| Financial statements to 31/5/17 09:50 - Mar 2 with 14802 views | CroydonCaptJack |
I think these must be imminent now. I am pretty sure they were due by the end of Feb so we should find out pretty soon how much better (or less worse!) we are doing as regards to FFP. |  | | |  |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:49 - Mar 7 with 3574 views | paulparker |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:42 - Mar 7 by stevec |
Still a lot better than it was.
Frightening how little ticket income pays towards the bills, doubt if it would fund our 17 player match day squad having a kick about on the Scrubs each week.
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it. |
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it.
sorry Steve its because of SKY we have modern football in the state its in and idiots like TF buying clubs like QPR so they can ruin them |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:50 - Mar 7 with 3577 views | EastR |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:42 - Mar 7 by stevec |
Still a lot better than it was.
Frightening how little ticket income pays towards the bills, doubt if it would fund our 17 player match day squad having a kick about on the Scrubs each week.
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it. |
the FL wouldn't be full of overpaid millionaires? |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:52 - Mar 7 with 3572 views | qprd |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:06 - Mar 7 by Gloucs_R |
So, still losing money then.....
How many championship clubs break even / make money? |
Championship football teams don't make money. They actually lose quite a lot.
Championship football is a terrible business to enter into. You are basically just betting on promotion to the prem, which is filled with TV money
The only problem with this strategy is that 8-10ish of the 24 teams in the Championship are all splashing major cash to get to the Prem. This makes it more costly to roll the dice on promotion, and also less likely that you'll get to the promised land (as theres more competition)
There is only one way for a team like QPR to make money in the Championship, and that is to develop young players and sell them on at a profit... | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:01 - Mar 7 with 3538 views | Gloucs_R |
So we need to become a selling club, with a new stadium attracting attendances of 30k every week........
Should be pretty easy to do. |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:11 - Mar 7 with 3521 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:01 - Mar 7 by Gloucs_R |
So we need to become a selling club, with a new stadium attracting attendances of 30k every week........
Should be pretty easy to do. |
The new stadium will be used for more than football traffic 23-25 times a season. So many people seem to overlook this fact and think that QPR home games are all the finance we are ever likely to receive. |  |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:18 - Mar 7 with 3502 views | stevec |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:49 - Mar 7 by paulparker |
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it.
sorry Steve its because of SKY we have modern football in the state its in and idiots like TF buying clubs like QPR so they can ruin them |
Very true. Guess what I meant was, we are where we are so although Sky have created this monster, the whole thing would go belly up without them now. |  | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:19 - Mar 7 with 3492 views | Gloucs_R |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:11 - Mar 7 by Esox_Lucius |
The new stadium will be used for more than football traffic 23-25 times a season. So many people seem to overlook this fact and think that QPR home games are all the finance we are ever likely to receive. |
I get it  | |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:23 - Mar 7 with 3478 views | colinallcars |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:42 - Mar 7 by stevec |
Still a lot better than it was.
Frightening how little ticket income pays towards the bills, doubt if it would fund our 17 player match day squad having a kick about on the Scrubs each week.
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it. |
But surely it was the Sky money coming into football that caused clubs to sign players at unbelievably high transfer fees and wages that started this mess in the first place. |  | | |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:11 - Mar 7 with 3277 views | EalingHoop81 |
Interesting that our loss is almost equal to the interest charge on the shareholder loans, the majority of which were capitalised as ordinary shares. The FL refused to allow the write off of a shareholder loan as reducing the loss that led to the FFP fine. Using the same approach, the interest charge on the shareholder loans should also be discounted - but I bet under the rules of FFP they aren’t.
The Mittals are being diluted by the capitalisation of the interest leads to Ruben having more shares. Doesn’t mean they are less committed but equally they don’t appear to be making additional loans.
Unsurprisingly the goiing concern nature of the group is entirely dependent on the ongoing support of the shareholders. The largest loan is also due within the year. Presumably that will be capitalised pretty soon or become repayable on demand!! | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:31 - Mar 7 with 3233 views | QPR_Jim |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 16:18 - Mar 7 by stevec |
Very true. Guess what I meant was, we are where we are so although Sky have created this monster, the whole thing would go belly up without them now. |
I guess they would either move abroad or take a pay cut, although depending on the circumstances they may not have the option to move abroad if other countries experience the same drop in revenue.
Sky may get muscled out by online streaming services eventually but I honestly can't see a scenario where the money would disappear completely, stagnate or reduce but nothing that would leave a major void. Wouldn't be that upset if the money did, disappear though. |  | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:48 - Mar 7 with 3195 views | Gloucs_R |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:11 - Mar 7 by EalingHoop81 |
Interesting that our loss is almost equal to the interest charge on the shareholder loans, the majority of which were capitalised as ordinary shares. The FL refused to allow the write off of a shareholder loan as reducing the loss that led to the FFP fine. Using the same approach, the interest charge on the shareholder loans should also be discounted - but I bet under the rules of FFP they aren’t.
The Mittals are being diluted by the capitalisation of the interest leads to Ruben having more shares. Doesn’t mean they are less committed but equally they don’t appear to be making additional loans.
Unsurprisingly the goiing concern nature of the group is entirely dependent on the ongoing support of the shareholders. The largest loan is also due within the year. Presumably that will be capitalised pretty soon or become repayable on demand!! |
Doesn't Ruben part own the new Los Angeles football team? | |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:52 - Mar 7 with 3185 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
I think some should think twice or more before slatting the owners as the fact is, without them financing the club and subsidizing the fans there would be no club. |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 20:27 - Mar 7 with 3136 views | VancouverHoop |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:48 - Mar 7 by Gloucs_R |
Doesn't Ruben part own the new Los Angeles football team? |
Yes, but so are 21 others (including Cardiff's Vincent Tan), they each own a very small percentage. [Post edited 7 Mar 2018 20:28]
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 22:26 - Mar 7 with 3017 views | KerryE |
What's this all about
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 22:56 - Mar 7 with 2984 views | qprd |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 22:26 - Mar 7 by KerryE |
What's this all about
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Nothing sneaky any this
The owners don’t collect interest from the club on the shareholder loans. It gets capitalised (aka converted into equity | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 23:14 - Mar 7 with 2948 views | bob566 |
I cant blame sky. Remember when it first came with the monday night football. We were up first against city. The alive and kicking song came on. Sinton equalized with a beauty. I was hooked. Its saturation now though | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 23:17 - Mar 7 with 2943 views | superhoopdownunder |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:31 - Mar 7 by QPR_Jim |
I guess they would either move abroad or take a pay cut, although depending on the circumstances they may not have the option to move abroad if other countries experience the same drop in revenue.
Sky may get muscled out by online streaming services eventually but I honestly can't see a scenario where the money would disappear completely, stagnate or reduce but nothing that would leave a major void. Wouldn't be that upset if the money did, disappear though. |
Most footballers would still be playing whether they got a grand a week or a hundred grand. If there was less money in the game what else would they do? Be a nuclear scientist? (they only earn on average 40k per year)
What's happened to football is sad - unfortunately broadcasting has taken over and due to all the money in the game - even very ordinary players become very wealthy (in comparison to the general public)
The fans are less able to relate to players these days partly due to this.
I am pleased to say I think QPR have players with better character playing for us at the moment. | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 00:03 - Mar 8 with 2892 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 22:56 - Mar 7 by qprd |
Nothing sneaky any this
The owners don’t collect interest from the club on the shareholder loans. It gets capitalised (aka converted into equity |
And let's be fair on this, that is a generous gesture on behalf of all the owners. The club is worth what the market (a willing buyer) will bear. Converting interest to shares just re-arranges slightly how that selling valuation would be divided between the parties. The interest rates may appear high, but that is an issue that affects nobody at the club except the owners. |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 02:10 - Mar 8 with 2843 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:39 - Mar 7 by paulparker |
all in all Uncle Tony & Friends have spunked 240 million to put us in a worse position to when they found us in
its going to take a very long time to get us into a competitive side even for this division
a long hard road awaits |
I always think the sum (£240m) understates the full extent of the spunking. Surely the huge sums we have earned since August 2011 have to be factored in?
The previous parachute payments, increased sums for: TV rights; sponsorship; and gate receipts all largely squandered on utter, utter tossers. |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 06:52 - Mar 8 with 2756 views | davman |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 15:42 - Mar 7 by stevec |
Still a lot better than it was.
Frightening how little ticket income pays towards the bills, doubt if it would fund our 17 player match day squad having a kick about on the Scrubs each week.
Whatever we think of Sky think what would happen without it. |
Players and agents would earn less. |  |
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 08:08 - Mar 8 with 2679 views | paulparker |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 19:52 - Mar 7 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
I think some should think twice or more before slatting the owners as the fact is, without them financing the club and subsidizing the fans there would be no club. |
subsidizing the fans
?????????????????????????????????????????????????????? | |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 08:43 - Mar 8 with 2624 views | superhoopdownunder |
Most of our transfer business is now undisclosed
Through the annual accounts we can see the following which Niall on Twitter kindly shared
FY 16-17 FY 15-16 FY 14 - 15
Player Sales 7,276 12,645 1,814
Player Registrations 14,900 10,400 38,782
We made a lost of 7.624m in 16-17
Made a profit of 2.245m in 15-16
and a lost of 36.968m in 14-15 (thanks Harry and Hughes)
Still struggling to understand why we need more than 25 players and support staff (we had 111 in 2016-17 - this is crazy) [Post edited 8 Mar 2018 8:44]
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 12:20 - Mar 8 with 2498 views | Ashdown_Ranger |
Got this summary, courtesy of Niall Rogers on Twitter
twitter.com/nrogers959
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QPR finances up and ready to go - just having a browse through.
An acknowledgement from @tonyfernandes that there is still a long term plan of self sustainability with more academy players making the move to the 1st team. Warren Farm and new stadium progress very slow.
Financial fair play - We lost our appeal (as we know) with the ruling being the fine was not disproportionate. The directors are confident that an appeal will be successful. As it's confidential, there is no disclosure as to how much it might be
Oh my life - We made a Gross Profit. This is like winning the league for accountants. Revenues exceeded Cost of revenues by £2.7m
That's against a £10m Gross Loss last year, so no small turnaround.
Revenue up from £42m to £48m as more money in from sky. Still have 111 Players, managers and coaches although wages down by a not insignificant £10.2m
Remember that loan from @ruben_E_G that was interest bearing? That cost us £5.9m
So, as fans are we paying more? Well; Gate receipts down £266k, however club shop sales up £100k, so what we are not spending on tickets we are at least spending part in the shop.
Wages to turnover is now a very healthy 56%. During 'Arry's year in the Championship it was 195%. Wonder what the FFP issue could be?
Profit of £7.2m on player sales as well, down from £12.6m the previous year although I think that might have included the Sterling bonus.
So where are we then? Net loss £6.4m for the year. Since the @tonyfernandes takeover that gives us total net losses of £220m against income of £359m so total expenditure during this tenure is £579m, of which £356m spent on wages.
A remarkable turnaround, and I think justification for some patience for what is happening on the pitch, to a point. Clearly a transition is taking place and all signs are that off the pitch things are happening to address the follies of the past.
Looks like cash going out. Loan still stands at £46m £30m at 1% per month and £16m at 2% per month.
The interest on this loan was converted into equity with 7,486,367,000 shares being issued in relation to the outstanding shareholder interest. Teach me not to read the small print.
The capitalisation of interest has in turn further diluted the shareholding of the other 2 major shareholders:
@Ruben_E_G - 51.17% @tonyfernandes - 45.2% @Amit_Bhatia99 - 3.41%
Must be added @Ruben_E_G is the only party that is currently lending the club money. £46m in all, an extra £12m in 16/17.
Rather interestingly we have £4.3m of "assets under construction". I guess this must be related to the land we have on Old Oak Common and Warren Farm.
Just realised, wage bill reduced by £10m and Caulker was still being paid. Another chunk will come off from him leaving.
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| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 08:03 - Mar 10 with 2136 views | JamesB1979 |
I know we need to look at profit for FFP but really everyone should be looking at cash flow, especially as our profit figure includes 11.3m amortisation of current player values (love to see the breakdown by player here!)
If you look at our operating cash flow, we’re cash flow positive at 900k. The only reason that shareholders have needed to put funds into the club is due to a net cash out on player sales and purchases. This looks to be relating to past player purchases from previous years.
Do need to lower cost by 10m (surely we don’t need 111 playing staff and coaches.... roughly same number as Burnley) when we lose last of parachute money (after end of next season I think) but to me accounts are very positive.
Only concern I have is owner shift. Is Ruben just increasing his stake to then control a sale? Or continue cutting cost until he can start taking some cash out? Say what you like about Tony but club was more a hobby to him and he just kept stumping up cash to support it. Did he ever think he’d make some cash? | | | |
| Financial statements to 31/5/17 on 12:33 - Mar 10 with 2020 views | distortR |
when hearing people talk about the beneficence of our overlords, as opposed to guilt, it's worth considering that one of the motives in ownership might be their piggybacking huge developments in royal oak through us. They might not be entirely altruistic. | | | |
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