| Post match warbs 22:08 - Oct 27 with 8236 views | Nov77 |
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| Post match warbs on 23:10 - Oct 27 with 1830 views | gazza1 |
| Post match warbs on 23:00 - Oct 27 by Hunterhoop |
That’s all broadly true, Gaz. But you cannot just pass them off as things Warburton doesn’t control or influence. And in doing do, he (and you) is encouraging a lack of personal and collective accountability.
We all knew Dickie could be handsy from game one. There have been 3-4 pen shouts against him for hands on. Warn him. Coach him. Make him take accountability for selling his team down the river.
We all know we are dominating the game with our previous shape, so why did MW change the shake so drastically (to ill result)? Just take off Bonne, hold your shape but with one up top. Hold you hands up. Fans and player respect that.
We all know Barbet has clownish errors in him. It’s hardly the first. And 2-0 down away with 10 men is hardly the time to be attempting a first time back pass from a dangerous cross into the box with no one, especially the keeper expecting it. Have him own it and take responsibility.
I can go on... |
Do you not think that he will be livid at loosing and not happy at all with Dickie Hunter?? Of course he will be. I blame the Manager and coaches and players for the results - nobody else generally.
We have to realise that the reason these players are with the Rangers is because they are limited and they will make a few errors .....I don't see the point in jumping down there throats like some do.
One point about defenders is that the rules have changed.....it used to be defend first but it appears to me that it is not any more. I don't necessary agree with that but thats what it is. |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 23:15 - Oct 27 with 1815 views | gazza1 |
I forgot all about the punter stuff Hunter....that was a bit of fun, nothing else but you seemed to take it personal if I remember right.
As for jusification....I can justify just as well as you can. and I know the game just as well as you do. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 23:19 - Oct 27 with 1800 views | actonman |
| Post match warbs on 22:29 - Oct 27 by CliveWilsonSaid |
I do agree with him though. Think we gave our all first 20/30 mins playing quite well but didn't get a goal. After that it all went a bit tits up. |
Not as in depth as Clive’s match reports this season but pretty much covers most games |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 23:24 - Oct 27 with 1792 views | Hunterhoop |
| Post match warbs on 23:10 - Oct 27 by gazza1 |
Do you not think that he will be livid at loosing and not happy at all with Dickie Hunter?? Of course he will be. I blame the Manager and coaches and players for the results - nobody else generally.
We have to realise that the reason these players are with the Rangers is because they are limited and they will make a few errors .....I don't see the point in jumping down there throats like some do.
One point about defenders is that the rules have changed.....it used to be defend first but it appears to me that it is not any more. I don't necessary agree with that but thats what it is. |
But great leaders don’t just go along with the trend because it’s the trend. Defenders do need to defend. But more importantly, if I was MW, Barbet appeared to give up. He kept on pushing forward, committing himself, taking himself out of the game and then not tracking back in the last 15. That is unacceptable from a senior pro.
On your first point, all the great managers did one of two things: they either took accountability themselves for bad performances or results, or the players were very clear (and the manager made it subtly clear to the fans and press) that he was livid with the players. Either way either he or the player(s) took accountability. Someone has to.
Warburton is failing to do either. Some would say he’s too “soft”. I think that’s too simplistic. But from a leadership perspective, take accountability yourself or hold others to account...don’t start blaming keyboard warriors or saying some of what happened was acceptable. It lowers the bar. It encourages others not to take accountability.
All the best teams in every discipline, especially sport, know their job and take personal accountability for performing them. But that requires the boss to do the same. I worry Warburton is simply not fostering the right team ethos of personal and collective accountability.
That never ends well. It ends up with finger pointing, buck passing, and collective failure.
If he’s livid with Dickie, say so, but add a positive that he is confident he can bounce back. If you’re worried about expressing your anger at him or forcing accountability onto him, then you don’t have the respect necessary from the dressing room to lead it. A culture of accountability would mean Dickie would be fine with it because he’d know it was warranted. [Post edited 27 Oct 2020 23:28]
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| Post match warbs on 23:26 - Oct 27 with 1786 views | Hunterhoop |
| Post match warbs on 23:15 - Oct 27 by gazza1 |
I forgot all about the punter stuff Hunter....that was a bit of fun, nothing else but you seemed to take it personal if I remember right.
As for jusification....I can justify just as well as you can. and I know the game just as well as you do. |
To be fair, I know you can. I just prefer your posts where you explain your opinion rather than post it as fact. Same with everyone, even if I disagree with them.
Just such a frustrating turn of events from 25 min onwards tonight. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 23:35 - Oct 27 with 1763 views | TopCat34 |
Bit of a stretch on that 25 mins here. Yeah, we we were better and dominated but we still didn't create any meaningful chances - why are we floating in crosses to nobody when we've clearly got Barnsley on the ropes?
Compared to the rest of the game, yeah it was incredible, but come on let's not go overboard - we looked shocking tonight. |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 23:42 - Oct 27 with 1738 views | ted_hendrix |
If Barbet carries on in his current form he'll be our leading goal scorer by the end of November. |  |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| Neil Warnock on 01:34 - Oct 28 with 1654 views | superhoopdownunder |
Once again it hasn't taken Neil Warnock very long to turn around a team. Look at Middlesboro - when he took over they were near the bottom and close to being relegated. They are now seventh in the table.
We should do whatever it takes to get Neil back.
He has the winning formula.
We currently have a formula that has league one all over it. | | | |
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| Neil Warnock on 06:59 - Oct 28 with 1601 views | paulparker |
| Neil Warnock on 01:34 - Oct 28 by superhoopdownunder |
Once again it hasn't taken Neil Warnock very long to turn around a team. Look at Middlesboro - when he took over they were near the bottom and close to being relegated. They are now seventh in the table.
We should do whatever it takes to get Neil back.
He has the winning formula.
We currently have a formula that has league one all over it. |
Won’t happen with our DOF in charge |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Post match warbs on 07:28 - Oct 28 with 1572 views | Paddyhoops |
No surprises he mentioned the keyboard warriors.
However from what I can see here, everybody here has been reasonably balanced in thier opinions and should imagine the majority of us are regulars at Loftus Road.
The so called keyboard warriors have stuck with the club through thick and thin before and after warburtons reign.
The last few months on a football level have been pretty turgid and have mirrored the national mood.
We need a release from the depressing situation, sadly our football club isn't providing it at the moment!!
I'd stick with him for now but its a case of trying to fashion silk purses from sow ears at the moment.
Very worrying. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 07:34 - Oct 28 with 1561 views | Northernr |
This might be an opportune moment to give the "keyboard warriors" stuff a rest.
When I sat down with him pre-season he certainly seemed to have plenty to get off his chest, about what I'd written, about what he sees on social media, about the abuse his players get online, and he certainly did that, but I feel like you get to do that once. He's chippy in every interview atm. Before Barnsley he was giving it "oh people used to say we couldn't defend, now the same people are saying we don't score enough" - well, yeh, both things are true Mark.
No win in seven, no goal in four, one win all season, 3-0 defeat to a team that hadn't won a game, abysmal form since we resumed in June. I get all the restrictions he's working under but I don't think it's a very good idea to be giving it "keyboard warriors" chat while fans are funnelling money into the club while getting nothing back and the team is playing like tarts. |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 07:58 - Oct 28 with 1499 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Post match warbs on 07:34 - Oct 28 by Northernr |
This might be an opportune moment to give the "keyboard warriors" stuff a rest.
When I sat down with him pre-season he certainly seemed to have plenty to get off his chest, about what I'd written, about what he sees on social media, about the abuse his players get online, and he certainly did that, but I feel like you get to do that once. He's chippy in every interview atm. Before Barnsley he was giving it "oh people used to say we couldn't defend, now the same people are saying we don't score enough" - well, yeh, both things are true Mark.
No win in seven, no goal in four, one win all season, 3-0 defeat to a team that hadn't won a game, abysmal form since we resumed in June. I get all the restrictions he's working under but I don't think it's a very good idea to be giving it "keyboard warriors" chat while fans are funnelling money into the club while getting nothing back and the team is playing like tarts. |
Agree with all that.
I was disappointed in his tactics last night after the red card and on Saturday. But new day and new perspective. I still think he's doing a decent job in our trying circumstances.
But for the last few weeks, I think he's been badly advised. As you say, every official interview sees him on the defensive and that's when facing respectful and decent in-house journalism.
At the moment his behaviour reminds me of Gerry Francis's at the end of his first reign. Gerry was facing severe financial constraints compared to most teams he faced and had the support of most of an understanding fanbase but he started doing two things
First, he started changing his tactics, seeming unsure. Gerry went long-ball which was completely foreign to our usual game under him. Warburton in the last three games has chopped and changed playing a wide diamond on Saturday ceding centre-mid), long-ball last night pre-red card, and again abandoning centre-mid after the red (we played with two anchors and two attackers). We no longer play his tight possession game.
Gerry also became incredibly and needlessly defensive despite having the backing of the majority of the fans onboard - continually carping about lack of funds, the enforced sales of Sinton, Parker and Wegerle and spending only ÂŁ160,000 to replace them. Warburton, while remaining commendably discreet about the true extent of the FFP straitjacket we and he are forced to wear, is being similarly - and needlessly - defensive. It would do him no harm at all to occasionally say "ya, that was poor, I slipped up with the tactics, the players slipped, we're better than that".
In the end, the fans got bored with Gerry and his negativity, and his departure - manufactured as it may have been - brought no great sense of loss from a fanbase he had first excited, then enthralled, but eventually made weary.
Warburton, and whoever has his ear, should remember that. |  |
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| Post match warbs on 08:05 - Oct 28 with 1481 views | Rangers67 |
Bit of advice for you MW , don’t start slagging the fans of who have a different opinion to you. Many of them have a lot of years invested in this club and care about it more than you ever will. Now I didn’t expect any thing else but defeat last night after the sending of but it goes a lot further than that as your recent results record shows. So in future button it unless you have something constructive to say or even an apology for our dreadful recent form. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 08:14 - Oct 28 with 1453 views | Hunterhoop |
| Post match warbs on 07:34 - Oct 28 by Northernr |
This might be an opportune moment to give the "keyboard warriors" stuff a rest.
When I sat down with him pre-season he certainly seemed to have plenty to get off his chest, about what I'd written, about what he sees on social media, about the abuse his players get online, and he certainly did that, but I feel like you get to do that once. He's chippy in every interview atm. Before Barnsley he was giving it "oh people used to say we couldn't defend, now the same people are saying we don't score enough" - well, yeh, both things are true Mark.
No win in seven, no goal in four, one win all season, 3-0 defeat to a team that hadn't won a game, abysmal form since we resumed in June. I get all the restrictions he's working under but I don't think it's a very good idea to be giving it "keyboard warriors" chat while fans are funnelling money into the club while getting nothing back and the team is playing like tarts. |
Agree.
At the minute MW needs to be thinking about he arrests the slide. Even mentioning the fans as being overly critical (thereby insinuating they are partly to blame) is a strange tactic. How will that make the players play better? I understand he may be going for the “us and them” strategy that many managers employ (most successfully, Warnock) but you do that with the “us” including the fans. And when the fans are not even in the ground, it seems a bit rich to reference them at all.
He and his players have to start taking accountability, not trot out cliches.
It is no use talking about “luck” when you’re in a run this bad, especially when “the incident” was something all fans, Luck and Sinton have been saying was waiting to happen for weeks.
The players did try but the lack of system/shape held them back. That’s not bad luck. Take responsibility. Why not just continue with a 441, and continue dominating in between the boxes and down the flanks. Take off Bonne. Don’t change the system entirely and negate your best threat (Adomah).
Perhaps he’s taking a very different line in the dressing room with the players. But I always worry when post match interviews during poor runs don’t involve either the boss taking it all on his shoulders or directly calling out unacceptable performances/mistakes of certain players (since they should know and understand it’s unacceptable). It doesn’t encourage the right culture. And you can still do the latter by backing the player to improve, come back stronger, etc.
Fear MW is going into bunker mode, trying to make out things aren’t that bad and it’s just bad luck. If you don’t recognise your weaknesses, you tend not to improve them. [Post edited 28 Oct 2020 8:17]
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| Post match warbs on 08:18 - Oct 28 with 1446 views | CamberleyR |
| Post match warbs on 07:58 - Oct 28 by BrianMcCarthy |
Agree with all that.
I was disappointed in his tactics last night after the red card and on Saturday. But new day and new perspective. I still think he's doing a decent job in our trying circumstances.
But for the last few weeks, I think he's been badly advised. As you say, every official interview sees him on the defensive and that's when facing respectful and decent in-house journalism.
At the moment his behaviour reminds me of Gerry Francis's at the end of his first reign. Gerry was facing severe financial constraints compared to most teams he faced and had the support of most of an understanding fanbase but he started doing two things
First, he started changing his tactics, seeming unsure. Gerry went long-ball which was completely foreign to our usual game under him. Warburton in the last three games has chopped and changed playing a wide diamond on Saturday ceding centre-mid), long-ball last night pre-red card, and again abandoning centre-mid after the red (we played with two anchors and two attackers). We no longer play his tight possession game.
Gerry also became incredibly and needlessly defensive despite having the backing of the majority of the fans onboard - continually carping about lack of funds, the enforced sales of Sinton, Parker and Wegerle and spending only ÂŁ160,000 to replace them. Warburton, while remaining commendably discreet about the true extent of the FFP straitjacket we and he are forced to wear, is being similarly - and needlessly - defensive. It would do him no harm at all to occasionally say "ya, that was poor, I slipped up with the tactics, the players slipped, we're better than that".
In the end, the fans got bored with Gerry and his negativity, and his departure - manufactured as it may have been - brought no great sense of loss from a fanbase he had first excited, then enthralled, but eventually made weary.
Warburton, and whoever has his ear, should remember that. |
Good parallel with Gerry there just before Marshgate. And funnily enough it's almost exactly 26 years since that happened |  |
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| Post match warbs on 08:28 - Oct 28 with 1415 views | ted_hendrix |
| Post match warbs on 07:58 - Oct 28 by BrianMcCarthy |
Agree with all that.
I was disappointed in his tactics last night after the red card and on Saturday. But new day and new perspective. I still think he's doing a decent job in our trying circumstances.
But for the last few weeks, I think he's been badly advised. As you say, every official interview sees him on the defensive and that's when facing respectful and decent in-house journalism.
At the moment his behaviour reminds me of Gerry Francis's at the end of his first reign. Gerry was facing severe financial constraints compared to most teams he faced and had the support of most of an understanding fanbase but he started doing two things
First, he started changing his tactics, seeming unsure. Gerry went long-ball which was completely foreign to our usual game under him. Warburton in the last three games has chopped and changed playing a wide diamond on Saturday ceding centre-mid), long-ball last night pre-red card, and again abandoning centre-mid after the red (we played with two anchors and two attackers). We no longer play his tight possession game.
Gerry also became incredibly and needlessly defensive despite having the backing of the majority of the fans onboard - continually carping about lack of funds, the enforced sales of Sinton, Parker and Wegerle and spending only ÂŁ160,000 to replace them. Warburton, while remaining commendably discreet about the true extent of the FFP straitjacket we and he are forced to wear, is being similarly - and needlessly - defensive. It would do him no harm at all to occasionally say "ya, that was poor, I slipped up with the tactics, the players slipped, we're better than that".
In the end, the fans got bored with Gerry and his negativity, and his departure - manufactured as it may have been - brought no great sense of loss from a fanbase he had first excited, then enthralled, but eventually made weary.
Warburton, and whoever has his ear, should remember that. |
Alienate the fans and you are in trouble.
This morning I'm more pissed off about his "keyboard warriors" quote than I was yesterday,
we're not bloody keyboard warriors, to the best of my knowledge we're working class fans of the club who just like him have an opinion.
The last thing he should be talking about is the fans of the club, 99% of us will still be here long after he's gone.
I was chuffed to bits when he became our Manager but that's gone now.
We've had to put up with crap for nigh on 4-5 Years and here we are still in the same bloody boat, I'm virtually used to it now and shrug my shoulders and deal with it, the reason we're in this situation has got nothing absolutely nothing to do with "keyboard warriors"
That's how I see it anyway. | |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| Neil Warnock on 08:32 - Oct 28 with 1403 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Neil Warnock on 01:34 - Oct 28 by superhoopdownunder |
Once again it hasn't taken Neil Warnock very long to turn around a team. Look at Middlesboro - when he took over they were near the bottom and close to being relegated. They are now seventh in the table.
We should do whatever it takes to get Neil back.
He has the winning formula.
We currently have a formula that has league one all over it. |
Never going to happen - why would he leave a club who actually want him, and as mentioned by paulparker, he's not a 'yes man'. Incredible to think that we had one of the best managers in the Championship and replaced him with Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink. In the five years since, he's saved a couple of teams from being relegated and been promoted - not a surprise to anyone, other than our board and DoF.
Picking the right manager is so important - look at Leeds and Bielsa. That's why, whatever happens with Warburton, I have zero confidence in those making the decision to make the right call. [Post edited 28 Oct 2020 8:33]
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| Post match warbs on 08:38 - Oct 28 with 1383 views | TGRRRSSS |
| Post match warbs on 22:37 - Oct 27 by Hunterhoop |
Agree, Barbet did give up to me. Completely unprofessional.
I get his frustration at “keyboard warriors”. Technically we’re all in that bracket on here.
But I fear he can’t see the woods for the trees. Some of the stuff online is WAY over the top, but some of it is reasoned and perfectly valid.
In the way he got overly defensive with Clive, he needs to be careful not to box himself into a position where “all” criticism is “keyboard warriors”. All that shows is the lack of personal and collective accountability in the squad under his watch. And I’d happily sit there with him and say the same thing. |
I see stuff on Facebook etc which is ridiculous, but I think his Keyboard warriors is a "catch all" including anyone who basically criticises MW.
I think MW also uses this to deflect from not only his players but also and more particularly himself
The impression I've got of MW is a serious minded individual but (and thats fair enough) but I wonder if he struggles with even justified comment/criticisms and when you cannot respond and look at things and say "well can I".... or "is there... etc
The stats overall on that other Thread are frankly dire and if it was any other club we'd be "their going down" ..........." |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 09:16 - Oct 28 with 1324 views | BostonR |
Some of the stuff (and I stress some) played last season was brilliant, but that was negated by our inability to defend, which Warburton never addressed.
It's now his team and on balance, we look a bit of a shambles and that must be down to the manager. If you recall, one of the main criticisms of him, is that he has no plan B and that is starting to ring true.
He's clearly an intelligent person, but I see an element of "my way or the highway" starting to come through and in that capacity he is no Warnock. I suspect the Board will stick with him but the next 3-4 games are going to pile on the pressure if does not turn this team/squad around. |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 09:34 - Oct 28 with 1296 views | TGRRRSSS |
Another thing, now complaining about fans.
Earlier during the Restart in the summer he complained we struggled with empty stadiums???
That perhaps was the beginning of the end maybe? | | | |
| Post match warbs on 09:52 - Oct 28 with 1266 views | gazza1 |
I cant see what MW has done wrong with his Post Match stuff.......I would also suggest that he will 'have it out' with individuals and the Team in general'. I don't think he is trying to deflect any blame, he knows that it is, ultimately, down to him. He perhaps just didnt feel it would do any good slating the individuals and team.
Personally, I try not to 'slag off' players too much, perhaps, because I understand how difficult it is to play and what playing instructions they are playing under. There are too many people on this MB that 'slag off' individuals for their own importance.
Last night was disappointing, for sure, for many reasons (and Hunter because you want examples or reasons.....the start we had in the first 25 minutes, the basic average team we were playing against, the players that we have should be good enough to go to Barnsley and win) but the reason we lost was because, primarily, of the sending off and we should have been ahead by then as well.
Look at the positives MW has brought to the Club and the restrictions that he is working with and to. Ask yourselves what good it would be to 'get rid' at this present time or in a couple of months. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 10:00 - Oct 28 with 1243 views | Hunterhoop |
| Post match warbs on 09:52 - Oct 28 by gazza1 |
I cant see what MW has done wrong with his Post Match stuff.......I would also suggest that he will 'have it out' with individuals and the Team in general'. I don't think he is trying to deflect any blame, he knows that it is, ultimately, down to him. He perhaps just didnt feel it would do any good slating the individuals and team.
Personally, I try not to 'slag off' players too much, perhaps, because I understand how difficult it is to play and what playing instructions they are playing under. There are too many people on this MB that 'slag off' individuals for their own importance.
Last night was disappointing, for sure, for many reasons (and Hunter because you want examples or reasons.....the start we had in the first 25 minutes, the basic average team we were playing against, the players that we have should be good enough to go to Barnsley and win) but the reason we lost was because, primarily, of the sending off and we should have been ahead by then as well.
Look at the positives MW has brought to the Club and the restrictions that he is working with and to. Ask yourselves what good it would be to 'get rid' at this present time or in a couple of months. |
In essence, I think it’s rarely a good thing to get rid of the manager. I think most on here do not want to see Warburton go. I think most recognise the positives of last year. I certainly don’t want him sacked and I want him to turn the results around.
But that doesn’t mean he gets a free pass for reasoned criticism. And it doesn’t mean he gets unlimited time. Many concerns raised above are valid. They shouldn’t be contentious to him or anyone else. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 10:01 - Oct 28 with 1243 views | daveB |
He can moan about keyboard warriors all he likes, he's lucky that there were no fans there last night.
I get it's a difficult situation but the change to 3 at the back after going a goal down was beyond stupid and the way we played that second half charging forward and leaving them with multiple one on ones was schoolboy stuff. Stay on the game, even at 2-0 down get to the last 10 minutes and then start chucking extra bodies forward and cause a bit of panic. To see us in just 2 minutes of injury time throwing men forward and leaving the defence 2 against 4 was insane, the best case scenario there would have been us making it 3-1, it wasn't worth the risk. |  | | |
| Post match warbs on 10:06 - Oct 28 with 1222 views | gazza1 |
| Post match warbs on 10:00 - Oct 28 by Hunterhoop |
In essence, I think it’s rarely a good thing to get rid of the manager. I think most on here do not want to see Warburton go. I think most recognise the positives of last year. I certainly don’t want him sacked and I want him to turn the results around.
But that doesn’t mean he gets a free pass for reasoned criticism. And it doesn’t mean he gets unlimited time. Many concerns raised above are valid. They shouldn’t be contentious to him or anyone else. |
I know you know your stuff Hunter and we do have differing opinions (tha'ts life) - Ned is one, cant get my head around it - he cant play the game (which you understand) and made so many mistakes but you just 'love him'!!! Why?? He should have been a wrestler or a long distance runner, he was strong enough!!
Of course he can be critised but it should be done as constructive as possible.....not how some do it. | | | |
| Post match warbs on 10:09 - Oct 28 with 1210 views | gazza1 |
| Post match warbs on 10:01 - Oct 28 by daveB |
He can moan about keyboard warriors all he likes, he's lucky that there were no fans there last night.
I get it's a difficult situation but the change to 3 at the back after going a goal down was beyond stupid and the way we played that second half charging forward and leaving them with multiple one on ones was schoolboy stuff. Stay on the game, even at 2-0 down get to the last 10 minutes and then start chucking extra bodies forward and cause a bit of panic. To see us in just 2 minutes of injury time throwing men forward and leaving the defence 2 against 4 was insane, the best case scenario there would have been us making it 3-1, it wasn't worth the risk. |
He didn't go 3 across the back when Dickie got sent off!!!
He was trying to be positive by changing it at half time by introducing Kane who gets up & down the pitch and provides attacking as well as defensive qualities.....personally I didnt have an issue with it. Later in the game when still 2-0 down he pushed players forward more, why not if we are loosing by 2 goals. | | | |
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