| With Hindsight on 10:22 - May 10 with 2383 views | TGRRRSSS |
Thats true, Rigg is generally a disaster wherever he goes, regarding Dave MC - I don't think he's really in the know in the same way these days, and it really rather shows.
Others have put it better than me but I agree naivete about youth football the book Broken Dreams is a brilliant example but also shows where a club like ourselves can get people like Eze who would otherwise fall through, if we continue this and work to further develop it then we're in business and youngsters and their parents etc will take us as a serious "pathway" to the top. |  | |  |
| With Hindsight on 10:30 - May 10 with 2367 views | francisbowles |
The link is behind a paywall (free trial with payment details) so not willing to sign up.
Can you enlighten us as to some of the detail? |  | | |
| With Hindsight on 11:45 - May 10 with 2318 views | nix |
| With Hindsight on 09:39 - May 10 by Esox_Lucius |
Smegma will almost certainly have a better overview than mine on this subject but my understanding is that Joe & Steve were in charge of the QPR academy but it was underfunded gave the appearance of being a job for boys position as they had the Gallen name. Under Les' direction the academy was overhauled, most of the existing academy staff were let go and the whole operation was restructured and properly funded, along with accountability and a plan to deliver with milestones etc. There are a number of those connected with the previous academy on social media sites always looking to put the boot in on the people now involved in the academy and stress how none of our players came through the academy. Factually accurate as it will take 8-10 years before one of our U6 or U8 players signed under the new regime to be ready for a first team place. In the meantime we have some talented people looking at players released from other clubs who they think will fit into the plan for QPR going forward and, so far, this seems to be a successful tactic until our Academy players come on tap. I am sure that if Les or Ramsey thought that Steve and/or Joe were the people to have in the new academy they would have been retained. Whether his methods were draconian or not Les is quite disliked by a lot of people working at the club because so many that had been there for a long time lost their jobs and the resentment is still there. There may have been a few cases of the baby disappearing with the bath water (Terry Springett?) but since the Tune Group have been marginalised and Total Soccer Group became the major shareholder that the clubs fortunes have taken an upturn and the feeling is the club is starting to be more like "QPR" again. |
That's my view too without knowing all the facts but just from my sense. I also think we've got a lot better at moving out players that aren't ever going to make it rather than having youngish players just languishing in the fringes of the squad well past the point when they should be moved on. As a result we've got a lot less bloated squad.
It certainly seemed like a bit of a cosy club that didn't seem to need to produce any real results. So I don't really pay attention when Kevin Gallen slags off the current management/coaching set up. |  | | |
| With Hindsight on 12:30 - May 10 with 2286 views | rsonist |
| With Hindsight on 10:30 - May 10 by francisbowles |
The link is behind a paywall (free trial with payment details) so not willing to sign up.
Can you enlighten us as to some of the detail? |
Full set of specialist coaches, physios, analysts, video team
Tailored international fixture programme of 40+ games a season of varying competition, outside of any league system and reliant on contacts network
Focus not just on domestic academy grads but using the edge they have in data to scout youth teamers from smaller more obscure leagues and undervalued markets, as well as already established footholds in Denmark etc
A complete satellite feeder club basically, one reiterating and taking advantage of approaches to development that the people we have in situ don't share (not necessarily inferior just different and more traditional) |  | | |
| With Hindsight on 13:30 - May 10 with 2216 views | Esox_Lucius |
| With Hindsight on 09:49 - May 10 by smegma |
Don’t you mean Steve ?? |
Yep, edited now thanks. |  |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| With Hindsight on 13:48 - May 10 with 2176 views | daveB |
| With Hindsight on 10:09 - May 10 by MedwayR |
I think most over the overhaul that resulted in Steve Gallen etc going was done under Mike Rigg rather than Ferdinand. |
Gallen left under Ferdinand, he was promoted to first team coach and when Ramsey was removed JFH didn't want him so he left. Club could and probably should have tried to find a role for him but it never happened. Kevin Gallen has never been particularly positive about anything at QPR since which I guess is understandable if you and your brother are booted out. |  | | |
| With Hindsight on 22:29 - May 12 with 1963 views | LazyFan |
| With Hindsight on 10:09 - May 10 by MedwayR |
I think most over the overhaul that resulted in Steve Gallen etc going was done under Mike Rigg rather than Ferdinand. |
I don't agree with his summation.
Yes for Academy if we are in the Prem, no if we are not. B ' Team, for now, is better. actually I would go for both. B'Team or whatever they are called these days for obvious reasons, the Championship is a marathon not a Sprint. We need 22 players and 4 young uns to be blooded as they come through.
Even if he's correct on the Academy costing loads and will not produce any better players than if we stole them away from other clubs like Manning or evolved the rejects like Eze, there is another good reason to have an Academy.
While it still has to produce players that will match Eze and Manning (otherwise there is no point), another great reason is that once you get one come all the way through, then this in the community is a massive draw for future players and fans.
It is this community aspect that Brentford will majorly regret as a mistake long-term. At the moment all is great as Brentford play Moneyball ahead of everyone else. But the point about the Moneyball in baseball was that everyone had outdated methods, but when they caught up by updating their methods there was no advantage.
We have had this before when in the past teams did not bring in the foreign players, the ones that did started beating the others. Then everyone did it and there was no advantage. And it normalised again.
It will do the same as QPR is catching up, slowly but we are doing it. Soon others will as well and then there is the Chelscum and Manure model of just hoovering everyone up ... twice!
But an Academy in my view is a massive advantage and there is no quick fix for that. As one can play Moneyball in one season, we have shown how we have pivoted and done that this season. And it is a massive success. If you say it was actually several seasons in the works, then you prove my point further. As an Academy will take way longer than that, which means if you have one, the compo could take decades to catch up if they ever do!
From the community angle we can really be a proper bedrock for future fans, passers-by and general kids who want to be part of that QPR magic as they see some young gun make it all the way through. Even if they are not good enough some of them will want to say "I played with new-Eze in the trials". I know him. I have met these people, people who say "I played for England boys with Ashley Cole". And then give you stories. This is how myth turns into identity.
An Academy makes us look strong and stable. We can attract players we do need to buy, as we shall have the proper set-up and also coaches and managers who know we have the proper set-up for them too. Scummy Agents will like us as it's an easier sell to their slaves.
An Academy is a statement that we are a proper club that wants to go places and does it in a way without spanking loads money on Prem rubbish that's past its sell-by date. It's also an asset that will probably go up in value and not down like the players we wasted millions on in the past. It's an investment that proves its worth in many different ways and also is hard for the others who do not have one to replicate.
So, I would still want to us create a proper Academy so, when Liverpool come calling, we can go "this one will cost you £20m this time and with addons as he's better than Sterling and we know you have to pay and you know we don't have to sell. We ALL know this as we are QPR". |  |
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| With Hindsight on 07:29 - May 13 with 1886 views | distortR |
Isn't Eze's younger brother in the academy set up?
That could work on so many levels. | | | |
| With Hindsight on 08:18 - May 13 with 1862 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| With Hindsight on 07:29 - May 13 by distortR |
Isn't Eze's younger brother in the academy set up?
That could work on so many levels. |
Yes, Chima.
And - I heard once or twice, somewhere - maybe a younger brother again? [Post edited 13 May 2020 8:18]
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| With Hindsight on 14:30 - May 13 with 1766 views | derbyhoop |
Generally Dave Mc seems to be on the ball. But, as a fan, he should be.
He's right about WF, as it must have been clear a long time ago that it was a project that was always struggling to work for us. Just took a long time to pull the plug.
I'm not convinced an Academy can be justified on a pure cost:benefit analysis.
As somebody (Brian?) said above, it also enhances our community presence, which gets kids and their families getting an attachment to QPR. The Academy didn't work at all for many years, with the exceptions of Sterling and Parrett. Recently, it seems to have stepped up a level. Furlong was here from age 8 and we got decent money for Bowler. I don't think Lumley, Eze, manning or Chair can really be seen as academy products.
However, most of the U23s seem to have spent part of this season out on loan at National League levels or equivalent, where they are probably getting harsh lessons in the world of men's football.
Most of them won't make it but you only need 1 or 2 per year group to justify the set up we have in place. And there's nothing to stop us picking up cast-offs from other clubs. See the recent interview with Joe Gubbins. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| With Hindsight on 19:56 - May 13 with 1701 views | rsonist |
In terms of concrete figures for the cost, the Brentford CEO in the article linked says "We were spending a lot of money, up to £2.5 million a year, running a category two academy". | | | |
| With Hindsight on 11:55 - May 15 with 1552 views | MedwayR |
| With Hindsight on 19:56 - May 13 by rsonist |
In terms of concrete figures for the cost, the Brentford CEO in the article linked says "We were spending a lot of money, up to £2.5 million a year, running a category two academy". |
Ramsey confirms it costs about £2m a year to run a Category 2 academy in this podcast posted by Brian.
The Locker Room with Chris Ramsey by BrianMcCarthy 15 May 2020 10:55This is my first time listening to this podcast. Hosted by Ciaran Deeley and Ross Bennett, two Sports Scientists at Rangers. Episode 5 is with Ramsey. It's very long but insightful. It doesn't just deal with Sports Science but for those of us who like coaching it touiches on lots of areas - technical, tactical, physical and psychological.
Took me a few listens to get through all of it, but I really enjoyed it. Ramsey comes across as likable, and funny in a gentle way.
https://podtail.com/en/podcast/the-locker-room-podcast-deely-sport-science/the-chris-ramsey-interview-developing-the-individu/
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