| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:01 - Apr 1 with 1965 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 17:16 - Apr 1 by Kilkennyjack |
Since you accept everything the UK government say without question, then you are part of the problem.
Think , say, weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and Hillsborough. The UK Govt has got ir badly wrong many times before.
If they have the evidence then get it verified.
Wtf. Russia should ‘go away and shut up’ ... 😂 |
Hahahaha! I'm nothing at all like that but let's look at it the other way. Occam's Razor suggests it was the Russians whilst you are accepting the Russians denials. The very same government who said that there were no Russian soldiers in the Ukraine, they then changed that story to, individual members of the Russian army went off in their holiday time (managing to take weapons from a secure armoury) to support the rebels. They also claimed that there were no Russian artillery nor tank units supporting the rebels and when photo's of these were produced they claimed that they were ones captured from the Ukraine. Also known Russian Intelligence Officers, were captured in photographs, supporting the rebels.
So distrust the UK government (a reasonable standpoint) but trust the Russian government (hypocrisy really) |  |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:06 - Apr 1 with 1958 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 17:36 - Apr 1 by trampie |
No reports of birds or animals dead in the area.
French heavily involved, Russia wants to know what is going on. |
Perhaps that it was not released as a gas...but that does not fit with some peoples narrative so it is ignored - that and the fact is that most people, understandably, have not got a clue. | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:23 - Apr 1 with 1941 views | Highjack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 17:36 - Apr 1 by trampie |
No reports of birds or animals dead in the area.
French heavily involved, Russia wants to know what is going on. |
Perhaps that day all the birds and animals were licking someone else's door handle? |  |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:31 - Apr 1 with 1924 views | trampie |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:01 - Apr 1 by DJack |
Hahahaha! I'm nothing at all like that but let's look at it the other way. Occam's Razor suggests it was the Russians whilst you are accepting the Russians denials. The very same government who said that there were no Russian soldiers in the Ukraine, they then changed that story to, individual members of the Russian army went off in their holiday time (managing to take weapons from a secure armoury) to support the rebels. They also claimed that there were no Russian artillery nor tank units supporting the rebels and when photo's of these were produced they claimed that they were ones captured from the Ukraine. Also known Russian Intelligence Officers, were captured in photographs, supporting the rebels.
So distrust the UK government (a reasonable standpoint) but trust the Russian government (hypocrisy really) |
I haven't seen anyone trusting the Russian Government, plenty trusting the UK Government which is up to them. |  |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:49 - Apr 1 with 1903 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:31 - Apr 1 by trampie |
I haven't seen anyone trusting the Russian Government, plenty trusting the UK Government which is up to them. |
As I previously stated Occam's razor would suggest it is Russia but all many here are doing is shouting "don't trust the government", "there is no proof it is Russia", "Porton Down is nearby" therein they are supporting (trusting) the Russian narrative.
Your point about trusting the UK government I find a little funny as I really don't trust our ministers at all (in fact I don't trust any government these day's) and I bet many that do accept Russian culpability are not very trusting of our government. | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:55 - Apr 1 with 1900 views | Humpty |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:06 - Apr 1 by DJack |
Perhaps that it was not released as a gas...but that does not fit with some peoples narrative so it is ignored - that and the fact is that most people, understandably, have not got a clue. |
You're right in none of us are experts in nerve agents.
For anyone with half an hour to spare, this is very informative.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3cswmp4
I'm sure it won't convince anyone with entrenched views and will be dismissed as fake MSM news etc.
Personally I won't be convinced until Theresa pops round my house herself and explains it all to me, top secret stuff included, with powerpoints and pictures and everything. |  | | |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 19:15 - Apr 1 with 1874 views | Loyal |
Puts the tormented souls fearing Tommy R and the free speech right in to perspective. |  |
| Nolan sympathiser, clout expert, personal friend of Leigh Dineen, advocate and enforcer of porridge swallows.
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 21:25 - Apr 1 with 1820 views | Private_Partz |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:31 - Apr 1 by trampie |
I haven't seen anyone trusting the Russian Government, plenty trusting the UK Government which is up to them. |
I think that is a fair assesment of the comments on this board.
Imho everything that comes from Russia on this subject needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.
Unfortuately I feel exactly the same way about the current British Government.
I am paricularly suspicious this time as we have very little information and what is coming out is conflicting and / of rumour.
We had another death a few days later with the 60 yr old dying in his home. That one had gone very quiet as well. [Post edited 1 Apr 2018 21:27]
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| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 21:26 - Apr 1 with 1819 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:01 - Apr 1 by DJack |
Hahahaha! I'm nothing at all like that but let's look at it the other way. Occam's Razor suggests it was the Russians whilst you are accepting the Russians denials. The very same government who said that there were no Russian soldiers in the Ukraine, they then changed that story to, individual members of the Russian army went off in their holiday time (managing to take weapons from a secure armoury) to support the rebels. They also claimed that there were no Russian artillery nor tank units supporting the rebels and when photo's of these were produced they claimed that they were ones captured from the Ukraine. Also known Russian Intelligence Officers, were captured in photographs, supporting the rebels.
So distrust the UK government (a reasonable standpoint) but trust the Russian government (hypocrisy really) |
Where did i say that i believed the Russians...?
The onus is on the Maybot to prove the accusations made. Thats it.
Your whataboutary bollocks is,well ....just bollocks ..😇 |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 21:46 - Apr 1 with 1800 views | smoulder |
If they just showed us the evidence in it's entirety......then maybe we could come to some sort of decision for ourselves. |  | | |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:03 - Apr 1 with 1778 views | Private_Partz |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 21:46 - Apr 1 by smoulder |
If they just showed us the evidence in it's entirety......then maybe we could come to some sort of decision for ourselves. |
The worry for me is that there is very little hard evidence. ....and it is all 'it must be them because they have done it before' and European nations have fallen into line as the Ruskies are no friend of theirs either.
We could be made to look very foolish here if this is the case.
With cctv everywhere there must be some evidence. We must now be sure of what nerve gas was used. We must be sure if how it was administered. We must surely have an idea of who did it.
The Govt do not have to give Joe Public the actual evidence, I suppose this could compromise national security. Just say that they have the above details as proof, of at least some of them.
We have had precious little so far. Unlike previous occasions when we heard of doctored tea, spikes in umbrellas, pictures from hospital bedsides etc. | |
| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:05 - Apr 1 with 1773 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 21:26 - Apr 1 by Kilkennyjack |
Where did i say that i believed the Russians...?
The onus is on the Maybot to prove the accusations made. Thats it.
Your whataboutary bollocks is,well ....just bollocks ..😇 |
1st point, fair one.
2nd, prove to whom? They are our elected government (yeugh!) and the opposition agree with them.
3rd, Not whataboutery. The competing arguments are that it is the Russians or a false flag op (probably British) My point was for those who go on about not trusting a side, they are not being even handed. | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:07 - Apr 1 with 1765 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:03 - Apr 1 by Private_Partz |
The worry for me is that there is very little hard evidence. ....and it is all 'it must be them because they have done it before' and European nations have fallen into line as the Ruskies are no friend of theirs either.
We could be made to look very foolish here if this is the case.
With cctv everywhere there must be some evidence. We must now be sure of what nerve gas was used. We must be sure if how it was administered. We must surely have an idea of who did it.
The Govt do not have to give Joe Public the actual evidence, I suppose this could compromise national security. Just say that they have the above details as proof, of at least some of them.
We have had precious little so far. Unlike previous occasions when we heard of doctored tea, spikes in umbrellas, pictures from hospital bedsides etc. |
How many years afterwards did we get to hear the "details"? | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:12 - Apr 1 with 1754 views | trampie |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:05 - Apr 1 by DJack |
1st point, fair one.
2nd, prove to whom? They are our elected government (yeugh!) and the opposition agree with them.
3rd, Not whataboutery. The competing arguments are that it is the Russians or a false flag op (probably British) My point was for those who go on about not trusting a side, they are not being even handed. |
I think you have it wrong, most people either don't trust the British Government and don't trust the Russian Government or they trust the British Government and don't trust the Russian Government, but you seem to be suggesting that people don't trust the British Government but do trust the Russian Government, I cant say i've seen that sentiment on this site. | |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:14 - Apr 1 with 1746 views | smoulder |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:03 - Apr 1 by Private_Partz |
The worry for me is that there is very little hard evidence. ....and it is all 'it must be them because they have done it before' and European nations have fallen into line as the Ruskies are no friend of theirs either.
We could be made to look very foolish here if this is the case.
With cctv everywhere there must be some evidence. We must now be sure of what nerve gas was used. We must be sure if how it was administered. We must surely have an idea of who did it.
The Govt do not have to give Joe Public the actual evidence, I suppose this could compromise national security. Just say that they have the above details as proof, of at least some of them.
We have had precious little so far. Unlike previous occasions when we heard of doctored tea, spikes in umbrellas, pictures from hospital bedsides etc. |
If the evidence is so overwhelming, then I see nothing wrong in the government being completely transparent with the evidence. The issue of compromising home security is.....in a word..... ridiculous. | | | |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:15 - Apr 1 with 1746 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:12 - Apr 1 by trampie |
I think you have it wrong, most people either don't trust the British Government and don't trust the Russian Government or they trust the British Government and don't trust the Russian Government, but you seem to be suggesting that people don't trust the British Government but do trust the Russian Government, I cant say i've seen that sentiment on this site. |
Your answer/thoughts on the 2nd point... | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:18 - Apr 1 with 1739 views | trampie |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:15 - Apr 1 by DJack |
Your answer/thoughts on the 2nd point... |
They are British and they believe the UK Government and the UK press without any question. | |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:27 - Apr 1 with 1725 views | Private_Partz |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:07 - Apr 1 by DJack |
How many years afterwards did we get to hear the "details"? |
I thought it was pretty pronto. The poor man dying in his bead was on our screen pdq I believe.
It is by the by though. Just say they have got it.
I don't want a picture of a smeared door handle, sight of the cctv, or details of who the hit man was.
The language used so far, and the press speculation surrounding it, suggest a lot if this may be still up in the air and it is doing our reputation no good whatsoever. | |
| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:27 - Apr 1 with 1724 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:18 - Apr 1 by trampie |
They are British and they believe the UK Government and the UK press without any question. |
I meant this bit "2nd, prove to whom? They are our elected government (yeugh!) and the opposition agree with them. " | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:37 - Apr 1 with 1711 views | controversial_jack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 18:01 - Apr 1 by DJack |
Hahahaha! I'm nothing at all like that but let's look at it the other way. Occam's Razor suggests it was the Russians whilst you are accepting the Russians denials. The very same government who said that there were no Russian soldiers in the Ukraine, they then changed that story to, individual members of the Russian army went off in their holiday time (managing to take weapons from a secure armoury) to support the rebels. They also claimed that there were no Russian artillery nor tank units supporting the rebels and when photo's of these were produced they claimed that they were ones captured from the Ukraine. Also known Russian Intelligence Officers, were captured in photographs, supporting the rebels.
So distrust the UK government (a reasonable standpoint) but trust the Russian government (hypocrisy really) |
I hate to break this to you, but Ockham's razor doesn't carry a lot of weight in law, or in any science discipline whatsoever |  | | |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:41 - Apr 1 with 1704 views | trampie |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:27 - Apr 1 by DJack |
I meant this bit "2nd, prove to whom? They are our elected government (yeugh!) and the opposition agree with them. " |
I am not sure what you are getting at, and its not my question, if you have some point to make ?, feel free to make it. | |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:49 - Apr 1 with 1690 views | DJack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:41 - Apr 1 by trampie |
I am not sure what you are getting at, and its not my question, if you have some point to make ?, feel free to make it. |
You said "The onus is on the Maybot to prove the accusations made. Thats it. "
She has obviously proved it to her party, the opposition and to many other nations governments. Are you suggesting that our government give detail on national security matters to the public? | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 23:02 - Apr 1 with 1677 views | trampie |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 22:49 - Apr 1 by DJack |
You said "The onus is on the Maybot to prove the accusations made. Thats it. "
She has obviously proved it to her party, the opposition and to many other nations governments. Are you suggesting that our government give detail on national security matters to the public? |
No I never said that ? | |
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 23:38 - Apr 1 with 1651 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 23:02 - Apr 1 by trampie |
No I never said that ? |
I said it.
Maybot cant just go around making very serious accusations, and then hide behind ‘national security’ if questions are asked.
I dont need the details.
I just need another trusted party to confirm that the UK govt position is indeed based in fact. Like some International body, or other ?
Thats important assurance when ‘the russians doing it’ makes no logic/sense at all. World Cup days away and Putin chooses a method that leads directly back to him. I think not. And its an amateur job as the 2 targets survived. Putin is a professional. It simply does not add up. | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 00:37 - Apr 2 with 1633 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Russia demands to see daughter of spy on 15:55 - Apr 1 by DJack |
...err no they are not! They are asking dull questions that are being fed out to the masses.
CCTV footage of the assailant is only ever found after they have been identified or if captured during the incident - And we don't have CCTV pointing at everyone's front door.
Suspects! This would not have been carried out by some dumb mwsh, it would have been executed by a professional who is trained to blend in and cover their tracks.
"Worlds deadliest" military grade nerve agent & 2 of the victims in recovery.
Only 3 victims in total. - how much (little) substance was used and in what form? My theory is that the father got the entire minuscule dose and the daughter and copper got the "off-gas"
"Why aren't mainstream journalists questioning further?" - Because they have got themselves informed with a bit of background info on how these things work and they are satisfied with how it looks, currently. Meanwhile, people with no knowledge are spouting shit. |
Well Mr Skripal must have farted at his daughter on that bench and then the first copper on the scene , although he couldn't have broken wind in the pub or restaurant or wherever else they had been. It's the only way to explain why just THREE PEOPLE have been affected. |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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