| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 09:59 - Feb 28 with 2258 views | DaleFan7 |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 23:37 - Feb 27 by EllDale |
I agree that we’re in a dangerous downward spiral.
And, shoot me down if necessary, I’m beginning to wonder about this business plan of selling young prospects.
It certainly worked to an extent with Craig Dawson and Scott Hogan although I’m led to believe that the initial down payments for them was not significant. And there appears to be some debate as to how much Wolves stumped up for Luke Matheson’s signature.
Apart from those three who else has moved on for a fee?
Midfielders like Jamie Allen, Andy Cannon and Daniel Adshead where we only received modest fees. I know that we were apparently skint at the time but an alleged £150k for Cannon was a joke.
Defenders like Joe Rafferty and Harrison McGahey.
The ones that we should have got good money left for nowt, the like of Hendo, NML and Callum Camps.
But even the latter only went to a side in the same division.
It’s no good trying to survive by nurturing neat, technical adept midfielders.
Hogan apart, when was the last time that a striker came through the Academy or via non-league?
It’s the Peterborough model that we should be trying to emulate because that’s where the brass is, for goal scorers. |
Totally agree with this. Everyone says our business model is to develop players through the academy to sell on but realistically who have we developed that came from the academy and we have, so far, raised a decent fee for?
Dawson didn't come through our academy. Hogan did but we had let him go before he came back. Matheson has gone but realistically who is paying a big fee to Wolves to get him, is he going to make it in Wolves 1st team when they can just go out and buy someone? Same with Adshead? Allen and Camps both from the academy left for nothing/next to nothing.
The money that we get tends to be from players who are on a downwards trajectory that we have turned around and are at an age where they can make an impact when other clubs sign them. Holt, Lambert, Murray, Hogan coming back etc. |  | |  |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 10:09 - Feb 28 with 2206 views | VivaDonaldo |
Slept on it, still feel miserable, but wouldn't change the manager. I'll try and explain why I feel that way.
I feel the time to make the change was prior to the transfer window, much like it was for Burton, who's manager was allowed to add to his squad significantly and change the way they were playing.
In backing BBM in January you do feel that this board are prepared to stick with him come what may. They've allowed him to recruit with next year in mind.
He is without doubt the cheaper option, but he is also it seems aligned with the way they want to go about scouting, recruiting and developing young talent in line with the aims of our two new board members.
To sack him now would prompt the question of who you would get in that would accept the current situation, be on board with the future plans but then also not break the bank with their wage demands (don't forget the usual back room staff changes too).
I trust Brian's recruitment and I think his man management of the players is good. What he probably needs, and we might get this with the sporting director appointment, is the ear of an experienced ex-manager where other ideas may be considered.
It feels at the moment like our playing strategy has tunnel vision and is set, regardless of the opposition or the way a particular game is progressing.
It's very admirable, but it isn't going to retain our league 1 status.
Relegation to league 2 won't be the end of the football club, particularly with the adjustments made to the budgets and the outgoing wages in the summer, but it will feel like a huge step back for us after so much progress on the last 20 years.
Everyone is entitled to their view and their course of action but I really disagree with the sentiment of "withdrawing" support for this team next year based on the way this season has gone. The club like always needs it's supporters next year and I feel as though you're essentially contributing to further difficulty if you decide to pull any financial support for the club.
Ultimately, the time has probably passed for changing the manager, see the season out and see where we land. With luck we get players back in time for a huge push at the back end of March. | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 10:24 - Feb 28 with 2144 views | dingdangblue |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 09:33 - Feb 28 by diver |
In my opinion no one can fairly judge this season based on football played under the Covid restrictions.Under normal circumstances games played with crowds we would have at least 10 more home points (look at the fall of Liverpool this season to prove my point).I think the season should be declared “null and void “.If you want a league table for this season perhaps it should be done on basis of balance sheet debt I bet we would be in play off position ! following this theme it gets in my throat that Bolton may replace us next season.Do not judge Manager and players on training ground sessions because that is what people are unfairly doing. |
We'd probably have 10 less away points though. |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 11:39 - Feb 28 with 1958 views | funkkk |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 10:09 - Feb 28 by VivaDonaldo |
Slept on it, still feel miserable, but wouldn't change the manager. I'll try and explain why I feel that way.
I feel the time to make the change was prior to the transfer window, much like it was for Burton, who's manager was allowed to add to his squad significantly and change the way they were playing.
In backing BBM in January you do feel that this board are prepared to stick with him come what may. They've allowed him to recruit with next year in mind.
He is without doubt the cheaper option, but he is also it seems aligned with the way they want to go about scouting, recruiting and developing young talent in line with the aims of our two new board members.
To sack him now would prompt the question of who you would get in that would accept the current situation, be on board with the future plans but then also not break the bank with their wage demands (don't forget the usual back room staff changes too).
I trust Brian's recruitment and I think his man management of the players is good. What he probably needs, and we might get this with the sporting director appointment, is the ear of an experienced ex-manager where other ideas may be considered.
It feels at the moment like our playing strategy has tunnel vision and is set, regardless of the opposition or the way a particular game is progressing.
It's very admirable, but it isn't going to retain our league 1 status.
Relegation to league 2 won't be the end of the football club, particularly with the adjustments made to the budgets and the outgoing wages in the summer, but it will feel like a huge step back for us after so much progress on the last 20 years.
Everyone is entitled to their view and their course of action but I really disagree with the sentiment of "withdrawing" support for this team next year based on the way this season has gone. The club like always needs it's supporters next year and I feel as though you're essentially contributing to further difficulty if you decide to pull any financial support for the club.
Ultimately, the time has probably passed for changing the manager, see the season out and see where we land. With luck we get players back in time for a huge push at the back end of March. |
I think there were probably two opportunities to give him the boot; going into January and then after the Charton game with a run of winnable games. I think the board thinks it’s probably too late now and are just crossing their fingers and hoping for a miracle.
With regards people withdrawing their support for next season, I think a lot of it was reactionary last night. However, should we go into next season with BBM at the helm I think people will have legitimate reason to not want to attend games. I can imagine the atmosphere would be pretty toxic and I could genuinely see us in another relegation scrap. The odd result aside, we’ve been an awful team to watch for four years. People are tired. |  | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 11:57 - Feb 28 with 1915 views | jonahwhereru |
The downside of yesterday is that I think we will be relegated. On the other hand they say it’s the hope that kills you, well all hope has been extinguished. So my life insurance premiums might reduce.
Numbed more than saddened and I am normally emotive. | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:05 - Feb 28 with 1898 views | D_Alien |
Some good points for and against BBM's tenure, but i'm afraid the "it's too late" argument doesn't hold water
Keith Hill was sacked this weekend in 2019, giving BBM enough time to make a difference. Notwithstanding those other points about the board's attitude to BBM, if there is any chance of a change then it's got to be within the next week or two
As we went into this run of fixtures i thought maybe the club would see how we stood afterwards. Our position is the most perilous it's been all season, and the standard of football quite frankly isn't football league standard - absolutely nothing to admire about it. I'm finding it virtually unwatchable; haven't watched some games and wished i hadn't watched the others. Whatever one's feelings about support, it can never be taken for granted. If sausages suddenly came loaded with shit instead of sausage meat, not only would it be useless for R17's sausage test but you'd wouldn't be thinking "i love sausages, eaten them all my life, i'm going to get some more, dammit" |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:15 - Feb 28 with 1876 views | tony_roch975 |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 10:09 - Feb 28 by VivaDonaldo |
Slept on it, still feel miserable, but wouldn't change the manager. I'll try and explain why I feel that way.
I feel the time to make the change was prior to the transfer window, much like it was for Burton, who's manager was allowed to add to his squad significantly and change the way they were playing.
In backing BBM in January you do feel that this board are prepared to stick with him come what may. They've allowed him to recruit with next year in mind.
He is without doubt the cheaper option, but he is also it seems aligned with the way they want to go about scouting, recruiting and developing young talent in line with the aims of our two new board members.
To sack him now would prompt the question of who you would get in that would accept the current situation, be on board with the future plans but then also not break the bank with their wage demands (don't forget the usual back room staff changes too).
I trust Brian's recruitment and I think his man management of the players is good. What he probably needs, and we might get this with the sporting director appointment, is the ear of an experienced ex-manager where other ideas may be considered.
It feels at the moment like our playing strategy has tunnel vision and is set, regardless of the opposition or the way a particular game is progressing.
It's very admirable, but it isn't going to retain our league 1 status.
Relegation to league 2 won't be the end of the football club, particularly with the adjustments made to the budgets and the outgoing wages in the summer, but it will feel like a huge step back for us after so much progress on the last 20 years.
Everyone is entitled to their view and their course of action but I really disagree with the sentiment of "withdrawing" support for this team next year based on the way this season has gone. The club like always needs it's supporters next year and I feel as though you're essentially contributing to further difficulty if you decide to pull any financial support for the club.
Ultimately, the time has probably passed for changing the manager, see the season out and see where we land. With luck we get players back in time for a huge push at the back end of March. |
absolutely, however valid the calls to sack BBM, the point of being a 'fan' is to support come hell, high water or League 2 - the clue's in the name. For those who intend to pull out as supporters next season, maybe they need a different forum - one for non fans! | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:18 - Feb 28 with 1864 views | VivaDonaldo |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:05 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
Some good points for and against BBM's tenure, but i'm afraid the "it's too late" argument doesn't hold water
Keith Hill was sacked this weekend in 2019, giving BBM enough time to make a difference. Notwithstanding those other points about the board's attitude to BBM, if there is any chance of a change then it's got to be within the next week or two
As we went into this run of fixtures i thought maybe the club would see how we stood afterwards. Our position is the most perilous it's been all season, and the standard of football quite frankly isn't football league standard - absolutely nothing to admire about it. I'm finding it virtually unwatchable; haven't watched some games and wished i hadn't watched the others. Whatever one's feelings about support, it can never be taken for granted. If sausages suddenly came loaded with shit instead of sausage meat, not only would it be useless for R17's sausage test but you'd wouldn't be thinking "i love sausages, eaten them all my life, i'm going to get some more, dammit" |
Completely get what you say from a timing perspective. But it was felt then that we have a ready made replacement in house that was an economical option.
Is there anyone in house who would genuinely satisfy the fans with their appointment? | | | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:19 - Feb 28 with 1860 views | Quigley_dale |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:05 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
Some good points for and against BBM's tenure, but i'm afraid the "it's too late" argument doesn't hold water
Keith Hill was sacked this weekend in 2019, giving BBM enough time to make a difference. Notwithstanding those other points about the board's attitude to BBM, if there is any chance of a change then it's got to be within the next week or two
As we went into this run of fixtures i thought maybe the club would see how we stood afterwards. Our position is the most perilous it's been all season, and the standard of football quite frankly isn't football league standard - absolutely nothing to admire about it. I'm finding it virtually unwatchable; haven't watched some games and wished i hadn't watched the others. Whatever one's feelings about support, it can never be taken for granted. If sausages suddenly came loaded with shit instead of sausage meat, not only would it be useless for R17's sausage test but you'd wouldn't be thinking "i love sausages, eaten them all my life, i'm going to get some more, dammit" |
The performances appear to be getting Wurst! | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:19 - Feb 28 with 1858 views | 442Dale |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:15 - Feb 28 by tony_roch975 |
absolutely, however valid the calls to sack BBM, the point of being a 'fan' is to support come hell, high water or League 2 - the clue's in the name. For those who intend to pull out as supporters next season, maybe they need a different forum - one for non fans! |
As posted numerous times, part of being a supporter is making sure that when things are wrong then it’s pointed out with the hope things are changed. Attending games is another argument entirely of course, but supporters do not and should not support everything.
I know you might not have been saying that, but it needs reiterating again. To support or not support the board/manager does not make someone any less of a supporter of a club. |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:28 - Feb 28 with 1823 views | funkkk |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:15 - Feb 28 by tony_roch975 |
absolutely, however valid the calls to sack BBM, the point of being a 'fan' is to support come hell, high water or League 2 - the clue's in the name. For those who intend to pull out as supporters next season, maybe they need a different forum - one for non fans! |
Personally, I’ve never been in to questioning other fans loyalty or commitment.
The majority of fans, it would seem, no longer think BBM should keep his job. If the board wishes to continue with him for the rest of this season and into next season then they shouldn’t be surprised if people don’t turn up. | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:56 - Feb 28 with 1722 views | D_Alien |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:18 - Feb 28 by VivaDonaldo |
Completely get what you say from a timing perspective. But it was felt then that we have a ready made replacement in house that was an economical option.
Is there anyone in house who would genuinely satisfy the fans with their appointment? |
I'd give Paul McShane the interim role until the end of the season
I posted on another thread a week or so ago that he'd been taking his coaching badges since 2014, starting at a much younger age than many others who intend to make a career in coaching/management, and providing the link to the article where he set out how dedicated he was whilst his team-mates were 'on the beach'
Tbh, we now have nothing to lose, and i've little doubt that as a motivator he'd run rings around BBM. Being 'liked' by your players isn't the same as being a good man manager, btw | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:11 - Feb 28 with 1674 views | Hopwoodblue |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:56 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
I'd give Paul McShane the interim role until the end of the season
I posted on another thread a week or so ago that he'd been taking his coaching badges since 2014, starting at a much younger age than many others who intend to make a career in coaching/management, and providing the link to the article where he set out how dedicated he was whilst his team-mates were 'on the beach'
Tbh, we now have nothing to lose, and i've little doubt that as a motivator he'd run rings around BBM. Being 'liked' by your players isn't the same as being a good man manager, btw |
Like I’ve said it more about removing BBM than appointing a new manager
As things stand we all expect relegation but a change in personal at the top might see us go down with a bit of fight right now we are going down with a whimper.
As bad as things are I still think BBM would have more support if he was honest and frank about
our performances in his post match interviews as I’ve said before I find it insulting that he thinks we buy into the “thought we played well” we were the better team” there was only going to be one winner” nonsense. |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:13 - Feb 28 with 1664 views | foreverhopefulDale |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:56 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
I'd give Paul McShane the interim role until the end of the season
I posted on another thread a week or so ago that he'd been taking his coaching badges since 2014, starting at a much younger age than many others who intend to make a career in coaching/management, and providing the link to the article where he set out how dedicated he was whilst his team-mates were 'on the beach'
Tbh, we now have nothing to lose, and i've little doubt that as a motivator he'd run rings around BBM. Being 'liked' by your players isn't the same as being a good man manager, btw |
McShane with Tony Ellis could well work out. An excellent defender in combination with an excellent striker. |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:35 - Feb 28 with 1609 views | nordenblue |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:13 - Feb 28 by foreverhopefulDale |
McShane with Tony Ellis could well work out. An excellent defender in combination with an excellent striker. |
We could do no worse, both already employed so no additional cost and you just never know there may well just be a reaction to players playing in their correct positions too,imagine that idea.... | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:40 - Feb 28 with 1602 views | tony_roch975 |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:19 - Feb 28 by 442Dale |
As posted numerous times, part of being a supporter is making sure that when things are wrong then it’s pointed out with the hope things are changed. Attending games is another argument entirely of course, but supporters do not and should not support everything.
I know you might not have been saying that, but it needs reiterating again. To support or not support the board/manager does not make someone any less of a supporter of a club. |
to support or not the Board/manager may not but choosing not to attend matches (as against not being able to) certainly does | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:41 - Feb 28 with 1595 views | 49thseason |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:13 - Feb 28 by foreverhopefulDale |
McShane with Tony Ellis could well work out. An excellent defender in combination with an excellent striker. |
Now is the time to maximise whatever talents we have in the club, we are beyond the point where we can afford to let ego or a particular philosphy to stand in the way of a rescue mission . Square pegs have to play in square holes, no one can be guaranteed a starting place, everyone needs to either buy in to one last big effort or find something else to do on Tuesdays and Saturdays. The tippy tappy has failed again, now its time for pragmatism, back to basics, get it forrard! If we dont score goals we get relegated, if we dont defend like dervishes we get relegated. We are out of options, its a simple game we have to score one more goal than the opposition over 90 + minutes all of which need to be high energy, high pace and utterly committed in every challenge, sprint, header and attack,
If that means asking McShane to get involved in preparing the team so be it, If it means some loanees missing a few games we promised they could play in , well tough, welcome to real football, if it means calling out players who aren't at it 100% because their heads are somewhere else, get on with it and either drop them or change their minds. Everyone lives with threats to income, health, relationships and troubles at work, wrapping footballers in cotton wool isnt a form of management , its just being a mate. |  | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:55 - Feb 28 with 1560 views | kel |
Not sure why people are saying (more on Twitter than on here) that we can’t afford to sack BBM because of a pay off we’d have to give him. It doesn’t seem to be an issue when getting shut of off the field staff. |  | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:55 - Feb 28 with 1555 views | dingdangblue |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 11:39 - Feb 28 by funkkk |
I think there were probably two opportunities to give him the boot; going into January and then after the Charton game with a run of winnable games. I think the board thinks it’s probably too late now and are just crossing their fingers and hoping for a miracle.
With regards people withdrawing their support for next season, I think a lot of it was reactionary last night. However, should we go into next season with BBM at the helm I think people will have legitimate reason to not want to attend games. I can imagine the atmosphere would be pretty toxic and I could genuinely see us in another relegation scrap. The odd result aside, we’ve been an awful team to watch for four years. People are tired. |
Its definitely not too late. BBM had 11 games back in 2019. We've got 15 left this season which is almost a third of the season to play for. The players need a new voice going off the last 3 non performances. | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 14:13 - Feb 28 with 1504 views | funkkk |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:55 - Feb 28 by dingdangblue |
Its definitely not too late. BBM had 11 games back in 2019. We've got 15 left this season which is almost a third of the season to play for. The players need a new voice going off the last 3 non performances. |
I actually agree. I’m just saying that I don’t think the board see it that way with recent appointments and statements. | | | |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:13 - Feb 28 with 1422 views | Nigeriamark |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 13:55 - Feb 28 by dingdangblue |
Its definitely not too late. BBM had 11 games back in 2019. We've got 15 left this season which is almost a third of the season to play for. The players need a new voice going off the last 3 non performances. |
If we get a couple of absolute pastings in the next 3 games & no points then perhaps they will do as per with KH. Squeak a couple of draws or 1 goal defeats then I think they will stick with him. I'd personally go with the McShane option [Post edited 28 Feb 2021 15:16]
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:14 - Feb 28 with 1427 views | Nafelad |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 12:56 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
I'd give Paul McShane the interim role until the end of the season
I posted on another thread a week or so ago that he'd been taking his coaching badges since 2014, starting at a much younger age than many others who intend to make a career in coaching/management, and providing the link to the article where he set out how dedicated he was whilst his team-mates were 'on the beach'
Tbh, we now have nothing to lose, and i've little doubt that as a motivator he'd run rings around BBM. Being 'liked' by your players isn't the same as being a good man manager, btw |
Is there an argument for McShane being 'promoted' to assistant player/manager? |  |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:31 - Feb 28 with 1376 views | D_Alien |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:14 - Feb 28 by Nafelad |
Is there an argument for McShane being 'promoted' to assistant player/manager? |
Hmm.. if quietly-spoken BBM could cope with a more vocal McShane, possibly
On the other hand, it could prime both parties for the future when BBM's contract runs out | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:34 - Feb 28 with 1370 views | 442Dale |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:31 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
Hmm.. if quietly-spoken BBM could cope with a more vocal McShane, possibly
On the other hand, it could prime both parties for the future when BBM's contract runs out |
Actually talk of the contract raises the question why there was no mention in the statement last week about it being negotiated for an extension. The support of the manager was obvious, so surely that converts into them getting him to stay for a longer period? | |
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| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:47 - Feb 28 with 1319 views | Nafelad |
| Match Thread: Rochdale vs Burton Albion on 15:31 - Feb 28 by D_Alien |
Hmm.. if quietly-spoken BBM could cope with a more vocal McShane, possibly
On the other hand, it could prime both parties for the future when BBM's contract runs out |
I imagine he'd be better than the current assistant, and maybe exert more influence on the manager. | |
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