| Potter offered a new contact 14:52 - May 17 with 12377 views | CARDAN |
Is this smoke and mirrors or are the owners genuinely trying to save this mess from getting worse? |  | | |  |
| Potter offered a new contact on 21:24 - May 17 with 2314 views | Dr_Winston |
| Potter offered a new contact on 21:10 - May 17 by thornabyswan |
The goalkeeping was a joke agreed.
But we only took 1 point off Leeds and Derby 0 off West Brom Norwich or Villa.
Over the season we were 2 players at least short of a realistic promotion challenge.
Yes I get where you are coming from on players like Asoro Mackay Etc.
But if we had signed a Bodde Pratley Rangel DDV or Jason Scotland type we would be in the PL now.
You can't just say stick with youngsters because of a couple that haven't worked yet.
We need some backbone and experience as well. |
"if we had signed a Bodde Pratley Rangel DDV or Jason Scotland type"
If we'd gone into last season having spent a combined £195,000 on players there'd have been a riot.  
Joking aside, you're right. Those are the kind of players we'd need. Getting to the point where we can consistently identify and acquire them again is the tricky bit. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 21:24 - May 17 with 2310 views | thornabyswan |
| Potter offered a new contact on 21:18 - May 17 by Private_Partz |
Yep. That is the way I saw it.
You need to have a good scouting system for that and I am not sure ours is up to it. I am more hopeful now Jenkins has gone though.
Time will tell if the Yanks have had a change of heart and will back Potter which they have patently failed to do in the past.
I have concerns as they have form for saying one thing then not adhering to it. |
We need to shift the Ayews though | |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 23:00 - May 17 with 2118 views | jackrmee |
| Potter offered a new contact on 20:16 - May 17 by Dr_Winston |
Potter did a good job. Not an amazing one, but good. His work in improving many players who had previously underachieved was perhaps the most pleasing aspect, even if certain tactical and personnel choices were less so.
If we'd gambled a bit on the playing side we might have gone straight back up. If we'd failed we'd be in even more shit than we are now. Personally I'd prefer not to gamble when the stakes are that high. |
Some tactics and teamsheets may have been less pleasing, but I think they were necessary, and helped Potter learn about the capabilities of each individual, plus the team working together in different set-ups.
May not have been pleasing at the time, but I definitely think we are better for it as a team and that's all that counts imo.
I'd rather be an improved unit as a whole in a lower league position, than be promoted with less quality or improvement. Does that make sense?
What I'm trying to say is, as long as we are moving forward, it's good and is all that matters. Being in a higher league doesn't necessarily mean that we have improved physically, mentally, tactically, or any any other thing ending in 'ally'.
I think his tactical 'tinkering' has made him/our players much better tactically, than if he had just stuck to a certain formation.
I think his sometimes questionable personnel choices made our him/our players more versatile and aware of their strengths and weaknesses, than if he'd just picked our best team on paper every week.
We may have gone up if we had picked the best team and stuck to a certain tactic or formation, but we almost definitely would have been worse off for it.
Without stresses and challenges it is impossible to test yourself and grow. |  |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 23:09 - May 17 with 2100 views | jackrmee |
| Potter offered a new contact on 21:24 - May 17 by jasper_T |
A Rangel to play in goal over Nordfeldt, maybe.
Otherwise I don't agree. We fell short due to set piece defending and the length of time it took to field a settled side. A lot of points dropped despite no lack of ability or nous in the squad.
Signing more players with the experience of Naughton, Fer, Olsson, Carroll, Dyer and Routledge wasn't going to magically fix anything on its own. |
I hazard to guess that we fell short simply on the set piece goals conceded alone.
Hopefully a whole preseason of working on man marking will cure that.
I'm confident GP is definitely the man to take us up to the prem. And in style. Keeping hold of him is our absolute main priority. | |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 23:17 - May 17 with 2077 views | jasper_T |
Not getting promoted means having to sell key players so I'm not sure I can buy the "stronger group" argument you're making there.
Either way I think the second half of the season did a lot more for the development of players like DJ, Byers and Grimes than the first half where they weren't playing consistently and in a variety of positions and systems. The tactical flexibility Potter wanted to instil was asking the younger lads to run before they had a chance to walk in senior football, and he said in a few post-match conferences that he'd not managed to get across what he wanted, to our detriment.
In the end walking proved enough for us to dominate most sides (at home). Byers reinvented himself somewhat as a deeper midfielder, but everyone else ended up playing where they were comfortable/used to playing, be it in the u18s and u23s, or their glory days under Laudrup. | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:35 - May 17 with 2028 views | jackrmee |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:17 - May 17 by jasper_T |
Not getting promoted means having to sell key players so I'm not sure I can buy the "stronger group" argument you're making there.
Either way I think the second half of the season did a lot more for the development of players like DJ, Byers and Grimes than the first half where they weren't playing consistently and in a variety of positions and systems. The tactical flexibility Potter wanted to instil was asking the younger lads to run before they had a chance to walk in senior football, and he said in a few post-match conferences that he'd not managed to get across what he wanted, to our detriment.
In the end walking proved enough for us to dominate most sides (at home). Byers reinvented himself somewhat as a deeper midfielder, but everyone else ended up playing where they were comfortable/used to playing, be it in the u18s and u23s, or their glory days under Laudrup. |
To our detriment results wise, but probably our benefit knowledge wise.
edit...and probably to our benefit results wise going forward. [Post edited 17 May 2019 23:58]
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| Potter offered a new contact on 08:34 - May 18 with 1744 views | Jinxy |
| Potter offered a new contact on 16:05 - May 17 by Darran |
‪At this moment in time I’d have thought it’s virtually impossible to give him assurances. ‬ |
Here's my take on it. I think like the rest of us, GP and the club accept and probably embrace the sale of DJ (for a healthy fee/addons/loan deal etc.). The "assurance" could take the form of the intent to sell stops at DJ (as well as relieving us of our other overpaid loanees etc. of course), with a healthy % of that being re-invested in the squad. The club should realise that if GP stays, there's a probability that most/all of our other promising talent would likely stay, with the opposite likely if he leaves. DJ apart, if anyone leaves they should be directly replaced (i.e. all proceeds re-invested in the squad) - time and availability permitting. That's the sort of assurance I'd seek, and I'd put clauses and penalties in the contract should they breach it!
This is where I think we'll see the club's REAL intent within the next week or so - the Americans have proved they are not to be trusted and seem surprisingly financially naive - however, Birch will probably advise that a moderate investment in GP and his squad could glean profits and ROI for his employers. Last summer my view was that an immediate return to the PL would be too quick, if we are to build a sustainable model as before (I said so to GP in the meet the manager thingy). The Americans will not care about the sustainable bit (e.g. nice football, young players etc.) like we fans do of course, but returning to the PL "cheaply" with the club being in a very nice saleable and attractive position should float their little boats (if they have >1 brain cell). We'll see - soon too. [Post edited 18 May 2019 8:37]
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| Potter offered a new contact on 08:35 - May 18 with 1732 views | Jinxy |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:35 - May 17 by jackrmee |
To our detriment results wise, but probably our benefit knowledge wise.
edit...and probably to our benefit results wise going forward. [Post edited 17 May 2019 23:58]
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Totally agree. | | | |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 09:09 - May 18 with 1663 views | Thornburyswan |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:09 - May 17 by jackrmee |
I hazard to guess that we fell short simply on the set piece goals conceded alone.
Hopefully a whole preseason of working on man marking will cure that.
I'm confident GP is definitely the man to take us up to the prem. And in style. Keeping hold of him is our absolute main priority. |
Agree - we weren't good enough to go up, could have made the play-offs if GP had settled team/formation earlier & once you get there we all know anything can happen - that said if by some fluke we'd made it we would not have been anywhere near ready & our American friends would not have invested sufficiently so we'd have been facing a 'Huddesfieldesque' season ahead.
IF we can keep GP & he gets the necessary assurances plus exit the Ayews/Baston/Fer etc etc we could build a decent side for next season on the back of the DJ fee plus any other exit funds. No easy task both internally & next year vs Fulham/Cardiff/Leeds/WBA/Stoke + one of Villa or Derby but I'd certainly take that.
If GP goes however suspect that might make a good few of our promising players consider their position if any other offers come in & the inevitable likelihood of a bottom half/relegation battle would loom. | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 10:42 - May 18 with 1488 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:00 - May 17 by jackrmee |
Some tactics and teamsheets may have been less pleasing, but I think they were necessary, and helped Potter learn about the capabilities of each individual, plus the team working together in different set-ups.
May not have been pleasing at the time, but I definitely think we are better for it as a team and that's all that counts imo.
I'd rather be an improved unit as a whole in a lower league position, than be promoted with less quality or improvement. Does that make sense?
What I'm trying to say is, as long as we are moving forward, it's good and is all that matters. Being in a higher league doesn't necessarily mean that we have improved physically, mentally, tactically, or any any other thing ending in 'ally'.
I think his tactical 'tinkering' has made him/our players much better tactically, than if he had just stuck to a certain formation.
I think his sometimes questionable personnel choices made our him/our players more versatile and aware of their strengths and weaknesses, than if he'd just picked our best team on paper every week.
We may have gone up if we had picked the best team and stuck to a certain tactic or formation, but we almost definitely would have been worse off for it.
Without stresses and challenges it is impossible to test yourself and grow. |
Would have cushioned the blow of having to find wages for the Ayews and Borja though (if we can't get rid) |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 11:00 - May 18 with 1445 views | dobjack2 |
| Potter offered a new contact on 23:17 - May 17 by jasper_T |
Not getting promoted means having to sell key players so I'm not sure I can buy the "stronger group" argument you're making there.
Either way I think the second half of the season did a lot more for the development of players like DJ, Byers and Grimes than the first half where they weren't playing consistently and in a variety of positions and systems. The tactical flexibility Potter wanted to instil was asking the younger lads to run before they had a chance to walk in senior football, and he said in a few post-match conferences that he'd not managed to get across what he wanted, to our detriment.
In the end walking proved enough for us to dominate most sides (at home). Byers reinvented himself somewhat as a deeper midfielder, but everyone else ended up playing where they were comfortable/used to playing, be it in the u18s and u23s, or their glory days under Laudrup. |
Every club is a selling club to a degree. It’s all about how you replace the key players that leave.
That can be promotion from within, if available and up to it, or smart recruitment to strengthen the side. Failing to replace players and/or rubbish recruitment only leads downwards. | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:10 - May 18 with 1413 views | jasper_T |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:00 - May 18 by dobjack2 |
Every club is a selling club to a degree. It’s all about how you replace the key players that leave.
That can be promotion from within, if available and up to it, or smart recruitment to strengthen the side. Failing to replace players and/or rubbish recruitment only leads downwards. |
I have no great faith in our recruitment given that our best side at the end of the season arguably didn't include any of the players we jumped to sign last summer. We play better football with Celina in the team but are so dependent on McBurnie's finishing he has to be accommodated at 10. CCV or Rodon is a discussion.
Wanted Woods for £6m+ but he can't get into a Stoke midfield our boys had 72% possession against.
Has to be better, and should be now that everyone is aware of what our old u23s are capable of. Otherwise "just back Potter (and his 30 year old chief scout)" could be a disastrous strategy. | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:15 - May 18 with 1390 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:10 - May 18 by jasper_T |
I have no great faith in our recruitment given that our best side at the end of the season arguably didn't include any of the players we jumped to sign last summer. We play better football with Celina in the team but are so dependent on McBurnie's finishing he has to be accommodated at 10. CCV or Rodon is a discussion.
Wanted Woods for £6m+ but he can't get into a Stoke midfield our boys had 72% possession against.
Has to be better, and should be now that everyone is aware of what our old u23s are capable of. Otherwise "just back Potter (and his 30 year old chief scout)" could be a disastrous strategy. |
Perhaps the reason we had 72% possession was Wood's absence? Just a thought. You never know with footballrs, some are tailor made to play passing football. Just because Woods bombed at Stoke doesn't mean he would have bombed here. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 11:18 - May 18 with 1378 views | jackrmee |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:10 - May 18 by jasper_T |
I have no great faith in our recruitment given that our best side at the end of the season arguably didn't include any of the players we jumped to sign last summer. We play better football with Celina in the team but are so dependent on McBurnie's finishing he has to be accommodated at 10. CCV or Rodon is a discussion.
Wanted Woods for £6m+ but he can't get into a Stoke midfield our boys had 72% possession against.
Has to be better, and should be now that everyone is aware of what our old u23s are capable of. Otherwise "just back Potter (and his 30 year old chief scout)" could be a disastrous strategy. |
What's the age of the scout got to do with anything? | |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 11:19 - May 18 with 1376 views | dobjack2 |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:10 - May 18 by jasper_T |
I have no great faith in our recruitment given that our best side at the end of the season arguably didn't include any of the players we jumped to sign last summer. We play better football with Celina in the team but are so dependent on McBurnie's finishing he has to be accommodated at 10. CCV or Rodon is a discussion.
Wanted Woods for £6m+ but he can't get into a Stoke midfield our boys had 72% possession against.
Has to be better, and should be now that everyone is aware of what our old u23s are capable of. Otherwise "just back Potter (and his 30 year old chief scout)" could be a disastrous strategy. |
Will some of our signings will be better for their experience this season or are some better suited to a division below?. Celina is a player you feel has to play but with our squad is there a position for him that doesn’t unbalance the side or place too much on Mcburnie
As for recruitment, our new recruitment team has a season of championship football behind it and hopefully a better understanding of what is needed in the division.
Time will tell on this one if of course Potter and his team stay. If they go, who knows what will happen with the existing squad let alone strengthening it. | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:22 - May 18 with 1366 views | NotLoyal |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:18 - May 18 by jackrmee |
What's the age of the scout got to do with anything? |
A bit dodgy in those shorts at that age ? |  |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 11:27 - May 18 with 1351 views | jasper_T |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:15 - May 18 by Brynmill_Jack |
Perhaps the reason we had 72% possession was Wood's absence? Just a thought. You never know with footballrs, some are tailor made to play passing football. Just because Woods bombed at Stoke doesn't mean he would have bombed here. |
He didn't improve them in the other 26 games he started so why would he have saved them against us? | | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 12:24 - May 18 with 1250 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:27 - May 18 by jasper_T |
He didn't improve them in the other 26 games he started so why would he have saved them against us? |
Like I said Woods and Stoke - not a good fit . Woods and us may have been an extremely good fit. We’ll never know though. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 13:31 - May 18 with 1151 views | BytholWyn |
| Potter offered a new contact on 11:27 - May 18 by jasper_T |
He didn't improve them in the other 26 games he started so why would he have saved them against us? |
The fact that he was lauded for his contribution to Brentford - another possession-based team - but ended up at a club with a dubious commitment to passing football may have something to do with it. I wouldn't be surprised to see that Woods might be available for a few million this summer. If there is any spare cash from player sales he may well end up with us after all. |  | | |
| Potter offered a new contact on 13:36 - May 18 with 1129 views | magicdaps10 |
| Potter offered a new contact on 12:24 - May 18 by Brynmill_Jack |
Like I said Woods and Stoke - not a good fit . Woods and us may have been an extremely good fit. We’ll never know though. |
Extremely naive to claim that Woods would be no good for us just because he done nothing at Stoke. |  |
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| Potter offered a new contact on 13:39 - May 18 with 1113 views | jasper_T |
| Potter offered a new contact on 13:31 - May 18 by BytholWyn |
The fact that he was lauded for his contribution to Brentford - another possession-based team - but ended up at a club with a dubious commitment to passing football may have something to do with it. I wouldn't be surprised to see that Woods might be available for a few million this summer. If there is any spare cash from player sales he may well end up with us after all. |
Not with the money Stoke are paying him. And with them needing to shift Allen and other PL high earners after their promotion gamble failed so spectacularly.
Even at Brentford Woods never had a season as good as what Grimes has just had, and he can't play any other role than deepest midfielder/water carrier (where our fans would have savaged him for being too small and lightweight even if he'd done well) | | | |
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