| Jeremy Corbyn 12:42 - Jul 24 with 115725 views | CountyJim |
I'm going to vote for him was going to go with Burnham but the amount of crap he's put up with and with dignity
He's a man of principal don't share his views on the monarch but we all have different points of view
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:16 - Jul 25 with 2075 views | perchrockjack |
It could be argued the LABOUR party is light years away from what it once was, ie the traditional party of manual workers. Although Atlee had a public school education, BEVIN was a nobody who left school at 11 and went on to be a great statesman and one who fully accepted "the bomb". Labour in those days were creative but also represented people because they were basically one of them. Corbyn is not and neither are careerists like Burnham, Cooper, Blair, and even back to the likes of Tony Crossland one of the first of the new brand of Polytechnic posturers who saw socialism as an ideal to ponder over but not one to live out.
People like Corbyn need to get off the backs of the "working class" |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:40 - Jul 25 with 2057 views | blueytheblue |
Labour's problem is they believe they need to represent a specific section of society, using outdated views on the makeup of the workplace and society.
Times have changed, workers rights have vastly improved. Economy and globalisation have made the idealism of some like Corbyn silly because it doesn't reflect the world these days. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:52 - Jul 25 with 2039 views | perchrockjack |
AMEN to that bluey post.
Its as it is ,really.
We don't have the miners,dustmen,labourers,or even steelworkers who relied on LABOUR to get them a fairer deal.
I d say LABOUR was destroyed in the 70 s when our country and its industries were being decimated by Union leaders utterly interested in a greater agenda, ie their own; I vividly remember the unctuous arrogant Clive Jenkins and his self aggrandisement.
Their members interest should have come first; they didn't. Most people also would have rather worked than shove their hand up at an open air "vote".
Latterly, Balls, Blair, Millband and Cooper have simply nailed down the coffin.
"Ordinary" people aspire, want better and should be encouraged by a government to achieve and be self sufficient. The current collection of cretins in power are not doing that.
We need a government to unite us ALL. If we have anti austerity lets all have it,RoyalS, MP S ,SO NO 10% RAISE | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 11:12 - Jul 25 with 2035 views | Private_Partz |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:52 - Jul 25 by perchrockjack |
AMEN to that bluey post.
Its as it is ,really.
We don't have the miners,dustmen,labourers,or even steelworkers who relied on LABOUR to get them a fairer deal.
I d say LABOUR was destroyed in the 70 s when our country and its industries were being decimated by Union leaders utterly interested in a greater agenda, ie their own; I vividly remember the unctuous arrogant Clive Jenkins and his self aggrandisement.
Their members interest should have come first; they didn't. Most people also would have rather worked than shove their hand up at an open air "vote".
Latterly, Balls, Blair, Millband and Cooper have simply nailed down the coffin.
"Ordinary" people aspire, want better and should be encouraged by a government to achieve and be self sufficient. The current collection of cretins in power are not doing that.
We need a government to unite us ALL. If we have anti austerity lets all have it,RoyalS, MP S ,SO NO 10% RAISE |
The middle ground is the way forward. A mixed Economy where both Privare and Public Sectors are valued. Where we truly are in it together whereby everyone pays a fair proportion of their income, and this includes the corporates.
It is not happening now with Labour attempting to destroy their values by siding with the Tory' s continued austerity measures. For me Corbyn is the best thing that could happen to Labour by providing a truly different version to the Nasty Party. A strong middle ground party could then keep the extremes of both in check.
The idea the unions are all bad is ridiculous and all the conditions if service that were fought for over the years are now being eroded. The truth is bosses being in too powerful a position is every bit as bad as unions with too much power. Facism and extreme Communism are as bad as each other. [Post edited 25 Jul 2015 11:13]
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| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 13:00 - Jul 25 with 1993 views | perchrockjack |
In general I agree PP put you ll note , if you read back, that I did not nor do not class ALL Unions as the same although many WERE in the bad old days, without question.
My experience of USDAW was truly eye opening as they were seen as not that powerful at all and as such had little clout.
We need Unions with good management (not w@nkers in suits) to lead us forward TOGETHER and this inspiration has to come from government ;its not by this shower of suits. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 13:41 - Jul 25 with 1976 views | Private_Partz |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 13:00 - Jul 25 by perchrockjack |
In general I agree PP put you ll note , if you read back, that I did not nor do not class ALL Unions as the same although many WERE in the bad old days, without question.
My experience of USDAW was truly eye opening as they were seen as not that powerful at all and as such had little clout.
We need Unions with good management (not w@nkers in suits) to lead us forward TOGETHER and this inspiration has to come from government ;its not by this shower of suits. |
Fair point. There are good and bad unions just as there are good and bad bosses. Much of the strife in the 70s was caused by both. | |
| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:05 - Jul 25 with 1965 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 08:45 - Jul 25 by VetchitBack |
Have you really not noticed how differently the BBC treat Cameron from other Tory leaders? I'm not talking just recently either. If not I really don't know what to say?
Only on the surface is UKIP all about the E.U. They are a party who are spearheaded by ex-Tories who rightly recognise the very much not-at-all conservative nature of the Conservative party and are starting to attract working-class voters betrayed by Labour's immgration policy who find the BNP a bit too strong.
David Cameron is an unquestionable liberal by his own admission and that of others. The evidence is there although I can see how making him appear more Right-wing will benefit those seeking to push that dubious "centre" even further left if that is possible.
It's quite Orwellian. UKIP are called extreme for opposing the truly extreme policy of importing annually hundreds of thousands of immigrants.
It's all very clever and practical for a lot of people. I've heard UKIP described as above as extreme and far-right!? Look at history and look around the world. They really aren't. The centre has been pushed so far left on social issues that any attempt to oppose it immediately flags you as beyond the pale. Perfect! Ingenious. You cannot try to change or rectify without being labelled as morally reprehensible.
Only in modern Britain could Blair or Cameron be described as socially Right-wing because so many are either part of it or have fell for it. |
You've obfuscated a bit by now concentrating on social liberalism. I don't doubt that Cameron is in essence a social liberal. Many modern Tories are, they have their roots in libertarianism which posits that what you get up to is nothing to do with me or anyone else as long as it doesn't harm others or impinge on others' freedoms. A noble concept but most who claim to be libertarians are nothing of the sort. You'll never get unfettered libertarianism of course. That really would be disastrous. And most libertarians don't understand the meaning if the term let alone practice it. They're mostly fairly dim to be honest.
Anyway, in most aspects the current Tory party can't in any way be described as centrist. But your disdain for social liberalism does beg one question. What type of social orthodoxy would you like to see prevail in 21st century Britain? |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:08 - Jul 25 with 1962 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 11:12 - Jul 25 by Private_Partz |
The middle ground is the way forward. A mixed Economy where both Privare and Public Sectors are valued. Where we truly are in it together whereby everyone pays a fair proportion of their income, and this includes the corporates.
It is not happening now with Labour attempting to destroy their values by siding with the Tory' s continued austerity measures. For me Corbyn is the best thing that could happen to Labour by providing a truly different version to the Nasty Party. A strong middle ground party could then keep the extremes of both in check.
The idea the unions are all bad is ridiculous and all the conditions if service that were fought for over the years are now being eroded. The truth is bosses being in too powerful a position is every bit as bad as unions with too much power. Facism and extreme Communism are as bad as each other. [Post edited 25 Jul 2015 11:13]
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New Labour was the very epitome of the middle ground you've described there. Socialists hated it, right wingers hated it. It didn't exactly grip the electorate either. Mind, the illegal foreign subjugations wouldn't have helped. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:17 - Jul 25 with 1955 views | JackSwanTV |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:08 - Jul 25 by exiledclaseboy |
New Labour was the very epitome of the middle ground you've described there. Socialists hated it, right wingers hated it. It didn't exactly grip the electorate either. Mind, the illegal foreign subjugations wouldn't have helped. |
Is there any point of a Labour Party if the only "electable Labour Party" is a party where inequality increases? | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:24 - Jul 25 with 1952 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:17 - Jul 25 by JackSwanTV |
Is there any point of a Labour Party if the only "electable Labour Party" is a party where inequality increases? |
A very good question. And one that Labour is currently struggling with. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:42 - Jul 25 with 1938 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
Who are these "ordinary" people you talk of Perchy |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:06 - Jul 25 with 1909 views | monmouth |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:24 - Jul 25 by exiledclaseboy |
A very good question. And one that Labour is currently struggling with. |
I don't really think they are struggling with it nearly enough...it's in the too hard box and so they are polarising the argument on old left/right drivel. they need to forget all that entrenched shite and redefine themselves from point zero, and then f***ing stand on their principles whilst optimising them to try and get maximum votes obviously. They're starting to look like a dead parrot to me though. Mind you I thought the same in 1985 when they were equally self obsessed and did start to reinvent themselves properly.....and led eventually to John Smith, whose death was a true disaster. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:07 - Jul 25 with 1907 views | perchrockjack |
Pay attention Tom.
They re the poor saps referred to by politicians of all parties.
"......hang on a minute, it's you ,me, everyone.
Nobody"...is.....ordinary | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:13 - Jul 25 with 1907 views | monmouth |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:07 - Jul 25 by perchrockjack |
Pay attention Tom.
They re the poor saps referred to by politicians of all parties.
"......hang on a minute, it's you ,me, everyone.
Nobody"...is.....ordinary |
It's all these 'hard working people' that get on my tits. They are certainly not ordinary as I've not seen that many in the last 35 years, though they all say they are, and the more they earn the harder working they say they are and the less they actually do. Funny that | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:18 - Jul 25 with 1906 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:06 - Jul 25 by monmouth |
I don't really think they are struggling with it nearly enough...it's in the too hard box and so they are polarising the argument on old left/right drivel. they need to forget all that entrenched shite and redefine themselves from point zero, and then f***ing stand on their principles whilst optimising them to try and get maximum votes obviously. They're starting to look like a dead parrot to me though. Mind you I thought the same in 1985 when they were equally self obsessed and did start to reinvent themselves properly.....and led eventually to John Smith, whose death was a true disaster. |
The problem is that most of Labour's defining principles disappeared when Smith died and Blair made the party "electable". As you pointed out yesterday, the notion that Blair made Labour electable by dragging it kicking and screaming from a hard left base that it hadn't actually been in for well over a decade (Kinnock having done all the dirty work there in the 80s) is nonsense given that they would have walked it in 1997 anyway given the absolute clusterf*ck that was Major's Tory government at the time. Labour need a cycle to exorcise whatever demons it finds and to decide what it wants to be. If that means Corbyn fighting an election as leader so be it. They're not winning in 2020 anyway. The concern for me is around how much of a ruin of a country and mainly its public services will Britain be by 2025 after another five years of Cameron followed by five of either Osborne or Johnson.
George Osborne or Boris Johnson will be Britain's next Prime Minister. Just think about that for one minute.
Enjoy the rest of your Saturday. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:58 - Jul 25 with 1889 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:18 - Jul 25 by exiledclaseboy |
The problem is that most of Labour's defining principles disappeared when Smith died and Blair made the party "electable". As you pointed out yesterday, the notion that Blair made Labour electable by dragging it kicking and screaming from a hard left base that it hadn't actually been in for well over a decade (Kinnock having done all the dirty work there in the 80s) is nonsense given that they would have walked it in 1997 anyway given the absolute clusterf*ck that was Major's Tory government at the time. Labour need a cycle to exorcise whatever demons it finds and to decide what it wants to be. If that means Corbyn fighting an election as leader so be it. They're not winning in 2020 anyway. The concern for me is around how much of a ruin of a country and mainly its public services will Britain be by 2025 after another five years of Cameron followed by five of either Osborne or Johnson.
George Osborne or Boris Johnson will be Britain's next Prime Minister. Just think about that for one minute.
Enjoy the rest of your Saturday. |
Superb stuff | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn (n/t) on 17:12 - Jul 25 with 1884 views | monmouth |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 16:18 - Jul 25 by exiledclaseboy |
The problem is that most of Labour's defining principles disappeared when Smith died and Blair made the party "electable". As you pointed out yesterday, the notion that Blair made Labour electable by dragging it kicking and screaming from a hard left base that it hadn't actually been in for well over a decade (Kinnock having done all the dirty work there in the 80s) is nonsense given that they would have walked it in 1997 anyway given the absolute clusterf*ck that was Major's Tory government at the time. Labour need a cycle to exorcise whatever demons it finds and to decide what it wants to be. If that means Corbyn fighting an election as leader so be it. They're not winning in 2020 anyway. The concern for me is around how much of a ruin of a country and mainly its public services will Britain be by 2025 after another five years of Cameron followed by five of either Osborne or Johnson.
George Osborne or Boris Johnson will be Britain's next Prime Minister. Just think about that for one minute.
Enjoy the rest of your Saturday. |
[Post edited 25 Jul 2015 23:18]
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 17:29 - Jul 25 with 1870 views | waynekerr55 |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:40 - Jul 25 by blueytheblue |
Labour's problem is they believe they need to represent a specific section of society, using outdated views on the makeup of the workplace and society.
Times have changed, workers rights have vastly improved. Economy and globalisation have made the idealism of some like Corbyn silly because it doesn't reflect the world these days. |
Well for me they represent virtually every other section of society bar the squeezed middle.
For that reason I'm out and remain a protest voter |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 18:22 - Jul 25 with 1843 views | Private_Partz |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:40 - Jul 25 by blueytheblue |
Labour's problem is they believe they need to represent a specific section of society, using outdated views on the makeup of the workplace and society.
Times have changed, workers rights have vastly improved. Economy and globalisation have made the idealism of some like Corbyn silly because it doesn't reflect the world these days. |
Workers rights have vastly improved? That one makes me laugh. We are heading backwards at the speed of knots.
I agree tha any party must represent all sections of society. Cameron and Co are most certainly not doing that. | |
| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 18:27 - Jul 25 with 1837 views | Private_Partz |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 14:08 - Jul 25 by exiledclaseboy |
New Labour was the very epitome of the middle ground you've described there. Socialists hated it, right wingers hated it. It didn't exactly grip the electorate either. Mind, the illegal foreign subjugations wouldn't have helped. |
A middle ground party is always going to be hated by the extreme right and left. New Labour actually did very well. It was Blair's foreign policy that tarnished the image plus the accusations against Brown when the financial crisis hit. I don't subscribe to the latter btw. Blame the bankers. | |
| You have mission in life to hold out your hand,
To help the other guy out,
Help your fellow man.
Stan Ridgway
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 18:31 - Jul 25 with 1836 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 18:27 - Jul 25 by Private_Partz |
A middle ground party is always going to be hated by the extreme right and left. New Labour actually did very well. It was Blair's foreign policy that tarnished the image plus the accusations against Brown when the financial crisis hit. I don't subscribe to the latter btw. Blame the bankers. |
It wasn't hated just by extremes. But I agree with your gist. The Blair years contained a lot of good things plus plenty of awful. I agree with you about Brown too. One of Labour's great failings over the last five years was its reluctance to head off the lie that it caused the recent recession. [Post edited 25 Jul 2015 18:35]
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 18:42 - Jul 25 with 1828 views | LeonisGod |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 10:40 - Jul 25 by blueytheblue |
Labour's problem is they believe they need to represent a specific section of society, using outdated views on the makeup of the workplace and society.
Times have changed, workers rights have vastly improved. Economy and globalisation have made the idealism of some like Corbyn silly because it doesn't reflect the world these days. |
Are you sure you're a scummer? You seem to speak far too much sense half the time.
Corbyn will resonate with the downtrodden and/or idealistic in former industrialised parts of the UK like this, but what he stands for won't buy him the mass support he needs for an election win. He would be a disaster for Labour's chances. Ed Miliband mark 2.
I can't believe the party comtinue to shoot themselves in the foot. If they can't see the obvious then I don't want them anywhere near no 10. |  | | |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 20:27 - Jul 25 with 1795 views | perchrockjack |
Hard working is a cracker.
Politicians hard working? Sometimes
Barristers? Often
Long hours ? Nah because boredom in a tedious job is hardest.
Confusing inn it which is why politicians should stop insulting us by referring to U.S. In this way | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 22:27 - Jul 25 with 1775 views | waynekerr55 |
| Jeremy Corbyn on 09:55 - Jul 25 by WarwickHunt |
I'll wager it was a Jewish conspiracy...  |
Those bloody Zionists
How do you keep them out of sheen? 😂 | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn on 22:41 - Jul 25 with 1770 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
Fantastic stuff
See you all on the way down
Unless you know you won't
Be on that way down z
Duck my facking g eyes
You've all changed
You've pulled up the ladder
Congrats to David & the c@@ts you've voyed for . | |
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