| So, Chris Willock... 17:10 - Aug 19 with 26569 views | SteveB |
Thoughts?
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| So, Chris Willock... on 22:21 - Aug 20 with 4712 views | numptydumpty |
| So, Chris Willock... on 22:13 - Aug 20 by Lblock |
Yes.
Well.
Errrrrrrrmmmm
Nah.
I’ve no words.
Just….wow. Really……. Wow!
Been a while since I’ve been in Zee Loft. I’ll have to hire a brown shirt and some jackboots for my next visit (can can walk through turnstiles natch).
Good choice of Username BTW |
Being mixed race myself it's apparent on occasions
Sorry to say
Not saying its widespread as it was years ago but there is still an undercurrent with some even if some think it's not, it can be seen by absolutely harsher treatment than others
And Willock played well on Saturday
When Rashford Sancho and Saka missed penalties for England some of the backlash was severely racist.
I wasn't labelling people racists, was saying some are unaware of subconscious bias !!!
It's still around and does happen [Post edited 20 Aug 2023 22:25]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 22:36 - Aug 20 with 4652 views | Hooparoo |
| So, Chris Willock... on 22:21 - Aug 20 by numptydumpty |
Being mixed race myself it's apparent on occasions
Sorry to say
Not saying its widespread as it was years ago but there is still an undercurrent with some even if some think it's not, it can be seen by absolutely harsher treatment than others
And Willock played well on Saturday
When Rashford Sancho and Saka missed penalties for England some of the backlash was severely racist.
I wasn't labelling people racists, was saying some are unaware of subconscious bias !!!
It's still around and does happen [Post edited 20 Aug 2023 22:25]
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That’s terrible that you’ve had to put up with that. Good on you for calling it out. |  |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 12:09 - Aug 21 with 4384 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 22:21 - Aug 20 by numptydumpty |
Being mixed race myself it's apparent on occasions
Sorry to say
Not saying its widespread as it was years ago but there is still an undercurrent with some even if some think it's not, it can be seen by absolutely harsher treatment than others
And Willock played well on Saturday
When Rashford Sancho and Saka missed penalties for England some of the backlash was severely racist.
I wasn't labelling people racists, was saying some are unaware of subconscious bias !!!
It's still around and does happen [Post edited 20 Aug 2023 22:25]
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And being mixed race myself I can vouch for QPR being one of the more inclusive, welcoming environments. Sure, there will always be the odd village idiot but to compare constructive criticism of Willock's poor form on this message board with the abuse suffered by Rashford, Sancho and Saka on social media following the final of Euro 2020 is stretching it, to put it mildly. I'm all for calling it out when it's merited but only when it's merited otherwise the power of the message is lost. |  | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 12:55 - Aug 21 with 4222 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 21:51 - Aug 20 by numptydumpty |
Right so if Willock suddenly performs in next few games which I think he could well do, you all likely to say well that's what I expect as bare minimum from him.
He has been a good signing already, only , £750k, given us some special moments. He either goes for a profit or stays and hopefully recovers full fitness and plays brilliantly this season and all this whilst loftforwords warriors sit on your armchairs on your fifth pint and your fifteenth big mac meal of the week!!
Farcical !!!!
But so QPR !!!!
As if being a top class football professional is always a doddle for those with talent, as if they just have to turn up to turn it on.
Hahaha !!!!
I played football in five a side leagues for few years and it's fricking full on and my level is so far down the chain.
Tried 11 a side recently ridiculously trying to regain my youth at 56 and turning on a sixpence is actually fricking hard work, and the effect on joints of sudden changes of movement at zero pace is hard work.
It's not simple.
Taylor Richards has been given a week off then from the boo boys
Really ....
Won't comment anymore but can't understand destructive comments about a guy has at times been decent for us.
Some people's idol and a superstar talent ie Taraabt, he had one superb season for us and then about ten years in the kebab shop literally.
Willock has kept himself in shape, and won't go the way of Adel, am sure [Post edited 20 Aug 2023 22:04]
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No one will be happier than I if Willock regains his form, however, even if that happens, that doesn't mean that criticism of his form over the last 12-18 months isn't warranted.
Interesting that you would select Taraabt as an example. Despite some stellar performances, Adel received a lot of criticism from some sections of the QPR faithful for not tracking back, being overweight, not passing to teammates who were in a better position, spending nights in shisha bars, petulant behaviour on and off the pitch, etc. Criticism of Willock has been mild in comparison.
The bottom line is criticism, whether merited or not, is part and parcel of the life of a professional footballer. For every Taylor Richards, read Josh Scowen. For every JCS, read Matthew Rose. And for every Chris Willock, read Conor Washington, SWP, Joey Barton, Macauley Bonne, Jeff Hendrick, Jose Bosingwa, George Thomas, Niko Hämäläinen, etc. Quite simply, if you're not producing on the pitch then criticism is bound to follow, irrespective of your ethnicity.
P.S. I'm not a big drinker (though I do enjoy the odd dark rum 'n' coke) and prefer Nandos to McDonalds.
P.P.S. Stick with the footy. At 56 you're more of a diesel engine and it takes a few weeks of playing regularly to warm up. Playing with people who are around your age range is key. | | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 12:58 - Aug 21 with 4214 views | Rs_Holy |
It looks like he is going to be a bit injury prone for the rest of his career? (hammy's now seem a bit fragile).
Shame as he has so much ability. Agree with the poster who said that he will probably be off at the end of the season (having played a handful of games)... probably to a below average Championship club? [Post edited 21 Aug 2023 13:40]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 18:42 - Aug 21 with 3974 views | numptydumpty |
| So, Chris Willock... on 12:55 - Aug 21 by Benny_the_Ball |
No one will be happier than I if Willock regains his form, however, even if that happens, that doesn't mean that criticism of his form over the last 12-18 months isn't warranted.
Interesting that you would select Taraabt as an example. Despite some stellar performances, Adel received a lot of criticism from some sections of the QPR faithful for not tracking back, being overweight, not passing to teammates who were in a better position, spending nights in shisha bars, petulant behaviour on and off the pitch, etc. Criticism of Willock has been mild in comparison.
The bottom line is criticism, whether merited or not, is part and parcel of the life of a professional footballer. For every Taylor Richards, read Josh Scowen. For every JCS, read Matthew Rose. And for every Chris Willock, read Conor Washington, SWP, Joey Barton, Macauley Bonne, Jeff Hendrick, Jose Bosingwa, George Thomas, Niko Hämäläinen, etc. Quite simply, if you're not producing on the pitch then criticism is bound to follow, irrespective of your ethnicity.
P.S. I'm not a big drinker (though I do enjoy the odd dark rum 'n' coke) and prefer Nandos to McDonalds.
P.P.S. Stick with the footy. At 56 you're more of a diesel engine and it takes a few weeks of playing regularly to warm up. Playing with people who are around your age range is key. |
Ok
Agree on some those points
Subconscious bias I would not call racism in anyways, just a little less likely to support than a white player
Am saying that in relation to fact his performance was improved on Saturday but many just simply said he was waste of space and good riddance. There were a few quotes like that in this thread.
The fact he played better gave myself hope things could continue on the up but the fact a lot of this thread was wholly negative despite an encouraging performance from Willock thought was very harsh. Point I was making.
But white, black or any ethnicity I do wonder what completely destroying players in text creates within a club culture.
I see it online a lot but at the games it's not so evident ie we get behind our team and try to get all of them be the best they can be not aim to cause their destruction, which happens on here and other online avenues.
The unconscious side of exclusion of race or ageism also can be seen in workplaces where been turned down for jobs due to my race ie would not fit n or get an interview. Friends name is Andre was told change his name to Andrew to get a job on application.
It's not blatant clearly more subtle but it does still exist.
Agree completely QPR as a club been very proactive with Les as D of F, Chris Ramsey amongst staff and the young Asian girl involved with coaching, I believe and of course the initiative with Kiyan Prince Foundation. Wasn't knocking that side at all.
My wording probably written quickly and misread perhaps, still some elements of bias in general society and there will always be the odd Alf Garnett.
The diesel Engine well maybe
More like an automatic. Definitely stuck in second gear but the engine ie brain still works currently if not aspects of the body. Yes and the age range understand but not quite wanting to or at the level where the walking football is the way forward!!! [Post edited 21 Aug 2023 18:52]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 01:57 - Aug 22 with 3685 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 18:42 - Aug 21 by numptydumpty |
Ok
Agree on some those points
Subconscious bias I would not call racism in anyways, just a little less likely to support than a white player
Am saying that in relation to fact his performance was improved on Saturday but many just simply said he was waste of space and good riddance. There were a few quotes like that in this thread.
The fact he played better gave myself hope things could continue on the up but the fact a lot of this thread was wholly negative despite an encouraging performance from Willock thought was very harsh. Point I was making.
But white, black or any ethnicity I do wonder what completely destroying players in text creates within a club culture.
I see it online a lot but at the games it's not so evident ie we get behind our team and try to get all of them be the best they can be not aim to cause their destruction, which happens on here and other online avenues.
The unconscious side of exclusion of race or ageism also can be seen in workplaces where been turned down for jobs due to my race ie would not fit n or get an interview. Friends name is Andre was told change his name to Andrew to get a job on application.
It's not blatant clearly more subtle but it does still exist.
Agree completely QPR as a club been very proactive with Les as D of F, Chris Ramsey amongst staff and the young Asian girl involved with coaching, I believe and of course the initiative with Kiyan Prince Foundation. Wasn't knocking that side at all.
My wording probably written quickly and misread perhaps, still some elements of bias in general society and there will always be the odd Alf Garnett.
The diesel Engine well maybe
More like an automatic. Definitely stuck in second gear but the engine ie brain still works currently if not aspects of the body. Yes and the age range understand but not quite wanting to or at the level where the walking football is the way forward!!! [Post edited 21 Aug 2023 18:52]
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Little to disagree with here, numpty. My point was specifically around criticism of Willock, not society in general. I've seen no evidence that the former is driven by unconscious bias. However, the thread on Mason Greenwood; that's another matter entirely. | | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 02:18 - Aug 22 with 3688 views | SydneyRs |
| So, Chris Willock... on 22:21 - Aug 20 by numptydumpty |
Being mixed race myself it's apparent on occasions
Sorry to say
Not saying its widespread as it was years ago but there is still an undercurrent with some even if some think it's not, it can be seen by absolutely harsher treatment than others
And Willock played well on Saturday
When Rashford Sancho and Saka missed penalties for England some of the backlash was severely racist.
I wasn't labelling people racists, was saying some are unaware of subconscious bias !!!
It's still around and does happen [Post edited 20 Aug 2023 22:25]
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You only have to look at the number of QPR fans online who seem to spend most of their time posting angry stuff about immigrants to know its definitely out there. And its been more obvious than ever the last few years.
I saw a few laughing on facebook about some refugees drowning last week. Whatever you think about whether they should be given residence in the UK, that is going way too far and reflects extremely poorly on those involved. And these are only the ones where I still see their posts, I blocked many others during all the brexit related fighting because it was getting so so toxic.
The many "jobs for the boys", "box ticking" type comments about Ramsey, Ferdinand and Hall another sign of it. It remains a significant problem and there's no point pretending otherwise.
As for Willock, if he's still here after the window as seems increasingly likely he could do himself and us a favour by signing a contract and working towards that big move he seems to want. |  | | |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 02:42 - Aug 22 with 3640 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 18:42 - Aug 21 by numptydumpty |
Ok
Agree on some those points
Subconscious bias I would not call racism in anyways, just a little less likely to support than a white player
Am saying that in relation to fact his performance was improved on Saturday but many just simply said he was waste of space and good riddance. There were a few quotes like that in this thread.
The fact he played better gave myself hope things could continue on the up but the fact a lot of this thread was wholly negative despite an encouraging performance from Willock thought was very harsh. Point I was making.
But white, black or any ethnicity I do wonder what completely destroying players in text creates within a club culture.
I see it online a lot but at the games it's not so evident ie we get behind our team and try to get all of them be the best they can be not aim to cause their destruction, which happens on here and other online avenues.
The unconscious side of exclusion of race or ageism also can be seen in workplaces where been turned down for jobs due to my race ie would not fit n or get an interview. Friends name is Andre was told change his name to Andrew to get a job on application.
It's not blatant clearly more subtle but it does still exist.
Agree completely QPR as a club been very proactive with Les as D of F, Chris Ramsey amongst staff and the young Asian girl involved with coaching, I believe and of course the initiative with Kiyan Prince Foundation. Wasn't knocking that side at all.
My wording probably written quickly and misread perhaps, still some elements of bias in general society and there will always be the odd Alf Garnett.
The diesel Engine well maybe
More like an automatic. Definitely stuck in second gear but the engine ie brain still works currently if not aspects of the body. Yes and the age range understand but not quite wanting to or at the level where the walking football is the way forward!!! [Post edited 21 Aug 2023 18:52]
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Unconscious bias definitely still exists in some parts of society. Personally, I feel like the opportunities are there but I have to work harder than the next man to get them.
My name actually sounds pretty British so interviewers are somewhat surprised when I walk into the room. I had one case at Lambeth Council where a senior management team made up exclusively of white folk didn't offer me the job. Their feedback was they were concerned that I wouldn't understand the needs and requirements of residents. They'd arrived at this conclusion purely on the basis of not hearing me use terms that they'd learned on courses such as "reasonable adjustments". My 'feedback' was my background represented 80% of Lambeth residents and council employees. Consequently, my cultural and professional experiences positioned me perfectly to understand requirements without the need to resort to tacky terms written by white folk who keep people in colour in menial jobs whilst hogging executive roles. If the board were keen on making "reasonable adjustments", it should move aside and let folk like me run the programme. To say that he was stunned was an understatement.
I had another instance where I worked for a leading pharma company as a programme manager. The project office would release performance stats on a monthly basis. Over the course of 3 years I led the stats in every single month bar one. In particular, my customer satisfaction rating was off-the-charts. Despite this, I was continuously overlooked for promotion in favour of white candidates who were nowhere near my level. The irony is my manager would regularly approach me for professional advice. It took me a while to realise that he was tapping into my expertise to further his own career and wanted to keep me in situ in order to retain access to my knowledge base. He was pretty distraught when I announced my departure and started belatedly offering me opportunities but by that time it was too little, too late. I started my own business and have never looked back.
I have another friend of Asian descent who owns properties in the Isle of Dogs. Many of his tenants are white so on the telephone he puts on a cockney accent when dealing with clients. One tenant who'd just moved into a house called to say that he was happy with the property but the garden needed cutting. My friend said he'd send someone over to deal with it but actually went in person. The next day the tenant called to say that whilst he was happy with the garden he was unsure of the person my friend had 'sent'. My friend responded in his best cockney accent, 'Yes, but they do a lovely job, don't they?" The tenant agreed and to this day has no idea that it was the man he was speaking with who'd actually come round. [Post edited 22 Aug 2023 2:43]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 03:53 - Aug 22 with 3591 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 02:18 - Aug 22 by SydneyRs |
You only have to look at the number of QPR fans online who seem to spend most of their time posting angry stuff about immigrants to know its definitely out there. And its been more obvious than ever the last few years.
I saw a few laughing on facebook about some refugees drowning last week. Whatever you think about whether they should be given residence in the UK, that is going way too far and reflects extremely poorly on those involved. And these are only the ones where I still see their posts, I blocked many others during all the brexit related fighting because it was getting so so toxic.
The many "jobs for the boys", "box ticking" type comments about Ramsey, Ferdinand and Hall another sign of it. It remains a significant problem and there's no point pretending otherwise.
As for Willock, if he's still here after the window as seems increasingly likely he could do himself and us a favour by signing a contract and working towards that big move he seems to want. |
Wishing to control immigration has little to do with race. Some of the anti-immigration rhetoric was against white folk, the furore around welcoming Ukrainians being the obvious example. Ironically you're stating your opinion from the shores of Australia, a country with a far stricter immigration policy than the UK. Personally I think the UK should adopt the Australian system, where those with skills in short supply are invited in. But that's another conversation for another thread.
Still has NOTHING to do with the criticism of Chris Willock, who is ill-advised by his father and has largely downed tools for the past 12-18 months. Yes, Saturday was a minor improvement but one swallow doesn't make a spring. As for signing a new contract, I wouldn't hold your breath as he can command a better deal leaving on a Bosman. | | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 10:20 - Aug 22 with 3384 views | francisbowles |
| So, Chris Willock... on 12:58 - Aug 21 by Rs_Holy |
It looks like he is going to be a bit injury prone for the rest of his career? (hammy's now seem a bit fragile).
Shame as he has so much ability. Agree with the poster who said that he will probably be off at the end of the season (having played a handful of games)... probably to a below average Championship club? [Post edited 21 Aug 2023 13:40]
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It's not necessarily so. Hoilett had loads of hamstring issues but then in about his last 18 months with us and after leaving us he seemed to have very few.
The key may be not rushing back and working on strengthening the affected areas. Then you have to get over the psychological effects. | | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 08:55 - Aug 23 with 2946 views | numptydumpty |
| So, Chris Willock... on 03:53 - Aug 22 by Benny_the_Ball |
Wishing to control immigration has little to do with race. Some of the anti-immigration rhetoric was against white folk, the furore around welcoming Ukrainians being the obvious example. Ironically you're stating your opinion from the shores of Australia, a country with a far stricter immigration policy than the UK. Personally I think the UK should adopt the Australian system, where those with skills in short supply are invited in. But that's another conversation for another thread.
Still has NOTHING to do with the criticism of Chris Willock, who is ill-advised by his father and has largely downed tools for the past 12-18 months. Yes, Saturday was a minor improvement but one swallow doesn't make a spring. As for signing a new contract, I wouldn't hold your breath as he can command a better deal leaving on a Bosman. |
Ok
Agree Willock not played well since start of January last year but also he has hardly started - seven times - and although, appreciate many doubt the sincerity of this, but officially he has been said to be injured.
I just asking all who keep saying this line that he has badly been advised by his father, how do you know this ??
Do you know someone who knows what his father is saying to him, and am guessing he is in the role of his agent.
And also what is his father advising him to do down tools ??? Really ??
Obviously that would not help his career.
And i am assuming his father has had a prominent role with his other son's career, who is at Newcastle and last season was very impressive.
Is his father advising him also, because it seems the two are at odds in how things are for each other currently.
How do people know this ?? [Post edited 23 Aug 2023 8:58]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 09:20 - Aug 23 with 2879 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
Just wanted to say I found the subconscious bias points very interesting - thanks for sharing your stories and experiences.
I was watching the Jonny Manziel documentary on Netflix this week as I watch a lot of US Sports and I did wonder what the mainstream media would have made of Manziel's behaviour and his money celebration in particular if he weren't white. I can't imagine a black or minority athlete being portrayed and treated as a lovable rogue like Manziel largely was.
Hopefully the days of outright racism in mainstream UK society are behind us but the lack of minority (and female) senior managers and directors (for instance) in every single company I've ever worked for kind of proves we still have a huge - if far more subtle - issue with subconscious bias. It's nice to see it being discussed openly here. [Post edited 23 Aug 2023 9:21]
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| So, Chris Willock... (n/t) on 03:45 - Aug 24 with 2480 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| So, Chris Willock... on 09:20 - Aug 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
Just wanted to say I found the subconscious bias points very interesting - thanks for sharing your stories and experiences.
I was watching the Jonny Manziel documentary on Netflix this week as I watch a lot of US Sports and I did wonder what the mainstream media would have made of Manziel's behaviour and his money celebration in particular if he weren't white. I can't imagine a black or minority athlete being portrayed and treated as a lovable rogue like Manziel largely was.
Hopefully the days of outright racism in mainstream UK society are behind us but the lack of minority (and female) senior managers and directors (for instance) in every single company I've ever worked for kind of proves we still have a huge - if far more subtle - issue with subconscious bias. It's nice to see it being discussed openly here. [Post edited 23 Aug 2023 9:21]
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To be fair, companies in the US are more likely to offer senior roles to people of colour. The pharma company I worked for was actually an American firm. However, I worked for the European HQ based in London. On my trips to the US, I found that the Deputy VP, Director of IT and Director of Project Management were all black. However, this was not mirrored in London, where Directors were exclusively white. American colleagues who were crunching the stats were at a loss to understand why I wasn't climbing the ranks. Clearly, they were oblivious to the lack of equal opportunities at their foreign affiliates. [Post edited 24 Aug 2023 4:07]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 07:01 - Aug 24 with 2409 views | PunteR |
This thread has changed since I last read it.. 😂 |  |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:19 - Aug 26 with 1990 views | EastR |
| So, Chris Willock... on 07:01 - Aug 24 by PunteR |
This thread has changed since I last read it.. 😂 |
Let's get it back on track
Not in the squad again today after 45 mins last weekend and just short of fitness
He'll be gone before the end if next week | |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:33 - Aug 26 with 1887 views | derbyhoop |
Willock doesn't make the bench for Southampton. Replaced by Stephen Bala? |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:33 - Aug 26 with 1883 views | connell10 |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:19 - Aug 26 by EastR |
Let's get it back on track
Not in the squad again today after 45 mins last weekend and just short of fitness
He'll be gone before the end if next week |
Good |  |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:34 - Aug 26 with 1874 views | terryb |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:19 - Aug 26 by EastR |
Let's get it back on track
Not in the squad again today after 45 mins last weekend and just short of fitness
He'll be gone before the end if next week |
Once again I ask, who would sign him? | | | |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:35 - Aug 26 with 1846 views | Mick_S |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:34 - Aug 26 by terryb |
Once again I ask, who would sign him? |
That lot up there that sound a bit like us? |  |
| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:37 - Aug 26 with 1836 views | terryb |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:35 - Aug 26 by Mick_S |
That lot up there that sound a bit like us? |
Perhaps you're right, but personally I can't imagine any club being interested.
Unless you meant Queens Park? [Post edited 26 Aug 2023 14:37]
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| So, Chris Willock... on 14:49 - Aug 26 with 1709 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:34 - Aug 26 by terryb |
Once again I ask, who would sign him? |
Reckon CW's up in the Highlands putting pen to paper as we speak! |  |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 15:00 - Aug 26 with 1622 views | kensalriser |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:49 - Aug 26 by PlanetHonneywood |
Reckon CW's up in the Highlands putting pen to paper as we speak! |
Inverness? |  |
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| So, Chris Willock... on 15:11 - Aug 26 with 1584 views | FDC |
| So, Chris Willock... on 14:34 - Aug 26 by terryb |
Once again I ask, who would sign him? |
This is it, at this point you just want the situation resolved one way or another, but he's going nowhere if he can't play 90 minutes regularly. |  | | |
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