| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:28 - May 13 with 3721 views | scarrow |
I'll have everything crossed that McNulty turns out to be a Hill type appointment but 3 shots on target in his four away games fills me with no confidence. I fear a very difficult season ahead with McNulty dismissed by December |  |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:37 - May 13 with 3696 views | Cedar_Room |
When the new board first started my one and only criteria for the manager they appointed was that they had some experience, to offset their lack.
Who did they appoint? Robbie Stockdale.
This time my one and only criteria for the manager they appointed was that they had some experience of the National Leagues, as it’s a whole new world for this club and it was vital at such a precarious point that the man in charge had managed down here before.
Who did they appoint? Jim McNulty.
And yet we’ve been told ‘lessons have been learned’. |  | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:59 - May 13 with 3608 views | D_Alien |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 23:46 - May 12 by 49thseason |
There will be a relegation clause in his contract which cancells his second season.
There might even be salary payments linked to league position....i know some people dont give much credit to the BoD but they aren't as daft as some seem to think. They are not going to make the same mistakes a second time. |
There's a clear and obvious error in Jim's contract
In the best interests of the club, it should have been one year plus options, depending on results
McNulty is new to all this, it represents a great opportunity for him, so if he didn't like those terms he had the option to leave it (as if...)
This would have reduced the club's liability in the event of failure at a level he has no experience in. As i posted the other day, i'm conflicted as to whether the board are able to function in the best interests of the club
Further, how will this deal help enable the board's quest to find external financial input, likely to involve a change in ownership? They've tied any new owners hands behind their backs
If a manager with NL experience and decent track record had been appointed, a two year deal would likely have been a minimum to attract them. The one factor i could see in appointing Jim was to keep their financial options more open; they've not even done that
Obviously, i wish Jim well, i've already said so - for the sake of us all, for Dale. No other reason
[Post edited 13 May 2023 9:03]
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 09:16 - May 13 with 3575 views | James1980 |
Perhaps those the board approached with experience feel their next career move should be into a football league club. Maybe the wage demands of an experienced manager would have meant an even lower budget for the playing squad. Was Jim the first choice? Did the job get offered to someone with experience who turned it down? |  |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 09:47 - May 13 with 3521 views | SaxonDale |
Glad that it’s been sorted relatively quickly- we couldn’t have afforded to go into the summer with any more uncertainty. It’s now on the club to support McNulty in making sure he has some experience around him (even if they support him in selecting LMA assistance) and also enable him to bring in someone he is happy to work alongside as assistant manager, be it Kevin Gibbins or someone else.
It’s also on McNulty and the club to try and win any doubters over. I’m sure the released list and some early signings could do that, as well as communication. |  | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 11:03 - May 13 with 3398 views | EllDale |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 09:47 - May 13 by SaxonDale |
Glad that it’s been sorted relatively quickly- we couldn’t have afforded to go into the summer with any more uncertainty. It’s now on the club to support McNulty in making sure he has some experience around him (even if they support him in selecting LMA assistance) and also enable him to bring in someone he is happy to work alongside as assistant manager, be it Kevin Gibbins or someone else.
It’s also on McNulty and the club to try and win any doubters over. I’m sure the released list and some early signings could do that, as well as communication. |
B@lls to LMA involvement if Sammy Lee is a typical example of what they can offer. | | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 11:50 - May 13 with 3281 views | sweetcorn |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 20:49 - May 12 by James1980 |
I wasn't suggesting it was. |
No but you asked for a manager who would be accepted.
As I said, it's not the fans job to find someone, but most fans have a certain standard they'd expect to be met by which ever candidate the board picks.
Jim unfortunately doesn't tick any of the boxes. |  |
| Leader of the little gang of immature cretins. |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:20 - May 13 with 3222 views | SaxonDale |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 11:03 - May 13 by EllDale |
B@lls to LMA involvement if Sammy Lee is a typical example of what they can offer. |
Sammy Lee was an example of the board giving too much autonomy to Stockdale. Lee and Stockdale were very close from their period coaching together at West Brom. It should have been someone completely different without any biases, to support Stockdale with ‘fresh eyes.’ [Post edited 13 May 2023 12:26]
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:36 - May 13 with 3183 views | R17ALE |
Interestingly, now Jim has got the gig the gigs have gone! |  |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:48 - May 13 with 3147 views | James1980 |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 11:50 - May 13 by sweetcorn |
No but you asked for a manager who would be accepted.
As I said, it's not the fans job to find someone, but most fans have a certain standard they'd expect to be met by which ever candidate the board picks.
Jim unfortunately doesn't tick any of the boxes. |
But what if we either can't afford or that standard doesn't want to manage us?
Like I said in a previous post we don't know if others were approached and turned us down or were unaffordable. [Post edited 13 May 2023 12:52]
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:59 - May 13 with 3099 views | samueloneils |
Why are we still discussing the appointment? It has happened.
The next big issue, as JMc has stated, is the sorting out of existing contracts and retained list.
Imagine the mad activity on phones and texts as all 18 players and their agents scramble to get the best deals for their clients, and to get decisions made.
There are 9 players ( including Brierley) with another year to go. But how many will want to step down a league? They have contracts- they can`t be swept out of the club if they choose not to go, despite what some people seem to think. Mullarkey, Sinclair and Rodney are decent players EOD and EEL may look for better prospects elsewhere. Sinclair may be a good future sales prospect at 21. Campbell ???? Ball !!!!!
Then there are the other 9 on contracts to next month. Hendo and Diacourraga are elderly . White, Bennett and Keohane are turned 30. Only Keohane is getting game time. Lloyd, Kelly and Odoh could probably do better elsewhere Taylor has done well and could be another future fee-earner because of his youth. Likewise Graham.
All these need to be sorted out pronto, and J Mc should be encouraged to prioritise those who he believes will want to stay for the right reasons, as he says in his interview.
Just imagine all this work to be done before he even publishes a retained list.
He needs all the encouragement he can get from the Board and from we, the fans. | | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 13:18 - May 13 with 3052 views | 49thseason |
We have been told that players contracted by the new board have got relegation clauses inmtheir conttracts, I presume this means a lower basic wage. On the players part, you would imagine they also have a clause that allows them to cut their contract short and move on if their wage is reduced.
Maybe there will be increased incentives in the contracts based on progress in the new division, promotion, a cup run etc. Better to have lower basic salaries with good incentives I would have thought. If players don't have a positive outlook on their chances of producing a decent season, perhaps they would be better moving on anyway. |  | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 04:58 - May 14 with 2595 views | pioneer |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 13:18 - May 13 by 49thseason |
We have been told that players contracted by the new board have got relegation clauses inmtheir conttracts, I presume this means a lower basic wage. On the players part, you would imagine they also have a clause that allows them to cut their contract short and move on if their wage is reduced.
Maybe there will be increased incentives in the contracts based on progress in the new division, promotion, a cup run etc. Better to have lower basic salaries with good incentives I would have thought. If players don't have a positive outlook on their chances of producing a decent season, perhaps they would be better moving on anyway. |
It's not about a positive outlook, it's about paying your mortgage and if that depends upon team achievements not Individual performance we won't be competitive in the market for decent players | | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 07:03 - May 14 with 2549 views | nordenblue |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 04:58 - May 14 by pioneer |
It's not about a positive outlook, it's about paying your mortgage and if that depends upon team achievements not Individual performance we won't be competitive in the market for decent players |
I'd imagine contracts are made up of a mixture of both, im fairly sure most of them won't be struggling to "pay a mortgage"...
First and foremost we need to look after our own house, quite literally. | | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:16 - May 14 with 2481 views | A_Newby |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:48 - May 13 by James1980 |
But what if we either can't afford or that standard doesn't want to manage us?
Like I said in a previous post we don't know if others were approached and turned us down or were unaffordable. [Post edited 13 May 2023 12:52]
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I think James1980 keeps making a very good and valid point about candidates for the post.
In Jim McNulty, the board / consultants may have made the "best" choice of those available and made it rapidly to allow team rebuilding to begin as soon as possible.
On another thread, Kel is (rightly) asking for the person who leaks confidential information at the Dale to be uncovered and removed.
Before that happens, perhaps the “mole” could do us a favour and leak a list of candidates who applied for the post, candidates who the consultants reached out to, and the actual candidates who were interested and interviewed for the post.
Then perhaps we could understand the reasoning behind the decision to appoint Jim McNulty; but only time will tell if it was the right decision.
On the issue of the “two-year” deal I will quote from Chris Dunphy’s book regarding Keith Hill’s five-year contract.
“Yes, it is true that we gave Keith Hill a five-year contract, but I also had a clause in the contract that should we dismiss him, then only 12 months would be payable, which had been the norm since I took the chair.
The truth is that all contracts are about the exit clauses, the rest is just PR for the supporters.”
Dunphy, Chris. More in Hope Than Glory (p. 206). Austin Macauley Publishers.
So, Jim McNulty has a two-year deal, but we do not know the exit clause.
It may be that the board have kept Chris Dunphy’s “norm” and McNulty will have to be paid one year’s pay if he is dismissed or it may have been set at a lower amount for example at say 6 or 3 months’ pay. |  | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:39 - May 14 with 2451 views | NorthernDale |
I think McNulty may need an experience No 2 as a sounding board for ideas and who can suggest plans B or C if required.
However my concern is the reduced budget and the implications for the Dale next season. Are we going to go all out for promotion or as the board decided our future may be in the NL and set the stall out for this future. I still think we have an half decent side, in that we it was in many games a fine line between getting a point and none, I may be wrong, but there were not many games in which we got beat by more then one goal.
I would release Bennett, White, Diagouraga, allow Ball, John and Campbell to leave on free transfers, if they can find another club Next season, hopefully we can hopefully keep the contracted players: O'Donnell, EEL, Mullarkey, Taylor, Rodney, Sinclair and Henderson, I would add Odoh, ( he is frustrating at times, he has the ability, but it is the end product that is missing). Those not under contract, I would try to re-sign Lloyd, Graham and surprisingly Kelly, I can see also Keohane getting a new contract.
The weaknesses of last season need to be addressed, the midfield, we need at least two or three midfield players, two fullbacks and two strikers. So with the loan players included, it would be basically 12 players out (including Brierley) and possibly 7 in, including if possible Dodgson on loan again. I can see more youth players getting first team opportunities next season as well. [Post edited 14 May 2023 9:05]
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 09:25 - May 14 with 2367 views | James1980 |
Wasn't part of Keith Hill's success especially in his first tenure getting players to buy into a culture. Hopefully based on what he said in his interview after getting the job this attitude is what Big Jim wants to replicate.
Also I think pre season is going to be very important especially getting fitness levels to where they should be. | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 10:00 - May 14 with 2286 views | D_Alien |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 08:16 - May 14 by A_Newby |
I think James1980 keeps making a very good and valid point about candidates for the post.
In Jim McNulty, the board / consultants may have made the "best" choice of those available and made it rapidly to allow team rebuilding to begin as soon as possible.
On another thread, Kel is (rightly) asking for the person who leaks confidential information at the Dale to be uncovered and removed.
Before that happens, perhaps the “mole” could do us a favour and leak a list of candidates who applied for the post, candidates who the consultants reached out to, and the actual candidates who were interested and interviewed for the post.
Then perhaps we could understand the reasoning behind the decision to appoint Jim McNulty; but only time will tell if it was the right decision.
On the issue of the “two-year” deal I will quote from Chris Dunphy’s book regarding Keith Hill’s five-year contract.
“Yes, it is true that we gave Keith Hill a five-year contract, but I also had a clause in the contract that should we dismiss him, then only 12 months would be payable, which had been the norm since I took the chair.
The truth is that all contracts are about the exit clauses, the rest is just PR for the supporters.”
Dunphy, Chris. More in Hope Than Glory (p. 206). Austin Macauley Publishers.
So, Jim McNulty has a two-year deal, but we do not know the exit clause.
It may be that the board have kept Chris Dunphy’s “norm” and McNulty will have to be paid one year’s pay if he is dismissed or it may have been set at a lower amount for example at say 6 or 3 months’ pay. |
Tbf, in terms of "PR for supporters" a 12 months plus options deal for a rookie would be infinitely superior PR
I get the confidentialy business, but an early departure from the post would result in a settlement figure which would become public once accounts are published, so might as well be up front about it | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 10:29 - May 14 with 2217 views | James1980 |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 10:00 - May 14 by D_Alien |
Tbf, in terms of "PR for supporters" a 12 months plus options deal for a rookie would be infinitely superior PR
I get the confidentialy business, but an early departure from the post would result in a settlement figure which would become public once accounts are published, so might as well be up front about it |
But doesn't that potentially send out the message that the board don't really believe in their appointment. | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:25 - May 14 with 2084 views | D_Alien |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 10:29 - May 14 by James1980 |
But doesn't that potentially send out the message that the board don't really believe in their appointment. |
It sends a message that they've had their fingers (and wallets) burnt and just haven't got the financial wherewithal for that to happen again, in combination with not wishing to tie the hands of potential future owners
We'd understand that perfectly well. Even Jim would, if he has any sense, and tbh if he needed such a boost to his ego he's in the wrong job | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:35 - May 14 with 2064 views | James1980 |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:25 - May 14 by D_Alien |
It sends a message that they've had their fingers (and wallets) burnt and just haven't got the financial wherewithal for that to happen again, in combination with not wishing to tie the hands of potential future owners
We'd understand that perfectly well. Even Jim would, if he has any sense, and tbh if he needed such a boost to his ego he's in the wrong job |
How about attracting players to the club and the attitude of those players? | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 13:02 - May 14 with 2032 views | D_Alien |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 12:35 - May 14 by James1980 |
How about attracting players to the club and the attitude of those players? |
They'll be in the same boat
We need players (of course Jim knows this) who're hungry and willing to fight every minute
Again, any that need their egos massaging aren't a good fit. Show us what you're made of, you don't have to be the most skilful but if you're the one with most fight you'll get all the support you've ever wanted from the fanbase | |
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| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 13:24 - May 17 with 1444 views | Chris1803 |
After all the speculation prior to Jim McNulty getting the job, I see Nathan Rooney today has announced he's left his job at Brunos Magpies in Gibraltar. Think he was down to 6/1 at one point for the Dale job! (Yeah, I know bookies odds don't mean much and are easily influenced!)
Wouldn't be surprised to see him end up at either a National League or League Two side before too long. | | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 13:49 - May 17 with 1379 views | HullDale |
I've seen that Lloyd is doing his coaching badges this week.
Could we be looking at Lloyd as a Player / Assistant Manager? Might mean we can offer him more in terms of wages & career progression to tempt him, but would still be saving as a club on 2 separate wages. |  | | |
| Big Jim confirmed as permanent manager on 15:30 - May 17 with 1237 views | fitzochris |
It is impossible for me to have an opinion on where I'd rank Jim McNulty as my choice for the club's "head coach" without knowing who he was up against.
It's now a moot point as it is he who the board have deemed to be the best candidate for the job.
What now needs to be explained by the board is what his remit will be as "head coach", who will be assisting him and whether or not his role involves player retention and recruitment. If it doesn't, who does it involve?
The role of MRKT both in the recruitment of our new "head coach" and going forward also needs to be explained to supporters.
That kind of transparency can only help supporter buy-in for whatever the objective is for the coming season.
Having spoken to a few people familiar with the National League, it seems to me we are now entering a level of football where physical attributes outweigh technical ones.
Players who are tall, fast and strong will outperform pinpoint passers and clinical finishers, quite simply because there won’t be enough players possessing the latter qualities to outright benefit a team at this level. Those players who possess all of the above attributes won’t be playing at this level very long either.
We need players who can beat offside traps, players who can win first and second balls and players who can hold the ball up. If we can get together a team containing that mix, we should be okay. We need a big, mean defensive block that’s difficult to play through or over. If we then seek to get the ball directly to the opposition box as quickly as possible, chances will come. It might not be pretty, but winning games and creating some stability in the league is more important, as far as I’m concerned. |  |
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