| Season ticket 21:11 - Mar 19 with 27680 views | sandy_dale |
Announcement tomorrow regarding season tickets for 17/18 |  | | |  |
| Season ticket on 18:21 - Mar 20 with 2515 views | electricblue |
Why dont the club offer a split season ticket...
In other words the season ticket costs £250 and spread over 2 payments.
The first £125 is payable before the preason deadline offer and the other £125 is payable end of november.....
That is surely cheap enough..
Or.
£50 deposit.
Then 8 monthly payments of £25.....
That way the club as a regular monthly income aswell..... |  |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Season ticket on 18:54 - Mar 20 with 2421 views | 1907 |
Hope we're marketing and doing something in conjunction with the Rochdale Sunday league clubs? |  | | |
| Season ticket on 18:58 - Mar 20 with 2406 views | DaleiLama |
| Season ticket on 18:00 - Mar 20 by 442Dale |
Of course for those who can't afford to part with £50 it's very hard to justify, but for those who can and they're a Dale fan/semi regular/have an interest in local football, it's hard to justify NOT paying the deposit.
Yes, there's a chance a target might not be hit and in that situation they can either pay an amount they don't want to or lose the £50, but it's about looking at the bigger picture. By paying the £50 now you're doing it for your club and your fellow fans who are doing the same, you're also doing it for the people considering parting with the deposit themselves. They want you to help make their decision and you want them to decide to do the same.
Again, this is SPECIFIC to those who CAN afford £50, some of whom will be hoping those who maybe can't will also take up what is a great initiative. It's not a case of "this is a good deal for me" or "I'll wait and see because I don't think it'll work but if it does I'll get one", it's about putting our own preferences to one side for the greater good. The word "I" needs to be shelved for a couple of months. |
Hmmmmmmmm. I have been stuck in the car half the day, so have been giving this whole issue a coat of weighing up and just listened to RG's interview.
I'm going to preface this by saying that Russ is a thoroughly likeable fellow and he's been like a breath of fresh air since his arrival. He has bags of ideas and experience and he is a terrific asset to the club. He listens and acts. I fail to see what more, as a fan, one could hope for. I have no doubt that his salary, and then some, will be paid for by the increased profitability of the club in the long run.
Now the kicker and playing devil's advocate to your post above - Russ has said the following in "the interview":
4k is achievable
It's very achievable
It's very, very achievable
Then he said if we can achieve 4k?
Then we have 1850 STs now and 2k is very achievable
Then when asked about 4k he was "sure it's achievable".
The he said the £110 season ticket is a start
Then I really hope the poeple of Rochdale get behind it.
Whilst it could be argued there are some mixed messages in this, he is mostly pretty convinced it will happen. Of course he has to be, and if he isn't, no one else will be. But if it is going to happen, why the s0dding hell have they done it like this. Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes.
I get what you are saying about supporting the club. And I've gone on record before saying that footy is an emotional experience, as is committing to a club/ST etc so I know the analogy isn't perfect, but imagine if Currys had a telly sale and said we want a £50 deposit and if we knock out 4k we'll ask for another £60/telly, but if we sell than less than 2k we'll be looking for another £300+/telly? Why should all the risk lie with the fan, is what I am saying. My knee-jerk gut reaction to this was it's a win-win for Dale, and the risk is transferred to the fanbase, some of whom could lose their deposit (this view hasn't changed since). That, in my personal view, is not the right way to go about business. At least not how I would have done it. The club is selling something - it should take the risk. They are saying there is no risk, so why shouldn't they take this "no risk" themselves? The idea is brilliant, the execution should have been better.
So there you go - that's the business-man side of me. Now the fan in me will post on the other thread thingy that I'm going to chuck my fifty in and see what happens. I gambled on a half ST and I am lucky that I can afford to lose the deposit if it does go tits up (my gut, again, tells me £150 might be where this settles, but who knows)? So I find myself supporting something to which I am morally opposed to. Not easy being a Dale fan most of the time. I just hope for everyone who can't afford to gamble, the club announces it has passed an "affordability" threshold in good time for them to still benefit. [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 19:13]
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| Season ticket on 19:19 - Mar 20 with 2332 views | Dorislove |
Very good post above .The net income to the club goes as follows after VAT removed.
2000 tickets £416666
2500 tickets £416666
3000 tickets £375000
4000 tickets £366666
Not much of a gamble by the club £50k and some of this would be recouped by all the extras bought by the extra 1500/2000.BUT like i said on another thread at least the club are trying . |  | | |
| Season ticket on 19:26 - Mar 20 with 2294 views | 442Dale |
| Season ticket on 18:58 - Mar 20 by DaleiLama |
Hmmmmmmmm. I have been stuck in the car half the day, so have been giving this whole issue a coat of weighing up and just listened to RG's interview.
I'm going to preface this by saying that Russ is a thoroughly likeable fellow and he's been like a breath of fresh air since his arrival. He has bags of ideas and experience and he is a terrific asset to the club. He listens and acts. I fail to see what more, as a fan, one could hope for. I have no doubt that his salary, and then some, will be paid for by the increased profitability of the club in the long run.
Now the kicker and playing devil's advocate to your post above - Russ has said the following in "the interview":
4k is achievable
It's very achievable
It's very, very achievable
Then he said if we can achieve 4k?
Then we have 1850 STs now and 2k is very achievable
Then when asked about 4k he was "sure it's achievable".
The he said the £110 season ticket is a start
Then I really hope the poeple of Rochdale get behind it.
Whilst it could be argued there are some mixed messages in this, he is mostly pretty convinced it will happen. Of course he has to be, and if he isn't, no one else will be. But if it is going to happen, why the s0dding hell have they done it like this. Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes.
I get what you are saying about supporting the club. And I've gone on record before saying that footy is an emotional experience, as is committing to a club/ST etc so I know the analogy isn't perfect, but imagine if Currys had a telly sale and said we want a £50 deposit and if we knock out 4k we'll ask for another £60/telly, but if we sell than less than 2k we'll be looking for another £300+/telly? Why should all the risk lie with the fan, is what I am saying. My knee-jerk gut reaction to this was it's a win-win for Dale, and the risk is transferred to the fanbase, some of whom could lose their deposit (this view hasn't changed since). That, in my personal view, is not the right way to go about business. At least not how I would have done it. The club is selling something - it should take the risk. They are saying there is no risk, so why shouldn't they take this "no risk" themselves? The idea is brilliant, the execution should have been better.
So there you go - that's the business-man side of me. Now the fan in me will post on the other thread thingy that I'm going to chuck my fifty in and see what happens. I gambled on a half ST and I am lucky that I can afford to lose the deposit if it does go tits up (my gut, again, tells me £150 might be where this settles, but who knows)? So I find myself supporting something to which I am morally opposed to. Not easy being a Dale fan most of the time. I just hope for everyone who can't afford to gamble, the club announces it has passed an "affordability" threshold in good time for them to still benefit. [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 19:13]
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You touched upon my point again in your last paragraph. It's for those who can afford it to drive it initially by putting aside any thoughts of "I'm not going to lose £50/pay full whack even though I can afford to" and getting their deposit paid with no questions asked.
This will then hopefully encourage those who find it a tougher ask to justify the decision, because once they see the targets approaching it'll become affordable. Then when those who can are ok to pay £250 stump up those who can afford £200 come into play, then £150... |  |
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| Season ticket on 19:49 - Mar 20 with 2203 views | DaleiLama |
| Season ticket on 19:26 - Mar 20 by 442Dale |
You touched upon my point again in your last paragraph. It's for those who can afford it to drive it initially by putting aside any thoughts of "I'm not going to lose £50/pay full whack even though I can afford to" and getting their deposit paid with no questions asked.
This will then hopefully encourage those who find it a tougher ask to justify the decision, because once they see the targets approaching it'll become affordable. Then when those who can are ok to pay £250 stump up those who can afford £200 come into play, then £150... |
And with respect, you have by-passed my point about which side of this partnership, the club or the customer, should take the burden of risk.
I understand the economics of the thing and momentum is critical to it succeeding. Taking my individual circumstances into account, I am taking that risk on board and as I probably won't get to half of the games if that, I'll walk away if it doesn't work out. It should never be in a position not to work out though. Don't know about you, but I haven't won £3m+ on the lottery like RAFC did. The club has deeper pockets than most of its fans. We shouldn't even be having this conversation.
I know you want it to succeed. So do I. But if you can't see the imbalance, then there's nothing more really needs adding. | |
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| Season ticket on 20:02 - Mar 20 with 2155 views | 442Dale |
| Season ticket on 19:49 - Mar 20 by DaleiLama |
And with respect, you have by-passed my point about which side of this partnership, the club or the customer, should take the burden of risk.
I understand the economics of the thing and momentum is critical to it succeeding. Taking my individual circumstances into account, I am taking that risk on board and as I probably won't get to half of the games if that, I'll walk away if it doesn't work out. It should never be in a position not to work out though. Don't know about you, but I haven't won £3m+ on the lottery like RAFC did. The club has deeper pockets than most of its fans. We shouldn't even be having this conversation.
I know you want it to succeed. So do I. But if you can't see the imbalance, then there's nothing more really needs adding. |
I can see it all and totally accept your point. We all have our own set of principles on things and that's never up for debate (unless they're irrational!).
The deal, as it is, needs supporters to do their bit. For those who can, please do. | |
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| Season ticket on 20:06 - Mar 20 with 2143 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Season ticket on 18:21 - Mar 20 by electricblue |
Why dont the club offer a split season ticket...
In other words the season ticket costs £250 and spread over 2 payments.
The first £125 is payable before the preason deadline offer and the other £125 is payable end of november.....
That is surely cheap enough..
Or.
£50 deposit.
Then 8 monthly payments of £25.....
That way the club as a regular monthly income aswell..... |
This would only work with electronic turnstiles,otherwise people who missed payments will still get access |  |
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| Season ticket on 20:19 - Mar 20 with 2110 views | Shun |
If we get the best price then it'll be £4.78 a match. Get that figure emblazoned on every billboard and bus shelter in Rochdale in big sparkly digits! [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 20:19]
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| Season ticket on 20:34 - Mar 20 with 2068 views | D_Alien |
| Season ticket on 18:58 - Mar 20 by DaleiLama |
Hmmmmmmmm. I have been stuck in the car half the day, so have been giving this whole issue a coat of weighing up and just listened to RG's interview.
I'm going to preface this by saying that Russ is a thoroughly likeable fellow and he's been like a breath of fresh air since his arrival. He has bags of ideas and experience and he is a terrific asset to the club. He listens and acts. I fail to see what more, as a fan, one could hope for. I have no doubt that his salary, and then some, will be paid for by the increased profitability of the club in the long run.
Now the kicker and playing devil's advocate to your post above - Russ has said the following in "the interview":
4k is achievable
It's very achievable
It's very, very achievable
Then he said if we can achieve 4k?
Then we have 1850 STs now and 2k is very achievable
Then when asked about 4k he was "sure it's achievable".
The he said the £110 season ticket is a start
Then I really hope the poeple of Rochdale get behind it.
Whilst it could be argued there are some mixed messages in this, he is mostly pretty convinced it will happen. Of course he has to be, and if he isn't, no one else will be. But if it is going to happen, why the s0dding hell have they done it like this. Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes.
I get what you are saying about supporting the club. And I've gone on record before saying that footy is an emotional experience, as is committing to a club/ST etc so I know the analogy isn't perfect, but imagine if Currys had a telly sale and said we want a £50 deposit and if we knock out 4k we'll ask for another £60/telly, but if we sell than less than 2k we'll be looking for another £300+/telly? Why should all the risk lie with the fan, is what I am saying. My knee-jerk gut reaction to this was it's a win-win for Dale, and the risk is transferred to the fanbase, some of whom could lose their deposit (this view hasn't changed since). That, in my personal view, is not the right way to go about business. At least not how I would have done it. The club is selling something - it should take the risk. They are saying there is no risk, so why shouldn't they take this "no risk" themselves? The idea is brilliant, the execution should have been better.
So there you go - that's the business-man side of me. Now the fan in me will post on the other thread thingy that I'm going to chuck my fifty in and see what happens. I gambled on a half ST and I am lucky that I can afford to lose the deposit if it does go tits up (my gut, again, tells me £150 might be where this settles, but who knows)? So I find myself supporting something to which I am morally opposed to. Not easy being a Dale fan most of the time. I just hope for everyone who can't afford to gamble, the club announces it has passed an "affordability" threshold in good time for them to still benefit. [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 19:13]
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" Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes."
I don't disagree with your points about the balance of risk, but with the above point in mind, I see this initiative - and the format of it - as something not specific to just one season. In a way, the 110 anniversary is coincidental, although a nice hook to hang the marketing on
So, if 4000 hot cakes were bought, what happens in 2018/19? Wouldn't people expect the same very low price? Psychologically, reverting to a higher price to ensure the longer term sustainability would be seen by many new ST holders as a price rise they maybe couldn't afford
This way, a similar type of deal can be put forward year on year without much damage to the finances if it doesn't work, whilst giving those with a real interest in affordable football at the COA an incentive, especially for adults whose kids are being introduced to the club via the junior membership scheme, which really is a brilliant piece of marketing
I think the "£3m lottery ticket" gives the club the chance to start the ball rolling, not to be used as a means of a one-off giveaway that then peters out. Plus, who knows what that money might be used for in terms of infrastructure which our newly-acquired fans can appreciate, both on and off the pitch |  |
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| Season ticket on 20:37 - Mar 20 with 2044 views | 442Dale |
| Season ticket on 20:34 - Mar 20 by D_Alien |
" Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes."
I don't disagree with your points about the balance of risk, but with the above point in mind, I see this initiative - and the format of it - as something not specific to just one season. In a way, the 110 anniversary is coincidental, although a nice hook to hang the marketing on
So, if 4000 hot cakes were bought, what happens in 2018/19? Wouldn't people expect the same very low price? Psychologically, reverting to a higher price to ensure the longer term sustainability would be seen by many new ST holders as a price rise they maybe couldn't afford
This way, a similar type of deal can be put forward year on year without much damage to the finances if it doesn't work, whilst giving those with a real interest in affordable football at the COA an incentive, especially for adults whose kids are being introduced to the club via the junior membership scheme, which really is a brilliant piece of marketing
I think the "£3m lottery ticket" gives the club the chance to start the ball rolling, not to be used as a means of a one-off giveaway that then peters out. Plus, who knows what that money might be used for in terms of infrastructure which our newly-acquired fans can appreciate, both on and off the pitch |
Plus I think half the fun will be the journey towards 21st June. This will create real interest throughout close season. | |
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| Season ticket on 20:38 - Mar 20 with 2043 views | LS27Rdale |
We can argue that we only need another 150 ST holders for the reductions to kick in.
Bearing in mind , the flyer going in every RMBC CTax bill between now and April....which i assume will be all about the ST prices for 2017/18...
Pretty sure 150 people will cough up the £50
The Hartlepool article, has Rochdale written all over it.....the unemployment, the crowd, etc etc
Just do it.... |  | | |
| Season ticket on 20:39 - Mar 20 with 2026 views | TVOS1907 |
| Season ticket on 20:37 - Mar 20 by 442Dale |
Plus I think half the fun will be the journey towards 21st June. This will create real interest throughout close season. |
There should be a bonus free season ticket for anyone who predicts our first game of the campaign.
I'm going for Peterborough (h). |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Season ticket on 20:41 - Mar 20 with 2001 views | D_Alien |
| Season ticket on 20:39 - Mar 20 by TVOS1907 |
There should be a bonus free season ticket for anyone who predicts our first game of the campaign.
I'm going for Peterborough (h). |
Middlesborough (a) | |
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| Season ticket on 20:44 - Mar 20 with 1983 views | boromat |
What's interesting is these targets and prices line up pretty well with my estimates of needing 440k to 500k to be sustainable. Interestingly the more targets we get through the less money the club makes in ticket sales. They must be hoping the difference will be made up by match day revenue increases in food and drink etc. Looking forward to that first week of sales to see how far we can get. It'll be close to a lot of ppls pay day. | |
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| Season ticket on 20:47 - Mar 20 with 1965 views | roccydaleian |
| Season ticket on 20:41 - Mar 20 by D_Alien |
Middlesborough (a) |
Wigan (h) |  | | |
| Season ticket on 20:48 - Mar 20 with 1955 views | boromat |
Blackburn (a) | |
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| Season ticket on 20:51 - Mar 20 with 1930 views | Dorislove |
| Season ticket on 20:44 - Mar 20 by boromat |
What's interesting is these targets and prices line up pretty well with my estimates of needing 440k to 500k to be sustainable. Interestingly the more targets we get through the less money the club makes in ticket sales. They must be hoping the difference will be made up by match day revenue increases in food and drink etc. Looking forward to that first week of sales to see how far we can get. It'll be close to a lot of ppls pay day. |
Not sure where you come up with those figures to be sustainable when our playing budget is around 1.7m ,i posted earlier about revenues from ticket sales on season tickets but away and walk ups have a massive impact on revenues . | | | |
| Season ticket on 20:54 - Mar 20 with 1904 views | dingdangblue |
| Season ticket on 19:49 - Mar 20 by DaleiLama |
And with respect, you have by-passed my point about which side of this partnership, the club or the customer, should take the burden of risk.
I understand the economics of the thing and momentum is critical to it succeeding. Taking my individual circumstances into account, I am taking that risk on board and as I probably won't get to half of the games if that, I'll walk away if it doesn't work out. It should never be in a position not to work out though. Don't know about you, but I haven't won £3m+ on the lottery like RAFC did. The club has deeper pockets than most of its fans. We shouldn't even be having this conversation.
I know you want it to succeed. So do I. But if you can't see the imbalance, then there's nothing more really needs adding. |
Could it have been an option to defer deposit payment between the 27th March and the end of the season? As an initial 'testing the waters' ? Give fans a chance to order their ticket 1st ? |  |
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| Season ticket on 20:58 - Mar 20 with 1868 views | boromat |
| Season ticket on 20:51 - Mar 20 by Dorislove |
Not sure where you come up with those figures to be sustainable when our playing budget is around 1.7m ,i posted earlier about revenues from ticket sales on season tickets but away and walk ups have a massive impact on revenues . |
Sustainable was the wrong word. It'd mean we'd be making similar to what we usually do. That's my worry as well we'd lose out on the pay on the day money. Hard to analyse fully I'm sure Russ has the figures from pool to back it all up. | |
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| Season ticket on 21:00 - Mar 20 with 3294 views | dingdangblue |
| Season ticket on 20:19 - Mar 20 by Shun |
If we get the best price then it'll be £4.78 a match. Get that figure emblazoned on every billboard and bus shelter in Rochdale in big sparkly digits! [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 20:19]
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Totally! This has to be the main advertising drive : (potentially) £4.78 per game. | |
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| Season ticket on 21:02 - Mar 20 with 3281 views | Dorislove |
| Season ticket on 20:58 - Mar 20 by boromat |
Sustainable was the wrong word. It'd mean we'd be making similar to what we usually do. That's my worry as well we'd lose out on the pay on the day money. Hard to analyse fully I'm sure Russ has the figures from pool to back it all up. |
Very true ,Hartlepool had a £25 away fans potd when they had this structure ,hope we dont go down that route .Not sure what the home section was. | | | |
| Season ticket on 21:06 - Mar 20 with 3259 views | DaleiLama |
| Season ticket on 20:34 - Mar 20 by D_Alien |
" Don't give people a decision to make. Just say look, we are going to let everyone in for a season for £110 next year to celebrate the anniversary. End of. It would have sold like hot cakes."
I don't disagree with your points about the balance of risk, but with the above point in mind, I see this initiative - and the format of it - as something not specific to just one season. In a way, the 110 anniversary is coincidental, although a nice hook to hang the marketing on
So, if 4000 hot cakes were bought, what happens in 2018/19? Wouldn't people expect the same very low price? Psychologically, reverting to a higher price to ensure the longer term sustainability would be seen by many new ST holders as a price rise they maybe couldn't afford
This way, a similar type of deal can be put forward year on year without much damage to the finances if it doesn't work, whilst giving those with a real interest in affordable football at the COA an incentive, especially for adults whose kids are being introduced to the club via the junior membership scheme, which really is a brilliant piece of marketing
I think the "£3m lottery ticket" gives the club the chance to start the ball rolling, not to be used as a means of a one-off giveaway that then peters out. Plus, who knows what that money might be used for in terms of infrastructure which our newly-acquired fans can appreciate, both on and off the pitch |
There absolutely has to be a sustainability to the increase in attendance/pricing. Russ mentiond more than 6k in the first season at 'Pool I think and numbers dwindled to 3.5k and prices increased I think he also said? Not sure I see any offer lasting permanently but the idea is presumably to get more loyal ST holders on the hook first. I suspect they cant plan further than this season until they have some sales data from all revenue streams to see how this impacts profitability.
How many STs do you think we would sell at 110 then? If its more than 4000 (which i think it would be), isnt that the target? If so, i dont think that we would be squandering any more money than has been budgeted from our lottery windfall if any at all. [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 21:16]
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| Season ticket on 21:12 - Mar 20 with 3233 views | D_Alien |
| Season ticket on 21:06 - Mar 20 by DaleiLama |
There absolutely has to be a sustainability to the increase in attendance/pricing. Russ mentiond more than 6k in the first season at 'Pool I think and numbers dwindled to 3.5k and prices increased I think he also said? Not sure I see any offer lasting permanently but the idea is presumably to get more loyal ST holders on the hook first. I suspect they cant plan further than this season until they have some sales data from all revenue streams to see how this impacts profitability.
How many STs do you think we would sell at 110 then? If its more than 4000 (which i think it would be), isnt that the target? If so, i dont think that we would be squandering any more money than has been budgeted from our lottery windfall if any at all. [Post edited 20 Mar 2017 21:16]
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Call it a hunch, but I reckon we'll see sales before the deadline stick at around 3250-3500, unless there's a new ploy brought to bear that takes risk away from the £50 deposit; some ideas have already been mentioned. At those sort of figures though, maybe there wouldn't need to be any additional marketing ploys erm... employed
If we can achieve in the low to mid 3000s this time round, it'd be a significant baseline to build upon. Obviously, I'd be delighted if we achieve the 4000 but we must be prepared for that not to happen, without seeing it as some kind of failure; no doubt some people would, but that's just their mindset - they thought anything less than a couple of thousand half st sales would be a failure but far from it
[Post edited 20 Mar 2017 21:14]
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| Season ticket on 21:19 - Mar 20 with 3194 views | boromat |
| Season ticket on 21:12 - Mar 20 by D_Alien |
Call it a hunch, but I reckon we'll see sales before the deadline stick at around 3250-3500, unless there's a new ploy brought to bear that takes risk away from the £50 deposit; some ideas have already been mentioned. At those sort of figures though, maybe there wouldn't need to be any additional marketing ploys erm... employed
If we can achieve in the low to mid 3000s this time round, it'd be a significant baseline to build upon. Obviously, I'd be delighted if we achieve the 4000 but we must be prepared for that not to happen, without seeing it as some kind of failure; no doubt some people would, but that's just their mindset - they thought anything less than a couple of thousand half st sales would be a failure but far from it
[Post edited 20 Mar 2017 21:14]
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I'd be impressed if we reach 3000 my guess is somewhere around the 2500 and I'd be very happy at that personally but it'd be nice to see as many through the doors as possible. | |
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