| Corona Virus 22:39 - Mar 7 with 514232 views | SgorioFruit |
Sorry for new thread,
But how bad do you lot reckon it’s going to get here in the UK?
I just been watching the news. Looking nasty in Italy. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 15:02 - May 18 with 1640 views | Cooperman |
| Corona Virus on 15:01 - May 18 by Highjack |
Which part of John Hopkins are they putting it in? |
John Thomas. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 15:11 - May 18 with 1621 views | Garyjack |
| Corona Virus on 15:00 - May 18 by londonlisa2001 |
Oh, I’m winding him up.
I know exactly what drug he’s on about.
I’m finding it funny that he’s arguing with the prof because the drug is one of drugs most widely used in animals. I’d wager many of us have used it on our dogs.
He’s on about ivermectin (which has been in trials in Johns Hopkins for ages). |
Side effects of Ivermectin:
Pain in your neck and back
Serious eye problems. Symptoms can include:
redness
bleeding
swelling
pain
loss of vision
Shortness of breath
Inability to control urination
Inability to control bowel movements
Trouble standing or walking
Confusion
Extreme tiredness
Extreme drowsiness
Seizures
Coma
Low blood pressure, especially when you get up after sitting or lying down. Symptoms can include:
lightheadedness
dizziness
fainting
Severe skin reactions. Symptoms can include:
severe rash
redness
blistering skin
peeling skin
Liver damage. Symptoms can include:
tiredness
nausea
vomiting
loss of appetite
pain on the right side of your stomach
dark urine
yellowing of your skin or the whites of your eyes
tiredness
loss of energy
stomach pain
loss of appetite
nausea
vomiting
diarrhea
dizziness
sleepiness or drowsiness
itchiness
Right i'm in, where can i get some?  |  | | |
| Corona Virus on 15:12 - May 18 with 1621 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 14:36 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
"The unit cost of a trivalent vaccination is £5.96. The unit cost of a flu vaccination at a GP surgery or in other healthcare settings is £9.80 for people in eligible groups (NHS England Vaccination and immunisation list 2018/19)."
Yes pennies and how well did you work?
ps I wil answer my own question.
"Mid-season estimates suggest that the flu shot has reduced the risk of illness by around 47% in vaccinated people, according to a report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) released Thursday. During the severe 2017-2018 flu season, vaccine efficacy was estimated at just 36%" [Post edited 18 May 2020 14:40]
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On the other hand measles is 99% and mumps 88%
Efficient. These put both over the levels needed for herd immunity (measles has a very high R0 so needs high coverage for herd immunity). Flu is not the best vaccine as the annual jab is a bit of a guess as to which antigens are needed. Also expensive as produced in embryonated eggs which is labourious and costly |  | | |
| Corona Virus on 15:28 - May 18 with 1592 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 15:11 - May 18 by Garyjack |
Side effects of Ivermectin:
Pain in your neck and back
Serious eye problems. Symptoms can include:
redness
bleeding
swelling
pain
loss of vision
Shortness of breath
Inability to control urination
Inability to control bowel movements
Trouble standing or walking
Confusion
Extreme tiredness
Extreme drowsiness
Seizures
Coma
Low blood pressure, especially when you get up after sitting or lying down. Symptoms can include:
lightheadedness
dizziness
fainting
Severe skin reactions. Symptoms can include:
severe rash
redness
blistering skin
peeling skin
Liver damage. Symptoms can include:
tiredness
nausea
vomiting
loss of appetite
pain on the right side of your stomach
dark urine
yellowing of your skin or the whites of your eyes
tiredness
loss of energy
stomach pain
loss of appetite
nausea
vomiting
diarrhea
dizziness
sleepiness or drowsiness
itchiness
Right i'm in, where can i get some? |
From the vets. Commonly used anti-parasitic in animals and indeed humans. Quite a nasty drug but fairly effective on worms and protozoa | | | |
| Corona Virus on 15:29 - May 18 with 1586 views | Highjack |
| Corona Virus on 15:11 - May 18 by Garyjack |
Side effects of Ivermectin:
Pain in your neck and back
Serious eye problems. Symptoms can include:
redness
bleeding
swelling
pain
loss of vision
Shortness of breath
Inability to control urination
Inability to control bowel movements
Trouble standing or walking
Confusion
Extreme tiredness
Extreme drowsiness
Seizures
Coma
Low blood pressure, especially when you get up after sitting or lying down. Symptoms can include:
lightheadedness
dizziness
fainting
Severe skin reactions. Symptoms can include:
severe rash
redness
blistering skin
peeling skin
Liver damage. Symptoms can include:
tiredness
nausea
vomiting
loss of appetite
pain on the right side of your stomach
dark urine
yellowing of your skin or the whites of your eyes
tiredness
loss of energy
stomach pain
loss of appetite
nausea
vomiting
diarrhea
dizziness
sleepiness or drowsiness
itchiness
Right i'm in, where can i get some? |
Yes yes but apart from all that it works a dream. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 15:45 - May 18 with 1566 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 15:00 - May 18 by londonlisa2001 |
Oh, I’m winding him up.
I know exactly what drug he’s on about.
I’m finding it funny that he’s arguing with the prof because the drug is one of drugs most widely used in animals. I’d wager many of us have used it on our dogs.
He’s on about ivermectin (which has been in trials in Johns Hopkins for ages). |
Well done Lisa, that wasn't hard was it?
Now find the other drug to go with it and there you have the cure.
Funny that the Doctor leading the study didn't mention all those nasty possible side effects isn't it?
Not my imagination or some crank website or forum is it?
The other point about Ivermectin is that it is a prophylactic as well.
ps you fibbed a bit about John Hopkins, they don't start their COVID-19 study until June, that doesn't sound like "ages". [Post edited 18 May 2020 15:51]
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| Corona Virus on 15:54 - May 18 with 1548 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 15:45 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
Well done Lisa, that wasn't hard was it?
Now find the other drug to go with it and there you have the cure.
Funny that the Doctor leading the study didn't mention all those nasty possible side effects isn't it?
Not my imagination or some crank website or forum is it?
The other point about Ivermectin is that it is a prophylactic as well.
ps you fibbed a bit about John Hopkins, they don't start their COVID-19 study until June, that doesn't sound like "ages". [Post edited 18 May 2020 15:51]
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The dose needed against a coronavirus looks to be very high-will be pushing safety there. Like all these things it is early days and need to take care what looks like a short term answer does not lead to longer-term problems. There are many potent side effects which may cause long-term damage | | | |
| Corona Virus on 15:57 - May 18 with 1541 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 15:54 - May 18 by Professor |
The dose needed against a coronavirus looks to be very high-will be pushing safety there. Like all these things it is early days and need to take care what looks like a short term answer does not lead to longer-term problems. There are many potent side effects which may cause long-term damage |
And excessive use could lead to resistance seen in many anti-parasitic drugs and prevent the use of ivermectin for other important diseases. No saying it wonder work but care is needed. Vaccines are generally safer too | | | |
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| Corona Virus on 16:09 - May 18 with 1528 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 15:45 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
Well done Lisa, that wasn't hard was it?
Now find the other drug to go with it and there you have the cure.
Funny that the Doctor leading the study didn't mention all those nasty possible side effects isn't it?
Not my imagination or some crank website or forum is it?
The other point about Ivermectin is that it is a prophylactic as well.
ps you fibbed a bit about John Hopkins, they don't start their COVID-19 study until June, that doesn't sound like "ages". [Post edited 18 May 2020 15:51]
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Yeah, we know the other drug. You’re just reading the stuff out of Bangladesh. Which is in turn based on what they were doing in Australia a while ago (end of March ish).
Paris has been looking at it for a while I think, and Johns Hopkins announced a study a few weeks back. If that hasn’t started, I’ve no idea, I just know they announced one.
There’s been a few things though saying that the levels needed would be very damaging.
Who knows.
But you keep on pouncing on these rumours / theories before they’ve been properly tested. To say ‘that’s the cure’ is just farcical.
I mean, if you’re doing it to say ‘I told everyone’ that’s fine, as you will definitely be able to do so at some point, given you’ve mentioned every single possible drug going. But if it’s because you honestly think you’ve found an answer that no one is looking at, that’s bollox. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 16:10 - May 18 with 1527 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 15:28 - May 18 by Professor |
From the vets. Commonly used anti-parasitic in animals and indeed humans. Quite a nasty drug but fairly effective on worms and protozoa |
Some people use it for ticks and worms for dogs. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 16:44 - May 18 with 1493 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 16:10 - May 18 by londonlisa2001 |
Some people use it for ticks and worms for dogs. |
Yes-worms are consider parasites as are ticks, fleas etc, though usually considered as ectoparasties.
Ivermectin has a long history against ticks etc. but more usually livestock-fipronil more used for dogs etc | | | |
| Corona Virus on 16:49 - May 18 with 1487 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 16:09 - May 18 by londonlisa2001 |
Yeah, we know the other drug. You’re just reading the stuff out of Bangladesh. Which is in turn based on what they were doing in Australia a while ago (end of March ish).
Paris has been looking at it for a while I think, and Johns Hopkins announced a study a few weeks back. If that hasn’t started, I’ve no idea, I just know they announced one.
There’s been a few things though saying that the levels needed would be very damaging.
Who knows.
But you keep on pouncing on these rumours / theories before they’ve been properly tested. To say ‘that’s the cure’ is just farcical.
I mean, if you’re doing it to say ‘I told everyone’ that’s fine, as you will definitely be able to do so at some point, given you’ve mentioned every single possible drug going. But if it’s because you honestly think you’ve found an answer that no one is looking at, that’s bollox. |
God you talk a load of bollocks at times.
How can I claim that I think I have found an answer that no one is looking at when the bloody doctors did the study and said it cured the patients, which I reported on.
I also reported on Ivermectin as a possible ages ago.
I haven't seen any studies from Australia, perhaps you can give me the links so that I can add it to my database.
There are lots of other drugs that are being used to successfully treat COVID-19, but all you hear from the government is there is no treatment and no cure.
They are lying, there are plenty of treatments that have been used in studies, just not "Clinical Studies". Other countries are using them to save lives while our Government prevent our NHS from using them and everybody asks why our death rate is so bad. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 16:58 - May 18 with 1471 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 16:49 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
God you talk a load of bollocks at times.
How can I claim that I think I have found an answer that no one is looking at when the bloody doctors did the study and said it cured the patients, which I reported on.
I also reported on Ivermectin as a possible ages ago.
I haven't seen any studies from Australia, perhaps you can give me the links so that I can add it to my database.
There are lots of other drugs that are being used to successfully treat COVID-19, but all you hear from the government is there is no treatment and no cure.
They are lying, there are plenty of treatments that have been used in studies, just not "Clinical Studies". Other countries are using them to save lives while our Government prevent our NHS from using them and everybody asks why our death rate is so bad. |
Use Pubmed. About the only peer-reviewed paper. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 17:04 - May 18 with 1461 views | Professor |
One company. Profit would be based on numbers used. Say vaccine costs 3 USD to produce and distribute. You retail for 5 USD. 2 billion does used annually. Do the maths. I would suggest you also look at the role of non-profit (GAVI, African Union PANVAC, Gates Foundation) in vaccines. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 17:16 - May 18 with 1446 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 16:09 - May 18 by londonlisa2001 |
Yeah, we know the other drug. You’re just reading the stuff out of Bangladesh. Which is in turn based on what they were doing in Australia a while ago (end of March ish).
Paris has been looking at it for a while I think, and Johns Hopkins announced a study a few weeks back. If that hasn’t started, I’ve no idea, I just know they announced one.
There’s been a few things though saying that the levels needed would be very damaging.
Who knows.
But you keep on pouncing on these rumours / theories before they’ve been properly tested. To say ‘that’s the cure’ is just farcical.
I mean, if you’re doing it to say ‘I told everyone’ that’s fine, as you will definitely be able to do so at some point, given you’ve mentioned every single possible drug going. But if it’s because you honestly think you’ve found an answer that no one is looking at, that’s bollox. |
So there is a 'proper' peer-reviewed paper from the group in Australia. It shows effects in vitro which are promising. As indicated by a previous answer, the bigger issue is that this is at level three-time greater than the concentration used for other therapies-notably onchocerca or river blindness. The levels used in river blindness already have toxicity issues so there is a rush for alternatives or vaccines.
So there is a big caveat that the levels needed for SARS CoV2 therapy would be so high as to be problematic. As I said earlier LISa, there is a lot of hand waving science going on here. Ivermectin may be the answer, but may equally be another false dawn. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 17:54 - May 18 with 1411 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 16:58 - May 18 by Professor |
Use Pubmed. About the only peer-reviewed paper. |
Sorry Prof, I lost faith in peer review years ago.
You put way too much faith in it as I showed last time we spoke about it.
But if it is only in Vitro then there are loads of those studies on many drugs that show promise, even some tested on mice.
My database contains a lot of them, but the ones that have been successfully used to treat actual COVID-91 patients that I am most interested in.
To name few, most of which are used in combination are
interferon beta-1b + lopinavir—ritonavir and ribavirin, used in Hong Kong.
Methylprednisolone part of the EMVS Treatment Protocol in the US which includes Enoxaparin, Famotidine, Hydroxychloroquine, Ivermectin, Heparin Siltuximab and Tocilizumab as well as Anakinra at different stages of treatment.
Abivax ABX464 used in France.
Actemra, apparently used in China.
Leronlimab (PRO 140) used as a last resort in New York with some very bad outcomes.
lopinavir/ritonavir sold as Kaletra used in Australia.
N-Acetyl Cysteine known as NAC used in Russia.
Tissue plasminogen activator, or tPA, another one used as a last resort with variable results.
Favipiravir used in Japan. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:01 - May 18 with 1401 views | Humpty |
| Corona Virus on 15:45 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
Well done Lisa, that wasn't hard was it?
Now find the other drug to go with it and there you have the cure.
Funny that the Doctor leading the study didn't mention all those nasty possible side effects isn't it?
Not my imagination or some crank website or forum is it?
The other point about Ivermectin is that it is a prophylactic as well.
ps you fibbed a bit about John Hopkins, they don't start their COVID-19 study until June, that doesn't sound like "ages". [Post edited 18 May 2020 15:51]
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Jesus. You really do believe you know the cure don't you? |  | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:07 - May 18 with 1395 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 17:04 - May 18 by Professor |
One company. Profit would be based on numbers used. Say vaccine costs 3 USD to produce and distribute. You retail for 5 USD. 2 billion does used annually. Do the maths. I would suggest you also look at the role of non-profit (GAVI, African Union PANVAC, Gates Foundation) in vaccines. |
But for shareholders the quick money is made in the promotion of the drug or vaccine moving the share price and not necessarily the sales.
That is one reason that Remdesivir is being pushed so hard in the US, many people including those working in the CDC and NIH are declared shareholders in Gilead or have received financial support from Gilead.
https://aapsonline.org/a-tale-of-two-drugs-money-vs-medical-wisdom/ | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:09 - May 18 with 1392 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 18:01 - May 18 by Humpty |
Jesus. You really do believe you know the cure don't you? |
I am quoting the lead Doctor, why do you keep saying it is me?
Can't you bloody read? | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:12 - May 18 with 1389 views | A_Fans_Dad |
Prof, the other drug used in the Bangladesh trial was Doxycycline which was idenified as an inhibitor of Deng fever. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:24 - May 18 with 1384 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 17:16 - May 18 by Professor |
So there is a 'proper' peer-reviewed paper from the group in Australia. It shows effects in vitro which are promising. As indicated by a previous answer, the bigger issue is that this is at level three-time greater than the concentration used for other therapies-notably onchocerca or river blindness. The levels used in river blindness already have toxicity issues so there is a rush for alternatives or vaccines.
So there is a big caveat that the levels needed for SARS CoV2 therapy would be so high as to be problematic. As I said earlier LISa, there is a lot of hand waving science going on here. Ivermectin may be the answer, but may equally be another false dawn. |
Yep.
To clarify, you realise I’m saying similar to you to fansdad (obviously just from a lay person’s common sense perspective) rather than jumping on his bandwagon don’t you... | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:25 - May 18 with 1382 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 16:44 - May 18 by Professor |
Yes-worms are consider parasites as are ticks, fleas etc, though usually considered as ectoparasties.
Ivermectin has a long history against ticks etc. but more usually livestock-fipronil more used for dogs etc |
I use advocate. No idea what’s in that. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:30 - May 18 with 1377 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 16:49 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
God you talk a load of bollocks at times.
How can I claim that I think I have found an answer that no one is looking at when the bloody doctors did the study and said it cured the patients, which I reported on.
I also reported on Ivermectin as a possible ages ago.
I haven't seen any studies from Australia, perhaps you can give me the links so that I can add it to my database.
There are lots of other drugs that are being used to successfully treat COVID-19, but all you hear from the government is there is no treatment and no cure.
They are lying, there are plenty of treatments that have been used in studies, just not "Clinical Studies". Other countries are using them to save lives while our Government prevent our NHS from using them and everybody asks why our death rate is so bad. |
“ I haven't seen any studies from Australia, perhaps you can give me the links”
It was the drug that was causing a lot of excitement in March at Monash university until stuff came out saying it didn’t work as expected unless unsafe doses were used.
The government aren’t saying there’s ‘no treatment and no cure’ they’re saying that things have to be trialled and investigated properly. There are three different strands of trial going on - they have been for a while now - they all have acronyms that I can’t recall. Each has several thousand people. They’ve been banging on about them for ages on the daily briefing thing. Plus they’ve plasma stuff going on at Oxford which again they’ve spoken about (as Hancock is one of those that’s been involved). | | | |
| Corona Virus on 18:38 - May 18 with 1367 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 18:12 - May 18 by A_Fans_Dad |
Prof, the other drug used in the Bangladesh trial was Doxycycline which was idenified as an inhibitor of Deng fever. |
It’s also used as an anti malarial. Although you’re buggered if you go somewhere with malaria and loads of sun as many people can’t go in the sun if they take doxycycline. | | | |
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