornets can put us all in the know, as they seem to be the ones sinned against.
Does anyone know how Hornets fared under lockdown in terms of government funding etc? |
Alas judd, a year on from defeating one self aggrandising propaganda machine we appear to have stumbled across another one. As kel pointed out further up this thread, a Rochdale Hornets Rugby League messageboard that gets 5 post a week and then is suddenly a flurry of activity, with knives out for the football club!
For those with good memories of facts of all things Dale, lets just recall what Rochdale Hornets said in 2016 when they signed that long term lease on the day that Rochdale AFC bought the ground from RFL and Council in a commercial transaction.
https://www.eurosport.com/rugby-league/rochdale-hornets-sign-new-lease-to-stay-a
"Rochdale Hornets RLFC are delighted with the news that Rochdale AFC has assumed control of Spotland Stadium," said Mark Wynn, chairman of the Kingstone Press League 1 club.
"We pay tribute to the vision of the Dale board in securing the future of the town's two professional teams in the stadium."
Rugby Football League chief executive Nigel Wood said:"We have been happy to support Rochdale Hornets' request to achieve considerably better terms to play at Spotland which will hopefully give the club every chance to both flourish and prosper at the stadium."
The last line of that, from the RFL's own chief executive, summarised that Rochdale Hornets had achieved "considerably better terms" so the club could "flourish or propser at the stadium"
Praise indeed!
That was just over 6 years ago.
In the meantime there have been a few changes on both sides.
On the football side, Chris Dunphy stepped down as chair of RAFC in December 2018 and later sold out his shares to two American chaps. Dunphy's successor Andrew Kilpatrick lasted a relatively short time (14 months) and installed an absolute tool of a CEO who was sent on his way a year ago by shareholders. Andrew Kilpatrick resigned for "personal reasons" in February 2021.
RAFC is now on its 3rd Chairman since December 2018 and has had 10 new directors since Dunphy stepped down and 4 resignations - although 2 of those 4 were inspired by activist shareholders.
Meanwhile at Hornets, the fan owned model was tried and failed and in 2020 "new" Hornets was formed from investment primarily of Andy Mazey - who angered Swinton Lions fans by aiming to move them and rebrand them to become the "Manchester Lions"
For both teams there was a global pandemic which stopped crowds and therefore revenue.
Nothing though - as far as we have told - has been changed in the property arrangement; Hornets are a tenant on a long term lease that the RFL, the Hornets board of the time and the Council signed off on. All parties then came out in the press and said what a great thing had happened.
Now for the interesting part.
Fat Pat told me that earlier in 2022 an enquiry was made for Hornets to groundshare with Rochdale Mayfield, which was rebuffed by the Rochdale Mayfield side. The Rochdale Hornets ladies side play at Rochdale Mayfield and Fat Pat's sister Chunky Carla knows a hooker or two. It's a small world.
Today, in an edited post, the user "Athleticgrounds" casually suggested:
https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/369627-doncaster-city/page/2/
...to be quite honest I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground, I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that, the football club clearly dont want Hornets at Spotland, despite the not inconsiderable amount of money they get from bar takings on Hornets match days. You would think Rochdale Football club would be grateful for any extra revenue no matter how small. Clearly not the case, which is of course their prerogative.
It's the first time I'd seen Fat Pat's warnings written down somewhere and given her pedigree on warnings about wide boys from when Curran, Jarvis and Bottomley spurned a greasy chip barm in April 2021, it rang the same alarm bells.
To be fair to Fat Pat, as everyone knows, she and her sister get around the town more than Cloughie's bike!
If you take that Athleticgrounds post at face value line by line:
I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground
As far as I am aware Rochdale Mayfield own their ground and all of the money generated from owning. Rochdale Mayfield are well run and debt free.
I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that,
A very logical and positive statement, but it does make you wonder why Rochdale Mayfield have not thought of accessing those government grants to develop their own stadium or indeed the Council haven't made that money readily available to Rochdale Mayfield over the years.
I wonder if the current smoke and mirrors is Rochdale Hornets trying to leave the lease signed in 2016 at Spotland and needing an "out" to ensure that they are not the ones seen to be breaking it.
Looking at the crowds and from reports of matches there are very small crowds and very odds scheduling decisions - like putting Rochdale Hornets games directly against Rochdale Mayfield ones. In which case, blaming the football club is a really obvious easy target.
When "The Hornet" weighed in after "Athleticgrounds", my antenna were properly twitching:
Maybe the pressures associated with a lack of a benefactor or investors, coupled with their ongoing decline on the pitch and also well documented legal wranglings (which could be costly in more ways than one) has made them pretty desperate. Hornets may have been seen as an easy target........
That soundbite sounds REALLY familiar having watched events since 1st June 2021 with a keen eye.
Hornets are averaging something like 400 at home per game - according to Rugby League Records - maybe 2020 Hornets see a future where taking over Rochdale Mayfield's ground and merging the two clubs and tapping into a bit of government or council grant money on the way means a better future for both. Who knows? [Post edited 1 Jun 2022 19:39]
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| Hornets on Sunday on 21:42 - Jun 1 with 2589 views | judd |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:34 - Jun 1 by RAFCBLUE |
Alas judd, a year on from defeating one self aggrandising propaganda machine we appear to have stumbled across another one. As kel pointed out further up this thread, a Rochdale Hornets Rugby League messageboard that gets 5 post a week and then is suddenly a flurry of activity, with knives out for the football club!
For those with good memories of facts of all things Dale, lets just recall what Rochdale Hornets said in 2016 when they signed that long term lease on the day that Rochdale AFC bought the ground from RFL and Council in a commercial transaction.
https://www.eurosport.com/rugby-league/rochdale-hornets-sign-new-lease-to-stay-a
"Rochdale Hornets RLFC are delighted with the news that Rochdale AFC has assumed control of Spotland Stadium," said Mark Wynn, chairman of the Kingstone Press League 1 club.
"We pay tribute to the vision of the Dale board in securing the future of the town's two professional teams in the stadium."
Rugby Football League chief executive Nigel Wood said:"We have been happy to support Rochdale Hornets' request to achieve considerably better terms to play at Spotland which will hopefully give the club every chance to both flourish and prosper at the stadium."
The last line of that, from the RFL's own chief executive, summarised that Rochdale Hornets had achieved "considerably better terms" so the club could "flourish or propser at the stadium"
Praise indeed!
That was just over 6 years ago.
In the meantime there have been a few changes on both sides.
On the football side, Chris Dunphy stepped down as chair of RAFC in December 2018 and later sold out his shares to two American chaps. Dunphy's successor Andrew Kilpatrick lasted a relatively short time (14 months) and installed an absolute tool of a CEO who was sent on his way a year ago by shareholders. Andrew Kilpatrick resigned for "personal reasons" in February 2021.
RAFC is now on its 3rd Chairman since December 2018 and has had 10 new directors since Dunphy stepped down and 4 resignations - although 2 of those 4 were inspired by activist shareholders.
Meanwhile at Hornets, the fan owned model was tried and failed and in 2020 "new" Hornets was formed from investment primarily of Andy Mazey - who angered Swinton Lions fans by aiming to move them and rebrand them to become the "Manchester Lions"
For both teams there was a global pandemic which stopped crowds and therefore revenue.
Nothing though - as far as we have told - has been changed in the property arrangement; Hornets are a tenant on a long term lease that the RFL, the Hornets board of the time and the Council signed off on. All parties then came out in the press and said what a great thing had happened.
Now for the interesting part.
Fat Pat told me that earlier in 2022 an enquiry was made for Hornets to groundshare with Rochdale Mayfield, which was rebuffed by the Rochdale Mayfield side. The Rochdale Hornets ladies side play at Rochdale Mayfield and Fat Pat's sister Chunky Carla knows a hooker or two. It's a small world.
Today, in an edited post, the user "Athleticgrounds" casually suggested:
https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/369627-doncaster-city/page/2/
...to be quite honest I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground, I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that, the football club clearly dont want Hornets at Spotland, despite the not inconsiderable amount of money they get from bar takings on Hornets match days. You would think Rochdale Football club would be grateful for any extra revenue no matter how small. Clearly not the case, which is of course their prerogative.
It's the first time I'd seen Fat Pat's warnings written down somewhere and given her pedigree on warnings about wide boys from when Curran, Jarvis and Bottomley spurned a greasy chip barm in April 2021, it rang the same alarm bells.
To be fair to Fat Pat, as everyone knows, she and her sister get around the town more than Cloughie's bike!
If you take that Athleticgrounds post at face value line by line:
I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground
As far as I am aware Rochdale Mayfield own their ground and all of the money generated from owning. Rochdale Mayfield are well run and debt free.
I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that,
A very logical and positive statement, but it does make you wonder why Rochdale Mayfield have not thought of accessing those government grants to develop their own stadium or indeed the Council haven't made that money readily available to Rochdale Mayfield over the years.
I wonder if the current smoke and mirrors is Rochdale Hornets trying to leave the lease signed in 2016 at Spotland and needing an "out" to ensure that they are not the ones seen to be breaking it.
Looking at the crowds and from reports of matches there are very small crowds and very odds scheduling decisions - like putting Rochdale Hornets games directly against Rochdale Mayfield ones. In which case, blaming the football club is a really obvious easy target.
When "The Hornet" weighed in after "Athleticgrounds", my antenna were properly twitching:
Maybe the pressures associated with a lack of a benefactor or investors, coupled with their ongoing decline on the pitch and also well documented legal wranglings (which could be costly in more ways than one) has made them pretty desperate. Hornets may have been seen as an easy target........
That soundbite sounds REALLY familiar having watched events since 1st June 2021 with a keen eye.
Hornets are averaging something like 400 at home per game - according to Rugby League Records - maybe 2020 Hornets see a future where taking over Rochdale Mayfield's ground and merging the two clubs and tapping into a bit of government or council grant money on the way means a better future for both. Who knows? [Post edited 1 Jun 2022 19:39]
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Hornets will NOT take over Mayfields ground. | |
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| Hornets on Sunday on 08:57 - Jun 2 with 2400 views | kel |
| Hornets on Sunday on 19:34 - Jun 1 by RAFCBLUE |
Alas judd, a year on from defeating one self aggrandising propaganda machine we appear to have stumbled across another one. As kel pointed out further up this thread, a Rochdale Hornets Rugby League messageboard that gets 5 post a week and then is suddenly a flurry of activity, with knives out for the football club!
For those with good memories of facts of all things Dale, lets just recall what Rochdale Hornets said in 2016 when they signed that long term lease on the day that Rochdale AFC bought the ground from RFL and Council in a commercial transaction.
https://www.eurosport.com/rugby-league/rochdale-hornets-sign-new-lease-to-stay-a
"Rochdale Hornets RLFC are delighted with the news that Rochdale AFC has assumed control of Spotland Stadium," said Mark Wynn, chairman of the Kingstone Press League 1 club.
"We pay tribute to the vision of the Dale board in securing the future of the town's two professional teams in the stadium."
Rugby Football League chief executive Nigel Wood said:"We have been happy to support Rochdale Hornets' request to achieve considerably better terms to play at Spotland which will hopefully give the club every chance to both flourish and prosper at the stadium."
The last line of that, from the RFL's own chief executive, summarised that Rochdale Hornets had achieved "considerably better terms" so the club could "flourish or propser at the stadium"
Praise indeed!
That was just over 6 years ago.
In the meantime there have been a few changes on both sides.
On the football side, Chris Dunphy stepped down as chair of RAFC in December 2018 and later sold out his shares to two American chaps. Dunphy's successor Andrew Kilpatrick lasted a relatively short time (14 months) and installed an absolute tool of a CEO who was sent on his way a year ago by shareholders. Andrew Kilpatrick resigned for "personal reasons" in February 2021.
RAFC is now on its 3rd Chairman since December 2018 and has had 10 new directors since Dunphy stepped down and 4 resignations - although 2 of those 4 were inspired by activist shareholders.
Meanwhile at Hornets, the fan owned model was tried and failed and in 2020 "new" Hornets was formed from investment primarily of Andy Mazey - who angered Swinton Lions fans by aiming to move them and rebrand them to become the "Manchester Lions"
For both teams there was a global pandemic which stopped crowds and therefore revenue.
Nothing though - as far as we have told - has been changed in the property arrangement; Hornets are a tenant on a long term lease that the RFL, the Hornets board of the time and the Council signed off on. All parties then came out in the press and said what a great thing had happened.
Now for the interesting part.
Fat Pat told me that earlier in 2022 an enquiry was made for Hornets to groundshare with Rochdale Mayfield, which was rebuffed by the Rochdale Mayfield side. The Rochdale Hornets ladies side play at Rochdale Mayfield and Fat Pat's sister Chunky Carla knows a hooker or two. It's a small world.
Today, in an edited post, the user "Athleticgrounds" casually suggested:
https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/369627-doncaster-city/page/2/
...to be quite honest I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground, I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that, the football club clearly dont want Hornets at Spotland, despite the not inconsiderable amount of money they get from bar takings on Hornets match days. You would think Rochdale Football club would be grateful for any extra revenue no matter how small. Clearly not the case, which is of course their prerogative.
It's the first time I'd seen Fat Pat's warnings written down somewhere and given her pedigree on warnings about wide boys from when Curran, Jarvis and Bottomley spurned a greasy chip barm in April 2021, it rang the same alarm bells.
To be fair to Fat Pat, as everyone knows, she and her sister get around the town more than Cloughie's bike!
If you take that Athleticgrounds post at face value line by line:
I think the time has come to consult with Mayfield and look at a plan to develop their ground
As far as I am aware Rochdale Mayfield own their ground and all of the money generated from owning. Rochdale Mayfield are well run and debt free.
I am sure there would be government grants available to do just that,
A very logical and positive statement, but it does make you wonder why Rochdale Mayfield have not thought of accessing those government grants to develop their own stadium or indeed the Council haven't made that money readily available to Rochdale Mayfield over the years.
I wonder if the current smoke and mirrors is Rochdale Hornets trying to leave the lease signed in 2016 at Spotland and needing an "out" to ensure that they are not the ones seen to be breaking it.
Looking at the crowds and from reports of matches there are very small crowds and very odds scheduling decisions - like putting Rochdale Hornets games directly against Rochdale Mayfield ones. In which case, blaming the football club is a really obvious easy target.
When "The Hornet" weighed in after "Athleticgrounds", my antenna were properly twitching:
Maybe the pressures associated with a lack of a benefactor or investors, coupled with their ongoing decline on the pitch and also well documented legal wranglings (which could be costly in more ways than one) has made them pretty desperate. Hornets may have been seen as an easy target........
That soundbite sounds REALLY familiar having watched events since 1st June 2021 with a keen eye.
Hornets are averaging something like 400 at home per game - according to Rugby League Records - maybe 2020 Hornets see a future where taking over Rochdale Mayfield's ground and merging the two clubs and tapping into a bit of government or council grant money on the way means a better future for both. Who knows? [Post edited 1 Jun 2022 19:39]
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‘Athleticgrounds’ posts on here too as a ‘Dale’ fan.
Another one who thinks we’re stupid. | | | |
| Hornets on Sunday (n/t) on 09:34 - Jun 2 with 2347 views | TyroneShoelaces |
“Maybe the pressures associated with a lack of a benefactor or investors, coupled with their ongoing decline on the pitch and also well documented legal wranglings (which could be costly in more ways than one) has made them pretty desperate. Hornets may have been seen as an easy target........ “
Dale fans have chosen NOT to have a benefactor but to be a fan owned club. Last season, both onnand off the pitch, was affected by the actions of the outgoing Directors not the current ones.
Why would the current Directors see Hornets as an easy target ?
Perhaps the current Directors have seen that Hornets were draining the Club of much needed resources. If Hornet and Hornets were ‘in it together’ they perhaps could see that any loss making part of the business wouldn’t in the long term be good for either Clubs [Post edited 2 Jun 2022 9:35]
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| Hornets on Sunday (n/t) on 13:02 - Jun 2 with 2193 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Hornets on Sunday (n/t) on 09:34 - Jun 2 by TyroneShoelaces |
“Maybe the pressures associated with a lack of a benefactor or investors, coupled with their ongoing decline on the pitch and also well documented legal wranglings (which could be costly in more ways than one) has made them pretty desperate. Hornets may have been seen as an easy target........ “
Dale fans have chosen NOT to have a benefactor but to be a fan owned club. Last season, both onnand off the pitch, was affected by the actions of the outgoing Directors not the current ones.
Why would the current Directors see Hornets as an easy target ?
Perhaps the current Directors have seen that Hornets were draining the Club of much needed resources. If Hornet and Hornets were ‘in it together’ they perhaps could see that any loss making part of the business wouldn’t in the long term be good for either Clubs [Post edited 2 Jun 2022 9:35]
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"The Hornet" has thrown a proper wobbly this morning with all of these difficult questions being asked:
https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/369627-doncaster-city/page/2/#co
What is your issue with the Hornets board?
Be clear, are you suggesting these guys who let’s not forget our CEO and board at the time approached to take us on, not the other way round should walk away?
Let’s also not forget the state the club was in at that time, and also the fact their take over bid was unanimously voted for without a single vote against.
You need to give your head a wobble with some of the constant snipes you aim at good Rugby League people who for no other reason than a love for the sport, put valuable time and money into it, and have stabilised us and furthermore despite covid (unforeseen) and major central funding cuts have backed the coach and put a competitive team on the park, with players and household names that Rochdale could previously only have ever dreamed of.
Final question for you, when the club was failing badly in 2019 as a society and reached out to potential owners / investors, how many Rochdale based potentials stepped forward with concrete proposals to take it on???
Let's give our collective heads a wobble and have a go at responding to that:
1. The current Hornets board are overseeing a currently unexplained and seemingly terminal decline of the club.
2. Attendances are on the floor, averaging circa 400, down significantly from last season and the games are being deliberately scheduled on a Saturday, not the traditional day of Sunday when Rugby League is usually played.
3. The comment on "Rochdale based" certifies the out of town/out of touch angle that's been seen throughout 2022 and is a key reason for the decline.
4. The comment on "players and household names that Rochdale could previously only have ever dreamed of" smacks of arrogance and being out of touch. Rochdale Hornets was well established well before this current administration.
5. The reasons for distress and failure are being explained as "major central funding cuts" which is true and nothing to do with the Hornets tenancy of Spotland from 2016. It should be pointed out that these "major central funding cuts" were well advertised by the RFL and could have been budgeted for.
6. The propaganda that these are "good Rugby League people" continues. Note that is not being "good Rochdale Hornets people" of which there are many.
It all looks like that the exposing of the attempt to move in with Rochdale Mayfield by Fat Pat and Chunky Carla has thrown a little spanner in the financial works of the promotion effort led by Dad's Army and a few hired in temporary workers.
The OP of this thread starts in February 2022 with the Rochdale Hornets tweet that “matchday operations” are being restricted for the home game against Barrow on Sunday for reasons that they didn’t divulge.
The only thing that looks from the outside that is severely wobbling is the Rochdale Hornets out of town leadership. Money must be tight! | |
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| Hornets on Sunday (n/t) on 16:59 - Jun 2 with 2046 views | judd |
| Hornets on Sunday (n/t) on 13:02 - Jun 2 by RAFCBLUE |
"The Hornet" has thrown a proper wobbly this morning with all of these difficult questions being asked:
https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/369627-doncaster-city/page/2/#co
What is your issue with the Hornets board?
Be clear, are you suggesting these guys who let’s not forget our CEO and board at the time approached to take us on, not the other way round should walk away?
Let’s also not forget the state the club was in at that time, and also the fact their take over bid was unanimously voted for without a single vote against.
You need to give your head a wobble with some of the constant snipes you aim at good Rugby League people who for no other reason than a love for the sport, put valuable time and money into it, and have stabilised us and furthermore despite covid (unforeseen) and major central funding cuts have backed the coach and put a competitive team on the park, with players and household names that Rochdale could previously only have ever dreamed of.
Final question for you, when the club was failing badly in 2019 as a society and reached out to potential owners / investors, how many Rochdale based potentials stepped forward with concrete proposals to take it on???
Let's give our collective heads a wobble and have a go at responding to that:
1. The current Hornets board are overseeing a currently unexplained and seemingly terminal decline of the club.
2. Attendances are on the floor, averaging circa 400, down significantly from last season and the games are being deliberately scheduled on a Saturday, not the traditional day of Sunday when Rugby League is usually played.
3. The comment on "Rochdale based" certifies the out of town/out of touch angle that's been seen throughout 2022 and is a key reason for the decline.
4. The comment on "players and household names that Rochdale could previously only have ever dreamed of" smacks of arrogance and being out of touch. Rochdale Hornets was well established well before this current administration.
5. The reasons for distress and failure are being explained as "major central funding cuts" which is true and nothing to do with the Hornets tenancy of Spotland from 2016. It should be pointed out that these "major central funding cuts" were well advertised by the RFL and could have been budgeted for.
6. The propaganda that these are "good Rugby League people" continues. Note that is not being "good Rochdale Hornets people" of which there are many.
It all looks like that the exposing of the attempt to move in with Rochdale Mayfield by Fat Pat and Chunky Carla has thrown a little spanner in the financial works of the promotion effort led by Dad's Army and a few hired in temporary workers.
The OP of this thread starts in February 2022 with the Rochdale Hornets tweet that “matchday operations” are being restricted for the home game against Barrow on Sunday for reasons that they didn’t divulge.
The only thing that looks from the outside that is severely wobbling is the Rochdale Hornets out of town leadership. Money must be tight! |
From what I'm hearing, Hornets are providing kit for a new amateur club playing in Rochdale for this and next season.
Players have been poached from Mayfield.
RMBC, I am led to believe, have funded a club house and changing rooms and will lay a new pitch for next season at Balderstone.
Not sure if this development could lead to a new, smaller stadium | |
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