| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:48 - Apr 23 with 2917 views | YorkRanger |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:42 - Apr 23 by Northernr |
Well that's where your balance comes in. Dunne had something to prove - people said he was finished. Dunne was cheap - because everybody thought he was finished. Dunne wasn't some big name, big timer so didn't look out of place here. Dunne was saying things like "I just wanted to play, I knew I still had it in me to play, everybody was writing me off." Ferdinand was saying things like "I was going to retire until Harry called, QPR are in London which is convenient".
You can;'t have a team of kids any more than you can have a team of 30+. It;s about balance. Dunne has been a very decent signing for us, Ferdinand has been a fcking awful one, and I don't think we're saying that with any degree of hindsight either - they looked like that when they were made. |
Ferdinand looks better in a cap though...  |  | |  |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:49 - Apr 23 with 2915 views | WeaverQPR |
Dunne has been immense id have him signed up on another year no probs. |  |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:50 - Apr 23 with 2911 views | YorkRanger |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:49 - Apr 23 by WeaverQPR |
Dunne has been immense id have him signed up on another year no probs. |
Agreed with that and what Clive said earlier about the Dunne signing.
Will be valuable next season, especially if we go down | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 12:27 - Apr 23 with 2849 views | CamberleyR |
He may be another Karl Ready but in the other hand he might be another Alan McDonald but as successive managers haven't played him, we'll never know. |  |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 12:46 - Apr 23 with 2818 views | JordanFoster |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:19 - Apr 23 by Northernr |
The debate about who's a better player - Rio or Ehmer - is ludicrous.
A debate about who would be more useful to QPR, perhaps less so. Even if Ferdinand had come in and played well this season (he hasn't, he's been a fcking dog) he would still have been expensive and here for 12 months at most. So it's more money going out, and it's a path obstructed for better long term options - not only Ehmer but Onuoha, Caulker etc. And that's if he was playing well, as it is he's expensive and short term and sht.
Ehmer may not be as good as Ferdinand but he's potentially much more useful to QPR long term. Had he played the matches Ferdinand has played this season it's unlikely the results would have been worse - Ferdinand's QPR record is P11 W1 D1 L9 - and we'd have a young centre back with a year of Premier League experience ready to use next year either regularly in the Championship or from the bench in the Prem.
QPR have been swines for this since Fernandes got here. Picking Bosingwa instead of Harriman when we were already down the prime example - yes he's a better player than Harriman, but why not give somebody with a long term future at the club a go. Had Harriman got a dozen premier League starts under his belt he might have got a Championship loan a year later, rather than a League Two one. If we loaned Darnell Furlong out now he'd get Champ or League One. If we'd loaned him our six months ago he'd have got Conference.
We must stop looking short term. It's one of the reasons I like Ramsey, because he doesn't.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
To an extent Clive, I agree.
To pick Bosingwa over Harriman when QPR's fate was already sealed was a bit of a kick in balls for Harriman, as it would have been for Jamie Mackie too. Especially when the manager was stressing about a lack of effort.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing and I'm certain that at the start of the season most would have said they would prefer to have Rio Ferdinand in the starting XI over Max Ehmer, of course not everyone would have - but the majority I think would.
It's all very well saying he would have a year of PL experience but that doesn't necessarily help us or him if he isn't good enough. Everyone saw the performances of Furlong and that was at fullback. Playing in the centre is far harder and at a club where the defence have/had little protection from the midfield, Ehmer would have been slaughtered. There's enough scouts watching the EDS games, there's enough managers and coaches there and he is at Gillingham because that's his level.
He's a good physical defender, but many are judging him on the seven minutes or whatever he played against M'Boro.
The same with Furlong, I don't think if he went out now he would get a League One or Championship club. You're throwing them into a league where blokes are battling for their lives to make a living and stay in a contract, Cole Kpekawa ended up playing for the Portsmouth reserves when he went out and Andy Awford said about it being a culture shock coming from Under-21 football.
He only played twice for the firsts. The size of Kpekawa and he even admitted himself how tough it was, to throw Furlong in there would be brutal. He wouldn't get anywhere near them League One sides - he's a second year scholar remember.
And a note on Dunne too, absolute myth that he was a cheap signing because no one else wanted him. No-one in the PL wanted him and no one other than us in the Championship could afford him. |  | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:23 - Apr 23 with 2761 views | PhilmyRs |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 12:46 - Apr 23 by JordanFoster |
To an extent Clive, I agree.
To pick Bosingwa over Harriman when QPR's fate was already sealed was a bit of a kick in balls for Harriman, as it would have been for Jamie Mackie too. Especially when the manager was stressing about a lack of effort.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing and I'm certain that at the start of the season most would have said they would prefer to have Rio Ferdinand in the starting XI over Max Ehmer, of course not everyone would have - but the majority I think would.
It's all very well saying he would have a year of PL experience but that doesn't necessarily help us or him if he isn't good enough. Everyone saw the performances of Furlong and that was at fullback. Playing in the centre is far harder and at a club where the defence have/had little protection from the midfield, Ehmer would have been slaughtered. There's enough scouts watching the EDS games, there's enough managers and coaches there and he is at Gillingham because that's his level.
He's a good physical defender, but many are judging him on the seven minutes or whatever he played against M'Boro.
The same with Furlong, I don't think if he went out now he would get a League One or Championship club. You're throwing them into a league where blokes are battling for their lives to make a living and stay in a contract, Cole Kpekawa ended up playing for the Portsmouth reserves when he went out and Andy Awford said about it being a culture shock coming from Under-21 football.
He only played twice for the firsts. The size of Kpekawa and he even admitted himself how tough it was, to throw Furlong in there would be brutal. He wouldn't get anywhere near them League One sides - he's a second year scholar remember.
And a note on Dunne too, absolute myth that he was a cheap signing because no one else wanted him. No-one in the PL wanted him and no one other than us in the Championship could afford him. |
Good post which I agree with.
I’ve always said that a youth player needs to either demonstrate considerable natural talent to play at the top level when their 18/19, or need to have had a decent education on loan, playing competitive league football against players, like you said, who are fighting for their next contract. Ehmer has experienced that and for my money would have been a better option to have on the bench than Furlong. I’m not saying Max will make it, he probably won’t, but during our recent injury crisis he would have been more suitable to filling in for the team simply because of ‘that experience’. Sadly he was out on loan for the thousandth time so was never an option.
And just to come back on some of the Ferdinand remarks about his reasons for joining us — ‘it was London and Harry phoned’ etc. Ferdinand openly stated that everyone he spoke to said he’d regret not playing football once he’d retired, and whilst he could, he should continue to give it everything. QPR had an appeal to him, it’s where he began his football and seemed an appropriate place to him to end it. Plus Harry and his promise of Rangers playing through him as part of a 3 man back line probably encouraged him as well. But hey, let’s just say the only reason he came to Rangers was to sell caps, catch up with his mates and earn a lot of cash for a year. Unfair on the man.
I do think Ferdinand’s always put the effort in when he’s played for us, he’s just lost too much of the qualities that once made him one of the world’s best. That said, sitting in the middle of the back 3 was where he was lined up to play and he actually had his best game on one of the few occasions he played that role. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:30 - Apr 23 with 2743 views | SpiritofGregory |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:50 - Apr 23 by YorkRanger |
Agreed with that and what Clive said earlier about the Dunne signing.
Will be valuable next season, especially if we go down |
Dunne's on at least 40k a week. We need to set a wage cap. |  | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:30 - Apr 23 with 2746 views | californiahoop |
Can't believe Hill and Dunne have been compared to Rio interms of contribution to the Rangers cause, lol!
Harriman, Elmer and most of youth squad should have played the moment relegation was confirmed.
Bircham spoke out about this after he left, I can't believe Redcrap didn't play these guys, as Clive mentioned, it would have lead to either better loans or transfer fees that would have covered some of the cost of running the youth set up.
Elmer's development has been hampered over the last 2-3 yrs, if we are relegated Harriman and Elmer MUST be accessed in pre season!! | | | |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:35 - Apr 23 with 2729 views | SpiritofGregory |
Man City are interested in McCarthy.
We need to be strong and keep hold of him - get rid of Green. [Post edited 23 Apr 2015 13:35]
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:46 - Apr 23 with 2708 views | Gloucs_R |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:35 - Apr 23 by SpiritofGregory |
Man City are interested in McCarthy.
We need to be strong and keep hold of him - get rid of Green. [Post edited 23 Apr 2015 13:35]
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Agree.
*sh7t, I have just agreed with SOG* |  |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 14:10 - Apr 23 with 2666 views | GetMeRangers |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 13:30 - Apr 23 by SpiritofGregory |
Dunne's on at least 40k a week. We need to set a wage cap. |
My apologies. I didnt realise you were a member of the board. It would be great if you could enlighten the rest of us, mere fans, to the wages of the rest of the playing staff. Do you think TF et al will agree with your push for a wages cap? Do they find your negativity helps redress their enthusiasm for the club? |  | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 16:13 - Apr 23 with 2571 views | vegasranger |
Are any of our youth players good enough even for the Championship? How many of our ex youth players not given a chance have gone on to play in either the Premier League or Championship? We have a terrible youth set up , to be honest if we hadn't run for the last 10 years how many players would we have missed out on? Sterling and who else? You can only give youth chance, if they are at the technical / physical level required. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 16:15 - Apr 23 with 2570 views | vegasranger |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 12:46 - Apr 23 by JordanFoster |
To an extent Clive, I agree.
To pick Bosingwa over Harriman when QPR's fate was already sealed was a bit of a kick in balls for Harriman, as it would have been for Jamie Mackie too. Especially when the manager was stressing about a lack of effort.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing and I'm certain that at the start of the season most would have said they would prefer to have Rio Ferdinand in the starting XI over Max Ehmer, of course not everyone would have - but the majority I think would.
It's all very well saying he would have a year of PL experience but that doesn't necessarily help us or him if he isn't good enough. Everyone saw the performances of Furlong and that was at fullback. Playing in the centre is far harder and at a club where the defence have/had little protection from the midfield, Ehmer would have been slaughtered. There's enough scouts watching the EDS games, there's enough managers and coaches there and he is at Gillingham because that's his level.
He's a good physical defender, but many are judging him on the seven minutes or whatever he played against M'Boro.
The same with Furlong, I don't think if he went out now he would get a League One or Championship club. You're throwing them into a league where blokes are battling for their lives to make a living and stay in a contract, Cole Kpekawa ended up playing for the Portsmouth reserves when he went out and Andy Awford said about it being a culture shock coming from Under-21 football.
He only played twice for the firsts. The size of Kpekawa and he even admitted himself how tough it was, to throw Furlong in there would be brutal. He wouldn't get anywhere near them League One sides - he's a second year scholar remember.
And a note on Dunne too, absolute myth that he was a cheap signing because no one else wanted him. No-one in the PL wanted him and no one other than us in the Championship could afford him. |
Excellent, realistic post Jordan. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 22:21 - Apr 23 with 2472 views | SomersetHoops |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:19 - Apr 23 by Northernr |
The debate about who's a better player - Rio or Ehmer - is ludicrous.
A debate about who would be more useful to QPR, perhaps less so. Even if Ferdinand had come in and played well this season (he hasn't, he's been a fcking dog) he would still have been expensive and here for 12 months at most. So it's more money going out, and it's a path obstructed for better long term options - not only Ehmer but Onuoha, Caulker etc. And that's if he was playing well, as it is he's expensive and short term and sht.
Ehmer may not be as good as Ferdinand but he's potentially much more useful to QPR long term. Had he played the matches Ferdinand has played this season it's unlikely the results would have been worse - Ferdinand's QPR record is P11 W1 D1 L9 - and we'd have a young centre back with a year of Premier League experience ready to use next year either regularly in the Championship or from the bench in the Prem.
QPR have been swines for this since Fernandes got here. Picking Bosingwa instead of Harriman when we were already down the prime example - yes he's a better player than Harriman, but why not give somebody with a long term future at the club a go. Had Harriman got a dozen premier League starts under his belt he might have got a Championship loan a year later, rather than a League Two one. If we loaned Darnell Furlong out now he'd get Champ or League One. If we'd loaned him our six months ago he'd have got Conference.
We must stop looking short term. It's one of the reasons I like Ramsey, because he doesn't.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Well said Clive. In our younger players we have players who with more experience and the right kind of coaching can gain ability and value. With players like Rio the opposite is true. |  |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 22:54 - Apr 23 with 2441 views | derbyhoop |
Ehmer has now played about 100 league games, all at L1 level. I doubt whether he would be good enough for the Premiership but he may be good enough for the Championship. The judgement must come from more qualified people than me. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 23:00 - Apr 23 with 2392 views | daveB |
not sure when a good time to give kids a chance is anymore. Doesn't matter what stage of the season it is games are usually must win and putting in kids leads to risks of losing, we've seen on here the criticism of Ramsey for putting Furlong in for a few games when he had no other options and going back a few years Waddock was slaughtered for going with the kids rather than Gallen and Bircham.
I hope if we have young players good enough they get a chance from now on but if we do and results don't go for us we'll soon be moaning that we need more experience. [Post edited 24 Apr 2015 7:50]
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 00:29 - Apr 24 with 2353 views | PunteR |
Keeping players at league 1 level is never going to progress them to premier level.
I hope we keep him,and give him starts in the 1st team next season,especially if the big earners are going. |  |
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| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:17 - Apr 24 with 2256 views | olderR |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 23:00 - Apr 23 by daveB |
not sure when a good time to give kids a chance is anymore. Doesn't matter what stage of the season it is games are usually must win and putting in kids leads to risks of losing, we've seen on here the criticism of Ramsey for putting Furlong in for a few games when he had no other options and going back a few years Waddock was slaughtered for going with the kids rather than Gallen and Bircham.
I hope if we have young players good enough they get a chance from now on but if we do and results don't go for us we'll soon be moaning that we need more experience. [Post edited 24 Apr 2015 7:50]
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Spot on.
Constant promotion/relegation seasons means our managers don't have a points cushion to try young players. The financial consequences are too great.
Even Chelsea with their vast youth squad have been labouring on with Drogba rather than try a youth player. |  | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:37 - Apr 24 with 2239 views | PhilmyRs |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 23:00 - Apr 23 by daveB |
not sure when a good time to give kids a chance is anymore. Doesn't matter what stage of the season it is games are usually must win and putting in kids leads to risks of losing, we've seen on here the criticism of Ramsey for putting Furlong in for a few games when he had no other options and going back a few years Waddock was slaughtered for going with the kids rather than Gallen and Bircham.
I hope if we have young players good enough they get a chance from now on but if we do and results don't go for us we'll soon be moaning that we need more experience. [Post edited 24 Apr 2015 7:50]
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Why constantly state Ramsey had no option but to play Furlong. Against Hull I can sympathise with his predicament, but it's rubbish to state he had no other options against Arsenal or Palace. He could have played 3 at the back, he could have played Ned right back, he could have played Henry right back, he coud have brought Hill in and played Yun right back. Fair enough you wouldn't have done that, but please don't state he 'had no other options' as it's just simply not true. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 14:09 - Apr 24 with 2169 views | daveB |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 11:37 - Apr 24 by PhilmyRs |
Why constantly state Ramsey had no option but to play Furlong. Against Hull I can sympathise with his predicament, but it's rubbish to state he had no other options against Arsenal or Palace. He could have played 3 at the back, he could have played Ned right back, he could have played Henry right back, he coud have brought Hill in and played Yun right back. Fair enough you wouldn't have done that, but please don't state he 'had no other options' as it's just simply not true. |
We didn't have enough fit centre halves to play 3 at the back and Henry was needed in midfield as Barton was suspended. Furlong was the only option for Hull and Arsenal. Palace he could have played Ned right back with Hill in the middle but options were very limited. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 14:43 - Apr 24 with 2142 views | PhilmyRs |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 14:09 - Apr 24 by daveB |
We didn't have enough fit centre halves to play 3 at the back and Henry was needed in midfield as Barton was suspended. Furlong was the only option for Hull and Arsenal. Palace he could have played Ned right back with Hill in the middle but options were very limited. |
I think you'll find Ned and Caulker started against Arsenal with Yun full back and Hill on the bench. Therefore you would have had the option to play 3 at the back or play Hill and Caulker in the middle with Ned full back. As Giroud was up front with limited pace Hill would have been fine with him.
Yes there was a clash of heads which forced Ned to be subbed at half time but options before the game were there for Furlong not to be picked in the first 11. So, as I said originally, only Hull was where his hand was really forced. He did have options for 2 out of 3 of those games. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 15:05 - Apr 24 with 2129 views | daveB |
who would have played right wing back then? Whatever he had done that night it would have been players out of position. As he played 4-4-2 in both games he needed a right back and had one natural right back available. Sums up the problem though that he is still getting stick for picking Furlong whilst the previous fella gets stick for not picking kids. | | | |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 15:40 - Apr 24 with 2113 views | PhilmyRs |
| Ehmer finally wants out? on 15:05 - Apr 24 by daveB |
who would have played right wing back then? Whatever he had done that night it would have been players out of position. As he played 4-4-2 in both games he needed a right back and had one natural right back available. Sums up the problem though that he is still getting stick for picking Furlong whilst the previous fella gets stick for not picking kids. |
Phillips did a good job second half against villa as a wing back. Yun, an attacking both footed full back probably could have done the job, with Traore moving to the left and even dare I say it, the SWP man who incidentally Ramsey decided to pick for Palace was an option.
Of course the sensible decision would of been to have played Ned there and stuck to the back 4. Ned is a player I don’t like at full back when you’ll likely have a fair bit of the ball, but when predominantly focussing on defensive responsibilities is sound. His performance dealing with Bale a few seasons back shows what he can do. So a back 4 of Ned, Hill, Caulker and Yun would have been my choice. That shows Ramsey did have “options”.
I like how the Manager is giving players a chance and making the first team accessible unlike the previous regime. It’s a step forward. I still think within that new found approach of giving younger players a chance you need to find a balance — e.g. judge the options available and the opposition you face and make a call on how best to win that game. Playing Furlong against Arsenal and Palace was a lack of judgment in my opinion. That said, had Doughty not received the injuries he’s had in recent weeks, I think Ramsey would have involved him from the start in at least one of the games. A move I would have supported. | | | |
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