| FFP 06:50 - Jan 31 with 10471 views | CorbyQPR |
This was posted on Twitter last night, true or not?
I think people are missing the point current FFP rules are based on losses accrued over a 3 year period, for us includes 1 year in prem so we cannot spend now or risk transfer embargo in summer, where in the summer prem losses fall out of equation and shackles can come off #QPR |  | | |  |
| FFP on 20:24 - Jan 31 with 3143 views | colinallcars |
So.....if I purchase my ST now as the club is exhorting us to do, will my few hundred quid go into this season's revenue helping to stay in the black FFP wise ? |  | | |
| FFP on 10:03 - Feb 1 with 2973 views | terryb |
| FFP on 20:24 - Jan 31 by colinallcars |
So.....if I purchase my ST now as the club is exhorting us to do, will my few hundred quid go into this season's revenue helping to stay in the black FFP wise ? |
No, income from ST's enter the club's books on a match by match basis.
For ease of calculation, if you paid £690 for the ST, £30 would hit the accounts at every home league game. | | | |
| FFP on 10:12 - Feb 1 with 2951 views | stevec |
| FFP on 14:47 - Jan 31 by Northernr |
Not true. The Premier League and Football League FFP rules are different. Our three years started after relegation so the first set of results we'll be judged by are the ones for this season released this time next year. |
Does this mean each team can have a different 3 year cycle to each other?
Assumed we'd all be operating a 3 yr over 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 at the moment and all start again from 2018/19 but curious how relegated or promoted clubs would fit into that.
I've had a bit of a look on the web and it's very hard to find anything definitive. |  | | |
| FFP on 10:22 - Feb 1 with 2942 views | terryb |
| FFP on 10:12 - Feb 1 by stevec |
Does this mean each team can have a different 3 year cycle to each other?
Assumed we'd all be operating a 3 yr over 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 at the moment and all start again from 2018/19 but curious how relegated or promoted clubs would fit into that.
I've had a bit of a look on the web and it's very hard to find anything definitive. |
I think all clubs are based on the three years you quoted as that was when the current rules started.
EDIT. Not sure how that would work with relegated clubs though. Perhaps it is a different cycle per club?
My understanding is that it's a rolling three years with the next perod being 2016/17, 17/18 & 18/19. [Post edited 1 Feb 2018 10:23]
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| FFP on 10:22 - Feb 1 with 2941 views | QPR_John |
| FFP on 10:12 - Feb 1 by stevec |
Does this mean each team can have a different 3 year cycle to each other?
Assumed we'd all be operating a 3 yr over 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 at the moment and all start again from 2018/19 but curious how relegated or promoted clubs would fit into that.
I've had a bit of a look on the web and it's very hard to find anything definitive. |
If a team in year one of their three year cycle gets promotion if relegated will they start in year two or start a new three year cycle | | | |
| FFP on 13:32 - Feb 1 with 2843 views | colinallcars |
I've just spent some time looking at FFP stuff online and am as baffled as ever. I get the new three year cycle bit OK and I see that owners cannot write off debt or plug the gap with personal funds but I can't find anything on whether the owner can pay the fine out of his own pocket or whether the club has to somehow find the cashwithin its own financial setup. This latter one would be impossible for us or more or less any club in our position. HELP ! | | | |
| FFP on 13:42 - Feb 1 with 2818 views | R_from_afar |
| FFP on 20:24 - Jan 31 by colinallcars |
So.....if I purchase my ST now as the club is exhorting us to do, will my few hundred quid go into this season's revenue helping to stay in the black FFP wise ? |
If I owned Rangers - God forbid, I hear you cry - I'd give you a free season ticket just for using the word "exhorting"! 
RFA |  |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| FFP on 13:56 - Feb 1 with 2789 views | stevec |
| FFP on 13:32 - Feb 1 by colinallcars |
I've just spent some time looking at FFP stuff online and am as baffled as ever. I get the new three year cycle bit OK and I see that owners cannot write off debt or plug the gap with personal funds but I can't find anything on whether the owner can pay the fine out of his own pocket or whether the club has to somehow find the cashwithin its own financial setup. This latter one would be impossible for us or more or less any club in our position. HELP ! |
As Colin points out, the fines are the Clubs debt but the owner could pay the fine off.
Creates an interesting proposition, if the League are really chasing the club for a plus £40 million fine which the club clearly can't pay, maybe TF and the Directors should attempt to call their bluff and see if the League would go through with putting the club out of the League. I'm not clued up on the clubs position but most asset rich businesses usually set up a Holding Company for the Fixed Assets.. If that were the case and the stadium was beyond the Leagues reach, TF could quite possibly say 'I'll hand over the football side of the club, if you can find £40 mill, good luck.' | | | |
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| FFP on 14:17 - Feb 1 with 2765 views | Northernr |
| FFP on 10:12 - Feb 1 by stevec |
Does this mean each team can have a different 3 year cycle to each other?
Assumed we'd all be operating a 3 yr over 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 at the moment and all start again from 2018/19 but curious how relegated or promoted clubs would fit into that.
I've had a bit of a look on the web and it's very hard to find anything definitive. |
Do you know what, I don't know. It's changed so much, I was reading stuff on the plane last night that makes my earlier statement wrong.
What is certain is that over a three year period in the Championship you're not allowed to lose more than £37m. Our three year period that includes this season and the previous two started with an £11m loss in the first year. |  | | |
| FFP on 14:23 - Feb 1 with 2748 views | stevec |
| FFP on 14:17 - Feb 1 by Northernr |
Do you know what, I don't know. It's changed so much, I was reading stuff on the plane last night that makes my earlier statement wrong.
What is certain is that over a three year period in the Championship you're not allowed to lose more than £37m. Our three year period that includes this season and the previous two started with an £11m loss in the first year. |
Know you look into these things, thanks.
Have to say, if the League can't even manage to put a concise documentation on the Web for the paying public to understand we need to question their competence when these fines get dished out. If it's based on the clubs profit and loss statement then that's our money they are playing with. | | | |
| FFP on 22:30 - Feb 1 with 2579 views | colinallcars |
| FFP on 14:23 - Feb 1 by stevec |
Know you look into these things, thanks.
Have to say, if the League can't even manage to put a concise documentation on the Web for the paying public to understand we need to question their competence when these fines get dished out. If it's based on the clubs profit and loss statement then that's our money they are playing with. |
Reminds me of an episode of Minder when Arthur Daley, on being refused service in a pub said “ my money's as good as anyone else's. In fact it is someone else's” if the league won't accept payment of the fine direct from the owner(s) then it looks like selling the ground and ground-sharing with Brentford. | | | |
| FFP on 22:52 - Feb 1 with 2553 views | QPR_John |
| FFP on 22:30 - Feb 1 by colinallcars |
Reminds me of an episode of Minder when Arthur Daley, on being refused service in a pub said “ my money's as good as anyone else's. In fact it is someone else's” if the league won't accept payment of the fine direct from the owner(s) then it looks like selling the ground and ground-sharing with Brentford. |
Did not surprise me that the "independent" panel found we had broken FFP rules but the fact they agreed that the punishment was proportional I found odd. Virtually liquidating a team for failing FFP must be disproportionate so I let's hope the FL are flexible | | | |
| FFP on 00:26 - Feb 2 with 2486 views | LythamR |
in principle FFP make some sense but there are so many problems and issues with it
I recommend TF/air asia massively sponsors a chinese team and they then buy say Loungo for 50M
Sorted and everyone is happy |  | | |
| FFP on 02:32 - Feb 2 with 2458 views | isawqpratwcity |
| FFP on 00:26 - Feb 2 by LythamR |
in principle FFP make some sense but there are so many problems and issues with it
I recommend TF/air asia massively sponsors a chinese team and they then buy say Loungo for 50M
Sorted and everyone is happy |
...and loans him back on a peppercorn basis! |  |
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| FFP on 07:21 - Feb 2 with 2380 views | kingo |
| FFP on 00:26 - Feb 2 by LythamR |
in principle FFP make some sense but there are so many problems and issues with it
I recommend TF/air asia massively sponsors a chinese team and they then buy say Loungo for 50M
Sorted and everyone is happy |
Don’t Watford already do something along those lines? |  |
| RIP: Sniffer, Doug and Pat |
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| FFP on 09:04 - Feb 2 with 2323 views | francisbowles |
I 'normally' understand a rolling three year period to mean that once you are in year three you are continually rolling over. (yes, very appropriate in our case)
i.e once you have got to year three then effectively you are always in year three, so that the original year two becomes year one, year three becomes two and year four becomes three ad infinitum. | | | |
| FFP on 09:17 - Feb 2 with 2299 views | EastR |
Our next set of accounts (our year 2 of 3) are due to be filed at Companies House in the coming weeks. | |
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| FFP on 12:37 - Feb 2 with 2237 views | terryb |
| FFP on 09:17 - Feb 2 by EastR |
Our next set of accounts (our year 2 of 3) are due to be filed at Companies House in the coming weeks. |
Thanks EastR.
I was wondering when we would see those results & thought it was earlier than this last year. | | | |
| FFP on 13:52 - Feb 2 with 2187 views | EastR |
| FFP on 12:37 - Feb 2 by terryb |
Thanks EastR.
I was wondering when we would see those results & thought it was earlier than this last year. |
No problem Terry. There’s an interesting article here outlining the new rules that were introduced last year on FFP for Championship clubs. It’s a year out of date but the principle applies by just dropping 2014/15 for 2017/18.
http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/championship-ffp-rules-201617.php
What I hadn’t realised til now was that on the 1 Mar each year clubs have to submit an estimate for their current year expected outcome.
So we will be submitting figures for the financial year ending 31 May 2018 to them in the coming weeks (the accounts for that period don’t have to be made public before March 2019).
So our next submission to them on the 1st March will be for:
- year ended 31 May 2016 (Actual loss £10.9m);
-year ended 31 May 2017 (we’ll find out when the accounts are published); and
- an estimate for this year ended 31 May 2018 (which we won’t see).
Our frantic offloading of players in January gives a strong indication that we must be very close to the wire (£39m) for the 3 years. The actual results for 2016 when they come out in March will tell us a bit more. | |
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| FFP on 20:39 - Feb 2 with 2138 views | Roller |
| FFP on 13:52 - Feb 2 by EastR |
No problem Terry. There’s an interesting article here outlining the new rules that were introduced last year on FFP for Championship clubs. It’s a year out of date but the principle applies by just dropping 2014/15 for 2017/18.
http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/championship-ffp-rules-201617.php
What I hadn’t realised til now was that on the 1 Mar each year clubs have to submit an estimate for their current year expected outcome.
So we will be submitting figures for the financial year ending 31 May 2018 to them in the coming weeks (the accounts for that period don’t have to be made public before March 2019).
So our next submission to them on the 1st March will be for:
- year ended 31 May 2016 (Actual loss £10.9m);
-year ended 31 May 2017 (we’ll find out when the accounts are published); and
- an estimate for this year ended 31 May 2018 (which we won’t see).
Our frantic offloading of players in January gives a strong indication that we must be very close to the wire (£39m) for the 3 years. The actual results for 2016 when they come out in March will tell us a bit more. |
Just to put a little flesh on these bones....
The current FFP regulations state that that a Championship club is not allowed to lose more than £39 million over a rolling 3-year period with the third year being based on a projected figure for the current season. This figure assumes that the owners are prepared to inject equity to cover the losses; these can only be £15 million if they are not. Rolling is the important word, try to erase cycle from any thoughts here.
Our last set of published accounts, which are for the year ending May 2016 show a £11 million loss. If we examine those accounts a little more closely there was a parachute payment of £24million. This dropped to £19.3m for last season and has dropped again to £9.6 million for this and next season. Secondly that season's accounts included our proceeds from Sterling’s transfer from Liverpool to Manchester City, believed to be £10million or thereabouts and also £4 million from Charlie Austin’s sale to Southampton. Yes, we did have a few high earning players that season such as Sandro, Green, and Fer, but it is also worth remembering that Caulker was out on loan with all his wages covered initially by Southampton and then by Liverpool and incredibly Evil Les even managed to get a couple of loan fees for him.
For the current season, we need to factor in that player’s transfer fees are spread across the term of their initial contract, so the final £2 million of the £8 million we paid for Caulker back in July 2014 will be in lodged in this year’s accounts. There will be smaller amounts to include for the purchase of players such as Washington, Luongo and Smithies as well, so there are transfer fees to include even though we spent little in the summer and haven't signed anyone in this window. Agents’ fees are also treated in this manner as Les Ferdinand was quick to point out when it was revealed that QPR paid more than any other Championship club to agents in the period from 1st October 2015 to 1st February 2016. Ferdinand confirmed that the bulk of the agents’ fees paid in that period were for historical transfers from when the club was in the Premier League. |  | | |
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