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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 08:36 12 Jan 2025
Sir Trevor Phillips has now joined the calls for a national inquiry. His view is that the rape gang phenomenon is different from most other child abuse. While most offenders try to keep the abuse secret, threatening the victim with dire consequences if they disclose what has happened, Phillips says that the awful thing about the gangs is that local communities knew what was happening. He cites the example of a teenage girl being kept in a room above a kebab shop with 15 men waiting in another room to take their turns , He says that there was a cultural issue whereby certain sections of the Asian community felt the girls had this coming because they were children of a decadent Western society where loose sexual behaviour was the norm.
Elsewhere the first Labour MP has expressed dissent from the party line, and an Oldham councillor has criticised the repeated attempts of Labour at both local and national level to block action.
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/grooming-gangs-campaigners-inquiry-
Finally there is a report that gang abuse is continuing.
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/grooming-gang-child-sex-offences-repor
[Post edited 12 Jan 10:41]
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Reply | 🦢 FA Cup weekend starts here
at 20:38 11 Jan 2025
Checking my specs tonight looking at the results. Brentford 0 Plymouth Argyle 1, Whittaker 82, Assist Sorinola. Am I having hallucinations?  [Post edited 11 Jan 20:38]
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Reply | Car buffs
at 13:26 11 Jan 2025
Yes, that is correct for most cars. On a few cars like my BMW there are live and earth terminals in the engine compartment away from the battery. |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 13:07 11 Jan 2025
There are signs of a split emerging in Labour, or at least a largish minority who are saying there must be some kind of national inquiry. On one hand, we have Wes Streeting, basically spelling out the view that said full investigation and prosecutions of all those involved would be bad for community relations - the policy stance that got us where we are now. On other hand, we have those like Burnham, Harman, the Blue Labour group and now Khalid Mahmood, who think this can't be swept under the carpet any longer.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/politics/general/pakistani-muslim-former-labour-mp-bac |
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Reply | Car buffs
at 19:08 10 Jan 2025
Modern cars with onboard computers and many accessories do seem to drain the battery if left unused. I've had a flat battery in the past when I've been away on holiday. Even over the Xmas to New Year period when I probably only made one short journey in a fortnight this caused my "battery draining while stationery" light to come on. The advice that I got from the BMW dealer a while ago was to use the car more. I ended up buying a solar charger (a panel that rests on the dashboard plus a control unit) and last time I went for a break away the battery was still okay on my return. |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 14:28 10 Jan 2025
That was the original Oldham Council request. A national inquiry could take various forms, including a limited inquiry led either by the Home Office. or an independent overseer Many arguing for a national inquiry emphasise that it would not duplicate the ground already covered. Most arguing against a national inquiry say flatly that the issues are local ones and only additional local inquiries are appropriate. It is good to hear that you would be happy with a limited national inquiry. I had misunderstood and thought your argument was a different one.  |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 14:08 10 Jan 2025
My word was "focused", which has similar meaning to what Andy Burnham meant by "limited", and meaning that the local inquiries need to be brought together to get a national perspective and there must be accountability. Burnham said that "there is the case for a limited national inquiry that draws on reviews like the one that I commissioned, and the one we have seen in Rotherham, the one we have seen in Telford, to draw out some of these national issues and compel people to give evidence who then may have charges to answer and be held to account.”
If the position of Burnham and Harman does not contradict your position, then I assume you are right on board with the above and also what Harman said: "people need to be trained and confident in their roles that they can take on issues which are in particular communities and that does not mean they are racist. (...) 'In police, Crown Prosecution Service, but above all in councils where people can feel 'we know we're doing the right thing here. (...)_I think that whether it's a task force, whether it's more action plans, whether it's a a mini inquiry on this, this is something that we need to develop resilience in". |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 13:03 10 Jan 2025
But Burnham and Harman are putting forward arguments that directly contradict your's. They give reasons why a focused inquiry might have value. Are they closet racists too? You cannot dismiss those arguments by suggesting they are owned by Musk. Associating a reasonable argument with a person of extreme views is a transparent rhetorical device that won't wash. |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 09:25 10 Jan 2025
This is moving into OTT territory What has Musk got in common with Andy Burnham or Harriet Harman? Logically Musk's internet ramblings do not undermine the argument about accountability and community relations that many sensible people are advancing. As I see things. the accusation of racism as the primary motivation for wanting another inquiry that you are hinting at, is another deflection from the true issues. |
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Reply | Swansea 2025 budget
at 19:33 9 Jan 2025
The examples of high-spending mentioned in the thread on school transport and special needs residential care are pretty sobering. When national taxes and council taxes are combined the present level of taxation is very high, but the size of the population needing public assistance seems to be growing worryingly fast. The public expenditure situation at national level makes me wonder how long we can afford all the services we provide. Much of our spending comes from borrowed money. The last time the UK government had a budget surplus (i.e. took more in taxes and revenues then it spent) was 2000-01. With the present situation with bonds and a falling pound, it seems that the "headroom" that Rachel Reeves thought she had for investment has all but gone. There are questions about whether she will cancel her China trip in case the markets panic. |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 16:17 9 Jan 2025
We shall have to agree to disagree. It is good to make people set out their arguments so that others can judge the strength of the claims. My preference is either a focused public inquiry or some form of action-oriented intervention with teeth (unlikely but more effective), and not the very limited measures and evasion of key issues that the government is trying to get away with.
I see that our Swansea West MP is all for the latter. [Post edited 9 Jan 16:44]
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Reply | Chagos Islands
at 14:08 9 Jan 2025
There is a tendency to talk about international law as if it is a coherent corpus of rules coming from an authoritative source about which all countries agree, Of course, that is not the case. It is a mish-mash of treaty obligations, rulings by various courts, and case law. Not all countries have signed up to particular treaties or recognise particular courts. The one that ruled in this case has no power to impose sanctions or enforce its judgements, which are advisory. Many will think the ruling that the islands belong to far away Mauritius is itself irrational, and takes no account of how Mauritius has treated exiled Chagossians or of the wishes of those Chagossians. |
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Reply | Oldham grooming gangs: Government blocks national inquiry
at 12:57 9 Jan 2025
As I see things, the idea that the rape gangs are just a small part of a larger problem and no more deserving of attention than other domains covered by the 2022 Inquiry, is just a continuation of the narrative we’ve seen from “progressive” commentators right back to the time the problem first surfaced. Why might we think the gangs deserve special attention? I suggest the following:
These were at the extreme end of sexual offences, more extreme than in most other domains covered. The gang phenomenon involved rape (often gang rape), trafficking of minors for sex, pimping, some killings, torture, and supply of drugs to minors.
There was a racial and cultural dimension, involving a view of young white girls from disadvantaged backgrounds as morally-worthless persons who could be exploited and discarded. This took a more extreme form than in the other domains, and raised wider societal questions about the integration of a certain minority population into British society.
There was a cover-up in this domain that seems to have been orchestrated and coordinated in a way that spans multiple organisations and institutions, and the line taken at the front line may have been influenced by messages passed down from very high levels, allegedly including government ministers. There were cover-ups in other domains, but not with this extraordinary level of coordination.
No senior person in any of the institutions involved in the scandal has been brought to book. Looking at other domains covered by the 2022 inquiry there has been some if all too rare examples of accountability: an archbishop has been brought down; a leading newsreader who viewed internet porn was convicted; a few culpable schools like Maidwell Hall have closed.
Can the UK campaign effectively for a halt to child abuse abroad if it does not first get its own house in order? While this must obviously include action in areas like abuse of children in schools and residential care, and indeed in private family settings, the rape gangs are perhaps the most visible manifestation of problems in our own country.
There is widespread concern about the number of unpunished individuals still at liberty, plus inadequate penalties for those convicted, and failure to implement promised deportations. This is a more visible public scandal than in other areas covered in the 2022 Inquiry.
This is a hotter public issue than any of the other domains. Just google “child abuse UK” and see what comes up. |
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