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It makes you wonder why he does not start with Hendo, with Rodney and Ayinde missing and use Hendo's experience, ability and footballing brain. But as others have implied, we are our own worst enemy, we overplay the ball at the back at times, which can cause unnecessary problems for our defence and like today cost us a goal. I agree with others, who have suggested that McNulty, who we all want him to succeed to reflect on why we are conceding unnecessary goals and change the tactics slightly.
Hopefully in the coming weeks we will getting players back from injury.
[Post edited 26 Oct 18:42]
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Barnet match thread on 18:45 - Oct 26 with 3286 views
McNulty it seems does,nt grasp the fact that by now every team in the division, will have done their homework on how we play week in week out. In particular teams are capitalising on our slow start, tippy tappy at the back, unwilling to shoot approach. Most on here can see it, opposing managers comment on it and even opposing team commentatators pick up on it immediately. We will win lots of games because we have some good players but fritter away many points because of McNultys predictable approach to games. Sadly, this squad should be shoe ins for a play off place but just like last season we will under achieve. Unless McNulty gets smart we will be mid-table by January. The very first thing that should change is the work rate for the first 15 minutes of every game. Starting at walking pace and playing at the back with what amounts to show boating is ruining our chances. As many point out, all teams are at it but just because someone jumps in the canal, does,nt mean we have to.
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Barnet match thread on 19:27 - Oct 26 with 3058 views
You won’t hear any arguments here around the ridiculousness of employing a style that costs stupid goals.
Not seen today’s goal, but the Halifax goal came from playing quickly and, vitally, the midfielder involved facing forwards - East on this occasion. It’s the balls into midfielders facing their own goal that costs us and so many other teams goals and makes no sense at all.
When we do play quickly and in a forward direction from the back it’s good to watch.
Its a simple coaching point that your midfield cannot spend its time watching their own keeper, they have to be on the half turn, to the left or right, but if you dont know the picture on the pitch behind you, you will inevitably lose the ball by turning into a tackle because the opponents will have worked out which way you are most likely to try and turn..... No matter what passing sport you play, football, hockey, lacrosse etc., you cannot be effective facing the wrong way.. Alan Shearer had the same problem at Newcastle when his goals dried up, until Bobby Robson shortly after taking over as manager wandered onto the training pitch and physically turned him so that he could see both goals with a small shift of his head. Problem solved!
[Post edited 26 Oct 19:28]
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Barnet match thread on 19:31 - Oct 26 with 3029 views
Barnet match thread on 18:45 - Oct 26 by BillyRudd
McNulty it seems does,nt grasp the fact that by now every team in the division, will have done their homework on how we play week in week out. In particular teams are capitalising on our slow start, tippy tappy at the back, unwilling to shoot approach. Most on here can see it, opposing managers comment on it and even opposing team commentatators pick up on it immediately. We will win lots of games because we have some good players but fritter away many points because of McNultys predictable approach to games. Sadly, this squad should be shoe ins for a play off place but just like last season we will under achieve. Unless McNulty gets smart we will be mid-table by January. The very first thing that should change is the work rate for the first 15 minutes of every game. Starting at walking pace and playing at the back with what amounts to show boating is ruining our chances. As many point out, all teams are at it but just because someone jumps in the canal, does,nt mean we have to.
I think Halifax result masks a trend, which is that teams have worked us out. Halifax we’re all over us first half, we scored against the run of play. Fax had to go for it second half, and the game got stretched, and because Fax had run their socks off second half, they tired, still mustered enough to equalise but we nicked it.
But, the trend is that all three results are available at kick off when we play, despite having better players on average than the opposing team. We very rarely control a game, whether the opposition is Barnet or Braintree, anything could happen. We’ve better players this year than last, so on average we’ve got a better points per game.
It’s a shame we don’t have any consistency of selection, yes we have injuries, but I’m not sure Jim knows what his best team is.
Maybe at some point Jim does get to select his best 11 with some consistency and they get the hang of the tactics he wants to use, and we do start to be able to get control over what pattern a game plays out, until he does results are just a lottery.
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Barnet match thread on 20:52 - Oct 26 with 2802 views
Barnet match thread on 20:52 - Oct 26 by dingdangblue
Awful first goal to concede. Looks like we should've equalised though.
We won't keep winning many football matches having already given ourselves a needless mountain to climb even more so against well drilled sides, Halifax should have been out of sight at half time luckily they weren't, Barnet today should have been further out of sight too, all too predictable.
[Post edited 26 Oct 23:48]
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Barnet match thread on 23:45 - Oct 26 with 2362 views
Barnet match thread on 22:11 - Oct 26 by nordenblue
We won't keep winning many football matches having already given ourselves a needless mountain to climb even more so against well drilled sides, Halifax should have been out of sight at half time luckily they weren't, Barnet today should have been further out of sight too, all too predictable.
[Post edited 26 Oct 23:48]
Yeah didn't like Jim's after match comment ' they made 1 mistake for our goal and we made 1 mistake for theirs'. The first goal is so important especially when you are the away team. To gift them that first goal so early without them having to do much is so demoralising, especially for all the fans who've travelled so far.
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
Barnet match thread on 23:45 - Oct 26 by dingdangblue
Yeah didn't like Jim's after match comment ' they made 1 mistake for our goal and we made 1 mistake for theirs'. The first goal is so important especially when you are the away team. To gift them that first goal so early without them having to do much is so demoralising, especially for all the fans who've travelled so far.
Yes, you feel sorry for the fans. Travelling all that way.at great expense and not long after the kick off we just gift Barnet a goal start and then chase the game all afternoon. A mistake that is now becoming predictable and is really damaging our season. The sort of mistakes that must start to affect the moral of the team. The second half display when we had nothing to lose and qdecided to have a go at them highlighted how within ourselves we are playing and how our structured approach to games is actually holding us back, showing our opponents too much respect. We produced chance after chance when the players were given their head to get at Barnet. Put McNicholas, Gilmour, Rowland, Rodney in the starting lineup yesterday and we would have probably won. The squad is definitely good enough to claim one of the play off spots but i have a feeling that the tactical straight jacket they appear to be playing in will prove to be our undoing, especially when playing at home. The manager also needs to step up to the plate and raise his game, if things aren't working then change it and put a stop to us keep throwing away games by trying to pass the ball around in front of our own goal. There's a pattern emerging, we are gifting our opponents far too many easy goals, comical goals and they are now starting to mount up and are stopping us from progressing. The manager seems to think it's acceptable though and part and parcel of the style he has decided that he wants us to play. Since football was invented there was a golden rule about trying to play football around your own penalty area, it's the wrong area of the pitch to do it and you'll come unstuck. We lost yesterday's game because we continue to put ourselves under pressure with the tactic, the buck stops with the manager but i fear for the psychological effect conceding these type of goals will have on the players. The tactics are giving us a uphill mountain to climb in a lot of games and causing frustration amongst the fan base who can see the folly of it all.
[Post edited 27 Oct 4:36]
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Barnet match thread on 07:03 - Oct 27 with 2008 views
What a miserable fecker he is. Not a motivational man is he? And he doesn't want to be in the FA Cup although he recognises that the fans might. Bet he is great at a party.
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Barnet match thread on 07:49 - Oct 27 with 1923 views
What a miserable fecker he is. Not a motivational man is he? And he doesn't want to be in the FA Cup although he recognises that the fans might. Bet he is great at a party.
At least he addresses the daft goal they gave away and expressed anger at how 'poxy' it was. He seemed genuinely concerned and upset about it. McNulty does the opposite, it's just part of the game to him. Is the result, winning games, the be all and end all for him? I don't think it is. I think McNulty derives pleasure from implementing his coaching plans and seeing how they play out in competitive games, player development also. I think he'll go on to better things but in a coaching capacity, i don't think he has the ruthlessness and win at all costs attitude to progress as a manager. Not addressing the conceding of these daft goals and just shrugging them off tells me that, they keep happening. The Barnet manager is rightly fuming in his interview, they have just beaten us and are above us in the league though. His interview is the opposite of McNulty's and hes called out the defensive mistake and highlighted it as something that needs to stop. McNulty is a safe pair of hands but i think he overthinks the game and his safety first tactics play into the hands of our opponents. We never start games quickly and seize the initiative, put our opponents on the back foot. The proof will be in the pudding when we look at the final league table but good teams don't hand goals to the opposition like we do. To just gloss over it in his post match interview and suggest it was a good game for the neutral is disrespectful to the fans and also the owners who are paying his wages. He is a nice man though.
[Post edited 27 Oct 8:05]
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Barnet match thread on 08:48 - Oct 27 with 1792 views
Barnet match thread on 04:15 - Oct 27 by TalkingSutty
Yes, you feel sorry for the fans. Travelling all that way.at great expense and not long after the kick off we just gift Barnet a goal start and then chase the game all afternoon. A mistake that is now becoming predictable and is really damaging our season. The sort of mistakes that must start to affect the moral of the team. The second half display when we had nothing to lose and qdecided to have a go at them highlighted how within ourselves we are playing and how our structured approach to games is actually holding us back, showing our opponents too much respect. We produced chance after chance when the players were given their head to get at Barnet. Put McNicholas, Gilmour, Rowland, Rodney in the starting lineup yesterday and we would have probably won. The squad is definitely good enough to claim one of the play off spots but i have a feeling that the tactical straight jacket they appear to be playing in will prove to be our undoing, especially when playing at home. The manager also needs to step up to the plate and raise his game, if things aren't working then change it and put a stop to us keep throwing away games by trying to pass the ball around in front of our own goal. There's a pattern emerging, we are gifting our opponents far too many easy goals, comical goals and they are now starting to mount up and are stopping us from progressing. The manager seems to think it's acceptable though and part and parcel of the style he has decided that he wants us to play. Since football was invented there was a golden rule about trying to play football around your own penalty area, it's the wrong area of the pitch to do it and you'll come unstuck. We lost yesterday's game because we continue to put ourselves under pressure with the tactic, the buck stops with the manager but i fear for the psychological effect conceding these type of goals will have on the players. The tactics are giving us a uphill mountain to climb in a lot of games and causing frustration amongst the fan base who can see the folly of it all.
[Post edited 27 Oct 4:36]
Just on that point about player morale: he's put Burger into a position of having to receive the ball under ridiculous pressure and before the game had settled down, destroyed his confidence. He got pulled at half time. Players make the "right noises" when interviewed (what else are they going to do?) but if i was Burger i'd be beyond pissed off
I'm sure the players don't walk out onto the pitch with the intention of not taking the game to opponents. When you first start kicking a ball as a kid, you don't practise playing it safe and sideways, you want to "have a go". Talk of the team being "resilient" and "together" like after the Halifax match looks more and more like the players just celebrating having the shackles taken off and being allowed to show what they can do. Shackles imposed by their coach. And then they're accused of not following instructions, ffs!
I'm sure the players also think about the effect on fans, especially at long-distance games. If we were losing because we're crap, Dale fans have an acceptance of that - we're used to it, at least the older ones are, and can have a laugh about it. What we're witnessing now is football with no fun, no joy, no spirit from the kick off, then leaving it too late. The tone has been set, McNulty won't, or more likely can't change. Never has a playoff place been witnessed with such lack of enthusiasm, and it comes from the top
Barnet match thread on 07:49 - Oct 27 by TalkingSutty
At least he addresses the daft goal they gave away and expressed anger at how 'poxy' it was. He seemed genuinely concerned and upset about it. McNulty does the opposite, it's just part of the game to him. Is the result, winning games, the be all and end all for him? I don't think it is. I think McNulty derives pleasure from implementing his coaching plans and seeing how they play out in competitive games, player development also. I think he'll go on to better things but in a coaching capacity, i don't think he has the ruthlessness and win at all costs attitude to progress as a manager. Not addressing the conceding of these daft goals and just shrugging them off tells me that, they keep happening. The Barnet manager is rightly fuming in his interview, they have just beaten us and are above us in the league though. His interview is the opposite of McNulty's and hes called out the defensive mistake and highlighted it as something that needs to stop. McNulty is a safe pair of hands but i think he overthinks the game and his safety first tactics play into the hands of our opponents. We never start games quickly and seize the initiative, put our opponents on the back foot. The proof will be in the pudding when we look at the final league table but good teams don't hand goals to the opposition like we do. To just gloss over it in his post match interview and suggest it was a good game for the neutral is disrespectful to the fans and also the owners who are paying his wages. He is a nice man though.
[Post edited 27 Oct 8:05]
He was also a great manager after we won at Fylde two weeks ago.
Again, not dismissing any of the valid concerns, but he will not change his philosophy. He can and should look at how to improve within it though. If we want to see something totally different, we would need a manager who plays totally differently.
And imagine how we’d all react having Barnet’s manager here. He’d have made the fallout to Hill’s interviews look quite calm!
He was also a great manager after we won at Fylde two weeks ago.
Again, not dismissing any of the valid concerns, but he will not change his philosophy. He can and should look at how to improve within it though. If we want to see something totally different, we would need a manager who plays totally differently.
And imagine how we’d all react having Barnet’s manager here. He’d have made the fallout to Hill’s interviews look quite calm!
Playing football in the wrong areas of the pitch is not a philosophy, it's suicidal in a lot of cases. It's even more suicidal when you haven't got the players with the technical ability to implement that style of play. So it's a double whammy. Some passion and clarity in a interview is refreshing ( Hill wasn't noted for clarity), it makes a change from the 'Jim and Greg 'show which is just as predictable as us throwing goals into our own net.
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Barnet match thread on 09:05 - Oct 27 with 1722 views
Those of you that have been to youth team matches what tactics/style do they deploy? As far as I understand the youth players should be being coached in a way so that they will eventually be able to fit seamlessly into the first team.
'Only happy when you've got it often makes you miss the journey'
Just on that point about player morale: he's put Burger into a position of having to receive the ball under ridiculous pressure and before the game had settled down, destroyed his confidence. He got pulled at half time. Players make the "right noises" when interviewed (what else are they going to do?) but if i was Burger i'd be beyond pissed off
I'm sure the players don't walk out onto the pitch with the intention of not taking the game to opponents. When you first start kicking a ball as a kid, you don't practise playing it safe and sideways, you want to "have a go". Talk of the team being "resilient" and "together" like after the Halifax match looks more and more like the players just celebrating having the shackles taken off and being allowed to show what they can do. Shackles imposed by their coach. And then they're accused of not following instructions, ffs!
I'm sure the players also think about the effect on fans, especially at long-distance games. If we were losing because we're crap, Dale fans have an acceptance of that - we're used to it, at least the older ones are, and can have a laugh about it. What we're witnessing now is football with no fun, no joy, no spirit from the kick off, then leaving it too late. The tone has been set, McNulty won't, or more likely can't change. Never has a playoff place been witnessed with such lack of enthusiasm, and it comes from the top
But they didn’t play with the shackles off against Halifax. They responded to the way the game panned out.
I can’t comment too much on yesterday as I didn’t see the game and it’s wrong to make too many judgments if that’s the case, so can only go off the opinions of those who did. We were poor first half and then really took it to them after our goal and should have at least got a point.
So going off that, why don’t we play like that for whole games because we obviously can? Thats down to the manager to make changes before and more quickly during games. Something he did against Halifax where we didn’t play spectacularly and take the game to the opposition, but we made the most of the ball when we had it and yes, were resilient without it.
I get it, I really do, this type of football is going to divide opinion. When it’s done right there positivity around the place (see after Fylde). When it’s done slightly differently and we still find a way to win most are still happy (see after Halifax). But in the main there is a good percentage of fans who don’t like it. That’s not going to change. So what do we do?
Impressing on the manager that when he can send out a team that battles, defends well and goes forward quickly (as on Tuesday) supporters can really identify with that is one way.telling him that playing dangerous balls into central areas around our box costs goals is one too. But what are the others?
Barnet match thread on 09:05 - Oct 27 by TalkingSutty
Playing football in the wrong areas of the pitch is not a philosophy, it's suicidal in a lot of cases. It's even more suicidal when you haven't got the players with the technical ability to implement that style of play. So it's a double whammy. Some passion and clarity in a interview is refreshing ( Hill wasn't noted for clarity), it makes a change from the 'Jim and Greg 'show which is just as predictable as us throwing goals into our own net.
But it is a philosophy. We might not like it, I certainly don’t, but that’s exactly what it is.
But it is a philosophy. We might not like it, I certainly don’t, but that’s exactly what it is.
Our interviews need a new interviewer.
Though, and this is hypocritical and most football fans are when we’re winning, when we use the philosophy effectively and play out quickly and forwards we look really good.
As per the second goal v Halifax.
It’s finding the balance. Because without playing that way we don’t score the second in midweek.
But it is a philosophy. We might not like it, I certainly don’t, but that’s exactly what it is.
Our interviews need a new interviewer.
It's a very frustrating philosophy. Jim needs to adapt his philosophy and put something in place to eliminate the risks associated with playing the ball out around our own penalty area. The interviewer needs to grow a pair and the manager needs to help him in the growth, but not in a sexual way because that would be wrong and not befitting of a family club.
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Barnet match thread on 09:26 - Oct 27 with 1577 views
But they didn’t play with the shackles off against Halifax. They responded to the way the game panned out.
I can’t comment too much on yesterday as I didn’t see the game and it’s wrong to make too many judgments if that’s the case, so can only go off the opinions of those who did. We were poor first half and then really took it to them after our goal and should have at least got a point.
So going off that, why don’t we play like that for whole games because we obviously can? Thats down to the manager to make changes before and more quickly during games. Something he did against Halifax where we didn’t play spectacularly and take the game to the opposition, but we made the most of the ball when we had it and yes, were resilient without it.
I get it, I really do, this type of football is going to divide opinion. When it’s done right there positivity around the place (see after Fylde). When it’s done slightly differently and we still find a way to win most are still happy (see after Halifax). But in the main there is a good percentage of fans who don’t like it. That’s not going to change. So what do we do?
Impressing on the manager that when he can send out a team that battles, defends well and goes forward quickly (as on Tuesday) supporters can really identify with that is one way.telling him that playing dangerous balls into central areas around our box costs goals is one too. But what are the others?
[Post edited 27 Oct 9:19]
The midfield and forwards start games in a very static way, due to the "play it unsafe" [TM] philosophy. It's an overall attempt at anti-galvanisation which is anti-sport and subdues the crowd at home to the level of a funeral service at most games. The singing section rightly got praised against Halifax but the reason why the game looked different is due to Halifax taking the game to us, not any change in tactics from the start.
The midfield and forwards start games in a very static way, due to the "play it unsafe" [TM] philosophy. It's an overall attempt at anti-galvanisation which is anti-sport and subdues the crowd at home to the level of a funeral service at most games. The singing section rightly got praised against Halifax but the reason why the game looked different is due to Halifax taking the game to us, not any change in tactics from the start.
[Post edited 27 Oct 9:35]
Exactly. The team responded to the game as it played out. And McNulty deserves a lot of praise for his tactical adjustments and subs too. We will not change our tactical philosophy but the manger can do more to change how it’s implemented, especially from the start.
When we have started some games well, albeit nowhere near enough, one feature has been getting midfielders playing forward rather than backwards and utilising the outside central defenders pushing on. We are missing crucial players like TAR who help with that and need others, like East did the other night, to play facing away from their own goal.
Bit harsh on the crowd, as the Sandy has been in good voice most of the season.
Movement off the ball is required imo. We play statues - foot on the ball looking for a player to pass to, who are all stationary with an opponent standing close by waiting to pounce on whomsoever the ball is passed to. Recipe for disaster. What happened to football being a simple game? Halifax played the way I remember we played like. When I played we had a few basic principals drummed into us:
When defending have your back to your goal When attacking try to receive the ball facing the opponent's goal. If not turn and shoot. NEVER pass the ball across your own penalty area. Cover each post at corners.
Simples.
The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance.
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Barnet match thread on 09:43 - Oct 27 with 1478 views
Movement off the ball is required imo. We play statues - foot on the ball looking for a player to pass to, who are all stationary with an opponent standing close by waiting to pounce on whomsoever the ball is passed to. Recipe for disaster. What happened to football being a simple game? Halifax played the way I remember we played like. When I played we had a few basic principals drummed into us:
When defending have your back to your goal When attacking try to receive the ball facing the opponent's goal. If not turn and shoot. NEVER pass the ball across your own penalty area. Cover each post at corners.
I have just watched the highlights and their first goal was shocking to say the least, Burger got caught facing the goal, instead of looking to go forward, after receiving the ball from Robson, leaving the Barnet player with an open goal. Even the Barnet commentators seemed shocked by the Dale's defending and asked what were they doing. To be fair, their second was a good goal and again the Dales goal came about from a back pass, which lacked any pace and Hendo sneaked in to score. Senior was unlucky to hit the post from an angled shot.
However the first goal reminded me of the goals conceded away at Eastleigh when 2 of the goals were down to messing around at the back. When will learn from the stupid errors? Hopefully we can get most of the injured back for the Oldham game, but Ferguson was missing yesterday with a knock, he may be back this week and there is a chance somebody else could be back next week.
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Barnet match thread on 10:09 - Oct 27 with 1346 views
Surprised noone has mentioned it but now that Kairo has hit his bad patch, inevitable with any striker, particularly after his spectacular start to the season, why do we have to fall back on a striker coming up to 40 to supplement him. Hendo will always be my hero and was superb yesterday, but there should be alternatives.
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