| Future dividends and the Trust 10:23 - Dec 8 with 5704 views | exiledclaseboy |
Following on from some comments in another thread about the Trust and how it takes decisions, a hypothetical question. If the Board decided to pay itself further dividends in the future, how should the Trust vote? And further to that, should the Trust's board take the decision on our behalf or should there be a vote of members to decide how the Supporter Director should vote? |  |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:12 - Dec 8 with 902 views | Swanseajill |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 11:43 - Dec 8 by Darran |
Dud you go to the AGM t'other week or do you know anyone (other than Uxy) that went? |
I was there.
I know it can be difficult to attend for many, due to work and travel for those living away.
But, if people feel the need to ask questions about how the Trust functions, then if they can't attend AGM's they can ask for their questions to be put to the board...either by a written question, or ask someone who is attending to ask it on their behalf.
As Ive said in the past, picking holes in the Trust comes so easy via a message board, especially that many that pick holes, are not even members .
Always it's "What is the club doing for me"
And not...What can I do for my club"
The Trust have had many board members who have worked tirelessly for some years now, I dont feel they have let us down so far, they have my vote to .....
Carry on, youre doing a sterling job. |  | | |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:28 - Dec 8 with 866 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:11 - Dec 8 by jackonicko |
From the SD website:
A Supporters’ Trust is a democratic, not-for-profit organisation of supporters, committed to strengthening the voice for supporters in the decision making process at a club, and strengthening the links between the club and the community it serves.
Supporters’ Trusts are constituted as Community Benefit Societies (CBS), a form of Co-operative that operates under a one-member one-vote principle. CBS’ are registered with the Financial Services Authority, and any changes to the rules must be approved by the members and only become effective once the FSA has agreed them, checking they are in keeping with the spirit of the organisation. The members own all assets and liabilities collectively, and any profit made is either kept as reserves or reinvested to meet its objects. They are not charities and whilst they contain the word ‘Trust’ they do not follow the legal definition of a ‘Trust’.
http://www.supporters-direct.org/homepage/what-we-do/faqs |
Actually it looks like you were right first time according to this:
http://www.swanseacity.net/fans/Supporters_Trust/
Here's the relevant bit:
"Supporters run the Trust. These make up the Trust Board. There are 11 elected supporter members. Each serves for a maximum of two years"
So the board can theoretically be entirely replaced in two years.
What seems surprising to me is that as far as I am aware Phil has held office since inception. How can that be, if board members are limited to 2 year terms? |  |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:30 - Dec 8 with 863 views | Darran |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:28 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
Actually it looks like you were right first time according to this:
http://www.swanseacity.net/fans/Supporters_Trust/
Here's the relevant bit:
"Supporters run the Trust. These make up the Trust Board. There are 11 elected supporter members. Each serves for a maximum of two years"
So the board can theoretically be entirely replaced in two years.
What seems surprising to me is that as far as I am aware Phil has held office since inception. How can that be, if board members are limited to 2 year terms? |
Get voted back on every 2 years see. |  |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:32 - Dec 8 with 861 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:28 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
Actually it looks like you were right first time according to this:
http://www.swanseacity.net/fans/Supporters_Trust/
Here's the relevant bit:
"Supporters run the Trust. These make up the Trust Board. There are 11 elected supporter members. Each serves for a maximum of two years"
So the board can theoretically be entirely replaced in two years.
What seems surprising to me is that as far as I am aware Phil has held office since inception. How can that be, if board members are limited to 2 year terms? |
Phil hasn't been chairman since the Trust was formed, that I do know. I think it's about four or five years. And I don't think they're limited to two-year terms, although that wording does imply that. They have to submit for re-election every two years. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:33 - Dec 8 with 860 views | Shaky |
Thanks, that's helpful but not conclusive:
"Robust Constitution - crucial rules such as the Objects, Powers and Application of Profits, may only be altered if there is a 75% majority in favour. "
The question is 75% of what? All members or those turning up at general meetings.
Also important that it is a limited liability structure, and it seems to me that there has got to be further statutes detailing some of this stuff, whether or not that comes in the form of Articles of Association. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:37 - Dec 8 with 849 views | Uxbridge |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:30 - Dec 8 by Darran |
Get voted back on every 2 years see. |
Because nobody stood against them see. |  |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:40 - Dec 8 with 842 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:37 - Dec 8 by Uxbridge |
Because nobody stood against them see. |
And are they voted in on a show of hands at the meeting? | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:41 - Dec 8 with 831 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:40 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
And are they voted in on a show of hands at the meeting? |
From what I remember ballot papers are sent to members to complete and return. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:42 - Dec 8 with 825 views | Uxbridge |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:40 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
And are they voted in on a show of hands at the meeting? |
There is an election process. The latest round was publicised some months ago. All Trust members are then balloted. As no one else stood, their reelection was confirmed at the AGM. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:43 - Dec 8 with 817 views | Phil_S |
Board terms are for two years. At the end of a two year period the board member due for 'retirement' can elect to stand for re-election to the Trust board which is undertaken by a ballot of all voting members.
if for arguments sake there are 6 places for election and just 5 people stood for election then the said 5 are elected to the Trust board.
Each person standing for election must be seconded by (from memory) 6 Trust members
The positions of Supporter Director, Chairman, Treasurer, Secretary and Associate Director are decided by the serving Trust board and all are one year positions with the exception of a Supporter Director which is a two year position.
The position of Vice Chairman is the decision of the Chairman.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:43 - Dec 8 with 810 views | Darran |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:40 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
And are they voted in on a show of hands at the meeting? |
What's your beef here then? | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:46 - Dec 8 with 800 views | Phil_S |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:33 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
Thanks, that's helpful but not conclusive:
"Robust Constitution - crucial rules such as the Objects, Powers and Application of Profits, may only be altered if there is a 75% majority in favour. "
The question is 75% of what? All members or those turning up at general meetings.
Also important that it is a limited liability structure, and it seems to me that there has got to be further statutes detailing some of this stuff, whether or not that comes in the form of Articles of Association. |
It will be 75% of members turning up at an AGM (or if necessary an EGM) The only change I believe to the model rules came at last years AGM and is detailed in the minutes of such. | | | |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:46 - Dec 8 with 796 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:41 - Dec 8 by exiledclaseboy |
From what I remember ballot papers are sent to members to complete and return. |
OK, there has got to be a legal document detailing the mechanics of all this, in some form or another.
It looks to me like the legal structure is basically a limited liability company with some exemptions and some prescriptions, and I would still imagine that there is a document substantially similar to Articles of Association even if that is not the exact title on the first page.
That's what we need to look at.
However, from my side I now have urgent business to attend to at the meat counter in Sainsburys, and will be out of the office for the rest of the afternoon.
Keep digging chaps. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:47 - Dec 8 with 792 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:43 - Dec 8 by Phil_S |
Board terms are for two years. At the end of a two year period the board member due for 'retirement' can elect to stand for re-election to the Trust board which is undertaken by a ballot of all voting members.
if for arguments sake there are 6 places for election and just 5 people stood for election then the said 5 are elected to the Trust board.
Each person standing for election must be seconded by (from memory) 6 Trust members
The positions of Supporter Director, Chairman, Treasurer, Secretary and Associate Director are decided by the serving Trust board and all are one year positions with the exception of a Supporter Director which is a two year position.
The position of Vice Chairman is the decision of the Chairman.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
So if (for example) I wanted to stand for election to the Trust board I'd have to be seconded by six current board members who I may be standing to replace on the board?
If I've understood that right, it sounds dodgy. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:47 - Dec 8 with 753 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:43 - Dec 8 by Darran |
What's your beef here then? |
Lamb today I think. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:48 - Dec 8 with 753 views | Phil_S |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:32 - Dec 8 by exiledclaseboy |
Phil hasn't been chairman since the Trust was formed, that I do know. I think it's about four or five years. And I don't think they're limited to two-year terms, although that wording does imply that. They have to submit for re-election every two years. |
If I have my dates right I was elected onto the Trust board in 2004 and have been Chairman since the summer of 2005.
My next time of standing for election is 2014.
If I am right Huw was voted on as Supporter Director this summer so he will serve term until 2015 at which point board members could stand against him for the position if they felt the need.
I would need to check the constitution but I think you have to serve 12 months as a board member before you can stand for an 'officer' position which would be Chairman, Supporter Director or Treasurer. | | | |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:48 - Dec 8 with 747 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:43 - Dec 8 by Phil_S |
Board terms are for two years. At the end of a two year period the board member due for 'retirement' can elect to stand for re-election to the Trust board which is undertaken by a ballot of all voting members.
if for arguments sake there are 6 places for election and just 5 people stood for election then the said 5 are elected to the Trust board.
Each person standing for election must be seconded by (from memory) 6 Trust members
The positions of Supporter Director, Chairman, Treasurer, Secretary and Associate Director are decided by the serving Trust board and all are one year positions with the exception of a Supporter Director which is a two year position.
The position of Vice Chairman is the decision of the Chairman.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
"Each person standing for election must be seconded by (from memory) 6 board members "
Presumably you can scrap or modify this rule with 75% majority? | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:49 - Dec 8 with 746 views | Phil_S |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:47 - Dec 8 by exiledclaseboy |
So if (for example) I wanted to stand for election to the Trust board I'd have to be seconded by six current board members who I may be standing to replace on the board?
If I've understood that right, it sounds dodgy. |
No you would have to be seconded by six trust members.
I shall amend that as I did say board members - my bad
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:49 - Dec 8 with 740 views | Darran |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:47 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
Lamb today I think. |
Well there clearly is one so what is it? | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:50 - Dec 8 with 733 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:49 - Dec 8 by Darran |
Well there clearly is one so what is it? |
This is an interesting thread mun, don't hijack it. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:51 - Dec 8 with 729 views | Darran |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:50 - Dec 8 by exiledclaseboy |
This is an interesting thread mun, don't hijack it. |
I'm not I'm just asking a simple question. | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:51 - Dec 8 with 728 views | Phil_S |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:48 - Dec 8 by Shaky |
"Each person standing for election must be seconded by (from memory) 6 board members "
Presumably you can scrap or modify this rule with 75% majority? |
Yes although as I said above then it is Trust members not board members otherwise it would be a closed shop in effect
I'm not sure why anyone would want to scrap any rule that would stop people being seconded for a position on the Trust board? | | | |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:52 - Dec 8 with 717 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:51 - Dec 8 by Phil_S |
Yes although as I said above then it is Trust members not board members otherwise it would be a closed shop in effect
I'm not sure why anyone would want to scrap any rule that would stop people being seconded for a position on the Trust board? |
Isn't it already almost a closed shop though if in order to be able to have to stand for election to the board you have to be seconded by the very people you may end up replacing?
EDIT - Just seen your edit which makes this post moot. Thanks.
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
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| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:53 - Dec 8 with 714 views | Shaky |
| Future dividends and the Trust on 12:49 - Dec 8 by Darran |
Well there clearly is one so what is it? |
A large number of people seem to be dissatisfied with the actions of the club.
I have no beef other that helping to understand how their views might be democratically expressed via the Trust.
Do you have a problem granting supports and paid up trust members the right of democratic expression? | |
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