| Next manager and reasons why... 17:17 - Aug 18 with 87574 views | Sheffield_dale |
Shame it didn't work for Robbie. IMO he didn't get the team prepared for the season and unfortunately deserves to go. I can understand what he wanted to achieve with the formation but didn't coach them well enough/quick enough to put it into action. We would be too far adrift before things clicked into place.
So, who do we want next.
I'll throw in a suggestion.
Dave Artell.
Steadily built up a Crewe team on a low budget and got promoted.
Not perfect by any means but he would be within our budget and has decent L2 experience and success.
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:22 - Aug 22 with 4884 views | James1980 |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 19:49 - Aug 22 by alderleydale |
Bollocks,
They were playing almost in his backyard only a week ago and he said he couldn’t change shifts.
Do me a favour. |
I prioritise home games. I work 2 weekends in 3 and get rostered annual leave and get 4 adhoc days plus lieu days I can book if I work bank holiday. If someone is already off being relief staff I can't get the day off unless I swap a rest day with one of my colleagues. This time of year it is quite difficult to swap for Saturday off.
I have used up all my spare leave to get to the home games I can this calendar year. I requested a late shift on Wednesday this week because I am going up to the cup game tomorrow and staying over night. I also asked for an early finish as possible on Friday because I will be getting up early on Saturday which is a day I have taken as leave. My shifts this week to facilitate seeing Dale
Wednesday 15:45-00:30
Thursday 13:25-22:20
Friday 10:20-19:05 [Post edited 22 Aug 2022 22:00]
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:28 - Aug 22 with 4839 views | 442Dale |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:22 - Aug 22 by James1980 |
I prioritise home games. I work 2 weekends in 3 and get rostered annual leave and get 4 adhoc days plus lieu days I can book if I work bank holiday. If someone is already off being relief staff I can't get the day off unless I swap a rest day with one of my colleagues. This time of year it is quite difficult to swap for Saturday off.
I have used up all my spare leave to get to the home games I can this calendar year. I requested a late shift on Wednesday this week because I am going up to the cup game tomorrow and staying over night. I also asked for an early finish as possible on Friday because I will be getting up early on Saturday which is a day I have taken as leave. My shifts this week to facilitate seeing Dale
Wednesday 15:45-00:30
Thursday 13:25-22:20
Friday 10:20-19:05 [Post edited 22 Aug 2022 22:00]
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If I was using most of my leave to watch Dale, it’d make me consider working more! Quite remarkable effort really. |  |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:29 - Aug 22 with 4835 views | TVOS1907 |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:22 - Aug 22 by James1980 |
I prioritise home games. I work 2 weekends in 3 and get rostered annual leave and get 4 adhoc days plus lieu days I can book if I work bank holiday. If someone is already off being relief staff I can't get the day off unless I swap a rest day with one of my colleagues. This time of year it is quite difficult to swap for Saturday off.
I have used up all my spare leave to get to the home games I can this calendar year. I requested a late shift on Wednesday this week because I am going up to the cup game tomorrow and staying over night. I also asked for an early finish as possible on Friday because I will be getting up early on Saturday which is a day I have taken as leave. My shifts this week to facilitate seeing Dale
Wednesday 15:45-00:30
Thursday 13:25-22:20
Friday 10:20-19:05 [Post edited 22 Aug 2022 22:00]
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He's been banned James, so you can save your typing fingers.
See you at Hillsborough. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:32 - Aug 22 with 4813 views | Brierls |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:20 - Aug 22 by D_Alien |
I too think we've got the basis of a side that can compete in L2, given the right management
One aspect of recruitment i would question is the overuse of young loanees. We're in no position to be giving promising youngsters experience, unless they're home grown. There's no loyalty to the club and their experience from the academies of major clubs is a world away from what's required
They can all go back for me, but no qualms if the new manager thinks he can get them busting a gut. Most of all, i just want to see a team with a proper Dale identity that's not wet behind the ears |
The loanee’s is a difficult one because season long loans are typically locked down for that period. I know we can expect the parent clubs want them to get minutes, and us saying circumstances have changed and they won’t get minutes should be a trigger to end an agreement, but I don’t think it’s that simple.
How many times do you hear of a loan being terminated because of a change in management?
The new manager will have to assess season long loan players in the same way he assesses contracted players. With the exception of Tulloch, who looked a panic signing, I think all the loanees are decent enough and improve the squad. |  | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:35 - Aug 22 with 4779 views | 442Dale |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:32 - Aug 22 by Brierls |
The loanee’s is a difficult one because season long loans are typically locked down for that period. I know we can expect the parent clubs want them to get minutes, and us saying circumstances have changed and they won’t get minutes should be a trigger to end an agreement, but I don’t think it’s that simple.
How many times do you hear of a loan being terminated because of a change in management?
The new manager will have to assess season long loan players in the same way he assesses contracted players. With the exception of Tulloch, who looked a panic signing, I think all the loanees are decent enough and improve the squad. |
The other doubt for me is Seriki, not because he’s not good enough but more whether he can play as an orthodox full back. If the new manager wants a Wayne Evans rather than a Corey O’Keeffe, that would be the discussion with Sheff U who will want their wing backs getting game time in a formation that matches theirs. | |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:39 - Aug 22 with 4758 views | D_Alien |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:35 - Aug 22 by 442Dale |
The other doubt for me is Seriki, not because he’s not good enough but more whether he can play as an orthodox full back. If the new manager wants a Wayne Evans rather than a Corey O’Keeffe, that would be the discussion with Sheff U who will want their wing backs getting game time in a formation that matches theirs. |
The 'game time' issue is one way to deal with loanees. If the new manager has different ideas on how to build a squad, just leave them on the bench. If their parent club objects, off they go
The shame is a selective use of young loanees can enhance a squad, as it mainly did when we were competing in L1. I appreciate that if we change our policy it could knock back the relationships built up with loaning clubs, but i wouldn't be having sleepless nights over it |  |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:43 - Aug 22 with 4735 views | Brierls |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:35 - Aug 22 by 442Dale |
The other doubt for me is Seriki, not because he’s not good enough but more whether he can play as an orthodox full back. If the new manager wants a Wayne Evans rather than a Corey O’Keeffe, that would be the discussion with Sheff U who will want their wing backs getting game time in a formation that matches theirs. |
We’re probably getting a bit ahead of ourselves to be honest. I’ve nothing to back this up, but it seems wing backs are a lot more commonly used than full backs these days.
The new manager will hopefully have a Plan A, B and C which will require players playing in different formations and actually know their role.
As daft as it sounds, it may be easier for us to move on (permanent or loan) contracted players, even new signings. I certainly wouldn’t lose any sleep over Sinclair going on loan for example. [Post edited 22 Aug 2022 21:46]
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 22:06 - Aug 22 with 4592 views | seasidedale |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:28 - Aug 22 by 442Dale |
If I was using most of my leave to watch Dale, it’d make me consider working more! Quite remarkable effort really. |
I remember in the mid 1970’s I was a nurse and had to work shift, on some Saturdays I would get to the ground after finishing work at 4.30 for last 15 mins I used to unlock and lock the gates after a match | | | |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 22:48 - Aug 22 with 4405 views | KnavesmireBob |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 20:58 - Aug 22 by TVOS1907 |
What do they think of their new ground, Bob? |
They quite like it TVOS. Bootham Crescent contained loads of happy memories and was in a great central location but it was falling to pieces. The new place lacks the character and heritage and is a pain in the arse to get to especially for away fans coming in from the station, but as far as modern small new stadiums go it's well put together and has decent facilities both in the ground and the surrounding area. Looking forward to plotting a new pub route from station to ground when you all next visit :) | | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 23:40 - Aug 22 with 4256 views | Shun |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:22 - Aug 22 by James1980 |
I prioritise home games. I work 2 weekends in 3 and get rostered annual leave and get 4 adhoc days plus lieu days I can book if I work bank holiday. If someone is already off being relief staff I can't get the day off unless I swap a rest day with one of my colleagues. This time of year it is quite difficult to swap for Saturday off.
I have used up all my spare leave to get to the home games I can this calendar year. I requested a late shift on Wednesday this week because I am going up to the cup game tomorrow and staying over night. I also asked for an early finish as possible on Friday because I will be getting up early on Saturday which is a day I have taken as leave. My shifts this week to facilitate seeing Dale
Wednesday 15:45-00:30
Thursday 13:25-22:20
Friday 10:20-19:05 [Post edited 22 Aug 2022 22:00]
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Please don’t feel the need to justify yourself, James. Anyone with any sense wouldn’t doubt your loyalty and commitment to the club. |  | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 23:47 - Aug 22 with 4242 views | sweetcorn |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 19:04 - Aug 22 by 49thseason |
The problem starts when too many key players are all allowed to leave at once without being competently replaced, not neccessarily like for like, but it didnt take a genius to see that losing 5 of our best players in a single season would require some replacements who could do a proper job. Not neccessarily the same job, but nonetheless a job perhaps in a somewhat reshuffled side. Ensuring that the team still had enough about it to successfully compete is the top priority, otherwise in respect of relegation there is no net increase in money in the accounts, the fee received simply cancelled by the losses from relegation. Ultimately a club has to develop income streams other than transfers or it is simply treading water at best or sinking at worst. |
Who's job is it to sort that out again? |  |
| Leader of the little gang of immature cretins. |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 23:49 - Aug 22 with 4235 views | sweetcorn |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 19:27 - Aug 22 by James1980 |
He wasn't going to sign no one though was he and it has been well documented we missed out on Stockdale's first choice signings last summer's transfer window. |
Again, you're making excuses. The facts are stock dale signed all of those players.
Where you discounting the transfer window when we set off like a promotion chasing team? Where you f**k so stop talking rubbish. | |
| Leader of the little gang of immature cretins. |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 09:55 - Aug 23 with 3686 views | AtThePeake |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 21:20 - Aug 22 by D_Alien |
I too think we've got the basis of a side that can compete in L2, given the right management
One aspect of recruitment i would question is the overuse of young loanees. We're in no position to be giving promising youngsters experience, unless they're home grown. There's no loyalty to the club and their experience from the academies of major clubs is a world away from what's required
They can all go back for me, but no qualms if the new manager thinks he can get them busting a gut. Most of all, i just want to see a team with a proper Dale identity that's not wet behind the ears |
Some of our key players in relegation fights of recent years have been loanees from PL/Championship clubs with little experience though. Robert Sanchez, Rhys Norrington-Davies, Gabe Osho, Ethan Hamilton, Stephen Humphrys (first time), Ethan Ebanks-Landell (first time).
Admittedly I don't know about the four we have at the moment just yet, but for me it's far more about the quality of the player than where they've come from and how long they're here for - particularly in the situation that we find ourselves in right now where every point is going to count. |  |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 10:01 - Aug 23 with 3667 views | AtThePeake |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 19:04 - Aug 22 by 49thseason |
The problem starts when too many key players are all allowed to leave at once without being competently replaced, not neccessarily like for like, but it didnt take a genius to see that losing 5 of our best players in a single season would require some replacements who could do a proper job. Not neccessarily the same job, but nonetheless a job perhaps in a somewhat reshuffled side. Ensuring that the team still had enough about it to successfully compete is the top priority, otherwise in respect of relegation there is no net increase in money in the accounts, the fee received simply cancelled by the losses from relegation. Ultimately a club has to develop income streams other than transfers or it is simply treading water at best or sinking at worst. |
Obviously the manager saw enough potential in the likes of Charman and Ball in January and then Ebanks-Landell and Seriki this summer to think they could do that job.
As much as I think Stockdale was out of his depth, I don't for one second think he signed those players thinking they weren't going to be able to 'do a proper job'. Unfortunately for him, and us, they haven't, hence why he's found himself out of a job, but he didn't sign those players thinking they weren't going to be good enough did he? | |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 10:59 - Aug 23 with 3491 views | BlueMessiah |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 23:40 - Aug 22 by Shun |
Please don’t feel the need to justify yourself, James. Anyone with any sense wouldn’t doubt your loyalty and commitment to the club. |
Agreed, despite the fact that when he joined the forum he was treated despicably by many of those who now back him. I'll never forget how he was viewed as some kind of interloper when the "Local Shop For Local People" mentality kicked in.
You know who you are. |  |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 11:17 - Aug 23 with 3432 views | EllDale |
I'd add Jack O'Connell to that list.
The loan market does seem to be a bit of a lottery though. Which is exactly why the parent clubs send them out, to see how they cope. | | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 11:46 - Aug 23 with 3291 views | 49thseason |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 10:01 - Aug 23 by AtThePeake |
Obviously the manager saw enough potential in the likes of Charman and Ball in January and then Ebanks-Landell and Seriki this summer to think they could do that job.
As much as I think Stockdale was out of his depth, I don't for one second think he signed those players thinking they weren't going to be able to 'do a proper job'. Unfortunately for him, and us, they haven't, hence why he's found himself out of a job, but he didn't sign those players thinking they weren't going to be good enough did he? |
I dont disagree, but when you sign a player with very few 1st team games under his belt, you run the risk of discovering that he simply cannot cut the mustard. As a coach, Stockdale probably thought he could cure any lack of experience, and indeed you can maybe accommodate a single inexperienced player, the questions are, how inexperienced and how many players are basically short of experience? Seriki, John, Graham, Nelson, Brierley, Malley, Taylor, Charman, Campbell, Sinclair, Tulloch all have very little league football experience. All possibly excellent players in time but a club in our position needs more players with proven game time. Injuries haven't helped but this squad is top heavy with youngsters and its just naive thinking to imagine that having 4, 5 or 6 of them in the team at the same time will produce satisfactory results.
I dont think Stockdale could shed his U23s coach thinking and get L2 manager into his head, his idea of adding experience was 35 year old Diagouraga and a 37 year old Henderson, what we needed were 26 or 27 year old versions of them or at least replacements with 100+ league games under their belts |  | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 11:51 - Aug 23 with 3253 views | DaleiLama |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 10:59 - Aug 23 by BlueMessiah |
Agreed, despite the fact that when he joined the forum he was treated despicably by many of those who now back him. I'll never forget how he was viewed as some kind of interloper when the "Local Shop For Local People" mentality kicked in.
You know who you are. |
Mentioned this before, but gave James a lift back to Stocky station a few times after games pre-pandemic when trams/local trains weren't running and I lived over that way. He's a sound bloke and dedicated to Dale. His opinions might not always chime with everyones and he has been known to go down the occasional rabbit hole, but anyone having a pop at his level of dedication is clueless. As TVOS rightly pointed out, he's been to a sight more games than a lot of locals and has a SC, which for a Sussex resident is downright admirable. |  |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 11:56 - Aug 23 with 3216 views | 442Dale |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 11:46 - Aug 23 by 49thseason |
I dont disagree, but when you sign a player with very few 1st team games under his belt, you run the risk of discovering that he simply cannot cut the mustard. As a coach, Stockdale probably thought he could cure any lack of experience, and indeed you can maybe accommodate a single inexperienced player, the questions are, how inexperienced and how many players are basically short of experience? Seriki, John, Graham, Nelson, Brierley, Malley, Taylor, Charman, Campbell, Sinclair, Tulloch all have very little league football experience. All possibly excellent players in time but a club in our position needs more players with proven game time. Injuries haven't helped but this squad is top heavy with youngsters and its just naive thinking to imagine that having 4, 5 or 6 of them in the team at the same time will produce satisfactory results.
I dont think Stockdale could shed his U23s coach thinking and get L2 manager into his head, his idea of adding experience was 35 year old Diagouraga and a 37 year old Henderson, what we needed were 26 or 27 year old versions of them or at least replacements with 100+ league games under their belts |
On paper he got the balance right, it’s not turned out that way so far though. There’s the experience of EEL, Kelly and Keohane who are probably in what’s classed as the prime of their careers, added to that is Rodney who has been around a while now too without playing a substantial amount of games anywhere.
Keohane has been a massive miss. | |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 12:06 - Aug 23 with 3175 views | DaleiLama |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 20:30 - Aug 22 by 442Dale |
Back to next manager/the current state of affairs: watching United provides a reasonable idea about what’s required. Castigated for a lack of quality and fight, dubious choices when passing around at the back last week and at a point where many fans were looking at a squad that was nowhere near good enough.
Whatever happens eventually in this Liverpool game, the first half hour illustrates how you react to that. Playing to their strengths with mobile front players, midfielders putting a shift in (even Fernandes winning tackles) and De Gea continually going long from goal kicks so the game can be played in the other half; it negates so many unnecessary issues when you utilise what you’ve got. Even when it includes Scott McTominay. |
You must have been reading my mind 442 - I had exactly the same thoughts going through my head.
It is also notable that the atmosphere was cracking due to the fan protests pre-match and it being Liverpool. Something which Robbie acknowledged at Spotland on the Moggy tribute night against Burton (which I couldn't make) as the best Dale game he'd managed in terms of support.
All the components to win are there at Utd and arguably may be at Dale too if we can capture a similar mindset.
I liked Robbie as a bloke from how he came across and Jim does similarly but we need someone with more of that fighting mentality at the helm next - someone who the players will run through brick walls for. They didn't for Robbie and it doesn't look like they will for Jim. We need consistent inspiration, belief and performances now. The new manager has to be able to bring that to keep us up. Here's hoping. | |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 12:28 - Aug 23 with 3078 views | BucketBstard |
All this wrangling and wringing of hands, not necks I hope, is immaterial now .
Despite what anyone says Nice Guy Robbie, recruited the biggest mess I have every seen in over 50 years.
They are not up to League 2 standards.
I fear for who ever comes in since the money has been pissed away on useless articles like Diago, Ball , EEL, John, Nelson, Seriki , Sinclair , Tulloch and Rodney.
I think Hendo could do a job but needs service.
Least Seriki and Nelson can go back hopefully and whoever comes in can get better loanees.
Is this the John Askey who got sacked from Shrewsbury cos he was very poor to say the least?
Its also very worrying to see the name Hill mentioned....surely not! He was the start of the rot the second time around . Lost that magical touch. And certainly hasnt reclaimed it anywhere he has been. | | | |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 12:36 - Aug 23 with 3005 views | TVOS1907 |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 12:28 - Aug 23 by BucketBstard |
All this wrangling and wringing of hands, not necks I hope, is immaterial now .
Despite what anyone says Nice Guy Robbie, recruited the biggest mess I have every seen in over 50 years.
They are not up to League 2 standards.
I fear for who ever comes in since the money has been pissed away on useless articles like Diago, Ball , EEL, John, Nelson, Seriki , Sinclair , Tulloch and Rodney.
I think Hendo could do a job but needs service.
Least Seriki and Nelson can go back hopefully and whoever comes in can get better loanees.
Is this the John Askey who got sacked from Shrewsbury cos he was very poor to say the least?
Its also very worrying to see the name Hill mentioned....surely not! He was the start of the rot the second time around . Lost that magical touch. And certainly hasnt reclaimed it anywhere he has been. |
Hill's name being mentioned is a made-up fake rumour by a National League Twitter looking for likes and re-tweets.
The number of people who've reacted to it, saying things like they're never going again or will be taking their season tickets back, is laughable. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Next manager and reasons why... on 13:25 - Aug 23 with 2820 views | 442Dale |
| Next manager and reasons why... on 12:28 - Aug 23 by BucketBstard |
All this wrangling and wringing of hands, not necks I hope, is immaterial now .
Despite what anyone says Nice Guy Robbie, recruited the biggest mess I have every seen in over 50 years.
They are not up to League 2 standards.
I fear for who ever comes in since the money has been pissed away on useless articles like Diago, Ball , EEL, John, Nelson, Seriki , Sinclair , Tulloch and Rodney.
I think Hendo could do a job but needs service.
Least Seriki and Nelson can go back hopefully and whoever comes in can get better loanees.
Is this the John Askey who got sacked from Shrewsbury cos he was very poor to say the least?
Its also very worrying to see the name Hill mentioned....surely not! He was the start of the rot the second time around . Lost that magical touch. And certainly hasnt reclaimed it anywhere he has been. |
Stonehouse, Whellans, Ainscow, Small, Chapman in 89? Remember those? Dolan also signed Brown, Goodison, Ward at the same time.
Hit and miss and we didn’t know until about October who was good or bad. That’s one example from the last 50 years. Need any more? | |
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