| Season Ticket Update on 18:51 - Jul 29 with 2311 views | Sandyman |
| Season Ticket Update on 13:54 - Jul 29 by Shun |
I accept that I’m in the vast majority here, but I’ll add my piece and say that I think a 6-page mountain has been made out of a molehill. Yes, communication could have been much better and that’s an ongoing problem at the club, but in my eyes the original statement was fairly clear and certainly not worthy of such condemnation.
It was a nice idea by the Trust and the club did well for agreeing to it. Even if it’s not specifically the club who are benefiting key workers, but us instead, it’s still a nice gesture.
I appreciate that a lot of people were upset and that this can be seen as just one more in a long line of missteps from the club, but looking at it as an isolated incident I really don’t think it deserves the outrage it received. |
This. Communications have now been given greater clarity, make the choice which suits you no matter what anyone else says, and move on. |  | |  |
| Season Ticket Update on 20:50 - Jul 29 with 2129 views | judd |
| Season Ticket Update on 14:40 - Jul 29 by ChaffRAFC |
Maybe the club are waiting till we have fixtures so they can more accurately tell people how many games the season tickets are for because God forbid they do it now, say you may miss three games and the fixtures turn out to mean it's four. We'll have a 20 page thread about a refund on that one game, there will be Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling! Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...The dead rising from the grave! Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!
(Yes, that's a Ghostbusters quote)
As for price increases, we knew a price increase was coming. The club need that money more than ever. Even with an increase, we'll still end up being one of the cheapest, if not the cheapest season ticket in the league, probably the whole EFL and some non-league sides as well. The cheap season tickets has made people forget about the value of them and what they will save compared to other clubs. |
How do you know the club need the money more than ever now?
What size increase would you pay for a season ticket based on 23 home games? |  |
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| Season Ticket Update on 21:11 - Jul 29 with 2096 views | James1980 |
| Season Ticket Update on 20:50 - Jul 29 by judd |
How do you know the club need the money more than ever now?
What size increase would you pay for a season ticket based on 23 home games? |
What would the price be at the 16/17 season prices be adjusted for inflation? Anything over that would not be justifiable imo. |  |
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| Season Ticket Update on 21:22 - Jul 29 with 2072 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Season Ticket Update on 20:50 - Jul 29 by judd |
How do you know the club need the money more than ever now?
What size increase would you pay for a season ticket based on 23 home games? |
Because we've had no income for four months, had a loan from the council, had to top up players wages etc etc. I would say the club need as much money as they can possibly get while trying not to price people out.
My increase is going to be based on the fact that my season ticket was a goldbond one. I fully expect the cost of season tickets to go up to about £200-£220 and I've accepted that and that would still be cheaper than 95% of clubs. If its 20 games because of restrictions then we can't help that though I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect a pass for Ifollow for any missed games before the October government advised date. |  |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Season Ticket Update on 21:25 - Jul 29 with 2060 views | James1980 |
I take back my previous comment that would have them starting at around £345. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 21:47 - Jul 29 with 2004 views | judd |
| Season Ticket Update on 21:22 - Jul 29 by ChaffRAFC |
Because we've had no income for four months, had a loan from the council, had to top up players wages etc etc. I would say the club need as much money as they can possibly get while trying not to price people out.
My increase is going to be based on the fact that my season ticket was a goldbond one. I fully expect the cost of season tickets to go up to about £200-£220 and I've accepted that and that would still be cheaper than 95% of clubs. If its 20 games because of restrictions then we can't help that though I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect a pass for Ifollow for any missed games before the October government advised date. |
We've had no income? Not even furlough payments?
Do you know our cash position?
Do you know our expenditure levels?
Do you know the details of payments received from the high profile sponsorship deals recently announced?
Do you know admission fees (including season tickets) represent c. 16% of income? 6 home games and a delay in season ticket sales more than covered by a loan that should be covered in September by the Dawson sell on fee, in my opinion.
If we need the money so much now, why offer cash refunds for last season?
Have you heard that the PL has promised £2.5m to each L1 & 2 club?
Does the increase in the Sandy season ticket price represent something like 30-40% on last season's full price and that would be acceptable for the standard of football we've persevered of late?
Each to their own in decision making on what they would spend but in my view you are in no position to make such cocksure statements about the club. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 22:22 - Jul 29 with 1932 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Season Ticket Update on 21:47 - Jul 29 by judd |
We've had no income? Not even furlough payments?
Do you know our cash position?
Do you know our expenditure levels?
Do you know the details of payments received from the high profile sponsorship deals recently announced?
Do you know admission fees (including season tickets) represent c. 16% of income? 6 home games and a delay in season ticket sales more than covered by a loan that should be covered in September by the Dawson sell on fee, in my opinion.
If we need the money so much now, why offer cash refunds for last season?
Have you heard that the PL has promised £2.5m to each L1 & 2 club?
Does the increase in the Sandy season ticket price represent something like 30-40% on last season's full price and that would be acceptable for the standard of football we've persevered of late?
Each to their own in decision making on what they would spend but in my view you are in no position to make such cocksure statements about the club. |
They're not cocksure statements, they're assumptions. They may be wrong, they may not be far off. Nobody knows the answers to the questions apart from the board of directors but I would argue many clubs, ourselves included will have been affected in a negative way for the last four months. If I'm wrong in that then good.
The cash refunds are offered because we have to.
The PL money will be huge but its not arrived yet and as we've seen with the Dawson money that hasn't arrived when we were expecting it, its difficult and naive to budget for money we haven't received.
The standard of football is league one football and has been for the best part of a decade. Our prices are less than all other league one clubs and probably all of league two, even with the estimated price increase. We were probably paying more for season tickets 10 years ago than we will be this season.
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Season Ticket Update on 22:31 - Jul 29 with 1916 views | James1980 |
| Season Ticket Update on 22:22 - Jul 29 by ChaffRAFC |
They're not cocksure statements, they're assumptions. They may be wrong, they may not be far off. Nobody knows the answers to the questions apart from the board of directors but I would argue many clubs, ourselves included will have been affected in a negative way for the last four months. If I'm wrong in that then good.
The cash refunds are offered because we have to.
The PL money will be huge but its not arrived yet and as we've seen with the Dawson money that hasn't arrived when we were expecting it, its difficult and naive to budget for money we haven't received.
The standard of football is league one football and has been for the best part of a decade. Our prices are less than all other league one clubs and probably all of league two, even with the estimated price increase. We were probably paying more for season tickets 10 years ago than we will be this season.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Starting from £314.50 so prices have been slashed in the past few years | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 22:37 - Jul 29 with 1903 views | judd |
| Season Ticket Update on 22:22 - Jul 29 by ChaffRAFC |
They're not cocksure statements, they're assumptions. They may be wrong, they may not be far off. Nobody knows the answers to the questions apart from the board of directors but I would argue many clubs, ourselves included will have been affected in a negative way for the last four months. If I'm wrong in that then good.
The cash refunds are offered because we have to.
The PL money will be huge but its not arrived yet and as we've seen with the Dawson money that hasn't arrived when we were expecting it, its difficult and naive to budget for money we haven't received.
The standard of football is league one football and has been for the best part of a decade. Our prices are less than all other league one clubs and probably all of league two, even with the estimated price increase. We were probably paying more for season tickets 10 years ago than we will be this season.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
They were not assumptions. You made statements without caveating them.
All clubs and businesses have been affected but there are ways and means of managing the effects.
The Dawson money is not yet due and the club will always budget for receipts in the future. It's called cash flow forecasting and is far from naive. It's common and sensible business planning.
The standard of football is survival by the skin of our teeth and will only get worse, in my opinion. It's been awful to watch these past 3 seasons bar a few cup games and Rotherham at home last time. In my opinion.
You'll probably find you can afford a car , never mind a lower league season ticket, cheaper than you would have 10 years ago. We had an economic crisis 10 or so years ago that led to austerity. We currently have a pandemic massively affecting employment and disposable income. We have cut expenditure significantly for next season.
I respect your right to expressing an opinion, but make it plain it's just that please. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 09:35 - Jul 30 with 1739 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Season Ticket Update on 22:37 - Jul 29 by judd |
They were not assumptions. You made statements without caveating them.
All clubs and businesses have been affected but there are ways and means of managing the effects.
The Dawson money is not yet due and the club will always budget for receipts in the future. It's called cash flow forecasting and is far from naive. It's common and sensible business planning.
The standard of football is survival by the skin of our teeth and will only get worse, in my opinion. It's been awful to watch these past 3 seasons bar a few cup games and Rotherham at home last time. In my opinion.
You'll probably find you can afford a car , never mind a lower league season ticket, cheaper than you would have 10 years ago. We had an economic crisis 10 or so years ago that led to austerity. We currently have a pandemic massively affecting employment and disposable income. We have cut expenditure significantly for next season.
I respect your right to expressing an opinion, but make it plain it's just that please. |
I'll put a disclaimer on all future posts that all views are just opinion.
Fact is we're paying for League One football, whether you like the style or that we will lose more than we win or not, it's League One and is tremendous value for money.
The cheap season tickets that were introduced didn't have the desired effect. We aimed to have a lot more uptake and then didn't revert the prices back when it didn't work. We've got around 2700 or so season ticket holders and had the prices stayed the same, I don't think we'd have had a huge difference in that number.
As for the car scenario, you may be right, but on the other side, I paid £70 for Liam Gallagher tickets that may have only cost £40 or so years ago.
I believe the club need more money as we have more staff, players and non-players on a lot bigger wages than we used to have.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Season Ticket Update on 09:46 - Jul 30 with 1722 views | Dalenet |
Realistically the club is unlikely to sell as many STs as normal, will have to charge for fewer games, will have far less away fans due to seating restrictions. We normally expect to take just under £1m a year from gate receipts and STs. So if the club was being realistic about making that money up from those attending games, it will need to charge around£450. And as the ticket holders will need to be spread out it won't be able to charge different levels for any of the 3 seated stands.
Briels and others were keen that we understood that the club was financially desperate and need to back the club with our wallets so I am assuming that people will be prepared to pay that kind of cost - which isn't out of line with other clubs in the division. | | | |
| Season Ticket Update on 10:04 - Jul 30 with 1697 views | nordenblue |
| Season Ticket Update on 09:35 - Jul 30 by ChaffRAFC |
I'll put a disclaimer on all future posts that all views are just opinion.
Fact is we're paying for League One football, whether you like the style or that we will lose more than we win or not, it's League One and is tremendous value for money.
The cheap season tickets that were introduced didn't have the desired effect. We aimed to have a lot more uptake and then didn't revert the prices back when it didn't work. We've got around 2700 or so season ticket holders and had the prices stayed the same, I don't think we'd have had a huge difference in that number.
As for the car scenario, you may be right, but on the other side, I paid £70 for Liam Gallagher tickets that may have only cost £40 or so years ago.
I believe the club need more money as we have more staff, players and non-players on a lot bigger wages than we used to have.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. |
To be honest Chaff even at £40 you've been rubbered to watch him....  | | | |
| Season Ticket Update on 10:06 - Jul 30 with 1695 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Season Ticket Update on 10:04 - Jul 30 by nordenblue |
To be honest Chaff even at £40 you've been rubbered to watch him.... |
Was waiting to see who would be the first to comment on choice of artist!  | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Season Ticket Update on 10:13 - Jul 30 with 1677 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Season Ticket Update on 09:46 - Jul 30 by Dalenet |
Realistically the club is unlikely to sell as many STs as normal, will have to charge for fewer games, will have far less away fans due to seating restrictions. We normally expect to take just under £1m a year from gate receipts and STs. So if the club was being realistic about making that money up from those attending games, it will need to charge around£450. And as the ticket holders will need to be spread out it won't be able to charge different levels for any of the 3 seated stands.
Briels and others were keen that we understood that the club was financially desperate and need to back the club with our wallets so I am assuming that people will be prepared to pay that kind of cost - which isn't out of line with other clubs in the division. |
But we're unable to go into stadiums until October and will have a reduction of capacity to approximately 2500-3000 to comply with social distancing? The fact that season ticket holders get that priority may mean we see more season tickets sold? If you don't get a season ticket, we sell as many as our reduced capacity allows, pay on the day customers may not be able to get to a game while social distancing is in place which could be for the remainder of 2020? Maybe longer, maybe a little less?
If we sell more season tickets than our reduced capacity allows, f*** knows how we then deal with that! Maybe a cap on how many season tickets we can sell?
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:00 - Jul 30 with 1618 views | Dalenet |
| Season Ticket Update on 10:13 - Jul 30 by ChaffRAFC |
But we're unable to go into stadiums until October and will have a reduction of capacity to approximately 2500-3000 to comply with social distancing? The fact that season ticket holders get that priority may mean we see more season tickets sold? If you don't get a season ticket, we sell as many as our reduced capacity allows, pay on the day customers may not be able to get to a game while social distancing is in place which could be for the remainder of 2020? Maybe longer, maybe a little less?
If we sell more season tickets than our reduced capacity allows, f*** knows how we then deal with that! Maybe a cap on how many season tickets we can sell?
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Yes Chaff that is the issue. We can't go into the stadium until October and capacity will be massively restricted. So the club has to recover £1m from a smaller pool of people.
We won't sell 2500 seasons because:
1. Too many people have been hurt by Covid financially
2. A cohort are terrified of going to the stadium - in the same way they won't go shopping
3. Some people won't risk stumping up cash up front if there is so much uncertainty with a risk of a local or second lockdown
4. Some won't want to move seats and they are going to have to do that
So if we sell 1500 tickets we will be lucky. Match day ticket sales may be restricted to less than 1000
So I guess the CEO has a dilema. Does he price the product to cover his income shortfalls and price too for demand - those that want to come can pay more?
In my mind a ST of £450 and a pay on the day ticket £30 will be the right price to reflect the need of the club. But I suspect there will be outrage as it will price some people out. But as others on this thread have shown - if we are real fans we will have to pay it | | | |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:10 - Jul 30 with 1601 views | 442Dale |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:00 - Jul 30 by Dalenet |
Yes Chaff that is the issue. We can't go into the stadium until October and capacity will be massively restricted. So the club has to recover £1m from a smaller pool of people.
We won't sell 2500 seasons because:
1. Too many people have been hurt by Covid financially
2. A cohort are terrified of going to the stadium - in the same way they won't go shopping
3. Some people won't risk stumping up cash up front if there is so much uncertainty with a risk of a local or second lockdown
4. Some won't want to move seats and they are going to have to do that
So if we sell 1500 tickets we will be lucky. Match day ticket sales may be restricted to less than 1000
So I guess the CEO has a dilema. Does he price the product to cover his income shortfalls and price too for demand - those that want to come can pay more?
In my mind a ST of £450 and a pay on the day ticket £30 will be the right price to reflect the need of the club. But I suspect there will be outrage as it will price some people out. But as others on this thread have shown - if we are real fans we will have to pay it |
There certainly shouldn’t be a situation where we are using the phrase “real fans”! Everyone’s circumstances are different and all fans will do their best. Maybe the club will have adjusted their budget to expect far less than £1m in ticket sales.
It’s going to need some creativity around pricing and how “season tickets” will actually work with the uncertainty around how many games we will be able to attend. |  |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:12 - Jul 30 with 1600 views | judd |
| Season Ticket Update on 09:35 - Jul 30 by ChaffRAFC |
I'll put a disclaimer on all future posts that all views are just opinion.
Fact is we're paying for League One football, whether you like the style or that we will lose more than we win or not, it's League One and is tremendous value for money.
The cheap season tickets that were introduced didn't have the desired effect. We aimed to have a lot more uptake and then didn't revert the prices back when it didn't work. We've got around 2700 or so season ticket holders and had the prices stayed the same, I don't think we'd have had a huge difference in that number.
As for the car scenario, you may be right, but on the other side, I paid £70 for Liam Gallagher tickets that may have only cost £40 or so years ago.
I believe the club need more money as we have more staff, players and non-players on a lot bigger wages than we used to have.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. |
I won't disagree that the value for money has made watching us acceptable.
I am not privy to the numbers of season tickets sold pre and during the low price era, but what I do believe is that we just do not sell as a club. If we cannot shift a low priced ticket for bottom end league 1 performances then how can we justify increasing prices and expect the same number to purchase the season tickets?
What market research has been undertaken to understand local pricing points to get people to Spotland both from a season ticket perspective or an on the day walk up? Competitor pricing is largely irrelevant as most football fans will only support one team. It's alternatives to attending matches that are the threat to Rochdale.
You believe the club has more staff, players and non-players - I believe this to not be the case right now.
As for Liam Gallagher, it is a fact that musicians used to make their money from record/CD sales, and tours and live performances promoted sales of the record, these tours usually at a loss offset by record sales. With a massive decline in the sales of CDs, artists now make their money from performing live and gig ticket prices have rocketed in recent years.
Where would you stand now if the club reinstated the Gala Dinner end of season night, assuming social distancing had disappeared? | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:41 - Jul 30 with 1551 views | AtThePeake |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:00 - Jul 30 by Dalenet |
Yes Chaff that is the issue. We can't go into the stadium until October and capacity will be massively restricted. So the club has to recover £1m from a smaller pool of people.
We won't sell 2500 seasons because:
1. Too many people have been hurt by Covid financially
2. A cohort are terrified of going to the stadium - in the same way they won't go shopping
3. Some people won't risk stumping up cash up front if there is so much uncertainty with a risk of a local or second lockdown
4. Some won't want to move seats and they are going to have to do that
So if we sell 1500 tickets we will be lucky. Match day ticket sales may be restricted to less than 1000
So I guess the CEO has a dilema. Does he price the product to cover his income shortfalls and price too for demand - those that want to come can pay more?
In my mind a ST of £450 and a pay on the day ticket £30 will be the right price to reflect the need of the club. But I suspect there will be outrage as it will price some people out. But as others on this thread have shown - if we are real fans we will have to pay it |
Happy to put my hands up and say I'm not a real fan then because there's no chance I'm paying £30 to watch a League One game. |  |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:45 - Jul 30 with 1537 views | TVOS1907 |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:41 - Jul 30 by AtThePeake |
Happy to put my hands up and say I'm not a real fan then because there's no chance I'm paying £30 to watch a League One game. |
You could buy half a horrible green Spurs away shirt for that price! |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:49 - Jul 30 with 1524 views | Dalenet |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:10 - Jul 30 by 442Dale |
There certainly shouldn’t be a situation where we are using the phrase “real fans”! Everyone’s circumstances are different and all fans will do their best. Maybe the club will have adjusted their budget to expect far less than £1m in ticket sales.
It’s going to need some creativity around pricing and how “season tickets” will actually work with the uncertainty around how many games we will be able to attend. |
Reread the thread. I am not a real fan either | | | |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:53 - Jul 30 with 1514 views | AtThePeake |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:45 - Jul 30 by TVOS1907 |
You could buy half a horrible green Spurs away shirt for that price! |
Ha!
Pertinently though, I could also buy a ticket to a Spurs away game for that price.
I've said it before but I really feel like L1/L2 football already offers the worst value for money. The Premier League prices are at times extortionate, but you pay for a better standard of football, a better atmosphere, better facilities etc. In non-league, although the standard on show is obviously lower, if you're a neutral it tends to be a better day out with the reduced prices and the freedom to have a pint on the terrace etc if you wish. When Dale aren't playing on a Saturday and I'm looking for a game to go to, I'm far more inclined to go to a PL/Champ or a Non-League game than I am L1 or L2. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:58 - Jul 30 with 1499 views | boromat |
Not sure it's been mentioned but the new ticketing system may have been implemented at just the right time. And hopefully it's capable of allowing a much more flexible approach to ticketing. So as well as full blown season tickets maybe there can be other forms of flexible payment methods which means when fans can't attend games they don't pay for example but still get a cheaper rate because they sign up to the season. Not sure exactly what schemes could be used but hopefully there's options available now that weren't before. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:59 - Jul 30 with 1498 views | judd |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:53 - Jul 30 by AtThePeake |
Ha!
Pertinently though, I could also buy a ticket to a Spurs away game for that price.
I've said it before but I really feel like L1/L2 football already offers the worst value for money. The Premier League prices are at times extortionate, but you pay for a better standard of football, a better atmosphere, better facilities etc. In non-league, although the standard on show is obviously lower, if you're a neutral it tends to be a better day out with the reduced prices and the freedom to have a pint on the terrace etc if you wish. When Dale aren't playing on a Saturday and I'm looking for a game to go to, I'm far more inclined to go to a PL/Champ or a Non-League game than I am L1 or L2. |
The American investors alluded to increasing the number of commercial staff in order to increase revenue streams - absolutely the right thinking.
It's takes some creative thinking to generate ideas about enhancing income - we cannot just stuff prices up 40 or 50% or some other horrendous number fans are bandying about elsewhere because times are hard. | |
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| Season Ticket Update on 11:59 - Jul 30 with 1496 views | dawlishdale |
I'm sure I read that the Sandy Lane stand will not be open next season due to social distancing issues. Thus, I wonder how much people backing the club are willing to pay for:
Main Stand (or Willbutts stand, as I doubt away fans will be allowed) and TDS stand.
Last year prices were
Main Stand £250 (£350 after early bird discount)
TDS £200 (£300 after early bird discount)
There were no discounts for OAP's I think this means that OAP's now pay more than before the "cheap" ticket scheme started; especially when you factor in huge price rises for car parking at the ground, which has more than doubled in the past 2 seasons...a big factor for our OAP's.
Also, please remember that you might not be able to sit with your mates at games; we don't know how many games we will actually see, and we have just released our three leading goalscorers.
And if we are so desperate for money, how about the £20 season ticket for juniors pricing? Perhaps that will have to rise, seeing as our capacity will be so much reduced. Before, we had thousands of empty seats to fill, and so I was all in favour of juniors for next to nothing, but maybe things will be different now.... | | | |
| Season Ticket Update on 12:04 - Jul 30 with 1478 views | isitme |
| Season Ticket Update on 11:58 - Jul 30 by boromat |
Not sure it's been mentioned but the new ticketing system may have been implemented at just the right time. And hopefully it's capable of allowing a much more flexible approach to ticketing. So as well as full blown season tickets maybe there can be other forms of flexible payment methods which means when fans can't attend games they don't pay for example but still get a cheaper rate because they sign up to the season. Not sure exactly what schemes could be used but hopefully there's options available now that weren't before. |
It makes it much easier to monitor monthly payments as the cards can just be deactivated if someone does not pay. |  | | |
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