| A woke policy agenda now emerging? 08:19 - Feb 8 with 1912 views | AnotherJohn |
Two news items today raise the question of whether the Labour Government is now unveiling more of the "progressive" policies that they have long had in mind, but were previously kept in the background.
It is reported that David Lammy will shortly meet the Reparations Commission of the Caribbean Community to discuss the reparations issue.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/07/foreign-office-opens-talks-on-paying
Then we hear that university research funding will increasingly depend on showing that institutions are pushing ahead with diversity, equality and inclusion policies. This will involve changing the rules of the next Research Excellence Framework to increase the % of funding dependent in DEI performance, and would encourage changes in patterns of staff recruitment and research topics funded.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/08/universities-punished-champion-diver
Both will be extremely controversial and did not feature in the manifesto. On the back of the mooted Chagos deal, this may signal the direction of travel of policy. Some will say this is what happens when you have a government of human rights lawyers. [Post edited 8 Feb 8:31]
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| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 15:51 - Feb 9 with 429 views | SullutaCreturned |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 19:16 - Feb 8 by Gwyn737 |
I agree with you.
But there’s not chance of us paying billions and Lammy, as Another John said) is only talking about possible non financial support.
That’s what we should be talking about, not the daft headlines in the Telegraph and GeeBeebies. |
There is no such thing as non financial support, that is smoke and mirrors. Whatever we do in the way of reparations is going to cost us money and where does that money come from?
Would you be happy if they cut schools budgets? What about the armed forces or NHS? Or maybe what if they put income tax up?
Whatever we do will have to be paid for and surely nobody can dispute that? | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:00 - Feb 9 with 419 views | Gwyn737 |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 15:51 - Feb 9 by SullutaCreturned |
There is no such thing as non financial support, that is smoke and mirrors. Whatever we do in the way of reparations is going to cost us money and where does that money come from?
Would you be happy if they cut schools budgets? What about the armed forces or NHS? Or maybe what if they put income tax up?
Whatever we do will have to be paid for and surely nobody can dispute that? |
I don’t think anything will happen, let alone £18 trillion pounds going over (which I believe is a number bigger that all the wealth held in the UK) | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:14 - Feb 9 with 407 views | SullutaCreturned |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:00 - Feb 9 by Gwyn737 |
I don’t think anything will happen, let alone £18 trillion pounds going over (which I believe is a number bigger that all the wealth held in the UK) |
We couldn't afford the 3.9 trillion let alone the 18, you're right BUT if Lammy agrees to non financial support it will still cost us money.
Can you agree to the last part? | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:18 - Feb 9 with 397 views | Gwyn737 |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:14 - Feb 9 by SullutaCreturned |
We couldn't afford the 3.9 trillion let alone the 18, you're right BUT if Lammy agrees to non financial support it will still cost us money.
Can you agree to the last part? |
Possibly, but I’d need to see the detail.
We’re guessing at the moment and the only ones making money are those generating clicks with fanciful headlines. | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:30 - Feb 9 with 383 views | SullutaCreturned |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:18 - Feb 9 by Gwyn737 |
Possibly, but I’d need to see the detail.
We’re guessing at the moment and the only ones making money are those generating clicks with fanciful headlines. |
Ok then, I'll put it another way. What could we do in the way of non financial reparations in the Caribbean that wouldn't cost us money?
I'd say there is nothing because whatever and whoever we sent there would cost money. I don't see how anybody can deny that.
I'm not saying it will happen, the Barbadian PM is demanding money but it doesn't mean we'll offer any or accept it becoming international law. | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:59 - Feb 9 with 370 views | majorraglan |
A lot of the stuff in the articles is not attributed to any particular sources and in my opinion is disinformation and mischief making from the Telegraph. | | | |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 21:36 - Feb 9 with 319 views | AnotherJohn |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 16:59 - Feb 9 by majorraglan |
A lot of the stuff in the articles is not attributed to any particular sources and in my opinion is disinformation and mischief making from the Telegraph. |
Bit puzzled by this claim, which possibly is made without full awareness of background information.
The second story about the increased importance of DEI in assessing university research performance comes from the recently announced guidance on REF 2029, and other statements from Research England. Universities’ research performance will be assessed in the following three domains:
Contribution to knowledge and understanding (50% weighting down from 60% in REF 2021). This replaces the previous category of research “outputs” and widens the focus beyond academic publications.
Engagement and impact (25% weighting) – similar to previous impact category and about real-world impact of research.
People, culture and environment (25% weighting up from 15%) – this replaces the previous environment component and will include an increased emphasis on research culture, including diversity, equality and inclusion.
DEI (EDI in REF language) looks set to become a larger component of this last environment score, which is now a bigger part of the total assessment (25%), and it will also influence assessment under the other two categories. This is an extract from the first link below.
_____________________
6.1 Equality, diversity and inclusion
The REF aims to support a research system that not only produces excellent research but also fosters an inclusive and diverse environment. This REF includes several measures to support greater equality, diversity, and inclusion, including:
An increased emphasis on research culture and the support for researchers, while moving away from direct scrutiny of the management of individuals by institutions.
A refreshed approach to panel appointments, building on learning from the previous exercise.
The introduction of a new People and Diversity Advisory Panel (PDAP), which builds on the previous Equality and Diversity Advisory Panel and will be further embedded into criteria-setting and assessment processes.
_____________________
The precise metrics haven’t yet been set in stone, and this is stirring up such controversy that there may be future movement. Research England manages the REF on behalf of all four UK higher education funding bodies, and it seems to have been heavily influenced by its Equality and Diversity Advisory Panel. This is causing huge debate within academia, so it is plain silly to suggest this is just the Telegraph.
https://2029.ref.ac.uk/guidance/section-1-overview/#section-key-changes-for-ref-
The other story about reparations is less clear-cut, and the Telegraph article may indeed have gone too far.
The Foreign Office, posting on X/Twitter, has denied that any talks in April are planned.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-slavery-colonialism-reparation
However, it seems that somebody is feeding the press. The Independent writes that: “Sources have suggested that the delegation would be led by Mia Mottley, Barbados’s prime minister.” Possibly one source is CARICOM itself ahead of that organisation’s meeting in Barbados later this month. The rumours may be linked to a recent meeting between CARICOM and UK representatives about the Economic Partnership Agreement (EPA) signed in 2021.
https://caricom.org/cariforum-uk-reaffirm-commitment-to-implementing-epa/
The Times, the Mail and GB News have all carried articles about a potential meeting so it isn’t just the Telegraph. This one from the Times was published on Saturday, after the Foreign Office denial.
https://www.thetimes.com/article/foreign-office-mulls-caribbean-slavery-reparati
Apologies to readers who don't want this much detail. [Post edited 9 Feb 21:43]
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| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 21:47 - Feb 9 with 311 views | Dr_Winston |
We have a Government led by people who hate the nation they ostensibly lead and have no problem in blaming it for many of the World's ills. It's not going to end well. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 23:26 - Feb 9 with 275 views | AnotherJohn |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 21:47 - Feb 9 by Dr_Winston |
We have a Government led by people who hate the nation they ostensibly lead and have no problem in blaming it for many of the World's ills. It's not going to end well. |
Well, there is our Attorney General, Lord Hermer, with a long track record of acting against the UK government in numerous cases involving Kenya, Caribbean nations, Chagos Islands refugees, asylum seekers from several countries, alleged victims of British army war crimes and police malpractice, and even Gerry Adams. Cardiff school boy.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/02/09/lord-hermer-advised-caribbean-na
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/02/06/attorney-general-hermer-british-empi
Of course, he worked for a while with Sir Keir at Doughty Street Chambers. [Post edited 9 Feb 23:30]
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| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 09:09 - Feb 10 with 218 views | Boundy |
| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 21:36 - Feb 9 by AnotherJohn |
Bit puzzled by this claim, which possibly is made without full awareness of background information.
The second story about the increased importance of DEI in assessing university research performance comes from the recently announced guidance on REF 2029, and other statements from Research England. Universities’ research performance will be assessed in the following three domains:
Contribution to knowledge and understanding (50% weighting down from 60% in REF 2021). This replaces the previous category of research “outputs” and widens the focus beyond academic publications.
Engagement and impact (25% weighting) – similar to previous impact category and about real-world impact of research.
People, culture and environment (25% weighting up from 15%) – this replaces the previous environment component and will include an increased emphasis on research culture, including diversity, equality and inclusion.
DEI (EDI in REF language) looks set to become a larger component of this last environment score, which is now a bigger part of the total assessment (25%), and it will also influence assessment under the other two categories. This is an extract from the first link below.
_____________________
6.1 Equality, diversity and inclusion
The REF aims to support a research system that not only produces excellent research but also fosters an inclusive and diverse environment. This REF includes several measures to support greater equality, diversity, and inclusion, including:
An increased emphasis on research culture and the support for researchers, while moving away from direct scrutiny of the management of individuals by institutions.
A refreshed approach to panel appointments, building on learning from the previous exercise.
The introduction of a new People and Diversity Advisory Panel (PDAP), which builds on the previous Equality and Diversity Advisory Panel and will be further embedded into criteria-setting and assessment processes.
_____________________
The precise metrics haven’t yet been set in stone, and this is stirring up such controversy that there may be future movement. Research England manages the REF on behalf of all four UK higher education funding bodies, and it seems to have been heavily influenced by its Equality and Diversity Advisory Panel. This is causing huge debate within academia, so it is plain silly to suggest this is just the Telegraph.
https://2029.ref.ac.uk/guidance/section-1-overview/#section-key-changes-for-ref-
The other story about reparations is less clear-cut, and the Telegraph article may indeed have gone too far.
The Foreign Office, posting on X/Twitter, has denied that any talks in April are planned.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-slavery-colonialism-reparation
However, it seems that somebody is feeding the press. The Independent writes that: “Sources have suggested that the delegation would be led by Mia Mottley, Barbados’s prime minister.” Possibly one source is CARICOM itself ahead of that organisation’s meeting in Barbados later this month. The rumours may be linked to a recent meeting between CARICOM and UK representatives about the Economic Partnership Agreement (EPA) signed in 2021.
https://caricom.org/cariforum-uk-reaffirm-commitment-to-implementing-epa/
The Times, the Mail and GB News have all carried articles about a potential meeting so it isn’t just the Telegraph. This one from the Times was published on Saturday, after the Foreign Office denial.
https://www.thetimes.com/article/foreign-office-mulls-caribbean-slavery-reparati
Apologies to readers who don't want this much detail. [Post edited 9 Feb 21:43]
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Thanks for posting , this just goes to show if you take time to research a topic it can sometimes support the content and not be dismissed because of its initial source . | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| A woke policy agenda now emerging? on 12:51 - Feb 10 with 188 views | Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
It’s been said that many of those from doughty street chambers only took cases based on the cab rank rule which is why they had to defend so many convicted terrorists but it has also been said that if Keir Starmer did have a black cab it would have been permanently parked outside Finsbury Park mosque. |  |
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