| Brexiters, why? 12:51 - Apr 22 with 32061 views | the_oracle |
When are the Brexiters going to be honest about the reason they want out?
By any objective view business says stay in. Support from the IMF, CBI big businesses like BT vodaphone, Marks and Spencers, BAE, Easy Jet etc etc. World leader say stay in to protect our position as a world power, to hold the EU together, prevent conflict etc. Unions cite worker’s protection as a reason to stay in. All the main parties support in, the Treasury says in. There are warnings from EU leaders that if we are not part of the club we will have serious problems.
I have not heard a single cogent reason, financially, to get out. Kate Hoey one of the Brexit leaders embarrassingly couldn’t site a single report saying why we would be better off. A few politicians led by Boris and Farage are for out. That’s it. There is no clear explanation of what happens next from them, they just don’t seem to know.
Everything seems to point to the view that “remain” is right.
So be honest, Brexiters, is it immigration?
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| Brexiters, why? on 13:25 - Apr 22 with 8286 views | dickythorpe |
Who care?
Still waiting for my pamphlet to come through the door....meanwhile I got bills to pay, work to get done..... |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 14:08 - Apr 22 with 8239 views | ymaohyd |
I want out and absolutely for the reasons of safety and control of immigration.
I get both points of view, understand the business community etc but for the life of me can't understand how any highly educated politician can argue that we are safer IN Europe.
As Scotland was hoodwinked into voting to stay in the UK I hope people aren't brainwashed in the same manner on this vote. |  |
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| Brexiters, why? on 15:10 - Apr 22 with 8177 views | Swanzay |
Whats good for large companies is not necessarily good for the average man in the street.
Brussels is full of unaccountable 'leaders',
In 2013 (Latest numbers I could get my hands on quickly) we paid in £17billion and got a total of £6Billion in return.
Just think what we could do with that £17billion. |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:13 - Apr 22 with 8174 views | the_oracle |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:10 - Apr 22 by Swanzay |
Whats good for large companies is not necessarily good for the average man in the street.
Brussels is full of unaccountable 'leaders',
In 2013 (Latest numbers I could get my hands on quickly) we paid in £17billion and got a total of £6Billion in return.
Just think what we could do with that £17billion. |
Even one of the brexit leaders thinks we would not be better off. [Post edited 22 Apr 2016 15:14]
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| Brexiters, why? on 15:14 - Apr 22 with 8167 views | jackrabbit |
Immigration alone is a reason to get out. The disaster that leads Germany, Merkel, has promised 75m Turks free access to the Schengen area. Ah you may say - we are not in the Schengen area. No, but once you're in it, it is an easy next step to get access to the UK from another EU country. We need to control our borders and be able to choose who we want to take-in.
Apart from that , the EU constrains and meddles in areas of policy that should be under our own control - education, finance, energy, the environment, and every other aspect of daily life that they can poke their well-fed noses into. The EU is rightly a byword for institutionalized extravagance, waste and abuse of public money. This is an outfit that has not had its accounts properly cleared for 19 years.
They wail about a leap into the unknown, yet there is nothing remotely “unknown” about Britain’s status outside the EU. We would just be returning to the position we held for centuries when we were a free, independent and highly successful nation.
Why do we need to be part of a political construct like the EU? We signed up to the Common Market - a free trade arrangement, which we will reinstate once we're out.
Indeed, there is nothing eccentric about non-EU membership. The world has 195 sovereign nations; 167 manage to exist without interference from Brussels, including the two most prosperous nations in Europe: Switzerland and Norway.
Don't mix up being European with being in the EU. I'm European, so are you, so are we all - it's a geographical accident of birth. The EU on the other hand is a political project - one that has gone sadly awry. This is the best chance we've got to get out. We were lied to in 1975 and we're being lied to again. Vote LEAVE ffs. |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:23 - Apr 22 with 8148 views | ItchySphincter |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:10 - Apr 22 by Swanzay |
Whats good for large companies is not necessarily good for the average man in the street.
Brussels is full of unaccountable 'leaders',
In 2013 (Latest numbers I could get my hands on quickly) we paid in £17billion and got a total of £6Billion in return.
Just think what we could do with that £17billion. |
11bn.
Anyway it's all about immigration. The outers are closeted/embarrassed Ukipers. |  |
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| Brexiters, why? on 15:24 - Apr 22 with 8148 views | jojaca |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:14 - Apr 22 by jackrabbit |
Immigration alone is a reason to get out. The disaster that leads Germany, Merkel, has promised 75m Turks free access to the Schengen area. Ah you may say - we are not in the Schengen area. No, but once you're in it, it is an easy next step to get access to the UK from another EU country. We need to control our borders and be able to choose who we want to take-in.
Apart from that , the EU constrains and meddles in areas of policy that should be under our own control - education, finance, energy, the environment, and every other aspect of daily life that they can poke their well-fed noses into. The EU is rightly a byword for institutionalized extravagance, waste and abuse of public money. This is an outfit that has not had its accounts properly cleared for 19 years.
They wail about a leap into the unknown, yet there is nothing remotely “unknown” about Britain’s status outside the EU. We would just be returning to the position we held for centuries when we were a free, independent and highly successful nation.
Why do we need to be part of a political construct like the EU? We signed up to the Common Market - a free trade arrangement, which we will reinstate once we're out.
Indeed, there is nothing eccentric about non-EU membership. The world has 195 sovereign nations; 167 manage to exist without interference from Brussels, including the two most prosperous nations in Europe: Switzerland and Norway.
Don't mix up being European with being in the EU. I'm European, so are you, so are we all - it's a geographical accident of birth. The EU on the other hand is a political project - one that has gone sadly awry. This is the best chance we've got to get out. We were lied to in 1975 and we're being lied to again. Vote LEAVE ffs. |
Out for just the open door policy!, every country has got to control numbers in and out. |  |
| Even when you know, you never know? |
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| Brexiters, why? on 15:39 - Apr 22 with 8128 views | blueytheblue |
For over 17 years the EU failed to publish auditted accounts.
A whistleblower, Andreasson, revealed the widespread corruption endemic within the EU finances. That person was then persecuted as a consequence.
EU prevent conflict? Yeah that's worked out really well - looking at you, Balkan states.
Labour say stay in? That must be why Corbyn voted against every EU related bit of stuff put forward in Parliament then.
Immigration is merely one particular aspect highlighting a lack of sovereignty. One size fits all rules are stupid when faced with a widespread a communiiy of different nations with different cultures. and economies. | |
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| Brexiters, why? on 16:13 - Apr 22 with 8098 views | BigPhilG |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:14 - Apr 22 by jackrabbit |
Immigration alone is a reason to get out. The disaster that leads Germany, Merkel, has promised 75m Turks free access to the Schengen area. Ah you may say - we are not in the Schengen area. No, but once you're in it, it is an easy next step to get access to the UK from another EU country. We need to control our borders and be able to choose who we want to take-in.
Apart from that , the EU constrains and meddles in areas of policy that should be under our own control - education, finance, energy, the environment, and every other aspect of daily life that they can poke their well-fed noses into. The EU is rightly a byword for institutionalized extravagance, waste and abuse of public money. This is an outfit that has not had its accounts properly cleared for 19 years.
They wail about a leap into the unknown, yet there is nothing remotely “unknown” about Britain’s status outside the EU. We would just be returning to the position we held for centuries when we were a free, independent and highly successful nation.
Why do we need to be part of a political construct like the EU? We signed up to the Common Market - a free trade arrangement, which we will reinstate once we're out.
Indeed, there is nothing eccentric about non-EU membership. The world has 195 sovereign nations; 167 manage to exist without interference from Brussels, including the two most prosperous nations in Europe: Switzerland and Norway.
Don't mix up being European with being in the EU. I'm European, so are you, so are we all - it's a geographical accident of birth. The EU on the other hand is a political project - one that has gone sadly awry. This is the best chance we've got to get out. We were lied to in 1975 and we're being lied to again. Vote LEAVE ffs. |
This. Fantastic post and thanks for it |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 16:42 - Apr 22 with 8058 views | WarwickHunt |
| Brexiters, why? on 15:10 - Apr 22 by Swanzay |
Whats good for large companies is not necessarily good for the average man in the street.
Brussels is full of unaccountable 'leaders',
In 2013 (Latest numbers I could get my hands on quickly) we paid in £17billion and got a total of £6Billion in return.
Just think what we could do with that £17billion. |
Teach f*ckwits maths? |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 16:45 - Apr 22 with 8056 views | AnotherJohn |
It is true that the big battalions are all lining up on the 'in' side, but there are one or two economic reports that suggest 'out' won't be all doom and gloom. Capital Economics (Roger Bootle) have just published one, but you have to sign up for their temporary free access to see it.
For me the reasons for voting out are: (1) I can't see how we can stop the UK population hitting 80 million if we don't; (b) that would have a very negative impact on public services ; (c) I don't think the 'best of both worlds' deal will last more than a few years; (d) after that I think the push for the superstate will gain real momentum (barring a meltdown because of present policies); and (e) I think the quality of the EU leadership is woeful - one car crash after another.
P.S.. Interesting WSJ Editorial today:
Wall Street Journal:
President Obama arrives in London Thursday to tell the U.K. to stay in the European Union, and no doubt Britons will appreciate this intervention as much as Mr. Obama appreciated Benjamin Netanyahu’s on the Iran deal. The British are already debating June’s Brexit referendum with a seriousness we wish the U.S. presidential candidates could match…
…Our view has been that Europe is stronger with a free-market Britain inside EU councils, but that case is harder to make today as Europe refuses to reform. The question for Britons is thus whether the short-term economic costs and uncertainty of Brexit are worth the longer-term benefits of a freer economic policy that could make the U.K. more competitive.
Rather than kibitz on behalf of Brussels, a U.S. President ought to wish Britons well and say the U.S. will stand with them whatever they decide. That should include engaging them in talks for a bilateral trade deal or to join the North American Free Trade Agreement if they do leave the EU. Fear-mongering about British economic isolation isn’t helpful. [Post edited 22 Apr 2016 17:05]
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| Brexiters, why? on 17:13 - Apr 22 with 8018 views | Highjack |
There are hundreds and hundreds of MEPs from various countries who are completely unaccountable to the British people deciding on and voting on legislation that affects the way we live our lives. It's completely undemocratic. That's the big one for me. They are largely anonymous, I would wager very very few people in this country could name more than 3 MEP's for Britain, let alone any of the rest. For me it's all about accountability and democracy. The clowns in Westminster might be absolute fu cking idiots but at least they are our f ucking idiots and we have the opportunity to kick them out every five years. |  |
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| Brexiters, why? on 17:23 - Apr 22 with 7996 views | Swanzay |
| Brexiters, why? on 16:42 - Apr 22 by WarwickHunt |
Teach f*ckwits maths? |
What you on about you massive quilt? | | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 17:33 - Apr 22 with 7975 views | Darran |
| Brexiters, why? on 16:42 - Apr 22 by WarwickHunt |
Teach f*ckwits maths? |
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| Brexiters, why? on 17:37 - Apr 22 with 7968 views | Swanzay |
| Brexiters, why? on 17:33 - Apr 22 by Darran |
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What are you finding so funny!? | | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 17:44 - Apr 22 with 7954 views | Clinton |
| Brexiters, why? on 17:13 - Apr 22 by Highjack |
There are hundreds and hundreds of MEPs from various countries who are completely unaccountable to the British people deciding on and voting on legislation that affects the way we live our lives. It's completely undemocratic. That's the big one for me. They are largely anonymous, I would wager very very few people in this country could name more than 3 MEP's for Britain, let alone any of the rest. For me it's all about accountability and democracy. The clowns in Westminster might be absolute fu cking idiots but at least they are our f ucking idiots and we have the opportunity to kick them out every five years. |
Broadly my position too.
I've not heard a decent, well argued reason to stay in.
Before last year I was happy with the status quo, then we had the referendum announced and I was still pro EU by default.
The lack of a positive, believable argument since then and the realisation that the nearly 30 nation EU is ungovernable in any sensible way has turned me strongly to the 'leave' camp.
Let's face it, it can't be economic suicide to want out otherwise the government would never have called the referendum in the first place. Why would they be irresponsible enough to allow the possibility of an 'out' vote if it will be so bad for us all. |  |
| If you can fill the unforgiving minute.
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son! |
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| Brexiters, why? on 17:46 - Apr 22 with 7950 views | the_oracle |
Some interesting views so far.
Immigration raises its head, but we will still be filling up with non EU migrants from Pakistan, Bangladesh etc in or out of EU. I've just seen this on another thread " It just seems like the country is being swept by some kind of paranoid persecution complex, mixed up with a large dose of jingoism and xenophobia, where it's all them against us and everything's wrong and it's all the EU's fault. We're so wonderful we can just go off and do it alone".
Do you think any protection the working man has gained from EU membership will still be in place within a year of leaving? Do you think a club of twenty seven will really treat us as an equal?
Odd no outers mentioned the Hoey interview, a leader of the out campaign who has no idea what will happen. Are you outers willing to risk our future on a hope we will be ok? Do you really think we can go back to the time of Empire and the golden age of British trade and expansionism? | | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:04 - Apr 22 with 7927 views | Morfa_Same |
| Brexiters, why? on 17:46 - Apr 22 by the_oracle |
Some interesting views so far.
Immigration raises its head, but we will still be filling up with non EU migrants from Pakistan, Bangladesh etc in or out of EU. I've just seen this on another thread " It just seems like the country is being swept by some kind of paranoid persecution complex, mixed up with a large dose of jingoism and xenophobia, where it's all them against us and everything's wrong and it's all the EU's fault. We're so wonderful we can just go off and do it alone".
Do you think any protection the working man has gained from EU membership will still be in place within a year of leaving? Do you think a club of twenty seven will really treat us as an equal?
Odd no outers mentioned the Hoey interview, a leader of the out campaign who has no idea what will happen. Are you outers willing to risk our future on a hope we will be ok? Do you really think we can go back to the time of Empire and the golden age of British trade and expansionism? |
Excellent post.
The first thing that will happen if the Ukippers get their way is the Tories will have a big bonfire of all our employment rights.
The out campaign is based on nothing but immigration scaremongering. They really haven't got a plan for what happens next. |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:16 - Apr 22 with 7901 views | Flashberryjack |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:04 - Apr 22 by Morfa_Same |
Excellent post.
The first thing that will happen if the Ukippers get their way is the Tories will have a big bonfire of all our employment rights.
The out campaign is based on nothing but immigration scaremongering. They really haven't got a plan for what happens next. |
The Eu will totally collapse in the near future anyway.....so lets get the f*ck out before it does. |  |
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| Brexiters, why? on 18:21 - Apr 22 with 7882 views | swan65split |
Immigration is probably why, and also a British feeling of "not being told what to do" Hardly helped by Mr Obama today.
Europe never wanted us , we were vetoed by France for many a year, lo and behold 1970 and we get North Sea oil.............maybe eyes saw us as being a feeder for Olive tree and wine lake subsidies.
I am a firm believer that if all those that voted in the first election to join, were to be alive and were to vote in this referendum.............the out vote would be Gigantic, its not the Eu that we were led to believe was the "happy ever after" |  | | |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:21 - Apr 22 with 7882 views | crackerjack |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:04 - Apr 22 by Morfa_Same |
Excellent post.
The first thing that will happen if the Ukippers get their way is the Tories will have a big bonfire of all our employment rights.
The out campaign is based on nothing but immigration scaremongering. They really haven't got a plan for what happens next. |
The ONLY reason Obama wants the UK to remain in the EU is so American companies can screw our public services (including the NHS) via TTIP. Let's be brutally honest here.... anything Cameron & Gideon want is bound to be bad for normal working people / families. |  |
| "Lead me from tortured dreams
Childhood themes of nights alone...." |
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| Brexiters, why? on 18:25 - Apr 22 with 7872 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
Boris Johnstone & Gove want out !
That's made my mind up |  |
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| Brexiters, why? on 18:34 - Apr 22 with 7853 views | blueytheblue |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:25 - Apr 22 by oh_tommy_tommy |
Boris Johnstone & Gove want out !
That's made my mind up |
Is Boris Johnstone the politician related to Mo Johnson the footballer? | |
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| Brexiters, why? on 18:42 - Apr 22 with 7841 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| Brexiters, why? on 18:34 - Apr 22 by blueytheblue |
Is Boris Johnstone the politician related to Mo Johnson the footballer? |
What's the letter T between tw@ts eh .
Talking about T
Johnson is as far right as the Tea Party
Right up the exit's street 😄 | |
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| Brexiters, why? on 18:44 - Apr 22 with 7833 views | Wingstandwood |
Immigration is a major worry for many! When you read the newspapers and they quote yearly figures that tend to be the equivalent of the population of a very large city? People think how can the U.K's economy/overstretched public services etc cope until breaking/crisis point is reached?
Speaking as a construction industry employee I can honestly say that immigration has driven down wages, working conditions and employment prospects of indigenous born and bred U.K citizens. You get Eastern Europeans being paid well bellow what would be considered 'the-going-rate' because its still way above the wage of their own countries. The irony is?..... Many work to save and sent a large percentage of it back home giving minimal personal spending returns to the U.K economy. How many Eastern Europeans are coming over here and how many of our fellow Brits are going over there to work cos I have not met or known one Brit to do so! |  |
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