| Calvin 11:08 - Nov 2 with 65322 views | macro |
Charged with violent conduct (I assume it's the challenge which Clarke went mad about)
Club going to protest against it so fingers crossed. [Post edited 2 Nov 2016 11:37]
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| Calvin on 23:33 - Nov 4 with 2685 views | dingdangblue |
| Calvin on 22:09 - Nov 4 by DaleiLama |
Not for a second trying to defend the indefensible 442, but in your own words "it really is out of character". Something extreme has been said or done that made Calvin snap. When that happens, common sense, discretion and decency go out of the window. I think he needs help making sense of why it happened and with prevention of any repeat offence for his and the clubs sake, as he will have a target on his back in future. Everyone has their limits. On this day, at minute 77, Calvin's were exceeded and we can only speculate as to why. You mentioned your kids reaction to it. There's a life lesson for them. Unfortunate indeed that they learned it from one of their heroes. |
It is very sad. Even sadder considering the way Calvin has played this season. It does seem totally out of character. What's worse is now this is going to be what he will be remembered for, comments from other fans calling him thug and a coward are very upsetting. But I suppose without knowing his normal character its only understandable. If any of us saw another player doing this we would rightly condemn it and be disgusted. Its hard to comprehend what he did really. |  |
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| Calvin on 23:38 - Nov 4 with 2669 views | D_Alien |
| Calvin on 23:33 - Nov 4 by dingdangblue |
It is very sad. Even sadder considering the way Calvin has played this season. It does seem totally out of character. What's worse is now this is going to be what he will be remembered for, comments from other fans calling him thug and a coward are very upsetting. But I suppose without knowing his normal character its only understandable. If any of us saw another player doing this we would rightly condemn it and be disgusted. Its hard to comprehend what he did really. |
I'm not so sure, ddb
Look at Cantona, look at Suarez, Rooney even. Beckham too - when he was sent off against Argentina in 1998, it was described as "career defining" and effigies were burnt!
People have short memories, and football fans are fickle. What Calvin needs to do is stay fit, come back with his head up and carry on playing the way he was doing. His name might be brought up the next time a player receives a similar punishment, but hopefully by then he'll be seen as an example of a footballer who went on to have an exemplary career |  |
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| Calvin on 23:41 - Nov 4 with 2655 views | DaleiLama |
| Calvin on 23:33 - Nov 4 by dingdangblue |
It is very sad. Even sadder considering the way Calvin has played this season. It does seem totally out of character. What's worse is now this is going to be what he will be remembered for, comments from other fans calling him thug and a coward are very upsetting. But I suppose without knowing his normal character its only understandable. If any of us saw another player doing this we would rightly condemn it and be disgusted. Its hard to comprehend what he did really. |
Indeed - he's been a model pro on and off the field and then kapow. I couldn't read that Sky thread after about a dozen comments. My main hope is that he learns and recovers from this, re-establishes himself as a regular first teamer and rebuilds his Dale legacy.
Who else have we got who scores when he wants? |  |
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| Calvin on 23:45 - Nov 4 with 2631 views | Shun |
| Calvin on 22:20 - Nov 4 by DaleiLama |
Kangaroo court in session .......... |
As suspected, Calvin's name is pretty damned across the country wherever this story appears. Hundreds of comments on whatever media it's posted on and not a one in support. I hope this negativity doesn't transfer to people's opinions of RAFC. |  | | |
| Calvin on 00:05 - Nov 5 with 2583 views | soulboy |
Once again im bemused by footballs authorities, clearly no consideration was given to his excellent disciplinary record. He was obviously provoked probably throughout the game by the odious Clarke who im afraid is typical of many of our opponents. It beggars belief some people are calling for him to be sacked, why not put the lad in prison as well? I cant help feeling that its a case of " lets make an example of him he only plays for little Rochdale". Ive lost count of far worse challenges that were nowhere near as severly punished, such as Dickov playing for Man City in a pre season friendly at Spotland almost breaking Gary Brown in half, an injury which ultimately cost the lad his career. 6 games maximum would have been sufficient and use that for every player guilty of a "nasty elbow". Some hope. [Post edited 5 Nov 2016 0:06]
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| Calvin on 00:07 - Nov 5 with 2574 views | Bobbyjoe |
| Calvin on 23:45 - Nov 4 by Shun |
As suspected, Calvin's name is pretty damned across the country wherever this story appears. Hundreds of comments on whatever media it's posted on and not a one in support. I hope this negativity doesn't transfer to people's opinions of RAFC. |
All the more reason that IF he was called a racial epithet, he should just say something along the lines of, "He called me a so-and-so, I've had it all my life, and I just snapped!" Equally, if he wasn't abused, that should be made clear, too. Justice must be transparent. These matters go beyond football. |  | | |
| Calvin on 00:10 - Nov 5 with 2555 views | judd |
| Calvin on 00:07 - Nov 5 by Bobbyjoe |
All the more reason that IF he was called a racial epithet, he should just say something along the lines of, "He called me a so-and-so, I've had it all my life, and I just snapped!" Equally, if he wasn't abused, that should be made clear, too. Justice must be transparent. These matters go beyond football. |
Absolutely. Two sides to every story. |  |
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| Calvin on 00:18 - Nov 5 with 2528 views | D_Alien |
| Calvin on 00:10 - Nov 5 by judd |
Absolutely. Two sides to every story. |
And if he's been advised not to by the club's legal advisors? | |
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| Calvin on 00:39 - Nov 5 with 2478 views | Bobbyjoe |
| Calvin on 00:18 - Nov 5 by D_Alien |
And if he's been advised not to by the club's legal advisors? |
Why would they advise him to not mention he'd been racially abused, potentially a crime in itself, (if he claimed he had been)? Who are they seeking to protect? The morals of the game? Perhaps the FA gave him an exemplary ban precisely because he wouldn't "grass" on a fellow professional, owing to some misplaced code of honour, in which case I think they may have shot themselves in the foot. I suspect the full story will emerge eventually. | | | |
| Calvin on 04:55 - Nov 5 with 2369 views | PDIDDY |
| Calvin on 19:35 - Nov 4 by macro |
I haven't slated the decision prior so get your facts right. Don't worry your head about it though worry more about your mortgaged to the hilt club. Look at sacking people within giggle for financial mismanagement. |
That old chestnut, 3 years on 😂 |  |
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| Calvin on 06:42 - Nov 5 with 2330 views | BartRowou |
Does anyone know why it's 12, not 11, 13 or 8? Is there a set criteria or do they just sit around and think of a number?
It's like those parents one hears in Morrisons - "right, yer grounded for a month." |  |
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| Calvin on 07:00 - Nov 5 with 2324 views | TVOS1907 |
| Calvin on 00:05 - Nov 5 by soulboy |
Once again im bemused by footballs authorities, clearly no consideration was given to his excellent disciplinary record. He was obviously provoked probably throughout the game by the odious Clarke who im afraid is typical of many of our opponents. It beggars belief some people are calling for him to be sacked, why not put the lad in prison as well? I cant help feeling that its a case of " lets make an example of him he only plays for little Rochdale". Ive lost count of far worse challenges that were nowhere near as severly punished, such as Dickov playing for Man City in a pre season friendly at Spotland almost breaking Gary Brown in half, an injury which ultimately cost the lad his career. 6 games maximum would have been sufficient and use that for every player guilty of a "nasty elbow". Some hope. [Post edited 5 Nov 2016 0:06]
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Unfortunately, Calvin wasn't making a challenge. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Calvin on 07:04 - Nov 5 with 2314 views | nordenblue |
| Calvin on 06:42 - Nov 5 by BartRowou |
Does anyone know why it's 12, not 11, 13 or 8? Is there a set criteria or do they just sit around and think of a number?
It's like those parents one hears in Morrisons - "right, yer grounded for a month." |
Think it just depends how they're feeling,what club it involves and if they believe they can bully you or not it would seem.It's the wonderful FA for you | | | |
| Calvin on 07:18 - Nov 5 with 2296 views | fitzochris |
I think we can all agree, given it was off the ball, that the offence is a very bad one. It's hard trying to convey to the brainless on Twitter that it was genuinely out of character. To see Calvin branded a monster, animal and thug is quite hard to take, given we all know he's not.
However, his act was monstrous, animalistic and thuggish, so I suppose trying to defend his usual character is a wasted exercise as far as the ignorant twitterati goes.
Those trying to say Clarke asked for it, too, may have a point, but there are ways and means of dealing with stuff like that, and a clothesline to the face isn't one of them. I suppose that's easy to say from my removed position, but we can only look at our own players when it comes to discipline.
For me, the ban itself is excessive but only in so far as the fact it is inconsistent with other offences, some of which I deem worse in nature. If 12 games was the benchmark for this type of act, it would be fine because it warrants it. Problem is, it isn't. It's a groundbreaking punishment in many respects.
I really do hope the club make a much better statement than what has been released already. The only legal implication I can see for them not doing so is that the police are already involved.
The other sad thing is that this detracts from the excitement of FA Cup round one and all talk of that. |  |
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| Calvin on 07:33 - Nov 5 with 2276 views | joecooke |
Watched it back a few times and regardless of potential provocation it is a horror challenge.
Its not a tackle trying to win the ball or to go through someone late to the legs, its a flying elbow to an opponents head.
The potential ramifications of such an action are far more serious health wise for your opponent and as such the 12 game ban in my opinion is warranted. |  |
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| Calvin on 08:13 - Nov 5 with 2242 views | mikehunt |
I wonder what would have happened had the ref seen it and sent Calvin off at the time. Would everyone have been appeased and Calv just serve a three match ban?
In a case like this I think we really need to know whether there was any provocation because, if we have been harbouring a latent psychopath in our midst, we don't want him. But that's how Calvin's action is being judged by the media. |  |
| The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance. |
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| Calvin on 08:46 - Nov 5 with 2163 views | mingthemerciless |
| Calvin on 07:33 - Nov 5 by joecooke |
Watched it back a few times and regardless of potential provocation it is a horror challenge.
Its not a tackle trying to win the ball or to go through someone late to the legs, its a flying elbow to an opponents head.
The potential ramifications of such an action are far more serious health wise for your opponent and as such the 12 game ban in my opinion is warranted. |
I agree. It wasn't during play going for the ball. I was reminded of the Arsenal midfield player Paul Davis a few years ago that punched an opponent from behind off the ball and broke his jaw. He got a long suspension in an era when play was a bit rougher than it is today in spite of the incident being out of character for the player. I don't think he was the same player after that.
Edit - just checked and Paul Davis got 9 matches in a more lenient era. Having said that he did break his opponents jaw.
I remember being at a Utd v Blackburn game in the sixties. Mike England was playing centre forward for Blackburn with that fiery Irish goalkeeper Harry Gregg in goal for Utd. Something must have happened between them. Towards the end of the game Blackburn got a corner. When it was swung in Gregg came running out towards England and just punched him in the side of the head with the ball a yard or two away. Gregg just carried on walking, he didn't wait to get sent off, he sent him self off.
I suppose he got a couple of games in those days, it was a different world then,
Other than those incidents I can't recall a similar event.
Regarding Andrews I think the ban is justified but that should be it. I wouldn't like to see him lose his job given his previous good conduct. [Post edited 5 Nov 2016 9:06]
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| Calvin on 08:48 - Nov 5 with 2159 views | DaleiLama |
| Calvin on 08:13 - Nov 5 by mikehunt |
I wonder what would have happened had the ref seen it and sent Calvin off at the time. Would everyone have been appeased and Calv just serve a three match ban?
In a case like this I think we really need to know whether there was any provocation because, if we have been harbouring a latent psychopath in our midst, we don't want him. But that's how Calvin's action is being judged by the media. |
Latent psychopath? A 12 year unblemished career is probably the highest degree of latency ever recorded. Suggest anyone harbouring such thought go for the unfortified cornflakes next time.
As for the media, bad news sells. Think back to when you last saw a good news story. | |
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| Calvin on 08:50 - Nov 5 with 2145 views | TVOS1907 |
| Calvin on 07:18 - Nov 5 by fitzochris |
I think we can all agree, given it was off the ball, that the offence is a very bad one. It's hard trying to convey to the brainless on Twitter that it was genuinely out of character. To see Calvin branded a monster, animal and thug is quite hard to take, given we all know he's not.
However, his act was monstrous, animalistic and thuggish, so I suppose trying to defend his usual character is a wasted exercise as far as the ignorant twitterati goes.
Those trying to say Clarke asked for it, too, may have a point, but there are ways and means of dealing with stuff like that, and a clothesline to the face isn't one of them. I suppose that's easy to say from my removed position, but we can only look at our own players when it comes to discipline.
For me, the ban itself is excessive but only in so far as the fact it is inconsistent with other offences, some of which I deem worse in nature. If 12 games was the benchmark for this type of act, it would be fine because it warrants it. Problem is, it isn't. It's a groundbreaking punishment in many respects.
I really do hope the club make a much better statement than what has been released already. The only legal implication I can see for them not doing so is that the police are already involved.
The other sad thing is that this detracts from the excitement of FA Cup round one and all talk of that. |
I could be wrong, but I wonder if there are new levels of punishment these days.
Those comparing it with the Cantona incident should remember that was 21 years ago; it would be like when I started watching Dale comparing incidents to those from 1961. Look at how the way goalkeepers can't now be challenged has changed over time, for instance.
We can only guess and won't know for sure until another player from another club does something similar. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Calvin on 08:56 - Nov 5 with 2134 views | mingthemerciless |
What would you rather be on the receiving end of ? A head butt to the upper chest or a flying elbow to the jaw ? | | | |
| Calvin on 08:57 - Nov 5 with 2135 views | DaleiLama |
| Calvin on 07:18 - Nov 5 by fitzochris |
I think we can all agree, given it was off the ball, that the offence is a very bad one. It's hard trying to convey to the brainless on Twitter that it was genuinely out of character. To see Calvin branded a monster, animal and thug is quite hard to take, given we all know he's not.
However, his act was monstrous, animalistic and thuggish, so I suppose trying to defend his usual character is a wasted exercise as far as the ignorant twitterati goes.
Those trying to say Clarke asked for it, too, may have a point, but there are ways and means of dealing with stuff like that, and a clothesline to the face isn't one of them. I suppose that's easy to say from my removed position, but we can only look at our own players when it comes to discipline.
For me, the ban itself is excessive but only in so far as the fact it is inconsistent with other offences, some of which I deem worse in nature. If 12 games was the benchmark for this type of act, it would be fine because it warrants it. Problem is, it isn't. It's a groundbreaking punishment in many respects.
I really do hope the club make a much better statement than what has been released already. The only legal implication I can see for them not doing so is that the police are already involved.
The other sad thing is that this detracts from the excitement of FA Cup round one and all talk of that. |
My interpretation of this is that Calvin is on thin ice and if he starts mouthing off telling his side of the story, it could be the trigger for Clarke to initiate a private prosecution, which he would probably win.
If I were his lawyer I would advise him to let that dog stay asleep. If it wakes up then everything will come out in court as alluded to earlier. | |
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| Calvin on 09:01 - Nov 5 with 2115 views | fitzochris |
| Calvin on 08:50 - Nov 5 by TVOS1907 |
I could be wrong, but I wonder if there are new levels of punishment these days.
Those comparing it with the Cantona incident should remember that was 21 years ago; it would be like when I started watching Dale comparing incidents to those from 1961. Look at how the way goalkeepers can't now be challenged has changed over time, for instance.
We can only guess and won't know for sure until another player from another club does something similar. |
There may well be. Cantona isn't the right comparison, for me, because he attacked a spectator. I guess the closest thing is Thatcher on Mendes, but that was both ages ago and involved the ball to some degree.
You're right. The test comes when an incident similar to this occurs again. | |
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| Calvin on 09:08 - Nov 5 with 2100 views | fitzochris |
| Calvin on 08:57 - Nov 5 by DaleiLama |
My interpretation of this is that Calvin is on thin ice and if he starts mouthing off telling his side of the story, it could be the trigger for Clarke to initiate a private prosecution, which he would probably win.
If I were his lawyer I would advise him to let that dog stay asleep. If it wakes up then everything will come out in court as alluded to earlier. |
I don't know.
I want to make it clear that I'm not mitigating Andrew's actions at all. Regardless of provocation, if any, what he did is unjustifiable, wrong, brutal, thuggish.
I called for confirmation of the offence. We got that in the form of the video evidence (albeit via the Daily Mail).
Anything beyond this is mere curiosity. I want to know why a man who both on and off the pitch comes across as a level-headed, decent individual smashed an opposition player when the ball was nowhere near the two of them.
It won't justify what he did, but maybe help people understand where he was coming from.
As far as private prosecutions go, it's arguable there could be a public one given the evidence. It's been said, unquantifiably, that a complaint has been made to the police. If that's the case, I can understand all concerned keeping quiet for now.
If it's not the case, it would be good to hear from the club as to how they view this whole affair. Not in a formal statement, but with quotes from Hill and Dunphy. Like it or not, the club, by association, is getting tarred with an almighty elbow-shaped brush out there right now. [Post edited 5 Nov 2016 9:10]
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| Calvin on 09:19 - Nov 5 with 2068 views | DaleiLama |
| Calvin on 09:08 - Nov 5 by fitzochris |
I don't know.
I want to make it clear that I'm not mitigating Andrew's actions at all. Regardless of provocation, if any, what he did is unjustifiable, wrong, brutal, thuggish.
I called for confirmation of the offence. We got that in the form of the video evidence (albeit via the Daily Mail).
Anything beyond this is mere curiosity. I want to know why a man who both on and off the pitch comes across as a level-headed, decent individual smashed an opposition player when the ball was nowhere near the two of them.
It won't justify what he did, but maybe help people understand where he was coming from.
As far as private prosecutions go, it's arguable there could be a public one given the evidence. It's been said, unquantifiably, that a complaint has been made to the police. If that's the case, I can understand all concerned keeping quiet for now.
If it's not the case, it would be good to hear from the club as to how they view this whole affair. Not in a formal statement, but with quotes from Hill and Dunphy. Like it or not, the club, by association, is getting tarred with an almighty elbow-shaped brush out there right now. [Post edited 5 Nov 2016 9:10]
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I am no lawyer but if there was a public prosecution does Clarke have to support it or can he drop charges? As of now he is the victim occupying the moral high ground but if the truth comes out all that is lost. | |
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