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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:35 - Apr 3 by Private_Partz
OK I will expand a bit. Two points. Firstly I don't think anyone expects Plaid to come in on a white charger and cure all ills. The concern is more about Welsh Labour and an associated protest vote in an attempt to oust the complacent career politicians that are wrecking Wales. Secondly the political landscape is changing and I suspect plaid will do better than fourth as our very unscientific and small poll suggests. I doubt they will come first mind :-)
Well their best hope is to come in third ahead of UKIP.
Shockingly tedious thread. It's just the same 5 posters saying the same thing over and over again. It's worse then when Trampie is off from school ffs. I've set my stall out many a time and I don't think if I did I'd be contributing an awful lot but the delusion and bitterness really is becoming laughable. I'm sure I read that there is a funding "apartheid" between Swansea and Cardiff. Really? Pick your words mun.
I wouldn't be surprised if everyone who has publicly backed a party on this thread is either a party member or a staffer.
Someone mentioned my home seat of Gower as well, and anyone who thinks voting plaid there will help needs psychiatric help. If you think Byron Davies cares about anything other than the Tory party you should read his defence of the tampon tax. Still, he sent a nice tweet to the steelworkers consolidating them.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:45 - Apr 3 with 1627 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:45 - Apr 3 by Private_Partz
Maybe. Not sure lib dems will rip up any trees either. Shame as a combo of the two would be my dream team for the time being.
LibDems will finish fifth. Coalition has killed them as a force. A shame because they're the party I mostly identified with for a long time during the centrist New Labour years.
Looking at some recent polls, I may have done Plaid a disservice. They're mostly polling well ahead of UKIP at the moment which is encouraging. I'd much rather see Plaid ahead of UKIP.
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:43 - Apr 3 by acejack3065
Shockingly tedious thread. It's just the same 5 posters saying the same thing over and over again. It's worse then when Trampie is off from school ffs. I've set my stall out many a time and I don't think if I did I'd be contributing an awful lot but the delusion and bitterness really is becoming laughable. I'm sure I read that there is a funding "apartheid" between Swansea and Cardiff. Really? Pick your words mun.
I wouldn't be surprised if everyone who has publicly backed a party on this thread is either a party member or a staffer.
Someone mentioned my home seat of Gower as well, and anyone who thinks voting plaid there will help needs psychiatric help. If you think Byron Davies cares about anything other than the Tory party you should read his defence of the tampon tax. Still, he sent a nice tweet to the steelworkers consolidating them.
Thanks for your detailed response to the 'tedious' thread. :-) can't find much to disagree with there. I don't want the Tories in Gower but I would rather Welsh labour did not get in at this moment in time. BTW I am not a card carrying supporter of any party. Corbyn''s version of Labour will do me. It's very different from Carwyn ''s however.
You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:01 - Apr 3 with 1584 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:35 - Apr 3 by Private_Partz
OK I will expand a bit. Two points. Firstly I don't think anyone expects Plaid to come in on a white charger and cure all ills. The concern is more about Welsh Labour and an associated protest vote in an attempt to oust the complacent career politicians that are wrecking Wales. Secondly the political landscape is changing and I suspect plaid will do better than fourth as our very unscientific and small poll suggests. I doubt they will come first mind :-)
This. Few here, besides Trampie, believe that Plaid will turn Wales into an economic powerhouse. But an increasing number of people have realised that a vote for labour means that Swansea will keep being neglected, all the investment in Wales will continue to go to the affluent and we'll be kept begging for scraps.
By the way, NicetoMichu, Gower has been labour since 1910...hardly marginal. When interviewed at the general election, many voiced discontent with how labour has maltreated Swansea for 20 years. So yes, exiledclaseboy, some of us want a better future for our children than we've had, and can you honestly see labour delivering that? They've done nothing for the past 20 years.
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 13:43 - Apr 3 by Private_Partz
Fair play, your undying love of Welsh Labour knows no bounds. You seem a bit worried that Plaid is creating some voting interest however. That seems more of a concern to you than the massive imbalance in investment in Wales between the SE and the rest. What are your views on that? Has there been an imbalance in your eyes? Do you think Welsh Labour have been fair handed in all of this? I would be much more interested in hearing your views in defence of Welsh Labour rather than ignoring that and harping on about how bad Plaid will be for us.
[Post edited 3 Apr 2016 13:44]
Firstly, since when does the analysis that supporting Plaid, especially in marginal seats (such as Gower or Wrexham in recent years), and knowing that this will help the Tories win seats/elections, mean that I have "undying love for Welsh Labour?
Secondly, I have recognised in previous posts I've written that the balance of funding has been slightly off, but not even close to what some people on here are suggesting.
Thirdly, I know you are not suggesting that Plaid are a "cure all". I agree, no party is perfect. I'm genuinely happy that Leanne Wood describes herself as a socialist, I am as well. But that can't be said for the other, old school, members of Plaid or even their own MPs currently in Westminster.
It's fairly obvious to everyone that Jeremy Corbyn's election has shown that there is a desire for Labour to return to some of their previous policies. It's going to take a bit of time to persuade some of the minority' of Labour MPs who don't like him, but that's politics. They are broad churches. I just think that, at this time, it's extremely reckless for the Welsh electorate to turn to a party whose core is not the socialism that you may think it is, at the expense of a party that is very clearly trying to change all of society.
Just look at the unions. The vast, vast majority actively support Labour because they understand the bigger picture. And no, it's not the case that it's just the union heads who are in cahoots with Welsh Labour and dragging their union members with them. The unions have been around a long time, they are self-interested, and therefore recognise that Labour is the best vehicle to improve workers rights and conditions. This was not the case in Scotland, where many unions transitioned to supporting the SNP even before they won power. This is not happening in Wales for many reasons including the fact that Plaid are a one-woman (Leanne Wood) socialist party. The rest are not.
For the electorate, there are clear connections between elections held at the devolved governments and general elections.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:06 - Apr 3 with 1574 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:01 - Apr 3 by CopperJack
This. Few here, besides Trampie, believe that Plaid will turn Wales into an economic powerhouse. But an increasing number of people have realised that a vote for labour means that Swansea will keep being neglected, all the investment in Wales will continue to go to the affluent and we'll be kept begging for scraps.
By the way, NicetoMichu, Gower has been labour since 1910...hardly marginal. When interviewed at the general election, many voiced discontent with how labour has maltreated Swansea for 20 years. So yes, exiledclaseboy, some of us want a better future for our children than we've had, and can you honestly see labour delivering that? They've done nothing for the past 20 years.
The Tories won Gower by 27 votes in May. It's literally THE MOST marginal seat in the country.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:08 - Apr 3 with 1572 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:01 - Apr 3 by CopperJack
This. Few here, besides Trampie, believe that Plaid will turn Wales into an economic powerhouse. But an increasing number of people have realised that a vote for labour means that Swansea will keep being neglected, all the investment in Wales will continue to go to the affluent and we'll be kept begging for scraps.
By the way, NicetoMichu, Gower has been labour since 1910...hardly marginal. When interviewed at the general election, many voiced discontent with how labour has maltreated Swansea for 20 years. So yes, exiledclaseboy, some of us want a better future for our children than we've had, and can you honestly see labour delivering that? They've done nothing for the past 20 years.
I'm aware that Gower had held the seat for a long time. But if you don't think that it was a marginal seat in the 2015 general election than you're mistaken. Many, including me, were very aware.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:12 - Apr 3 with 1567 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 15:57 - Apr 3 by Private_Partz
Thanks for your detailed response to the 'tedious' thread. :-) can't find much to disagree with there. I don't want the Tories in Gower but I would rather Welsh labour did not get in at this moment in time. BTW I am not a card carrying supporter of any party. Corbyn''s version of Labour will do me. It's very different from Carwyn ''s however.
Detailed eh, you haven't heard the half of it yet.
I support labour but in an ideal world I'd be some sort of green/plaid/labour/lib dem mesh soft left coalition.
The beauty of the assembly election is the list vote. I'd implore everyone in South Wales to vote lib dem or plaid there
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:13 - Apr 3 with 1567 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:01 - Apr 3 by CopperJack
This. Few here, besides Trampie, believe that Plaid will turn Wales into an economic powerhouse. But an increasing number of people have realised that a vote for labour means that Swansea will keep being neglected, all the investment in Wales will continue to go to the affluent and we'll be kept begging for scraps.
By the way, NicetoMichu, Gower has been labour since 1910...hardly marginal. When interviewed at the general election, many voiced discontent with how labour has maltreated Swansea for 20 years. So yes, exiledclaseboy, some of us want a better future for our children than we've had, and can you honestly see labour delivering that? They've done nothing for the past 20 years.
I'm a Gower constituent and if you predicted to me as far back as 20 years ago that Labour would lose to an unpopular sitting Tory government I would have immediately thought?............ 'Nutter'!
But I could see this coming over the last few years because speaking as a working class/construction industry type whom knows what its like to be surrounded by natural Labour voters? The loyalty, affection, love and emotion for Welsh Labour is no longer there! Brickies, steel erectors and hod-carriers are more likely to NOT vote. If that leaves the backdoor open to the Tories well don't blame us blame yourselves Labour!
Argus!
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:04 - Apr 3 with 1520 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:06 - Apr 3 by acejack3065
The Tories won Gower by 27 votes in May. It's literally THE MOST marginal seat in the country.
Yeah ummmmm but it wasn't once not so long back either (hint!....hint!.....hint!) and never should it have become one especially when a very unpopular Tory government was sitting! Something has gone badly wrong (hint!.....hint!....hint!) and sometime in the not too distant future other places like Llanelli and Swansea West could go the same way?
Welsh Labour? The only party more dangerous to itself than any opposition or rival!
[Post edited 3 Apr 2016 17:17]
Argus!
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:06 - Apr 3 with 1517 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 16:13 - Apr 3 by Wingstandwood
I'm a Gower constituent and if you predicted to me as far back as 20 years ago that Labour would lose to an unpopular sitting Tory government I would have immediately thought?............ 'Nutter'!
But I could see this coming over the last few years because speaking as a working class/construction industry type whom knows what its like to be surrounded by natural Labour voters? The loyalty, affection, love and emotion for Welsh Labour is no longer there! Brickies, steel erectors and hod-carriers are more likely to NOT vote. If that leaves the backdoor open to the Tories well don't blame us blame yourselves Labour!
Yeh, the electorate is not as politically engaged as generations past. To blame that on Welsh Labour is ridiculous. Are Welsh Labour (or their equivalents) to blame for mass numbers of people in Kent voting for UKIP? Are these same brickies and other working class men and women voting in their interest when they vote for Nigel Farage, a guy who is more Tory than the current Tories in Westminster?
No.
Class dealignment is an issue for left-wing parties everywhere. Interest in current affairs and how politics can and cannot impact your own life is at an all time low. The only winner from this continued ignorance are right-wing parties, because their supporters will always come out and vote no matter what. It's a phenomenon that is seen the world over.
But sure, let's continue to split the vote of the left-wing amongst the informed and less informed socialists and ensure that RT Davies and David Cameron complete their ambition of dismantling society as we know it.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:15 - Apr 3 with 1511 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:06 - Apr 3 by nice_to_michu
Yeh, the electorate is not as politically engaged as generations past. To blame that on Welsh Labour is ridiculous. Are Welsh Labour (or their equivalents) to blame for mass numbers of people in Kent voting for UKIP? Are these same brickies and other working class men and women voting in their interest when they vote for Nigel Farage, a guy who is more Tory than the current Tories in Westminster?
No.
Class dealignment is an issue for left-wing parties everywhere. Interest in current affairs and how politics can and cannot impact your own life is at an all time low. The only winner from this continued ignorance are right-wing parties, because their supporters will always come out and vote no matter what. It's a phenomenon that is seen the world over.
But sure, let's continue to split the vote of the left-wing amongst the informed and less informed socialists and ensure that RT Davies and David Cameron complete their ambition of dismantling society as we know it.
Yes indeed from where I'm standing Cameron and his bunch could not give a sh*t about me or Wales!.......But I am not going to vote for Labour on the basis they are not Tories and when all the money is being spent (by Labour) in Cardiff to the detriment of us all.
Welsh Labour = Taffy-Red-Tories! Tories = North South U.K divide. Welsh Labour = Cardiff and rest of Wales divide.
Argus!
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:19 - Apr 3 with 1501 views
For all those who don't seem to acknowledge how damaging a vote in one election can be to another, can you please explain to me how UKIP (an anti-Wales party of former Tories) is predicted to get a number of seats at the WELSH Assembly elections?
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 18:56 - Apr 3 with 1450 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:19 - Apr 3 by exiledclaseboy
Is there any actual, proper evidence for the whole "Welsh government spends disproportionate amounts of money on Cardiff" theory?
Labour have stated that they WILL build the M4 relief road if returned to power. That's £1.5 billion of our money. They have pledged £580 million of our money to the Cardiff City Deal. The money will be spent.
Going back to the start of the Assembly, there was originally £3.75 million allocated in the Assembly referendum White Paper for converting City Hall to be the Sennedd. They spent £70 million on a new building instead. Billions have gone into Cardiff Bay, mostly private investment, but a huge amount of our money created the infrastructure to draw in that investment. Someone else mentioned £800 million of ours went into the bay. I can't honestly confirm that figure but if you look at that infrastructure it cost us a fortune. £20 million a year is spent just maintaining the Bay. I've lost track of the grants given to draw in PWC and various other prestigious companies providing highly paid jobs. I won't try to guess at the number of grants but at £3/5/10 million a time you can imagine the amount
The new bus 'interchange' is costing £150 million (our bus station cost £11 million !). It's probably being built by the developers of the 5 star hotel, luxury appartments, underground parking and retail which is all part of the development but they wouldn't be building it out of the goodness of their hearts. Free land maybe ? However it's happening it's our money at the end of the day.
No time for more at the moment but others will probably add to this.
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 19:08 - Apr 3 with 1442 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 18:56 - Apr 3 by johnlangy
Labour have stated that they WILL build the M4 relief road if returned to power. That's £1.5 billion of our money. They have pledged £580 million of our money to the Cardiff City Deal. The money will be spent.
Going back to the start of the Assembly, there was originally £3.75 million allocated in the Assembly referendum White Paper for converting City Hall to be the Sennedd. They spent £70 million on a new building instead. Billions have gone into Cardiff Bay, mostly private investment, but a huge amount of our money created the infrastructure to draw in that investment. Someone else mentioned £800 million of ours went into the bay. I can't honestly confirm that figure but if you look at that infrastructure it cost us a fortune. £20 million a year is spent just maintaining the Bay. I've lost track of the grants given to draw in PWC and various other prestigious companies providing highly paid jobs. I won't try to guess at the number of grants but at £3/5/10 million a time you can imagine the amount
The new bus 'interchange' is costing £150 million (our bus station cost £11 million !). It's probably being built by the developers of the 5 star hotel, luxury appartments, underground parking and retail which is all part of the development but they wouldn't be building it out of the goodness of their hearts. Free land maybe ? However it's happening it's our money at the end of the day.
No time for more at the moment but others will probably add to this.
You keep informing me and others! You keep posting and keep informing individuals of type to weigh up his/her opinions on whether Welsh Labour are actually worth voting for at WAG elections.
The vibe I'm getting is "Ignore the disgraceful Labour Cardiff bias but please vote for them/us because they're/we are not Tories".
Argus!
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 23:52 - Apr 3 with 1384 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:19 - Apr 3 by exiledclaseboy
Is there any actual, proper evidence for the whole "Welsh government spends disproportionate amounts of money on Cardiff" theory?
A very good question. One of my main grouses with the Cardiff based media is that they never draw comparisons between the SE and the rest of Wales. Take employment and housing prices for instance. You rarely get a comparison between Swansea and Cardiff leave alone the rest of Wales. I know house prices are actually falling in Swansea and I bet this is not the case in Cardiff. The Daily Post ran an article on the per capita spend across Wales by WAG and it was not pretty. Huge disparities between the South and the North of Wales. SWEP ran an editorial on the disparity but they, along with the DP, will have, or already have, their paymasters in Cardiff. A completely unhealthy media situation exists in Wales. All we are left with is the blindingly obvious. Many posters have highlighted examples of the projects that WAG have been involved in in relation to Cardiff. No one can counter this with any tangible evidence of anything approaching that in the rest of Wales. In Swansea we are told how fortunate we are to have a pool and a museum......
You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
0
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 00:07 - Apr 4 with 1379 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:56 - Apr 3 by nice_to_michu
For all those who don't seem to acknowledge how damaging a vote in one election can be to another, can you please explain to me how UKIP (an anti-Wales party of former Tories) is predicted to get a number of seats at the WELSH Assembly elections?
Welsh labour give everything to Kerdiff Welsh Tory's give us nothing, as do all Tory's Liberals and Plaod are a joke So I can only assume people are really sick to the back teeth of the mainstream party's and are voting for a change. I don't see any viable options myself and I don't want to vote for any of them
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The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 08:53 - Apr 4 with 1355 views
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:06 - Apr 3 by nice_to_michu
Yeh, the electorate is not as politically engaged as generations past. To blame that on Welsh Labour is ridiculous. Are Welsh Labour (or their equivalents) to blame for mass numbers of people in Kent voting for UKIP? Are these same brickies and other working class men and women voting in their interest when they vote for Nigel Farage, a guy who is more Tory than the current Tories in Westminster?
No.
Class dealignment is an issue for left-wing parties everywhere. Interest in current affairs and how politics can and cannot impact your own life is at an all time low. The only winner from this continued ignorance are right-wing parties, because their supporters will always come out and vote no matter what. It's a phenomenon that is seen the world over.
But sure, let's continue to split the vote of the left-wing amongst the informed and less informed socialists and ensure that RT Davies and David Cameron complete their ambition of dismantling society as we know it.
The problem is, it's the apologists Uncle Toms like you that allow them to keep maltreating us. We vote them in because we live our life afraid of Tories, when Welsh Labour has done more damage to Swansea than any Westminster Government. It's the people who keep making excuses for Labour and allowing them to give our money to the affluent that are causing this problem. If you beat a dog long enough, one day it's going to bite back. Don't blame the dog for that. If Swansea bites back, Welsh Labour and its supporters only have themselves to blame. People are frightened off by saying 'Ahhh you're letting the big nasty Tories in at the back door' - well, then treat us better and we won't need to make you worry!
If people hadn't voted them in (and will probably continue to vote them in, because their parents vote Labour, their grandparents voted Labour etc etc), then they'd have to fight for our vote.
Exiledclaseboy - I've asked Edwina & Julie James how much was spent on Cardiff Bay/St David's/Millenium Centre and both refused to answer. But, considering something like the Liberty Stadium cost £20m, how many hundreds of millions do you think went into Cardiff Bay (which is huge), St David's and building things like the Senedd/Millenium Centre? It's the knock-on effect of these places too, all pay good wages. And as Langy said, look everytime a new big company, like Pinewood studious, decides to relocate to Cardiff, it's always 'with a grant from the WAG'..........shouldn't they be spending that grant to relocate jobs to areas that need them? Or will they continue to give to the affluent forever?
If these same policies were enacted under a Tory government, people would be outraged. Because it's under the guide of Labour, the sheep keep voting them in.
The 2016 Assembly Elections: Which way will you be voting & why? on 17:56 - Apr 3 by nice_to_michu
For all those who don't seem to acknowledge how damaging a vote in one election can be to another, can you please explain to me how UKIP (an anti-Wales party of former Tories) is predicted to get a number of seats at the WELSH Assembly elections?
It's because euroscepticism in this country is at an all time high and they are the only party not cuddling up to Europe.
The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
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