| Henry + Carroll 10:55 - Jan 29 with 4008 views | Ferdy |
Im not one to dig out our own players and I have been patient with Little Tom due to his age and attitude but I thought he was useless again last night. I lost count the amount of simple 10 yard passes he misplaced and also the amount of times he got pushed off the ball. I am beginning to think he just isnt very good.
Henry as a nasty habit of p1ssballing about whilst facing his own goal and losing possession apart from that he got better as the game went on last night.
Of the two I would rather start Henry alongside Barton on Saturday. |  | | |  |
| Henry + Carroll on 11:10 - Jan 29 with 3951 views | Neil_SI |
I've said this elsewhere, in the thread specifically about Henry, but the team selection and style of play contributed to their problems. They both played quite deep, too deep in my opinion, but their problems were further compounded by Danny Simpson's absence.
Simpson is willing to overlap, and transition into midfield and attacking positions, which encourages movement and support in areas of the pitch that allow others to take up better positions to receive the ball.
Because this didn't happen, I expected Armand Traore to do so on the other side, seeing as he is an attacking sort of player, but he stayed in a limited role and didn't really offer much in the way Simpson does. And then the players at the back had a bad day at the office in terms of how they passed and moved it, and put pressure on the two midfielders to really get them out of jail.
The two wide men didn't really come off their channels that much, especially Matt Phillips, who you often see bursting infield, but he stayed more wide this time and simply went up and down in straight lines. We never found Andy Johnson on the ball, or into the channels where he likes to work, so it all became flat and static very quickly.
Any player on the ball is going to have a hard time picking someone out, without putting them under pressure, in those situations. Perhaps one of them needed to break free and burst forward a little more, but with our lack of pace at the back, and being a flat four in the middle, they went for safety first as they've done many a time, and just sat back into position and eventually some balls dropped our way and we found the goals needed to win the game. |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 11:16 - Jan 29 with 3930 views | QPunkR |
Yeah I also said a lot about the general tactics in the other Henry thread. Having said all that (I can't be arsed to write it all again!), I still don't think Carroll's any good, even though there were mitigating circumstances for last night |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 11:38 - Jan 29 with 3888 views | ngbqpr |
LTC is always always showing for the ball, yes he sometimes gives it straight back, yes it sometimes goes sideways or backwards...but he does look for forward movement...if it's not there (ie no space for him to run into and no one else finding space - which as Neil points out was the big problem last night), then to use the current 'buzz term', he recycles possession til the opening presents itself
Yes in the cut & thrust of the Championship he does get hustled off the ball too much at times, and some passes do go astray - but in no way would I compare him with Henry, who gets hustled off the ball twice as much as LTC despite being much bigger...shows for it less...frequently doesn't know what to do with it when he does get it...and misplaces more passes
As a central 2 in a 442 it doesn't work for me - but whilst I know I'm in a minority, I like having LTC in the team, whilst ideally Henry is simply a sub who comes on to tighten things up in the last 15-20 |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 11:47 - Jan 29 with 3864 views | TacticalR |
He's only little. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:01 - Jan 29 with 3818 views | daveB |
I like the fact he always wants the ball and tries to pass to a team mate but in a 4-4-2 he is always going to be exposed. He's one of the new generation who have been brought up coached to keep the ball like a Spanish player which is great but not ideal for a wet tuesday night against Bolton |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:03 - Jan 29 with 3814 views | TheBlob |
Carroll will be better when he's bulked up a bit.But that will happen when he reaches puberty.....a pretty hair raising time in itself. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:10 - Jan 29 with 3797 views | Discodroid |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:03 - Jan 29 by TheBlob |
Carroll will be better when he's bulked up a bit.But that will happen when he reaches puberty.....a pretty hair raising time in itself. |
praise the lord for the giftness of laughter!!
i think henry got caught out again in the last minute or so,doing the james browm 360 degree shuffle, and their forward was unfortunate to be called up for a foul.
and for that reason
im out. |  |
| " I guess in four or five years, the new generation's music will be .. electronics, tapes. I can kind of envision .. maybe one person .. with a lot of machines, tapes, and electronics setups, singin or speaking .. and using machines " James Douglas Morrison | 1969 |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:35 - Jan 29 with 3715 views | simmo |
| Henry + Carroll on 11:38 - Jan 29 by ngbqpr |
LTC is always always showing for the ball, yes he sometimes gives it straight back, yes it sometimes goes sideways or backwards...but he does look for forward movement...if it's not there (ie no space for him to run into and no one else finding space - which as Neil points out was the big problem last night), then to use the current 'buzz term', he recycles possession til the opening presents itself
Yes in the cut & thrust of the Championship he does get hustled off the ball too much at times, and some passes do go astray - but in no way would I compare him with Henry, who gets hustled off the ball twice as much as LTC despite being much bigger...shows for it less...frequently doesn't know what to do with it when he does get it...and misplaces more passes
As a central 2 in a 442 it doesn't work for me - but whilst I know I'm in a minority, I like having LTC in the team, whilst ideally Henry is simply a sub who comes on to tighten things up in the last 15-20 |
Basically how I feel. I think we are a better team with him in midfield but I don't think it works in a flat 4-4-2 where he will be under pressure and has less short passing options ahead of him.
If you give him some space to operate and actually have forward players moving ahead of him, I think he is our most incisive central midfielder. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:37 - Jan 29 with 3707 views | WeaverQPR |
Would you all go 451 on satd then? |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:38 - Jan 29 with 3696 views | simmo |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:37 - Jan 29 by WeaverQPR |
Would you all go 451 on satd then? |
With available personnel that would be my first choice formation anyway, well, a variation of it - 4-2-3-1 and 4-5-1 without the ball, etc. [Post edited 29 Jan 2014 12:39]
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| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:43 - Jan 29 with 3680 views | jonno |
We got out of jail last night against an abysmal Bolton side. Another very poor performance, and if Austin had had to go off we would have lost. Carroll should never be in midfield in a 442 at this level in a million years. And Henry - well he does his best but when a team in the division below don't want him that tells you all you need to know. Barton's obvioulsy a dickhead but we certainly miss him when he's not playing - let's hope he's fit for Saturday or we'll take a drubbing. |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:44 - Jan 29 with 3674 views | WestbourneR |
My take is - he has a good football brain and understands tempo and play making. Something no on else in squad really has, in an attacking sense.
BUT technically he's just not good enough. For a 'ball player' his passing is shoddy and his shooting worse. He's also just far far too light weight. He's basically not a very good player. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:45 - Jan 29 with 3667 views | WeaverQPR |
Like to see Hoilett or Traore play wide left,Phillps on right and Kranjcar in middle | |
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| Henry + Carroll on 12:55 - Jan 29 with 3630 views | johnhoop |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:43 - Jan 29 by jonno |
We got out of jail last night against an abysmal Bolton side. Another very poor performance, and if Austin had had to go off we would have lost. Carroll should never be in midfield in a 442 at this level in a million years. And Henry - well he does his best but when a team in the division below don't want him that tells you all you need to know. Barton's obvioulsy a dickhead but we certainly miss him when he's not playing - let's hope he's fit for Saturday or we'll take a drubbing. |
This is spot on. Bolton were an awful side, the worst we've played this season. Their fans had it right at the end when they were singing"How shit are you-it's only 2-1."
If we don't have Barton back for Saturday and Austin is out with his shoulder injury, our chances of getting anything out of that game are very remote indeed. |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:58 - Jan 29 with 3615 views | headhoops |
Henry + Carroll anagram of really con HR or enrol lycra HR. its slow today in the office.
As part of a 5 man midfield Carroll has potential. Henry for me should hang up his boots, a very, very poor mans Shaun Derry. How these two plus SWP, Toilett, Bennyhoon and Oneill start ahead of Diakite is frankly more disturbing than the alleged Mad Malians mindset. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 13:04 - Jan 29 with 3591 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:43 - Jan 29 by jonno |
We got out of jail last night against an abysmal Bolton side. Another very poor performance, and if Austin had had to go off we would have lost. Carroll should never be in midfield in a 442 at this level in a million years. And Henry - well he does his best but when a team in the division below don't want him that tells you all you need to know. Barton's obvioulsy a dickhead but we certainly miss him when he's not playing - let's hope he's fit for Saturday or we'll take a drubbing. |
spot on. |  |
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| Henry + Carroll on 13:48 - Jan 29 with 3531 views | joolsyp |
| Henry + Carroll on 12:43 - Jan 29 by jonno |
We got out of jail last night against an abysmal Bolton side. Another very poor performance, and if Austin had had to go off we would have lost. Carroll should never be in midfield in a 442 at this level in a million years. And Henry - well he does his best but when a team in the division below don't want him that tells you all you need to know. Barton's obvioulsy a dickhead but we certainly miss him when he's not playing - let's hope he's fit for Saturday or we'll take a drubbing. |
Nail on thread Jonno. I got criticised for saying this on the match thread immediately after the game. Frankly there were very few positives from last night other than 3 points, Charlie scoring again and keeping the run going. Play the same team against Burnley on Sat and we'll get comfortably beaten. |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 19:41 - Jan 29 with 3428 views | derbyhoop |
Would that be LTC who was voted MOTM? |  |
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Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Henry + Carroll on 21:01 - Jan 29 with 3353 views | WadR |
I thought Carroll was very good between around the 25th and 65th minute. Either side of that, he really struggled. The main issue was, as other have said, the lack of a simple ball. He too often resorted to overly elaborate flicks because Traore or Henry weren't readily available. He did make one or two important sliding tackles and made a good run followed up by that weak shot.
I like him, but with Henry in a 442 with very little cover from either wide player or Johnson meant he was going to struggle. Henry's positioning when Carroll was in position was often poor and likewise Traore doesn't offer the intelligence that Assou-Ekotto has. | | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 07:29 - Jan 30 with 3272 views | MelakaRanger |
| Henry + Carroll on 13:48 - Jan 29 by joolsyp |
Nail on thread Jonno. I got criticised for saying this on the match thread immediately after the game. Frankly there were very few positives from last night other than 3 points, Charlie scoring again and keeping the run going. Play the same team against Burnley on Sat and we'll get comfortably beaten. |
Regrettably I think you are spot on here. Same team on Saturday as against Bolton and we will be marmerlised! |  | | |
| Henry + Carroll on 09:18 - Jan 30 with 3208 views | Ferdy |
| Henry + Carroll on 19:41 - Jan 29 by derbyhoop |
Would that be LTC who was voted MOTM? |
Ridiculous!
Who voted for that his Mum? | | | |
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